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For all those who say Phins should move on from 17..

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by vt_dolfan, Oct 14, 2014.

  1. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    If Hoyer is a free agent, I'd show interest in him. I'd also monitor Mariota closely for the draft next year. Tannehill... time to be consistent or GTFO.
     
  2. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If Lazor is still on staff next year then I'd target a trade with Philly for Matt Barkley. That's one guy that interests me, aside from even the obvious Philly connection and familiarity with the scheme.

    I'm "queasy" on some of the top-tier prospects in the draft. I wouldn't mind Jameis Winston or Connor Cook, but I'd rather wait a year and go after Christian Hackenberg. Hard. Especially if Tannehill shows himself more consistent the latter half of this year.

    I'd still target Barkley and a mid-round guy like Shane Carden, Rakeem Cato, or Sean Mannion as competition for Tannehill and/or Barkley if you can get him.
     
    Aqua4Ever04 likes this.
  3. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    My biggest fear regarding Tannehill's future:
    When he finally starts getting comfortable in this new system and leading his team to convincing wins, it'll be too late in the season and we still won't make the playoffs. Then the coaching staff will likely be fired and a new system brought in, and then the cycle repeats itself... he'll have trouble adjusting early on in the season and the fans won't be patient with him and he'll get run out of town.. he then gets picked up by a team who'll develop him the right way and transform him into a perennial Pro Bowler.
    I pray this doesn't happen :pray:
     
  4. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Thats why we have to hit it right at the next HC hire to be honest. Ross has to hit it out of the park with that hire.

    Most likely that coach will decide what they see or dont see in 17, and draft accordingly. Your not costing yourself anything by continually trying to upgrade at QB.

    My opinion is 17s ceiling is somewhere between the 15th and 10th best QB in the league. Thats good, but its not elite. Never stop reaching for elite anymore. We've seen what that can do. You have to balance things out.....cost vs value. Sure..you can say eh...Tannehill sucks...if he doesnt improve get rid of him. Ok....then hope who you draft doesnt suck..or get ready to pay starter money to Brian Hoyer....
     
  5. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    So far, regarding college QB's, the only QB that I've watched and feel I can form an opinion on is Mariota. This one is the real deal. He's got all the tools. He's got a big arm. He can run. He keeps eyes downfield when he's scrambling around. He's got an... interesting release. A little bit of a slow pull back, but he can snap it and rip it like Flacco. I wouldn't say he's 100% polished and ready to go. He's only a junior so we'll see if he comes out. Added bonus, if Lazor or this offense is still around next year, big if, but Mariota should know most of it.

    Seen a little of Brent Hundley... a lot like Stephen Morris IMO. So that's that :lol:
     
  6. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Sure, but "in your opinion" Tannehill was also the best quarterback since Dan Marino. So if you're starting to see the light a little bit, don't let the same optimism blind you towards the best QB on our roster.
     
  7. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    ...and yet in his 11 games on the field with Miami, he's won 8 games and lost 3 (not counting pre-season, where he's also out-shined Tannehill for 3 years in a row). Name ANY STRETCH where Tannehill has been 8-3 as a quarterback...or any other QB we've had that wasn't named Marino or Noodle Arm, for that matter. Because statistically and in the win column, Moore has been the best we've had except for Pennington's great season.

    With that said, you guys are crazy to support a 3 year beta-test with Tannehill and then say that Moore doesn't deserve even a test run. He's proven himself time and time again, while Ryan has been the definition of average.
     
  8. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Does Moore get this team to the super bowl? I'd bet no...so I don't see a reason to pull development...particularly since the jury's still out.

    Edit: good stretch or not, his career numbers are below RT in many categories...if he was way ahead, I'd look at it different.
     
  9. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Okay, so the "success factor" for Tannehill or any other QB is to eventually get us to the playoffs, yet Moore has to take us to the Super Bowl immediately to be worth getting some playing time? That's a ridiculous statement.
     
  10. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    No...I don't give a damn about sneaking into the playoffs...that's not the goal. I don't see this team getting to the SB regardless...but I think RT has the better future possibility of the two.
     
  11. scotty_irnbru

    scotty_irnbru Well-Known Member

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    Go look at their stats. They are almost identical. Except Moore has been in the league 8 and tannehill 3. We know what Moore is. We know what his ceiling is. We're still finding that out with RT. I think we have different opinions of proving themselves.
     
  12. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    And I suppose your going to dig up that I said Tannehill was the best QB since Dan Marino.

    Or did I say...Tannehill is the best "Dolphins" QB since Dan Marino.

    Look...we arent going to agree here. I dont see Moore as an upgrade, Im sorry. If he was, hed be playing right now.
     
  13. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Huh..the league average..or the league middle. 3 or 4 much higher ratings can throw off league average.....as well....historically, the 90.1 number is much higher then normal.

    Theres not historical evidence to show that continues and will be that at the end of the season.
     
  14. ElNino

    ElNino Well-Known Member

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    Consistency would be nice - at times he looks like the savior, other times he looks just like the last 10 guys we've had.
     
  15. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm glad someone caught that. :shifty:

    Combining my response here with Paul talking about Mariota. I've not had a chance to see Mariota play yet this year. The one time I had the opportunity was the night they played against Arizona and lost. But, I was at my friends bachelor party in Lexington (we were betting on the ponies the next day at Keenland), and we were at a UK campus bar. Willy Cauley-Stein and the Harrison twins showed up. Party ensued. I remember Oregon losing, but that's about it...Need to watch him more.

    Hackenberg, for my money, is going to end up the closest thing coming out of college to Andrew Luck. I think some of that will be shrouded as he plays at Penn State and they're still clearly feeling the sting from the Jerry Sandusky mess, especially in terms of talent, and the B1G is down pretty badly.

    I'd be fine with Winston or Cook if they fell to Miami or they could move up relatively easily a la the Dion Jordan trade up from 12 to 3. I would NOT sell the farm to get either of them. I WOULD sell the farm for Hackenberg. That's my stance.

    I also think that if Jim Harbaugh came to town, he might just be able to "fix" Tannehill the way he did with Alex Smith. I'm okay with that attempt as well provided my hedges their bet by bringing in viable competition.
     
  16. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    We're not finding anything out with RT...and he's started almost as many games as Moore. There was a legitimate reason for Moore's poor season though and the league now makes it mandatory to bench players with concussions. Their stats are almost even because Moore was seriously injured...but what's Tannehill's excuse? Oh yeah, he just stinks.
     
  17. scotty_irnbru

    scotty_irnbru Well-Known Member

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    So we agree there is no real difference then? In that case why keep plugging with the 30 year old who is out of contract at the end of this season as opposed to the 26 year old we've got for the next 2 years who we can surely all agree has more potential?
     
  18. scotty_irnbru

    scotty_irnbru Well-Known Member

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    So if they are identical why would you choose the out of contract 30 year old as opposed to the 26 year old we have for the next 2 years? Even the most matt moorish of people must agree that tannehill has a higher ceiling, so why not coach that up? This isn't a team of win now 32 year old vets.
     
  19. scotty_irnbru

    scotty_irnbru Well-Known Member

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    Sorry. My post disappeared then reappeared.
     
  20. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Awwww...why'd you change your sig pic that showed how special he was?
     
  21. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Missing games to a concussion does NOT impact averages...
     
  22. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Here's some philosophical food for thought. How many people here didn't support Beck, didn't think Fiedler was the answer, and may have not supported Henne, but DO support giving Tannehill more than just 2.3 years?

    I think that's an important question considering some fans form arguments against Tannehill on the belief that everyone who supports Tannehill also had to support Beck, Fiedler, and Henne?.... and vice versa- that everyone who doesn't support Tannehill also didn't support Beck, Fiedler, and Henne. I mean, an argument can't be made that "Tannehill is destined to bust because some fans were right about Henne, Beck, and Fiedler" unless it's proven that those same fans were congruent. For instance, if one fan didn't support Henne but did support Beck & Fiedler, then what does that say if they don't support Tannehill? Does that say that they're destined to be correct because they were correct about Henne, or does it say they're 66.7% likely to be wrong since they were wrong about Fiedler & Beck?

    I for one know I wasn't a fan of Beck's, and I never believed Fiedler was the answer..... so am I wrong about wanting to give Tannehill more time just because I wanted to give Henne more time and he proved to be a bust, or am I perhaps potentially correct in believing Tannehill needs more time because my beliefs were correct about Fiedler and Beck... and Orton, Kolb, Flynn, Palmer, and the list of unspectacular QBs I wasn't a fan of drafting? Where's the distinction here?
     
  23. Phinastic

    Phinastic Active Member

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    I don't think he is the problem either. I've said many times that you don't need a hall of fame quarterback to win the superbowl, you just need a competent one. I think we have that. And I also think that allows us to not have to dish out a ton of money to keep him either, freeing up a lot more for other players on our team.
     
  24. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Fielder's arm strength was too weak. He had good heart, however couldn't throw an out pattern. Which allowed teams to cheat on the inside.

    I thought Beck didn't get good enough shot. However he proved to not be good enough. However I did support him.

    Henne, no. After 2nd year I was done. He did not display any improvements.

    I think Tannehill needs more time. His 1st half against the Packers was pretty bad, however no one else was helping him. His pass that Wallace dropped was beautiful. His 2nd half was very brilliant.
     
    ToddPhin likes this.

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