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The Official 2015 MLB Thread

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by finyank13, Mar 9, 2015.

  1. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    [video=twitter;675388219056373760]https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/675388219056373760 [/video]

    This is fun.
     
  2. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Those HGH shots had to have come from somewhere right?
     
  3. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Gammons reported today that the Marlins asked for Mookie Betts, Eduardo Rodriguez, Christian Vazquez, Yoan Moncada and another pitcher for Jose Fernandez. The asking price is rightfully high but something like that would be insane. But hey there's no harm in asking I guess.

    He also reported the Sox knew about the Chapman situation and rightfully backed off. And Johnny Cueto really wanted to play for the Red Sox.
     
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  4. Finfangirl

    Finfangirl Season Ticket Holder Luxury Box

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    Gonna use Soler to get the pitcher, they desperately need.
     
  5. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    I think that desperately need is a bit much. I'm not saying that I'm opposed to using Soler to go get the right guy, someone who would be a #2 on a lot of teams for example, and would be under team control for 3+ seasons at a reasonable cost, but that's obviously easier said that done. As is then trading Jason Hammel's contract to make room for the new guy.

    I'm comfortable with the starting staff the way that it stands, and I'm not interested in giving away a guy with a ton of potential just for a mediocre #3 type.
     
  6. Finfangirl

    Finfangirl Season Ticket Holder Luxury Box

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    Sarcasm.....I was kidding, relax. I actually think the cubs will end up using Warren as a 5th starter at some point and end up trading for someone at the deadline. That's Theo's M.O.. the cubs are my national league team. My family is in Iowa, and they love their cubs!
     
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  7. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    What's the Cubs rotation right now?


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  8. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Its something like Arietta, Lester, Lackey, Hammel, Hendricks..
     
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  9. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

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    To be honest he didnt. He has two opt outs. If he doesnt like Chicago or he feels he can make more per year on a new contract ......
     
  10. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Yes, with Travis Wood and Adam Warren as relievers who can step in and start. Hammel has a 10 mil team option in 2017 that is very unlikely to be picked up. Hendricks is under team control for years, and could in theory be included in a trade for someone who would step into the rotation between the top two and Lackey, if the team chose to go that way.
     
  11. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Yeah, its a three year deal for the Cubs with the option for Heyward to stick around after that if he chooses. I'm cool with it. Hopefully the next three years will be pretty magical, Heyward performs well, and decides to stick around. If not...then Rizzo, Russell, Baez, Bryant, Soler and Schwarber are all still under contract or control beyond that.
     
  12. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

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    Better of having Heyward in CF and waiting for Almora to be ready. Then you move Heyward to RF and trade Soler.
     
  13. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That contract for Heyward though.....atrocious. Yeah he plays tremendous D in a corner OF spot, don't know really how that will translate to center and if it doesn't translate to CF he's really a streak 270 hitter whose good for about 15 homers...i.e. a 6 spot hitter. That's one player I am thrilled the mets didn't spend money on....
     
  14. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Almora's been treading water the last few years. He's battled injuries and his bat just hasn't ever come around. As good as his defense in CF may be, I think that the odds of him playing well in AAA this season are 50/50 at best. I've been in favor of the Cubs moving him for pitching for a while now, and selling before the luster is completely gone off of his prospect status.
     
  15. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    It's likely he bats second with the Cubs. His OBP is extremely useful, as are his good base running skills, with the other guys there to drive him in.
     
  16. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Still not worth anything close to 23M a season. He wasn't even one of the top 2 FA OF's (Gordon and Upton) and I'm not sure I'd take him over Cespedes either....would really depend if I wanted a bat or defense.
     
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  17. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

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    MLB seems to disagree with your opinion.
     
  18. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thats fine. Thats allowed to happen. They can be wrong all theyd like to.
     
  19. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    That's pretty dang good. If Arrieta comes close to this past season.


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  20. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    He was absolutely on fire the entire second half. It was like he was playing on easy mode in MLB The Show, lol. The other teams were just helpless. You can't expect him to completely replicate that magic, but I'll take 90% of that in a heartbeat. If he can put up an ERA below 2.50 (he was 2.53 in 2014) and go 7+ innings as often as he did (averaged 7 last season, and was much better after the break), with the improved offense, he should give the bullpen a lot of rest.
     
  21. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    I wouldn't say that's "MLB"'s opinion. Just the GMs of three or four teams. They're a little crazy. Upton's worth more than J-Hey is easy unless you value defense WAY above everything else. I think some have just fallen in love with his phenominal athleticism for his size. That's what made us all believe he might be the next superstar. But it hasn't panned out and at this point probably won't. I know he's still young but he's played six seasons in MLB already. He is what he is most likely. It's a huge gamble and I think the Cubs will regret paying that much in 3 or 4 years.
     
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  22. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    I don't think he's reached 15 homers in a couple of seasons or so. He flashed some power in 2012 with 27 homers and hasn't even sniffed a number like that since then. I think he has more of a line drive swing which is fine except if you're paying 23 million a year an average around .300 would be nice. He's a phenominal athlete but not worth elite money. It's a head scratcher to me.
     
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  23. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Yep, not a Cubs fan but all i know is anything that pushes Hammel further to the back of the rotation is a good thing for them. He can be very good but he can also be a gascan at times. Might end up being the Drew Hutchison of that team, where his era might be high but since he is facing other teams 4's/5's he will likely have huge run support
     
  24. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Well, we can all look at the numbers and see whats there, but it boils down to a few things.

    - Heyward fits exactly the type of player that the Cubs front office is looking for. He may not be great at any one thing (other than his glove, which is fantastic), but he's very good at almost everything.
    - He would have been one of the Cubs leaders in virtually every catagory last season.
    - He brings skills that not many of the Cubs other players posses, such as a high on base and low K rate, plus he's left handed.
    - The Cubs have been one of the worst situational hitting teams in MLB the last few years. Much worse than average at getting guys in from third with less than two outs, and very bad at hitting into double plays. Heyward is very good in both catagories, and will allow them to score runs without homers.

    He and Zobrist both bring things to the club that were just missing, and will allow the rest of the guys in the lineup to continue to develop while also focusing on what they themselves do well. Both are probably more valuable to the Cubs than they would be other cubs, and that's all that really matters.
     
  25. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    All that and I'd question the signing at 15M a season let alone 23. He's a nice player but he's not a star....and that's star money
     
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  26. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

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    Upton is no star defensively and seems to already be trending down. Yes he puts up the HR's but his BA and OBP? Not so much.
     
  27. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    He has more of a swing down swing. Which results in not lifting the ball like he should.

    I like some of the things John Mallee teaches. It might be something where they signed him expecting to fix some swing issues.


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  28. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    With that sad. I would never pay him that money.


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  29. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

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    Keep in mind its a copycat league. KC is doing very well with players that put the ball in play, play great defense, and having a loaded BP.

    Heyward does two of these things. Never mind he is just the type of player they need.
     
  30. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    If they can afford to pay 23M a year for seven years for 20 extra OBP points, 15 to 20 less HRs a year, and an average that will be a little bit higher (but still under .300) then more power to them I suppose. He's a great guy to have on your roster but it boggles my mind how he drew that kind of money. I watched him play in Atlanta for five years, he was rarely the kind of difference maker you think you'd get for a financial commitment like that.
     
  31. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Upton does have more power, however through his first six seasons and the same age that Heyward now is, he only averaged 3 more HR per 162 games played than Heyward has. In many other areas, the two are very similar in their stats, however Heyward's oWAR through his first six seasons is almost 2 points higher than Upton's, and his dWAR is excellent while Upton's is poor. Upton also strikes out a lot more, and the Cubs already have plenty of guys who've got that covered, and needed someone badly who does not.
     
  32. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    According to baseball reference:
    Upton has accumulated 18.8 oWAR the last 6 years vs 17.5 for Heyward. Additionally Upton has consistently been in the 3-3.5 oWAR range vs Heywards inconsistency.
    Upton has played 895 games the last 6 years vs 835 for Heyward and out homer him 147-99 (24.5 hrs per year vs 16.5). Uptons played thru some bad injuries those years as well.
    Heyward has a significant edge in dWAR.
    Upton leads 191-179 in Offensive Runs Above Replacement level.

    Stats dont necessarily bear out what youre saying....
     
  33. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    I was comparing Upton's first six seasons to Heyward's, not the last six. Same age range too, which makes it a fair comparison, IMO.
     
  34. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Pete Rose stays banned and honestly feel its the right call.
     
  35. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    I don't have a strong opinion. The details have gotten pretty murky over the years. I don't know that anyone can ever know if he was throwing games due to gambling or not. If he was, or if the gambling was influencing how he managed, then the ban is deserved. Imagine how differently everyone would view him had he simply never become a manager.
     
  36. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Cueto to Giants... 6 year 130 million opt out at 2017

    Madbum/Cueto/Samardjiza/Peavy/Cain

    Very solid rotation especially if Cain returns to form

    Had they signed Grienke, samardjiza nor cueto obviously wouldnt have happened and the lineup becomes madbun/grienke/peavy/cain/heston.

    Not signing Grienke moves Heston to the bullpen.
     
  37. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Yeah, thats really solid on paper. Going all in on the pitching side, and with defense. Posey and Crawford are very productive for their positions, but other than that, their bats don't exactly scare me, but they did end up tied for 11th in MLB in runs per game last year, so they were doing something right.
     
  38. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    I still think it was a mistake letting Aoki walk to the Mariners. They will regret that. But this is a team like the Cardinals that depend on pitching and great defense.
     
  39. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

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    Its not only about throwing games, its as you suggest about influencing the game, and to lesser extent, what Gambling Houses infer and a gambler's (i.e. Rose's) potential debts could impact the game (or squeeze him to throw a game, etc) and indirectly impact power of gambling organization based on inferred knowledge. In the end, this all tarnishes the game. The integrity of it, the influence someone has over it. And so on, and so on....

    So, a couple of things on on the details, lots of evidence exists to show Rose bet as a player and manager on games he played in or made decisions about ~ regardless that it took years for Rose to finally admit it himself years after denials and denials and denials.

    And frankly from MLB standpoint gambling and its impact, even if you bet as player which some say is worse (which evidence shows Rose to have done) or Manager (which is what Giamatti and Vincent focused on) what gets lost in the statements of "well, he only bet on his team to win" (which again evidence isnt 100% clear on he only bet on his team to WIN item)....reality is that he is clearly telling Vegas what to do on the occasions he doesnt place a bet to WIN. Think about it, Rose bets on his ACE and #3 arm to WIN, but never bets on his #2, #4, or #5 starter, etc. Other examples are "generic" "he" only bets on HOME games, or DAY Games following Night Games, etc.

    Regardless of the times he bets even if its to WIN, he is clearly "telling" Vegas his attitude, approach, mindset on the times he doesnt bet. Replace Rose's name with any Player, Manager or Owner (any member of an organization really) and that person has direct or indirect influence that sully's the reputation, Betting to WIN or not. And history already had shown that socializing with Gambling Organizations, or its Leadership imparts negative reflection (MLB with BlackSox Scandal, and even NFL with Namath, and even Hornung, and Karras suspensions). All sports are at risk...its the #1 no-no for a reason.

    Its also about how Rose potentially impacts his players on the days he does bet (overuse cause he cares and wants the Win) and the days he doesnt (overuse cause who cares he didnt bet and this #2 pitcher, #4 pitcher, #5 pitcher stinks anyway in his mind so throw them to the wolves for all he cares so he can focus on his next BET to Win, etc, etc, etc.) The RISK is endless to the sport once you go down this slope.

    Now, not specific to your post, but what everyone should keep in mind is that as far as commissioner's office goes, Banned to ever work again in MLB capacity is the only thing this Manfred's statement and decision ensures. And its justifiable beyond any shadow of a doubt. Rose broke the #1 rule, a clear, known rule to all. His MLB punishment is justified to that end.

    Banned from HOF voting is separate thing based solely on HOF executive committee rules (established by HOF after Rose's MLB ban by Giamatti/Vincent), and just prior to Rose nearing the waiting-period eligibility to be on a ballot for plaque and HOF membership, etc.

    Lastly, since HOF is a museum which tracks the history of baseball; the reality is that, regardless of MLB banishment, as part of the HOF Museum, Rose is already part of that and his name, likeness, and equipment, have several sections with his items and stories already throughout the building.

    So unless the HOF Executive Committee changes its rule about anyone on the ineligible list by MLB, being ineligible and therefore not allowed to be added to a ballot for the chance to be voted on, well thats a whole different issue, and nothing to do with Manfred's decision to simply stay the status-quo and follow the original ruling by Giamatti/Vincent, etc.

    No chance to be voted on for getting a plaque is HOF punishment, not MLB punishment.

    Personal Aside: I just dont understand how LIFETIME ban can be discussed as "hasn't enough time passed?" crowd....geez, for those that feel that way, I never understand that......its a LIFETIME BAN by definition, and ROSE himself accepted and acknowledged LIFETIME ban from any working relationship with MLB.

    Clearly, Rose was gambling on (HAHA..yes intentional) HOF leadership never removing his chance to even be voted on....he lost that bet too.

    For me, unless/until they (Veterans Committee) vote on Shoeless Joe, they never should vote on Pete Rose.
     
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  40. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

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    Thanks for the insight. As someone who has never gambled or been around gambling, that whole culture is mostly foreign to me. I was also just becoming a real baseball fan when it all went down originally, and while I didn't pay a whole lot of attention to the off the field stuff in those days,
     

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