Official Dolphin vrs Jets suck game thread

Hate to even bring this up but lazor's ridiculously bad game plans are another "positive" for the pro-tannehill camp... He definitely hasn't helped tanny with any good creative plans that's for damn sure. Still undecided on the debate myself oh well all we can do is keep watching and keep bleeding aqua and orange lol...

 

Yeah Lazor is absolutely part of the problem, along with the O line, and Tannehills lack of continued growth. Like I said, QBs have bad years, it happens. Rivers and both Eli Manning had rough years recently. Not saying Tannehill is on their level, but I don't think he's plateaud as a quarterback. I think he just had a down year in a transitional season where changes were made. He'll have his third offensive coordinator in four years by the start of next season. I expect different results from him in year five. We all knew he was a five year project and next year will be his last in Miami unless he can deliver. As frustrated as we all are, lets remember the circumstances he's dealing with. A crappy coordinator, a horrific O line, and a shotty defense.
Not giving him a pass by any means (he gets a lot of blame as well), I just think the blame should be equally spread all the way around. If people are going to solely blame THill and ignore everything other atrocity surrounding this team then they are ignorant.

 

Agree 100%, especially with the last sentence

 

thank! You!

 

I agree with the premise of your post. When you're throwing negative yard passes to 3 yard passes, you might as well run it. Get out of the damn shotgun and pound it straight ahead with Ajayi. With that said though, you're going to end up in a lot of 3rd and 8+ which we know our passing game isn't going to pick up. It's near impossible to sustain balance when your offense can't convert on 3rd down. It's not nearly as simple as "run the ball for a yard more often ". The fins have nothing to lose though, Thill has proven over and over again that he can't put up points through the air. He is completely dependent on his supporting staff and they haven't been very supportive lately. Even on a 3rd a d 3, he's dependent on a rb breaking 2 tackles when the first guy is lined up for a blindside.

A few things I disagree with however is the complaining about the run on 3rd n 25. Ajayi had just as much chance of picking up 25 yrs than Thill does throwing a 3 yard route to Landry in that situation. Just throw a hail Mary prayer up at that point in the game. It's just nitpicking that play call tho when you consider we can't pick up a 3rd n 5 through the air, let alone 3rd n 25.

You mention trading Miller (a free agent) and Ajayi a (rookie)? Not very feasible considering the deadline has passed.

 

I wish I could say I enjoyed watching the Fins make a mockery out of football. The only thing embarrassing is fans thinking we re a hc or OC away from being respectable. Just like Philbin before him, Lazor needs to go but similarly he's far from our only or even biggest problem. I said this team needed a lot more than a coaching change before Philbin got canned. We need talented players more so than coaches. It just makes things that much worse when you've got knumbskulls like Philbin, Lazor and Campbell (if he's not involved in O he needs to be).

 

Lazor would be be lucky to coach in college after this season.

 

You are absolutely right that we are more likely Head coach or OC away from being good.... But for holy hell, does every single post by the same group of posters have to be negative 24/7... We all see what's happening. Extremely tiring just to hear people beat up on this punching bag of a team. God forbid someone has the audacity to post a little optimism... People come out like cockroaches to quell it.. Too many posters are finding way too much joy in our misery


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

We all wish this were true. Lazor is clueless this year but he's far from our biggest problem. If only it were as easy as just replacing the OC. When your oline can't run block, is inconsistent pass blocking (mostly 1 guy getting slapped around), and your QB is below average it doesn't matter who is calling the plays. Replacing Lazor will likely help but it's not going to be the difference between a bottom 5 offense and a league avg or better one. How many playmakers does this team have? We don't or can't use our te in the passing game, one of our few mismatch guys and our best boundary wr is Matthews. This team and offense is pitiful and lacks tslent. No amount of coaches changed will solve that. Coaching changes and mediocre QB play go hand in hand.

 

I'm optimistic on some of our younger guys. Specifically Ajayi and Parker had a nice game. I'm concerned with his lack of crispness if you will but he looks like he could be a part of the puzzle going forward. We need to get Ajayi. Parker and McCain a lot more pt. There's just not much to be positive about man. Anybody taking the time to post on this board as Dolphins fans aren't enjoying this. You're taking disgust and fed up with joy.

 

No one is enjoying this mess. Theres not a single thing i find amusing about not having a quarterback nor coaching staff, nor a competent front office. Nothing at all funny about that.

What is amusing to me are the posters that argue that this mediocre player is better than he actually is. You all are so desperate for a franchise quarterback, Henne gets all the love and support, Tannehill gets all the love and support. Youre blinded by this desperation that you cant see that hes not the guy.

The excuses are getting pathetic now.

Even if we fixed our offensive line, the talent at quarterback shows we are no better than the Kansas City Chiefs (offensively), defensively theyre way over our league. But offensively, we would still be a borderline first round/8-8 team.

 

[video=twitter;671131053130711040]https://twitter.com/star_island25/status/671131053130711040[/video]

 

To everyone bashing Bill Lazor. Please share with us which plays he should have been calling.

 

There's plenty of things wrong with this team outside of Tannehill but I don't know what's so damn hard about separating Tannehill's poor play and the rest of the team. If I had a dollar for everytime some fan who can't judge for himself said "we can't judge him until we get good wrs...and then ol and then hc then oc...Tannehill made plenty of **** plays today that had nothing to do with his lack of support around him. Some fans can separate the two and others just throw all the evidence out because a pass gets dropped or Fox gets plowed over. You'll come to learn that 1 sack negates any bad throws/decisions by Thill. 1 drop negates a dozen inaccurate throws and 1 deep pass completion a game negates any criticism toward Thill.

 

Honestly when you miss a wide open receiver down the field and check it down to a fully blanketed Parker...

I think if you get the coaching film you will see several missed plays..

With that said i still would want a new OC and DC. A new head cosch is bringing his own staff anyways so it will happen.

 

I don't think I've seen anybody solely blame Tannehill. I've seen people absolve him of any responsibility and I've seen people say he's PART of the problem.

 

One example... on the INT to Stills.. from what I remember, there's 3 guys running routes. Parker, and the RB were both within about 3 yards of the LOS, and Stills was the only one remotely close to the first down marker. I'll judge more when I watch the game again later in the week.

However, Pretty obvious where we're going with the ball, no? Now, that doesn't excuse the terribly late, and off target throw, but it's a pretty good example IIRC.

 

Lamar Miller had 5 carries.

Tannehill threw 58 passes.

That's all we need to know.

 

clearly had we run 30 times we would've won. Lazor's an idiot but the Thill homers are slowly running out of other people to blame. What's so hard about admitting he's part of the problem?

 

I don't deny for a second that the play calling could be better. What I want to put out there is that good QBs aren't thriving on great playcalling. Tannehill isn't doing his OC or his teammates any real favors. The defense wins about 50 percent of the time, no one is open off the play design, then what happens? Better QBs make something happen on a decent percentage of those plays. RT rarely if ever makes plays the aren't really there.

 

Ok... so, you ask for an example of a bad playcall, I give you one, and you deflect it to the QB making a better play out of nothing? Ok... so... why did you ask again?

I'm not about to defend Ryan for much from the last 3 games, he hasn't played well. We all know that. However, it has to be mentioned, just how bad everything is around him. It's hard to be a solution to the problem, when everything around you is part of the problem.

I can't stand the fact he stands there like a ****ing moron in the pocket that's basically non existant. However, I think he's viewing it as... this is the play... I'm going to do what I can to make it work. While that's a strength, it's a strength to a fault with him. That's the way they've coached him.

I agree, if nobody is open, do something. Anything. Just do it, make a play. Again, I'd have to see it again and I'm enjoying this glass of wine too much to go back and watch that debacle again, but theres alot of stuff going on in these plays where there's about 2 downfield options, and everything else is short. People want to call them checkdowns, and in a sense, sure, they are. However it's not the QB going, damn, I'm too afraid to throw downfield, its more like... damn, there's my two options covered, im about to get killed because Dallas Thomas and Jason Fox suck, so I'll throw to the short guys.

It's a very poorly designed offense most of the time IMO. It's too much east/west, not enough north.

Again, because everyone's so jump around here lately, I'm not defending Ryan. I'm just saying, Lazor is leaving a whole lot to be desired. We dont have a run game because our OL sucks. I think LAzor is somewhat right in trying some quick, safe passes to gain a few yards similar to run plays to be safe, and get yourself in better positions on 2nd and third down, but he relies on it way too much. You can't abandon the run completely.

bottom line for me, we're really hamstrung right now by a poor OL, and an poor offensive scheme, and poor execution by everyone (yes, including RT) on the offense.

 

Watching get the game on my dvr and reading along. Just a truly LOL comment. Thanks for the laugh!

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk

 

Really good post, tons of respect bro. I'll have a more in depth response later but like u I am sipping heavily lol.

 

I hear you.

I'll know/feel more when I re-watch the game later. I know though, I re-watched that play several times this afternoon, and was mind blown. Pretty sure on the next drive, the pass to Parker into double coverage that was almost picked, was the same thing. Parker was the only WR downfield, everyone else was short of the first down. Talk about holding your QB and offense hostage...

I'm not saying there aren't other plays where guys are downfield and Ryan is checking down, I'm sure he is. This offense is based on pre-snap reads, with little audible flexibility. Lazor, is similar to Philbin, control freak IMO. You just aren't going to be successful that way. I get Lazor's reasoning, the OL... but.. at some point, he's got to realize... with that contract, the QB is here longer than he is guaranteed to be here so... MAKE IT WORK. Adapt... Lazor never adapts. For maybe a drive or so a game, you're like woah.. where did that come from... then... its gone. We're the same inept barely throw it past the LOS team... but that's by design. There's a reason we replaced the WR's to run a RAC style offense.. thats what Philbin/Lazor wanted... it's not working, so... adapt... change... at some point, realize, you're the OC. Your salary is miniscule compared to the players, dont be stubborn. Just work with what you have, and make it work. And, dont tell me that's what he's doing. We've done the same thing the last three games, it hasn't worked, and no changes.

Lazor has to go.

 

I would have benched tannehill as well he needs a check up from the neck up, he looks like a guy frustrated and beaten down IMO.i think he is a good qb and we can win with him but this offense is awful. its the same thing every week, these 3 or 4 yard routes are junk, linebackers and safeties are running down hill and blasting our receivers and running backs since there is 0 reason to fear anything down the field since really we throw the ball deep 1 times(if that) a game. so what does lazor do? he lines up under center 3 or 4 times and calls a play action when YOU HAVENT RUN THE ****ING BALL AT ALL, and you expect for some reason the linebackers and safeties to buy it? all the while the oline is snapping balls at the ankles, jason fox still can't block for **** and we wonder why tannehill looks like he regressed. its hard for a qb to have any type of rhythm when the offensive system has 0 rhythm to it. tannehill last year was at his best when running the ball and throwing those 7-15 yard routes. when he got into that rhythm he would get hot for games on end.

 

Campbell throwing the offense under the bus.

 

he should have fired lazor when he let coyle go.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Did I miss the part where we tout Tannehill's garbage time stats as if it's some indicator of future greatness?

 

As I stated in my earlier post, the offensive side of football is more of a game of chess rather than checkers. In chess, you move pieces to to set your board up to be able to not only attack your opponent at will, but to defend yourself against any attack from your opponent. It's a game of patience and strategy to keep your opponent off balance and the strategic element applies to offensive play calling.

We have two decent running backs in Miller and Ajayi. Are they an Adrian Peterson, Frank Gore or Marshawn Lynch? Perhaps not but then again, when you don't get the ball in their hands you'll never know but as to the question, "which plays should he have been calling?", that's pretty easy and pretty apparent...balance is the key to everything.

You MUST make an effort to commit to the run, be they up the middle, between the tackles, pitches to the outside or sweeps left or right. Properly designed running plays bring in extra blockers TE's, FB, etc which forces defenses to bring extra defenders in from the secondary to account for these extra blockers and make the tackle. Your runs don't have to be successful; they have to be executed though, especially when your defense is holding the opponent as ours was during the first half of yesterday's game. You have to commit to the run in order for your passing game to be successful.

If an offense lines up on their first series and they run the ball on 1st, 2nd and 3rd downs, punt the ball and on their next possession, run the ball again on 1st down, what are they going to do on 2nd down? Will they run the ball again? Will they run play action pass? Will they run a designed pass play from what appears to be a running formation? I don't know and that's the point. You have to keep the opposing defense off balance and guessing. Bill Lazor has done none of that.

All Lazor does is call passing plays, with intrinsic schemes and routes which on paper may appear to yield success, but in execution aren't realistic as these plays don't take into consideration the speed of defenders at the NFL level. Additionally, when 70% of your offensive plays called this season are passing plays, it makes it much easier for a defense to prepare...they KNOW all you're going to do is throw, with the occasional run called as a caveat to appease your running backs.

I've been illustrating this for years going back to the Sparano days...when the Dolphins run the ball 20+ times per game and have a single back gain 100+ yards in a game, we win...bottom line. Critics of my point of view tried to counter by saying the reason we had all of those rushing attempts in those wins was because we were winning, a myth which I've debunked many times already.

I dare anyone to find me a game in the post Marino era which we threw the ball 40+ times per game and ran the ball less than 10 times in which we've won. Sure, there may be the odd onsie or twosie, but as an overall offensive philosophy which has produced consistent winning, you won't find.

Winning teams RUN the ball.

 

We have talented players and they've proven it. The wins, no the DESTRUCTION of Tennessee and Houston clearly demonstrated that we can indeed not only win, but win BIG so I'm one of those that believe more in the coaching deficiency rather than the player deficiency.

I point to Jim Harbaugh as a recent example of how a single coach can make a difference. He went to San Francisco and with the same quarterback and the same running back and the same everything else for the most part took a losing team to the NFC championship not once, not twice but thrice in 4 years.

Like the soldiers in our military, these players are men that require competent leadership in order to not only perform, but excel.

 

How about Campbell does what it seemed he wanted to do at the start and just tells the coordinators and whole team to just go for broke? We aren't winning anything this year, why to try to eek out the season managing the game with short passes? Tell both the O and D to try to make a statement, and risk it all. And tell Tannehill not to be afraid to run. Worse case scenario? They lose badly, and we get a higher draft pick.

 

Deservedly so.

 

I'm done with Tannehill. I realized that every excuse I've made for him were the same things I said about Chad Henne. He's probably a nice guy, probably really smart too, but he's not a QB to lead your team. I thought that maybe if they put a team around him to hide his weaknesses he'd be fine. I don't believe that anymore. The sack he took today where he watched the defender come at him, had PLENTY of time to move, throw it away, ANYTHING and he stood there and took the sack was enough for me. His passes were getting WRs killed. Yes, his line and play calling suck, but if you're going to be "it" you need to carry your team. He can't. Time to draft a QB. And for those that are against that: NE drafted Brady when they had Bledsoe, who was better than Tannehill at that time in their respective careers. I get that RT17 is here for 2 more years, but it's time to start looking, if for nothing than to tell him he's replaceable. Man, there are tons of holes. Ugh. Maybe with Lazor fired Miami will run the ball 45 times next week.

 

So draft a QB in the 6th, then?


And Bledsoe really wasn't any better than Tannehill for the 3 seasons preceding their drafting of Brady, though he saw more success early on.

 

I don't care what round. Just draft one. That's all I'm saying.

 

I'm all in for drafting a QB.