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Hickey Confirmed for 2015 - Merry Christmas!

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Dec 23, 2014.

  1. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Last year had bully gate and this year had more pressures, with about the same amount of hits.

    Vikings hit Tannehill a bunch last game.
     
  2. NyPhinfan

    NyPhinfan Season Ticket Holder

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    Who knows...you may be right..but obviously when the tackles miss blocks its easier to see. Last year our tackles could not stop a good wind
     
  3. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Ok. So injuries just have no context. Lol. Got it. Dustin Keller missed 80% of the 2012 season. We should have known he was going to take a ****ing helmet to the knee in a preseason game. Stupid us. Thanks Ireland.
     
  4. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Agreed. Our tackles were terrible last year.
     
  5. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Injuries happen to all teams and even with injuries it is easy to explain how Hickey did an O.K. job at best.

    For him to do a pretty good job, rests in the development of the draft picks that did nothing. Something people would have HATED Ireland for.
     
  6. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    What does any of that have to do with what I said? Was Kellers injury on the gm or not???? Or are we just being selective? He should have known better right?
     
  7. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity

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    Ireland shmireland. He's gone. Past. Finito. Hickey is the Dolphins' GM and he did a darn good job in his first year. That's good news.
     
  8. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Even putting aside my objections to this(there are a lot, mind you), did you not notice where I said Ireland deserved to be fired?

    A guy has played 16 games in his career exactly once, and his injury is a surprise that the GM shouldn't have accounted for?
     
  9. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Doesn't mean it's the gms fault he got injured. Could happen to anyone. Again, since there is supposedly zero context to injuries as you two claim, Keller missed almost an entire NFL season due to injury, so it was a bad signing by Ireland since Keller took a helmet to the knee, yes or no???

    Also you can object as much as you want, doesn't make what I wrote any less factual. Terrible player and terrible evaluation in Jmart all around and the scandal centered around his mental instability... the worst oline and most sacks given up in our history on top of the contracts for the most pathetic linebacking crew. That's not even everything. That's the most glaring. There's plenty more for just last year. You know, all the reasons he was let go the same year. Object away.
     
  10. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Yeah i agree. And its pretty obvious. But according to some salty individuals he did no better than Ireland this year. It's hard to even type that without laughing
     
  11. Chad Muska

    Chad Muska Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You seem to be confused about many things. Nobody said it was the GM fault that players get injured. But health history is absolutely something very important to take into account when you sign a player. Hickey signed players who had an history of missing time. It was an easy to predict that a few of these guys would miss some time this year. Many posters even pointed to it before the season began. It happened. Just a coincidence I guess? Honestly I don't see how this is so hard to understand. If you don't get that, there is not much more to say.

    Nobody said Jonathan Martin was a good player. He was really bad. Nobody is saying Ireland did an amazing job. A lot of people are happy that he is gone. Me included.
     
  12. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You did it again.
    Stunning.
     
  13. Itsdahumidity

    Itsdahumidity X gonna take it from ya

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    Good. I look forward to back to back off-seasons of real talent acquisitions. You jeffy cultists are still hanging around huh?
     
    dWreck likes this.
  14. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    You're reading what I said and mustered up this? Did you even read what I responded to? I said myself that it's important to take injury history into consideration for player acquisitions. I never said Hickey did anything aside from a 'good' job. not great, not amazing, not bad. Good. I'm well aware no one said Ireland did an amazing job, I never said anything remotely close. HOWEVER, This entire thing started because someone compared Hickeys offseason to that of Irelands, which is ridiculousness in it's purest form. Especially taking last year into consideration.

    I'm not confused. Trust me. I understand that someone with the longest injury history imaginable can never get injured again, just as well as the opposite could be for someone with a clean history. It's chance.

    And actually, Several people were blaming Hickey for bringing in players with injury history, making it "his" fault, as if someone getting injured is a knock against a GM. It's not.
    Here's a quote to help with that pesky reading thing.

    "essentially a given" Lmfao. That's not blaming anything on the GM? interesting. By this measure, If a GM hires someone with an injury history and they don't get injured, they should be told they were just lucky because injuries are pretty much guaranteed to happen if you've been injured before. You can't have a rock solid back up plan for every single player that has any form of an injury history, give me a break.

    I absolutely LOVE the fact that everyone who is defending the absolutely ridiculous notion is completely ignoring my Keller statement.

    Since Keller had an injury history (almost an entire season out) and took a helmet to the knee on a low tackle, is that a knock against Ireland?????? Shouldn't he have known he was going to get hurt again? If the answer isn't 'yes' then there is no basis for that argument. Injuries have context, Sorry.

    Brent Grimes:
    Missed 2 games in 2010
    Hurt on an off over 9 games in 2011, missed a good chunk of time.
    Missed the entire 2012 season due to injury aside from game #1

    Thats 3 straight years absolutely Polluted with injury history. Was/Is he an easy prediction as well? When's he getting hurt next? Since the psychics you're referring you didn't mention anything.
     
  15. Chad Muska

    Chad Muska Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You talk about pesky reading. Maybe you should pay more attention to reading comprehension. The part you quoted never said it was the GM fault a player get injured. Not even close. He said it was part of the equation, meaning it is part of the evaluation the GM makes of a player before signing him. He said the GM didn't compensate for it, meaning he didn't have a good fall back option in case he gets injured. Can't believe I have to explain this. I guess Hickey must have thought the risk was worth it. He rolled the dice and got burned a bit.

    Of course an injury prone player might never get injured again, and a never injured player might get hurt at any time. Difference is you think all injuries depend only on randomness and bad luck. I think randomness and bad luck plays a huge part but also that some players are more durable while some are less. I think some players are more risky because of that. Disagree if you wish.

    Not sure what is so great about your Keller "statement". The guy was coming off a tough season dealing with injuries. He was signed only to a 1 year contract with Miami because he could not get the kind of contract he wanted elsewhere. Why? Because NFL GM are wary to give long term commitment to players with injury history. I wonder why that is the case since I learned today that injury history is irrelevant, all that matter is luck. Anyway Ireland took a chance on Keller, an injury prone player, who got injured early. That is the risk he chose to take and he got burned there because the team situation at TE looked very bleak at the time. He didn't KNOW that Keller would get injured, but I bet he knew it was a good possibility.

    If you still don't get that, just look at any year in Free Agency. Players with the best health history will be much more in demand and get bigger contracts while those coming off injury plagued season often have to wait longer and settle for short term. Probably just coincidence too.

    I guess it could make an an interesting strategy. In Free Agency, sign only players with shaky injury history. They will come cheaper. I'm sure you would approve.
     
  16. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I love Juice, but Sean Smith and Koa Misi were both good 2nd round picks. We'd have been ahead of the game to have re-signed Smith and not traded Vontae.
     
  17. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Didn't Sean Smith start full time as a rookie? Same with Misi.
     
  18. 305

    305 Brawndo Club Member

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    Get off my lawn.
    I'm not going to judge Hickey on one season with us... But I will be able to after I see how he handles some of Ireland's dead weight. Philbin is mediocre at best, but he can win with some better pieces. And Tannehill looks pretty good when the line holds up. Coyle has to go.
     
  19. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Misi will never sit well with Dolphins fans especially those that were pleadig for Gronkowski when he was there on our lap...

    Still As far as production goes Landry has already produced ten times better in his first year than any of the Ireland second round picks did as rookies
     
  20. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    double
     
  21. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Heh. Whatever you say, chief.

    Thankfully you butted into a back and forth, missed my context in it's entirety, and regurgitated what you thought was a counter-point to the wrong idea. Every time I mentioned it being directly the "GMs fault", was tongue in cheek. I'll simplify it for you so we don't go in circles anymore and you don't overheat. You don't 'fault' a GM for injuries. You don't 'knock' a GM for a player being injured by someone else. Period. It's not an argument. You don't.
     
  22. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Well, TBF, we needed a lot of players. About the only way to accomplish that is take some gambles on guys and sign them to low risk 1 year contracts.

    There are, after all, caps to the draft. The only thing with wiggle room is FAs and even then you have the salary cap. The only way to finagle that is by lowering contracts.
     
    Tin Indian likes this.
  23. Chad Muska

    Chad Muska Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    About what I expected: not much.

    See ya
     
  24. Chad Muska

    Chad Muska Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't mean that you can never take a chance on this kind of player. You sometimes strike gold on a bargain deal and you look like a genius. Sometimes you don't.

    And I don't see how you can let a GM completely off the hook when he signs injury prone players and guess what? What you expected happen...

    I'm not even saying Hickey did a bad job. But those comments how he was amazing in his fist year just seem too much.
     
  25. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I think Hickey's first draft was a solid meat and potatoes type. After the top 2 picks though, he did kind of gamble on greatness because he went mostly smaller programs the rest of the way. North Dakota State, Liberty, Montana, Coastal Carolina, and Marist. The only exception being Georgia. That was different than Ireland who seldom went away from BCS schools. The draft gets a C grade at the least, as it stands right now, but if by the end of next year, we get 2-3 more starters out of the group, it becomes a B+ or A IMO.

    Where Hickey really shined though was signing UDFAs. This group was the best I can ever remember in Miami. We have seen enough of Damien Williams to be optimistic about his future. Also Chris McCain was a great UDFA signing. Only two teams made an offer to him after the draft, us and the Rams. Glad he chose us to sign with. We still have not seen much of the several rookies that were stashed on IR for the year. Kamal Johnson, though he looked good last preseason, Davonte Wallace, 5th rounder Arthur Lynch, and Sammy Seamster. L'Damian Washington is a 6'4 and 195 lb rookie WR we've had on the PS for the past week or so and hopefully will sign to a future contract after the season. Emmanuel Dieke is a 6'6, 270 lb rookie DE we've had on the PS off and on all season. DeAndre Coleman is a massive rookie DT who just got signed to the 53 for the 2nd time this season. He may also be someone to watch in camp next year.
     
    Itsdahumidity likes this.
  26. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Are there people who really want to replace Dennis Hickey after one year?? A year in which he drafted a very promising group??

    It's not taboo, although I would disagree to not think he has started off very well....but to call for his head already?? Zero logic whatsoever.
     
  27. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I haven't been one that has claimed he was amazing, ftr.

    My point is, with the sheer amount of bodies we needed, he HAD to take that many injury risk guys on low deals. Its the only way to bring in that many players...other than signing scrubs to the same type of deal. Personally, in that specific scenario, I'll take the approach he took with guys with real upside over scrubs that aren't an injury risk. At the very least some of your young guys can learn from these guys and you'll get solid play from them when or if they get hurt.
     
    Tin Indian likes this.
  28. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    For the life of me I cannot understand how there are guys here trying to say that Hickey did no better than Ireland.

    I find that astonishing. I will grant anyone it is a one year sample and we don't know what he will do in the future but I'm honestly encouraged.

    And somehow he managed to do it without calling anyone's mother a prostitute. The embarrassment Ireland brought to us all with that one is enough to last a lifetime. But good ole Jeff somehow he managed to follow that up by drafting the Pilsbury Dough Boy who not only sucked but managed to launch us into an even bigger "scandal".
     
    Fin-Omenal likes this.
  29. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Well the bar Ireland left is very low, it has never left the ground actually, so doing better than him is not worthy of praise.

    I think Hickey had a solid first draft and offseason, but it is one season so I think we need to give it another offseason before we can really grade him. To me he gets an automatic C+ in 2015 if he gets rid of Wheeler, Ellerbe, Wallace and Hartline, and who he drafts would round out the rest of his grade.
     
  30. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    I've been against Wheeler and Ellerbe since we first brought them in... I remember I said on the other site that all we did was add speed with less tackling, we downgraded. How can those two possibly be an upgrade over Dansby and Burnett, even if you switch the defense to 3-4 or 4-3, you make Burnett and Dansby adjust to their new roles, cause you know, they're better linebackers by far?

    But all the know-it-alls had to defend their Ireland-boo with the typical "you an arm chair GM! IRELAND REAL GM!"

    The sooner we cut those two, the better I'll feel abobut our defense..
     
  31. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    Not gonna get an argument from me there. I had higher hopes for Ellerbe and the move back to the outside would probably benefitted him greatly, but we'll never know.
    Wheeler on the other hand never made any sense at all.

    Both of those guys need their walking papers.
     
  32. Chad Muska

    Chad Muska Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I haven't seen a signle post calling for his head.

    I didn't mean that you did.
     
  33. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Good, that would be pathetic at this point.
     
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  34. Piston Honda

    Piston Honda Well-Known Member

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    I can't speak to a Irish vs Hickey comparison other than to say Hickey seems to be more willing to defer to Philbin's wishes. What I can say is that by the end all fairness had pretty much left the stage in terms of grading Ireland and had he done the exact same things that Hickey has done he'd most likely be getting killed for it.
     
  35. Piston Honda

    Piston Honda Well-Known Member

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    Ellerbe and Wheeler (and Jordan) were acquired to play a defense that Coyle doesn't run. Hindsight is 20/20 but I'd love to see what would have happened had we kept Bowles, let him run out 3-4 on D, while Philbin handled the offense. Best of both worlds imo.
     
  36. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Wheeler fits better as a 4-3 OLB, especially Sam, than anywhere else. That's where he's had his best season. He kind of made sense, if we'd had a hole at OLB, which we didn't until after Wheeler was signed and Burnett cut.
    Ellerbe though, was a head scratcher. He did his best work as a 3-4 ILB. Even then he was just a middle of the road player, certainly not worthy of the deal our Jeffy boy gave him. The Ravens must have laughed their butts off, when they saw that, and were able to sign a better player in Daryl Smith for a fraction of what Ellerbe got.
    Jordan IMO fits any defense, if he is allowed to play standing up on as an OLB.
     
  37. Piston Honda

    Piston Honda Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking Irish wanted Wheeler next to Ellerbe at ILB, a good rotation with those two and Misi, Jenkins as a nickel LB. Meanwhile Jordan, Wake and Vernon play outside. Soliai, Starks, Wake, Shelby at DL, that's a good front with depth and versatility.
     
  38. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    When the pair were signed, Coyle and his 4-3 were already here. So it would make the most sense that they were signed to fill the two spots vacated when Dansby and Burnett were later cut. I don't see why you think they'd have been signed to play ILB together in a 3-4, when the 3-4 left with Nolan a year prior.
     

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