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Worst play call in NFL history?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Bumrush, Feb 1, 2015.

  1. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    True... but.... Marshawn Lynch. Behind one large full back.
     
  2. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    First of all, the goal isn't to use all 4 downs, it's to get the TD so I'd dial up the play that has the highest probability of that, which I think many agree is to give the ball to Marshawn Lynch (he only needs 1 yard).

    Second of all, you can get 3 plays off with 26 seconds and one timeout, especially since the ball will be at the previous line of scrimmage if Lynch is stopped. First play will take 5-8 seconds? In a hurry up offense, you're going to be able to get a second play in after say 15 seconds? So yeah you can get 3 plays in with 26 seconds left.
     
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  3. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    If they were going to pass on that down - they should have done a fade to Matthews so it would not be intercepted.

    But, the momentum was with Seattle. They were smokin' and Lynch would not have been denied, imo. And, Caroll's reasoning was that they could use their TO to get two more runs. If so, well, then, just run it twice. There is still a chance to get three plays with a TO. But, with Lynch the way he was playing? I'd take my chances with only two plays and two runs from Lynch and I'd go home and be happy. If the Pats stop Lynch at the goal-line kudos to them.

    The other option is to run the read-option with Lynch and Wilson. Those are the two best options up close. So, if they centered on Lynch and Wilson reads an opening - he can run it in. Wilson is a great runner - was almost untouchable in that game.

    I think Belichick decided he was going to trust his D to stop them and not call a TO. I was thinking they should call a TO but I also know what that does to the D's confidence and the benefit it gives Seattle to think about what they will do - so, I got that.
     
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  4. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    In hindsight the decision to pass wasn't that bad. The throw from Wilson wasn't that bad. The break by Butler was beyond excellent. The strength of Lockette was ... weaksauce.

    And I was wondering WTF Bill's not calling a TO. And in the end it worked. He calls a TO and they run the ball four times.
     
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  5. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Well, to each his own, but I view it like almost everyone else does.. I think the decision to pass was terrible.
     
  6. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Last year he went the entire season, including playoffs, without throwing the ball more than 33 times in a single game. He won a playoff game completing 9 passes. He could have the best YPA of all time, that's damn difficult for any other qb to get away with while winning a Super Bowl.

    I think there's some middle ground here. I think we can agree he's good and also benefits from a historically good defense and damned good running game.
     
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  7. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    But as I said, he had 35+ dropbacks in 5 games in 2013. Ignore that if you like. Try and discard it on the basis of some technicality because he chose to make defenses look silly by stealing 1st downs with his legs, if you choose. But doing so amounts to nothing more than making an attempt at a paper argument that bears no weight on the football field, or on film.

    No quarterback that has ever won a Super Bowl has ever done so by themselves. Not Joe Montana, John Elway, and certainly not Tom Brady. Has he gotten help to win as much as he has? Absolutely. Have they all? You bet.

    I don't know what the need is for middle ground. I'm telling you that the player is CURRENTLY playing at a Hall of Fame pace. Because that is absolutely one hundred and fifty percent true. No Hall of Fame bid was made in three years so obviously he has more to go. But if he continues at this pace, he's in the Hall and there's no need for an opposition viewpoint or a middle ground between opposing viewpoints, because that just is what it is.
     
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  8. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Thee...Ohio State University

    Too expand on that? John Elway didn't win a Super Bowl until he had a top 5 defense and a 2,000 yard Running back. I won't mention a top 3 TE ever and a borderline HOF WR....and that OL was pretty damn good too.
     
  9. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    noone is falling all over him, you say he's a great qb, thats what you said, then i agree, and when I think someone is great and some folks say that that opinion is overrated or wrong then I argue and stand up for the pick, thats all...I don't know where rooting for him to emplode comes in buddy but ok..lol..
     
  10. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Precisely right. They all get help to win a championship because it's damn hard to win a championship.

    I mean John Elway got to throw to Rod Smith, Easy Ed McCaffrey and Shannon Sharpe to go along with Terrell Davis. What does Russell Wilson have? Doug Baldwin, Jermaine Kearse, Ricardo Lockette, Chris Matthews and Luke Wilson to go along with Marshawn Lynch? That's it?
     
  11. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    I think it is evident to most that Wilson is a special player who is still getting better, I wouldn't call him "great" at the moment but I think when it's said and done he has a shot at that title. He's a playmaker, he's a winner, he's a franchise QB.
     
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  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    thats good sh^% man..dig it.

    hope everyone likes apples..
     
  13. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    no'one has ever said he's a great ''passer'', Ive just said that he's a great dual threat ''QB'', and has shown that with that type of skill set it is a fine recipe for success in this league.

    I think its time to find the term that describes the totality of his game instead of trying to isolate him into some box.

    its not about perfect passing crap, or does he go thru all his progressions or what throws does he do well or bad, its about understanding the total impact his skill set has on every play, to sense the type of urgency he plays with on every down, the intelligence to know when to bail and buy time, and the athletic ability to do whatever he wants on a field against the best in the world..dude is great..
     
  14. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Yes, that's exactly what they should've done. If you run and get stuffed, then oh well. But you have to put the ball in the hands of your best player, the best power back in football and trust him to get 1 yard. If he doesn't....THEN you can pass on 3rd and 4th down. And if you throw the INT then it's easier to swallow.

    I feel comfortable saying it's the worst play-call I've ever seen. Lynch scores the Touchdown, no doubt in my mind.
     
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  15. cdz12250

    cdz12250 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Why pass? To do the unexpected? When you have the proven ability to impose your will on the defense on short runs like that? This is one yard we're talking about. It didn't have to be up the gut. But you have to do whatever you can to maintain possession. Can't score without the ball. You throw it, you're putting possession up in the air, literally. Makes zero sense to me.
     
  16. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    If Carrol was really worried about time on the clock, then you have to really question why they burned two timeouts on that drive.
    Horrible clock management.
     
  17. Lloyd Heilbrunn

    Lloyd Heilbrunn Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    An non football fan friend posted this on Facebook, lol:

    "That was the first superbowl I have ever watched and even I was like WTF are you doingggggg"
     
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  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I like how there's essentially no comment that when he drops back to pass 35+ times in a game, he's basically a 4300 yard passing, 30 touchdown, 900 yards rushing quarterback.

    Comment?

    Nope.

    "But what happens when Seattle needs to lean on him 35+ times a gaaaaaaame..."
     
  19. WhiteIbanez

    WhiteIbanez Megamediocremaniacal

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    Too many bad things can happen. Forcing the football into middle of that D. You could see a tipped ball or maybe an int with 20 seconds left in the SB. :wink2:
     
  20. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    ive rewatched that interception a million times, and i cant believe Butler actually held onto the ball lol that was an incredible catch he made. Looks simple at first but the guy was running towards the ball and Wilson threw a fastball... 99% of the time that ball gets knocked down... Especially from an undrafted rookie... Goodness.. That was just terrible luck by Wilson but an incredible catch by Butler. More impressive than Kearse' catch in my opinion.
     
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  21. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    He really did make a heck of a play. And on that Kearse catch he had some pretty strong presence of mind to get up and push Kearse out of bounds. A lot of guys would have loafed around and look dumbstruck as Kearse ran into the end zone.
     
  22. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    and carroll keeps denying that they screwed up...you run on 2nd, if he doesn't make it, you call timeout, then you roll wilson out giving him a pass run option into the end zone, then you have fourth down to do whatever..

    he didnt play the percentages, the strengths of his team, the momentum, the lowest risk play on 2nd down...

    he needs to standup and say they bleeped up..
     
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  23. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    16 games with 35 passing reps..one full season of data...4300 yards passing..900 yards rushing...lol...are you serious..

    where you at????

    ... thats what I thought..

    come on man, we just playin..

    folks try to talk sh&^ and say if he had to throw as much as ryan does, then he wouldn't do well...well ok, where you gonna go to now..

    oy yeah, marshawn Lynch..defense..
     
  24. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I just watched that play in super slo mo...kearse chokes, he pulls up during the route, lets say de-celerates to the spot, lets say pu$$ied out on the route..like real bad..

    not wilsons fault at all, but he took the blame..good man..

    anyone wanna keep talking sh^% ill stay in this thread all freakin year..
     
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  25. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    It's a lost cause. People will not change their opinion on Wilson, even if Seattle gets a competent receiving corp and he puts up 4500 yard, has a 3 to 1 TD ratio and rushes for a thousand yards. They will say his WR's inflated his stats.
     
  26. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Not only are Rusell Wilson's numbers incredible, but the impact he has on that offense and the defense as a result that do not show up in his personal statistics is even more incredible.

    The guy avoids sacks, extends plays, and makes something out of nothing better than any quarterback I've ever seen. And that's not hyperbole.
     
  27. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Do you mean Lockette on the route? Because I agree with that.

    PLUS Kearse does a poor job of pushing his defender into the path of the other DB for the 'rub' to make sure Lockette is open.

    It's a multiple level eff-up... O.C. calls bad play... H.C. approves.... QB chooses to go with the play as called... Kearse fails to push CB into other CB's path.... Lockette fails to fight for position on high-contact route to win a Superbowl.... and CB makes great play with determination and anticipation because he says... Patriots Coaches have prepared them to recognize that look.


    So what you have is a contribution from the Seahawks players and coaches, and the New England PLayers and Coaches all in one play.

    Which is why, sadly, New England deserved to win.

    I hate ****ing saying that.
     
  28. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    "HAND IT TO MARSHAWN!!!" is now the Seattle equivalent of "LACES OUT!!!"
     
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  29. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    I'd noticed Butler with a couple other nice plays that quarter too, prior to the ending. He was really playing sharp.
     
  30. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    The Good News? Philbin will be studying and emulating this.
     
  31. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box


    Fortunately the Seahawks had the LOB. But they were all injured and hobbled by the Superbowl. Wilson still almost pulled it off.

    I mean, this is a third year player we are talking about. Already been to more Superbowls than Dan Marino.


    Won more too.


    Just sayin'.
     
  32. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    It implicitly shows up in his rushing stats and to a lesser degree in the passing stats. But yeah, I agree that he makes something out of nothing better than perhaps anyone ever. My only question is whether he will be able to do that in 5 years or so. Often QB's that rely on mobility get game-planned against over time (guys like Vick really come to mind..), but so far he seems to be able to do it as well as ever.
     
  33. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box


    True. And you know, to argue the other side for a moment, if Seattle had won then many in New England would have been criticizing Belichick heavily for those timeout decisions at the end.

    Does than make him a bad coach, instead of one of the best ever?

    Sometimes we infer too much from too little.

    Seattle lost a game. They executed a play poorly. They are still a dominant team with a great Head Coach and wunderkind QB and talented young defense. Who wouldn't gladly trade what we have here for that?
     
  34. bran

    bran Senior Member

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    yeah the route was awful.
     
  35. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Look at this angle.. it was just an incredible play lol Still don't know how he manage to catch that ball after a shoulder bump/running with a full head of steam/Wilson throwing a fastball.

    [video=youtube;RgloErF-H2c]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgloErF-H2c[/video]
     
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  36. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    I don't see the issue in giving all the credit in the world to this Butler kid. He played this perfectly. This pass is probably a TD, or at least incomplete, the vast majority of the time.

    This was a fun game. Someone had to make a play and the rookie did.
     
  37. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Seeing it from this angle even if Lockette catches it he's not making it to the end zone. But at least they'd still have the ball. Butler breaks on the route before the ball is even thrown. Maybe Wilson never saw him, or misjudged how fast he was going to get there.
     
  38. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I heard him say they coached him up on this play. He sure sniffed it out and committed full speed. Impressive.
     
  39. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    On this play the read for Wilson is the spacing and the assignment. He's not supposed to try and somehow judge how fast Butler is coming on the play or some such. Butler had the spacing and assignment that dictated the throw.

    But he knew the play was coming, and he played it exactly how you coach it, and Ricardo Lockette pulled up because he sensed contact. I'm sure it wasn't a voluntary thing Lockette did, but it was nonetheless the incorrect thing to do and those instincts to shy away from contact cost the Seahawks the Super Bowl. The worst the play should have been was incomplete.
     
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  40. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I noticed Wilson peeking over right before the snap. I bet that tipped them off to a pass.

    Butler didn't flinch on the half assed fake by Lockette and not even a step after Lockette breaks Butler is already on the move. Amazing.
     

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