1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Tannehill is Committed and " one Tough ***"

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Apr 5, 2016.

  1. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Also, Tom Brady is a bad example, as it's well known that he took less than he is worth, to help the team.
     
  2. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    No, I'm going to disagree there. I don't doubt the kids heart, his dedication, his commitment. He has a lot of heart. So did Rudy. Just saying, I'm not doubting any of that. I see him more of a mechanical QB vs someone that is more cerebral.
     
  3. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    It's the perfect example. Not you, but someone else implied Tanny turned down better opportunities to sign with Miami. I'm arguing, that is wrong on two levels: One, he didn't sign an undermarket contract, two, he wouldn't just be allowed to walk. Not saying the contract didn't make sense for both parties, it does, and that's exactly my point. Miami overpaid but left themselves a backdoor. It worked out and it was a decent deal for all parties at the time it was signed.

    I just object to the notion Tannehill gave up promise of more riches, to stay here. He absolutely did not.
     
  4. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    And I've never stated otherwise. I said it above, you don't let QBs walk even if they're only top 14'ish. Hell we keep signing Matt Moore. QBs are way too valuable to let them go. And that's all I'm saying. Tanny didn't have a choice of teams. He either signs an extension, or sign one year Franchise deals after his contract ran out next year, and risk losing it all in a freak accident. If he plays well, he'll get another extension. But some posters were trying to put him on a pedestal as if he made some sort of sacrifice. Naw, both sides signed a deal that made sense for both sides. That's all I'm pointing out. He signed a contract because it was overvalued a little, and he gave up a little (backdoor by the team). That's all it was.

    If he's not a disaster and isn't hurt, he's getting every dollar of those contracts. You can't say that about other positions, but QBs, they get paid.
     
    resnor likes this.
  5. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    I just disagree with him being overpaid. I mean, look what Osweiler got. It may look overpaid, when compared to other guys, but next year or the year after, you'll be seeing guys that aren't as good as Tannehill getting contracts bigger than his. If Rodgers signed a deal tomorrow, and didn't give a hometown discount, he'd be paid significantly more than Tannehill.
     
    Shane Falco likes this.
  6. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

    6,338
    2,400
    113
    Nov 22, 2014
    uh, yeah it is. It is exactly what you do if you are afraid someone might come in and play better then you showing the world you are not that good.
     
  7. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

    6,338
    2,400
    113
    Nov 22, 2014
    I am in no way saying he is not tough. I just think his confidence is not as strong as people think, why do you think there have been so many comments on the coaches protecting him?
     
    Finster likes this.
  8. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Yeah...I highly doubt Tannehill was afraid of Matt Moore.
     
    dgfred likes this.
  9. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    One again, those reports were blown way out of proportion. The coaches telling scrubs to quit messing around in a walkthrough isn't "protecting" Tannehill.

    Frankly, with the reports about Philbin and Lazor trying to replace Tannehill, it makes the stance that they were "protecting" him even more untenable. People even theorize that Lazor abandoned the run so often to make Tannehill look bad, then giving the finger to the front office.
     
    number21 likes this.
  10. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    I do see the two as related though. I questioned why practice squad players were even messing with Tanny. Just like when Geno Smith got punched in the face, several questioned his stature in the team because some Jets defensive players were not quick to defend Geno.

    Same thing here. You think Practice Squad (and one normal team mate I believe) players would mess with the QB if he was the unquestioned leader? Naw, I don't think so.

    If you are talking about me and Lazor, that's not what I said. I said Lazor was in the **ck it stage. It wasn't about making Tannehill look bad. It was no longer protecting him, like he did the year before. He tailored the offense to suit Tanny's strengths. I argued, on this very forum, this is not the offense Lazor wants to run. He had to modify it last year because the first few games were bad. Really bad. SO he changed it.

    Why was he willing to modify his offense in year 1, but all we hear in year 2 was how rigid he was, refusing to change anything. Because he entered the f*** it stage. And we have information to back that up. So coach is on TV saying we're going to pound the ball.

    Lazor calls 60 passes, 40 runs.

    Coach says again, we're going to back to pounding the ball.

    Lazor calls 70 passes, 30 runs.

    You're trying to tell me Lazor isn't saying, F*** it? He absolutely was.

    But back to Lazor. Even when things were so called "humming" last year, 2014, I was reading in between the lines of Lazor's public comments. They were critical of Tanny if you really looked at them. Lazor was blunt, and you got the sense that the offense was not ran how he wanted to run it. Not scoring any TDs from beyond the red zone except one, and it was from 21 yards? Having to compress the field? Etc. etc. so to anyone paying attention, Lazor felt his offense was being held back, and it was due to limitations by Tanny.

    and if you force me, I'll look my posts up.
     
    dolphin25 and Pauly like this.
  11. dgfred

    dgfred Free Agent pickup

    642
    259
    0
    Dec 17, 2015
    N.C., USA
    That is a good post except for 'due to limitations by Tanny'... unless you mean T-baum.

    The limitations were the OL, play-calling and Defense.
     
    jdang307 and miami365 like this.
  12. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    Fair enough, but Tannebaum wasn't that much responsible in 2014 ;) It was Ireland then Hickey.
     
  13. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,696
    3,743
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    It could be Lazor saying, I'm smarter than this meat head you promoted above me and I'll prove it.
    It could be Lazor looking at tapes of his opponents and seeing opportunities in the passing game because in other games the opponent's defense had to game play for run or pass, but when the phins come out the opposing DC just schedules short/medium pass defense. rinse. repeat.

    Lazor's attitude in 2015 seemed more about arrogance and hubris to me than resignation or frustration.
     
    resnor likes this.
  14. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,696
    3,743
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    The bold is where the money is for Lazor. He's a 'system' coach (example Bill Parcells), not a 'player' coach (example Don Shula).
     
  15. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

    23,698
    39,847
    113
    Sep 7, 2012
    Hattiesburg, MS
    He lacks intellect now? This is something that not a single coach or scout has stated. In fact, his intellect was what helped propel him into the 1st round, despite his lack of college snaps.

    Also, as per Armando, he's already built a playbook this off-season and is running it with the WRs on his own to familiarize himself and the WRs with route tree and calls. http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/


    Does that really sound like someone who isn't cerebral, or who isn't commited, or lacks leadership, or whom the WRs dislike - or whatever other silly sh*t has been rehashed in this thread as "reported" (speculated) by Miko, Omar, or other "anonymous" sources?
     
    number21, dgfred and resnor like this.
  16. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Yep. It's pretty crazy the stuff people say about Tannehill. The guy has never gotten a fair shot from many of the fans.
     
    Mcduffie81 likes this.
  17. cbrad

    cbrad .

    10,659
    12,657
    113
    Dec 21, 2014
    I don't know if "cerebral" or "intellect" is the right word, but Tannehill has often shown a lack of good decision-making in different game situations. One obvious example is not running when there is a lane. The other big example is wasting too much time in a hurry-up offense when you have to drive down the field quickly. In fact, he wastes WAY too much time in those situations IMO. Those are examples of lacking certain football smarts.
     
    dolphin25, jdang307 and djphinfan like this.
  18. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,651
    67,546
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    here's the thing..Ryan doesn't make a defense pay with his legs instinctually, as in the sixth sense of when to tuck it and run when protection breaks down, and, he doesn't do it intentionally when a defense turns his back to him...its very unsettling..pisses me off actually..and makes me question everything.
     
    dolphin25, jdang307 and cbrad like this.
  19. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

    23,698
    39,847
    113
    Sep 7, 2012
    Hattiesburg, MS
    You're forgetting how much Philbin stressed on him to stay in the pocket and make plays specifically from the pocket. You can look the exact quotes up by Philbin on the subject. It not's like Tannehill's just been told to go out and make a play. He's done exactly what he's been coached to do under Philbin and Lazor. He's not FU type QB in the mold of Marino or Favre.

    One of the scouting knocks on Tannehill I recall was something to the effect that he was "almost too coachable", in that he tries hard to please his coaches and thinks instead of reacts. I think maybe this is what you're referring to. That said, he's routinely commended for making the correct reads as well as where he goes with the ball. Again, the execution may be lacking, but not his intellect or "football smarts".

    I disagree on the hurry-up offense and dare say that his 2 min drives are often among his best, though I'm often wrong on lots of things. ;-)
     
    number21 likes this.
  20. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

    23,698
    39,847
    113
    Sep 7, 2012
    Hattiesburg, MS

    Again, he doesn't say FU to the coaches and ad-lib on the field. Philbin drilled it into him to stand in the pocket and play the entire field. He's not going to morph into Wilson or Favre and do his own thing out there - unless Gase tells him "here's the play, but if it's not there, just make something happen"...
     
    number21 and resnor like this.
  21. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    You went from cerebral/mechanical to lacking intellect? You'd be at the top floor of a tall building with that leap.

    Cerebral isn't just studying. It's being able to apply what you learn when real bullets fly. No amount of studying would turn Joey Harrington into a cerebral QB. Blaine Gabbert got a 48 on a wonderlic but is a frozen deer in headlights. Nobody called Tanny dumb.

    It's making the right decision when you have 1.75 seconds and not 3. Some of that is instinctual too (like Wilson or Romo or Ben feeling pressure on the blind side without ever seeing it and making a move out of the way) it's a bit of both. Tanny doesn't have that.
     
    dolphin25 likes this.
  22. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

    23,698
    39,847
    113
    Sep 7, 2012
    Hattiesburg, MS
    Perhaps we're arguing semantics... You said "I see him more of a mechanical QB vs someone that is more cerebral."


    I read that you saying he's more of an automaton and less intellectual. Or perhaps you chose the wrong word because by definition "cerebral" is a term for someone who is intellectual or scholarly.

    Separately, if you want to argue his instincts aren't as honed or refined as a Peyton Manning, Russell Wilson, or Big Ben in select situations, then no argument. I agree, they are not. We can only hope that his instincts and abilities continue to develop in much the same way a martial artist's instincts and abilities develop over time as he progresses up the ranks from belt to belt...

    What I mostly took issue with was the altogether silliness in this thread. As DJ pointed out a few pages ago, Tannehill's stats jumped up big time when he actually had his starting OL together the past 2 seasons for those 7 games. Having decent enough pass protection only 7 out of 32 games is not a winning recipe. If we can field our OL starters for at least 10 games this season, I expect Tannehill to have his best season ever as a pro while learning his 3rd Offense in his 5th season.
     
    number21 and resnor like this.
  23. cbrad

    cbrad .

    10,659
    12,657
    113
    Dec 21, 2014
    I think the word "cerebral" is a useful word to describe a select few QB's but not many. The reason I say this is because I think it really applies to Peyton Manning, a guy who was almost an OC on the field.

    To me, "cerebral" for a QB means being able to quickly process relevant information so that you can read the defense, go through your progressions, and consistently choose the best possible action given what the defense gives you. It includes coming up with ways to get the defense to prematurely reveal its intentions, as well as doing things to keep them off balance. Basically a "cerebral" QB outsmarts the defense.

    In any case, I wouldn't label any more than a few QB's as "cerebral". So while Tannehill for me definitely isn't a cerebral QB, neither is almost every other QB.
     
  24. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,651
    67,546
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    come on Cooch, this is not sound thinking when evaluating a player..he hasnt shown any signs of either, even when philbin got fired.
     
  25. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

    25,809
    39,060
    113
    Dec 21, 2007
    Berlin,Germany
    money he would get elsehere too, if he would have demanded a trade
     
    number21 and resnor like this.
  26. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

    25,809
    39,060
    113
    Dec 21, 2007
    Berlin,Germany
    like the team hasn't shown any signs of protecting him better, i hope he doesn't sees ghosts already
     
  27. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

    25,809
    39,060
    113
    Dec 21, 2007
    Berlin,Germany
    Russell Wilson was sacked 45 times..the same amount as Tannehill with around 100 less pass attempts
     
    resnor and Fin D like this.
  28. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

    72,252
    43,684
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    There was a graphic displayed during a game last year (i think it was on NFL channel) where they listed the top 4 QBs at getting themselves sacked. Wilson was tops and Thill wasn't there.
     
    resnor and Alex13 like this.
  29. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,651
    67,546
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    I was just refferring to a cerebral element of the game that hasnt shown itself.
     
  30. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Yeah, I remember that stat being shown, and I remember it being largely ignored on here.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  31. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

    25,809
    39,060
    113
    Dec 21, 2007
    Berlin,Germany
    would be interesting to find out which game it was and the time stamp of it....any idea ?
     
  32. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

    72,252
    43,684
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    I reposted somewhere in some thread or another. Though I can't remember.
     
  33. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    I don't remember. I remember FinD and I talking about it in a GameDay thread. Don't remember which game (I can't wait for the runaround where a couple posters accuse me of making this up since I can't produce the video of it).
     
    Fin D likes this.
  34. cbrad

    cbrad .

    10,659
    12,657
    113
    Dec 21, 2014
  35. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

    72,252
    43,684
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    Thank you, but what we're talking about specifically was a stat that the NFL itself posted, it showed a percentage or something about sacks that were the fault of the QB.
     
    resnor likes this.
  36. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,329
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Yeah, the stat was QBs who are responsible for being sacked the most. Was an interesting stat that was showed, because of all the talk on here about how Wilson would be sacked even more if he wasn't so great, because his line is so bad.
     
  37. cbrad

    cbrad .

    10,659
    12,657
    113
    Dec 21, 2014
    resnor and Fin D like this.
  38. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

    72,252
    43,684
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
  39. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

    14,282
    5,005
    113
    Sep 10, 2009
    Boone, NC
    Since when was SOB considered a censorship worthy word?

    I keep reading it as ***...one tough ***.

    Then my mind gets confused and explodes in a diaspora of thought that spans from possible colloquial usage (Dan Lebatard is one tough ***) to porn (Dan Lebatard is..."One Tough ***").

    So, yeah, thanks for that...
     
    Finster likes this.
  40. JPPT1974

    JPPT1974 2022 Mother's Day and May Flowers!

    410
    84
    28
    Apr 15, 2012
    Just hope that with a new coach he will be having an elite year!
     

Share This Page