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The Official Tannehill Sucks/Doesn't Suck Thread

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Fin D, Sep 6, 2015.

  1. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You sure are posting a lot in a thread you called the stupidest ever by the worst poster ever. Interesting.
     
  2. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Like I thought, can't answer it.

    For the record, you said that me talking about receivers and oline is deflecting. Too bad both those units are extremely important in any discussion of any QB. Your quote:

    You clearly give no credence to the idea that the receivers or oline struggling negatively impact a Tannehill's overall stats. You completely disregard them as being important when evaluating Tannehill's performance. NEVER have I said they were the only problem, that's something you've invented.

    If you can't understand the relationship between his receivers sucked, so how much was Tannehill really struggling, then I can't help you.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  3. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    You know how it works man. You're arguing with someone who speaks in extremes. Singular criticisms = OH EM GEE HE SED HE SUKZ!!1!

    Unfortunately there will always be plenty of "booger eater" logic when it comes to fan forums. The worst will be if Tanny takes the real step. It'll be endless about how much winning will be due to our QB ...... which is what we want, but will be entirely ironic given their "It's a team sport and the rest of the team has failed him" stance.

    I'm still waiting for them to produce that list of legendary QB's with poor win-loss records and lackluster situation stats (i.e. 4th quarter and when the team is trailing).
     
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  4. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    By this logic our Wrs and OL (funny i know) must have really stepped it up after those 3 games because they were no longer in Tannehills way he was able to play better.

    Yuppers.
     
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  5. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's sad that we need a thread for this ****. It's nice though, hopefully I'll never visit it again and see this garbage.
     
  6. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    AAAAAAAAAAnnnnd that's why I created this thread.
     
  7. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Then you sir, deserve a thank you.

    Wait, did I just say that? :lol:

    :hi5:
     
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  8. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    How many people have said Ryan sucks in this thread?? You had the right idea in creating a thread discussing our QB, you just failed miserably with the stupid title.
     
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  9. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    So...you don't believe the receivers stepped their play up as compared to the first three games or so?

    Does admitting the receivers played poorly somehow mean that Tannehill didn't also struggle somewhat? I don't understand your reticence to actually admit that all the problems weren't actually all Tannehill's fault. I mean, I thought this was the new and improved, objectively looking at Tannehill, Fin-Omenal...
     
    MikeHoncho likes this.
  10. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You guys really think they had that much info? They would never lose the game if they had that much info. You're ignoring the part where they said Ernie Adams was wrong 75% of the time or more even.

    It's pretty irrational to believe they had that much insight. Did they attempt to cheat? Absolutely they did it's pretty obvious now. But how successful were there especially with the countermeasures all the other teams. It only worked on teams like the bills and dolphins apparently
     
  11. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    I never mentioned any cheating. :shifty:
     
  12. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Again Baby 'D'...ive never said anything was all his fault. So when you trybto use that as some "point" youre trying to make you sound silly.

    Ive expressed my feelings on our QB enough times that i dont need to explain where I stand with him. I just have no problem stating what i feel he has struggled at in years past and point out he needs to improve on.

    I call it logic, you call it hating.
     
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  13. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Look, I've always been a big Tanne fan, but I'm not going to say I haven't had my criticisms. I was one of the first to complain about some issues like his reads and yes, his deep ball and inability to hit and especially not see a 10 yard open Wallace. I'm not talking about a 10 yard open Wallace after players have already broken off the coverage. I'm talking about a mofo'n 10 yard open Wallace. However, I agree with those that say it isn't all his fault and there is A LOT to like about him and he shouldn't take all the blame for every issue whislt ignoring the other factors. I'm psyched he's our QB and he's done some great things here. He has improved in so many ways and if you remember, the last couple of games last year, he was getting better at just letting the deep ball rip without thinking too much. He was taking big steps and was doing good and showed much signs of improvements in that area. I just hope he can keep that going and doesn't take too long to build or rebuild that chemistry and develop the muscle memory, confidence and swagger, etc, etc, etc. Certainly appeared to have it going this preseason. I am more than keeping the faith as we all are or should be. :pointlol::up:
     
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  14. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    All the reports about the room full of information that was shredded under Goodell's sight kinda lean toward that, so ya. But the real cherry on top was the comms...that part's significance can NOT be understated.

    Whether Earnie was right 10 or 100% of the time doesn't matter...BB had what he needed.

    And I'm sure every Cheatriots fan on the planet thinks it's irrational...
     
  15. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    For the last time, where in the title did I accuse anyone of anything? You are taking a non accusation as an accusation. That reflects on you not me.

    This is simply identical to the Philbin thread which I made right BEFORE this one. Even the first post is almost identical.

    The only failure here is you, once again, getting your ample panties bunched for nothing. No one attacked you in the title. No one insulted you in the title. No one insulted anyone in the title.

    Really the only real insulting happening in this thread is you and your gang attacking me and resnor, per usual.
     
  16. shamegame13

    shamegame13 Madison & Surtain

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    At least make the thread title "Ryan Tannehill is greatest QB ever/Ryan Tannehill sucks" to represent the 5%'ers that think he is gods gift and since you guys seemingly wanna skip that middle grey area where he belongs.
     
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  17. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    There's no need to do it, because it doesn't imply anything or insult anyone.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Here's a thought...you don't have to come out and say it's all Tannehill's fault, if when people point out where the oline and receivers failed him massively, you ignore it, and say that those people are simply making excuses for Tannehill. If you truly believed it was not all his fault, then you wouldn't continue to disregard the wealth of information pertaining to how receivers and oline impact a QBs performance.

    But you do ignore and disregard. You aren't in the least bit balanced in you take on Tannehill, yet you continue to argue that those of us looking at the entire offense as a whole, instead of only Tannehill, are somehow less balanced than you.

    For the record, any discussion is any QB will involve discussion of their weapons and their protection. It's silly to try to remove those things from any evaluation of a QB, especially when using passing stats or wins/losses as your criteria.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  19. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    The fact that Tanne's 4th quarter rating is 18 points below his rating in the first 3 quarters is why we aren't winning more than 8 games, and until that changes we won't be a legit team.

    13 of the 16 games played were decided in the 4th quarter, 11 games with the lead in the 4th, 1 tied and 1 game trailing by 1 in the 4th, but we should have had the lead, Tanne misses wide open Wallace vs Ravens, from the 11 yard line, inexcusable.

    comp% in first 3 quarters around 70%

    comp% in 4th quarter 56%

    rating in first 3 quarters around 98

    rating in 4th quarter 79.9

    Same Oline, same WRs, same coaches

    SAME QB

    No need to wonder why we're not winning, change those stats and we'll win, pretty simple.
     
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  20. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    You are delusional. If the defense doesnt completely s**t the bed while tannehill is watching on the side line 3+ times last year we are in the playoffs and this isn't even a topic. Did you miss a quarter of our games?
     
  21. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    So, here we go:

    Do you believe that the oline being a turnstile helped or hindered Tannehill's ability to throw the ball late in games? How often did we watch teams send 4 guys, in obvious passing downs late in games, and see the pressure come in under 2.5 seconds, from multiple places? When 4 guys are rushing and getting intense, quick pressure, you have 7 guys in coverage. Does Tannehill need to be better? Sure, maybe. But, how fair is it to lay it all on Tannehill when his oline is getting destroyed by 4 guys? You create a false narrative, saying that the only way to win is to change Tannehill's stats, implying that the burden is all on Tannehill. Again, you are ignoring the effect that the oline and receiver play has on the QB. We could just as easily see those stats being better had receivers played better, or the oline had played average football.

    Why didn't you post the stat about 4th quarter when Dolphins were trailing by 7 or less? Tannehill had a very good rating in those situations. Perhaps that was because the defense couldn't just assume pass in those situations?

    You look at everything from one perspective: that Tannehill needs to improve. Here's my perspective: Tannehill can improve all he wants, but if the oline continues to be sh!t, and allows 4 rushers to get intense pressure, then Tannehill will continue to struggle to find receivers when there are 7 guys in coverage. I'm saying it right now, if we get AVERAGE play from our oline this year, our offense will be very good. I'm hoping we get to see what the offense is like when the receivers and oline play at least average football. The ignorant will try to credit Tannehill, and talk about what a leap he made. The only way I'll be giving a ton of credit to Tannehill is if his oline sucks bad again, and he puts up even better stats than last season.

    Sorry for all the excuses.
     
  22. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    you must be a Patriots fan.
     
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  23. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    This is even a discussion?

    Put it this way, Opening Day, Sunday..and the Qb for your Miami Dolphins is:

    -Sage Rosenfils
    -Cleo Lemon
    -John Beck (who is starting for my CFL team, the BC Lions..Lord help me)
    -Chad Henne

    THill has those losses around his neck, most of the time, b/c the D collapses and USUALLY Sturgis has missed a makeable FG.

    His 4th Qtr accuracy bothers me, no doubt about it, keep in mind he is an ascending player who has operated behind a dreadful offensive line most of his career, to me what he has accomplished is impressive and noteworthy.
     
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  24. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    It's hilarious how the team doesn't "let him down" in those other quarters when his numbers are good - but come time for the 4th quarter (and most times we're trailing) those numbers take a serious dive and suddenly it's the team around him that's mostly responsible for it.
     
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  25. Linus

    Linus Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well there's context to the numbers too. When they're in obvious passing situations, the line has gotten completely dominated in big-time situations (all of 2013 and the second half last year) which may account for the drop off. Last year when they were only trailing by 7 or less in the 4th quarter (defense still had to defend the run), his 4th quarter rating was right on par with the other quarters.

    In his rookie year, the 4th quarter was his highest rated quarter....did he become un-clutch since then?
     
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  26. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    It's possible. Extrapolating future performance based on 1 year (let alone a rookie year) wouldn't seem very sound.

    I find the "obvious passing downs" a bit of a misnomer though. That happens more than in just the 4th quarter and when we're trailing. Is there some stat to support that notion though?
     
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  27. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, its not like that noob Joe Philbin didn't say the exact same thing to Tannehill last year and again throughout the preseason....obviously he didn't understand what was really happening either.
     
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  28. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Its hilarious how some 'fans' shrug off things like 'worst line in the nfl' 'most sacks in the nfl' 'WR core consisting of Hartline as a #1 best option' as if they are normal for other teams and not some of the most difficult things a young QB would have to deal with.... He gets told they are excuses because.... dolphins.
     
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  29. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    Not shrugging it off at all. We need better out of that unit - much better. But it was a symbiotic relationship between a very inconsistent O-line and a QB who still to this day needs work on his command of the pocket. He lacks that natural feel of a rush and when to step up or slide around.

    I hope to see that improve this year, since he's got more experience under Lazor's offense and it'll be less likely to be swimming in his own head.
     
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  30. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Not saying its you per-se but there is a reoccuring theme with a few posters here who do shrug it off as just 'excuses'. Which is bull****, frankly. Id love to see they themselves play qb behind an equivalent line with equivalent receivers at ANY level of play and be told they are just making excuses for not being clutch enough, also while your defense single-handedly loses a quarter of your season.
     
  31. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    While at the same time, comparing him to all-time top 3 QBs. Happens often.
     
  32. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Id like to see some quotes on that one. As much of a tanny homer as I am I dont recall anyone saying he is comparable to an all time great. That is agreeably just as bad, but seems farfetched.
     
  33. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I think you misunderstand what he's saying. The people who criticize Tannehill, then compare him to guys like Rodgers or Manning, and then conclude that he's somehow bad because he isn't as good as them right now. So, they disregard the poor support that Tannehill gets, then compare his stats to all-time greats, and say, "See? He's not very good."
     
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  34. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Since I can see one of Rock's last posts, due to it being quoted by Dcfiero, I'll address it:

    It's all well and good to say that he needs to improve pocket presence, but my issue is, when you say he needs to sense pressure, and step up or slide around, are you considering last season, when he would try to climb the pocket, since the edges were destroyed, and he would get hit from the rush up the middle? Or, when he would try to slide away from pressure up the middle, only to get hit by pressure from the outside? I would like to see Tannehill have a pocket that doesn't give up pressure from all angles, routinely, before sitting back and saying that he has terrible pocket presence.
     
  35. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    I think he needs to improve pocket presence too even though I'd lay most of the blame for sacks/pressures on the OL and not him. Why? Because there were enough times where it looked like it was more the QB's fault than the OL.

    I'd also add that some of the blame should be on the coaches because it seems like they haven't given Tannehill the freedom to change the play on the spot as much as they could. Give the man more responsibility for the play called and I think he'll show better pocket awareness as well as when to run.
     
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  36. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Ohhhh I gotcha. my apologies to PF1968 then, I did misread it.
     
  37. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yes, I would agree with all this. I get some people think of Tannehill as a mobile QB, and they want him to escape pressure like Russell Wilson, but, Russell Wilson can run like Barry Sanders, and Tannehill cannot do that. I also think that when you have a weak spot on your oline, you can plan for it, and understand that pressure may come from that spot, so you're better able to react to it. When it's every spot on your oline, you can't really react, and you can't be decisive in trying to break free of the pocket, so you end up stuck in a pocket that is collapsing around you.
     
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  38. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    Go away. You hit me with the melodramatic, tween-angsty post about being put on ignore ...... at least stick to it.
     
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  39. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    I found it to be more like 60/40 O-line to QB. If Tanny cleans that up, the sack numbers don't look quite so atrocious.
     
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  40. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Where is Fin D? I can't enjoy an argument without him.
     
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