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Blanket Coverage: Time running out for Tannehill to show Dolphins growth

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Sceeto, Dec 3, 2015.

  1. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    His stats were inflated last season. When we absolutely needed him to rise, he **** the bed. Case in point, the Ravens game at home last year where he continually held on to the ball and we got demolished in the 2nd half.. Game had significant playoff implications.
     
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  2. keypusher

    keypusher Well-Known Member

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    This message board is like the last stages of a failing marriage. Every conversation winds up in the same place.
     
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  3. Sherman is not inexperienced and he is unemployed too

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  4. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    The coaches are the result of the hiring by the owner. So you can blame poor coaching, but I blame poor ownership.

    With Ross remaining the owner and Tannebaum being the head of football operations, I honestly don't see this team becoming relevant anytime in the foreseeable future.

    The crap in this organization starts at the top and flows downhill.
     
  5. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    Don't forget when he missed a WIDE open Wallace from the 11 yard line, which would have given us the lead, in the 4th quarter, that took the starch right out of the team, and filled the Ravens with it.
     
  6. yes he was trending upward and did give reason for optimism but imo he leveled off this season. I think we are seeing his ceiling. If you see it differently, I respect that. Its jusy my opinion from what I have seen. Improvement yes, but not enough for me to hold out hope. Going into this season I was optimistic about him but that optimism has evaporated.

    For everyone who still has faith in him you are most likely going to see him get one more shot at it next season. Im hoping the light comes on for him but jot holding my breath and if saw a QB I liked in the draft ot FA for that matter, I would pull the trigger on him.

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  7. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think people should consider your second line more. If we look at the league's younger QBs (guys with fewer than 10 years experience), who exactly is capable of "winning games" for their teams?

    Matthew Stafford? No.
    Matt Ryan? No.
    Joe Flacco? No.
    Derek Carr? No.
    Andy Dalton? No.
    Alex Smith? No.
    Blake Bortles? No.

    The only examples of heroism would be Andrew Luck and Russell Wilson and even those I think you'll find lose more than they win when they don't have help.

    It's not until you get to guys with tons of experience that you see any real ability to consistently carry the team. People are far too nonchalant in comparing Tannehill to QBs who've been in the league a very long time.

    I'm beginning to think the fans in Miami may actually be part of the problem. I can't imagine them having the patience to allow someone like Tannehill to develop. They're far too quick to turn on their own. It's rather disturbing for a franchise that projects this woe-is-me, "we're cursed" sort of attitude.

    Fact is, I think you'd be hard pressed to find any QB with 5-6 years of starting experience between college and the pros and show how that QB is consistently playing at a really amazing level. That's just unrealistic. The truth is, I think Miami's going to have to commit to winning without a dominant QB. This ridiculous search for a hero just has to put to death.
     
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  8. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Perhaps that is because every season has ended up in the same place since this ownership took over. Out of the playoffs and always promising the next year will be the year that turns it around.

    The best definition for deja vu, is every Dolphin season since Ross became majority owner.
     
  9. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    That's no reason to pay him 20 mil per.
     
  10. we can agree to disagree. I think most of those QBs give you a better chance at winning than RT.

    On a positive note
    Im happy with Miller. He is a solid back. If we give him some blocking up front I think he can hurt some defenses

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  11. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    QBs make a lot of money once they're outside of their rookie deals. What can I tell you. Unless you feel he's holding you back from getting the guys you really need I wouldn't worry about what's in another man's bank account.

    Fact is, Miami shouldn't be out there signing big-time FA deals anyway.
     
  12. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Perhaps you should check your facts. Because Matt Ryan has led his team to more 4th quarter wins than any other QB in the NFL since he entered the league in 2008.

    I would also wager that everyone of the QB's on your list who have been in the league since Tannehill have far more fourth quarter comeback wins than Tannehill.

    I would trade Tannehill for any of the QB's on your list and not think twice about it. Unfortunately I don't think any of the teams with the QB's you listed would trade their QB for Tannehill.
     
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  13. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure I see it differently, I was just responding to what you said about his play being consistent throughout his tenure in Miami and I don't agree with that. I haven't completely lost faith yet but I'm finding it harder and harder to believe in him going forward. I think next season a new coach will come in and give Tannehill a chance to prove himself, but will likely bring in some legit competition. Maybe one more vet and a rookie QB taken in the later part of the draft. Tannehill will have one more opportunity after this season and if he can't make the most of it, he will be gone in 2017, IMO.
     
  14. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Our problems go back ~15 years though.. to the Wannstedt era. That's really when this team started going downhill.
     
  15. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    lol. you expect a completely new offensive system installed in one week? i look at it this is the base. build on it next week and the week after that build on it some more. we'll see what the offense looks like at the end of the season. that's the impression that's going to last
     
  16. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Do they give you a better chance at winning or is that just BS though. Not being mean but looking better on TV doesn't really matter to me. We saw Matt Ryan put up incredible stats over the last few seasons in Atlanta and yet they didn't sniff the play-offs largely because they've had one of the worst ranked run defenses.

    So, in reality Miami is winning just as much as the Falcons were last year when the Falcons were having similar struggles with their defense and their O-line.

    I can show you Detroit's struggles as well.

    I can show you how Dalton has played badly when he doesn't have AJ Green.

    Last year Derek Carr wasn't very good and his team only won 3 games.

    Blake Bortles has always played below the level of expectation and his team's haven't won.


    Where exactly are all these teams winning? If you find the years where the Lions, Bengals, Falcons, etc. all have won more than they've lost it's the same years where they're run the ball well and played great defense.


    You're not going to win games by asking Tannehill to be great because he's not. He's right at the average, but so is everyone else aside from Luck and Wilson.

    What do you guys want to hear?

    So show me where the Dolphins can buy the next Andrew Luck or Russell Wilson in the draft or get comfy with Ryan. That's the reality.
     
  17. no but i was looking to see new life out of him and it was not there for me.

    He makes too many bad throws for my taste

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  18. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. Inflated by an obvious that eventually got figured out. Except he didn't come close to Foles.


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  19. of course he has the rest of the season to show me wrong but i have my doubts is all I'm saying

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  20. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

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    That's exactly it. His salary is holding us back from signing and retaining good players at other positions. We let go of talent over the years in anticipation of his contract.


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  21. finsfandan

    finsfandan Well-Known Member

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    I figured. Now we've gotta give a new coaching staff another 4 years to see how Tannehill does, right?


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  22. DolphinGreg

    DolphinGreg Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Eh, I think you have to look at 2016 as a wash. You lost your HC, OC and DC only to wind up running out of a burning building.

    Tannehill's most likely the starter in 2016 given his contract. With all the other needs, it's a virtual certainty the team will not go QB very highly in the draft next year.

    Ryan will basically walk into 2016 knowing his job is on the line. That's how it's going to go. I'll be shocking if that's not what happens.
     
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  23. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You think they installed a new offense this week??!
     
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  24. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I agree that was the beginning of the downward spiral. Yet Ross purchased a team which was 11-5 and a playoff team the year before he became majority owner and the team has not had a single winning season since then.

    To me, having a competent owner who hires the best personnel is the most important aspect of building a winning organization. Ross hasn't made a single hire since he became the owner which has benefitted this organization, IMO.
     
  25. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Regarding the coaches I agree.. regarding Tannenbaum and Hickey, not yet sure. I still like the drafts, and what they did in FA is not great but it isn't horrible either. We need a good HC and whoever he wants to install as coordinators under him. That's the most important thing this team can do. After that, the next most important decision is what to do with Tannehill, and that will fall on Tannenbaum.. it's a test of his ability as GM for sure.
     
  26. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    Ross was also sold a bill of garbage (no pun intended) from Huizenga and Parcells.

    Huizenga knew he was finished, gave Parcells a contract he could get out of if the ownership changed and then promptly sold the team to Ross at a premium.

    Ross has not had good luck as an owner and his loyalty has killed him.

    But don't make it seem like this franchise has been anything other than garbage since Marino retired.
     
  27. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    thats how it should be. the front office has determined, correctly in my view, that Tannehill wasnt the problem. They basically came to the conclusion that our receivers were last year and the coaching staff was this year. Add in they almost certainly feel the oline is a problem as well and next year they will have a new coaching staff and a better oline. If Tannehill cant win with that then his job should be on the line. But you cant expect someone to compete in the Daytona 500 driving a stock hyundai
     
  28. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    maybe phrased poorly. same system different playcalling emphasis. more running, more vertical routes (at least in the first half), some rollouts. i'm sure they will keep tweaking the playcalling moving farther away from lazor's point of emphasis which was ball control short passing and move into a more balanced, play action offense, mid level throwing offense. i'm not sure if that is a new system or just different play calls within the same system
     
  29. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I don't remember reading anywhere that Huizenga held a gun to Ross's head and forced him to buy the team.

    Ross has been doing business deals his entire adult life and he knew exactly what he was signing when he agreed to purchase the team. He was a minority owner of the Dolphins prior to becoming majority owner. Therefore if he wasn't aware of what he was buying into when he became the majority owner, he has no one to blame but himself.

    This includes the fact that Parcells had a contract which allowed him to get paid in full and leave at anytime if Huizenga sold the team.

    The fact is that as an NFL owner, Ross has been totally clueless. I have no doubt he wants to put a winning team on the field. I just don't think he has any idea how to go about hiring the right football people to do this.

    I do not have any faith in Tannebaum and Hickey and based on his previous hires, I suspect we will see another Philbin or Sparano as the next head coach of the Dolphins next year.
     
  30. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    Using other teams mistakes as a reason to keep Tanne isn't sound reasoning, if he isn't a major factor in winning then 20 mil per is too much, it has nothing to do with someone else's money, it's about cap space, Matt Moore is making 5 mil, and we'd most likely be 5-7 with him too, and there are a good handful of other lower priced QBs we could sign that will give us just as much chance to win as Tanne.
     
  31. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    he seemed pretty pumped today. ever since the eagles game i felt tannehill was going through the motions a bit but today i saw him pretty animated. it was good to see. definitely had some overthrows. maybe too amped
     
  32. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    That is a depressing thought but I have to agree with you.Ross is a clueless idiot when it comes to running an nfl organization.We are doomed unless he sells and now that he has put all this money into this stadium that is not going to happen.I will probally be dead before we have a contender.
     
  33. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    After today, you REALLY do not believe Ryan is a part of the problem??
     
  34. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    the day you figure something is the day the earth ends. where did you see four years mr reading comprehension?
     
  35. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    i said before the game started i didnt expect much with the coaching changes. even next week i'm not expecting much other than a slight improvement over this week. the week after that though is when i will expect some good games from tanny. you have to give the coaching staff a few weeks to adjust to the elimination of lazor. our new OC has never called a game in his career prior to today. let him get a couple under his belt first. i thought the playcalling was pretty poor today but i thought the overall philosophy was sound if that makes sense to you. run, keep a balanced offense, make the defense play you honest. dial up a deep pass over the middle of the field for once instead of the sidelines. dont run tannehill but have some rollouts. the philosophy is sound, now they have to work on the individual playcalling within the philosophy to set up the defense. granted its hard to do with our crappy oline. did you see the play where tannehill identified jernigan lining up the middle and noone blocked him still? lol
     
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  36. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    The Dolphins were 8-8 the last two seasons and while it is still possible they could get to 8-9 wins this season. I think most of us can agree this is the worst team they have fielded over the past three years.

    So I am not sure what Hickey and Tannebaum did to improve the overall team. When you consider that right now the Dolphins have one of, if not the highest payroll in the entire league. They certainly aren't getting much bang for the buck.

    I see Tannebaum spending big money just like he did with the Jets and we all know how that ended for the Jets. As far as Hickey is concerned, I can take him or leave him. I would prefer a more talented GM, but I doubt one would be willing to take the job if it meant working for Tannebaum.
     
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  37. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fair enough. Zac Taylor is the last person on earth to install a new system in a week
     
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  38. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    I think the drafts the last two years have been refreshing after the Ireland days. We're not wasting 1st and 2nd round picks anymore. In those two years we picked Juwuan James, Landry, Parker and Phillips, all seem to be good/very good. In FA, they got rid of a lot of Ireland's baggage (remember Wheeler and Ellerbe?), signed Suh, etc..

    I don't see why Tannenbaum/Hickey are so bad. I like them so far actually.

    Like I said, you need to dissociate what they've done from the players/coaches they inherited for a moment and ask yourself whether you think they are sub-par. I don't think so. This offseason will be the biggest test though because we're getting new coaches (firing Philbin early was a plus too for Tannenbaum) and we'll see what they do with Tannehill.
     
  39. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    He is at a disadvantage in more than a few categories, but I can't ignore the lack of awareness and the horrible field vision he displays on a weekly basis. He is a very flawed QB at this point, but he will be here next year so lets just hope something clicks so we do not have to deal with these 10-17 point outputs from the offense.
     
  40. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    How do you think I feel? I turned 65 this year and I have no idea how many more years I have before I become worm food.
    I will always be a Dolphin fan, since they have been my team since 1966.

    It is just the frustration of having a clueless owner like Ross which drives me crazy. I guess having Joe Robbie and Don Shula for so many successful years just spoiled me and now late in life, I am being forced to deal with one of the most incompetent owners in the entire NFL.

    Getting old is hard enough without the added aggravation of seeing my beloved Dolphins flounder year after year. I wish I could just forget about them and find something else to do on game day, but my one addiction remains the Dolphins and I have yet to find a cure for this addiction.

    Even livng here in beautiful Hawaii, with the wonderful views of the nearby ocean and the majestic mountains doesn't help to alleviate the feeling of saddest I feel about how far this organization has fallen in the last decade and a half and especially under the ownership of Ross.
     
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