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How is Ajayi ranked so low going into next year?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Rickysabeast, Jun 17, 2017.

  1. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    You took the time in your post to send a jab to the pro-Tannehill crowd, so don't act like you did nothing wrong. You instigated the argument, FinD argued back. It's called self-awareness, try it out.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  2. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    The attacks in this thread were started by you. Nobody had mentioned Tannehill (which makes sense since it wasn't about Tannehill) or called any other posters "trolls" or any other names or labels.

    "If I said, "Tannehill wasn't that good last year, without Pouncey he was terrible"...the trolls would be screaming bloody murder. Yet the line graded out higher than Tannehill overall and we still hear this nonsense daily."

    The Tannehill mention and the name calling seemed to be intended to disrupt the thread and provoke an argument. As is often the case, the person who started the name calling was doing exactly what he was accusing other of doing.

    "troll
    One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument."
     
    Fin D likes this.
  3. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    You can't logically compare a passing troll remark to some of the stuff we see around here.
     
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  4. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    I'm pretty sure most people understand what you are saying, it's a very simple concept, better coaching and better players around him will allow him to play better.

    That exists for every athlete in every sport though, but what I and others around here are saying is that if he was as good as you and others are claiming, we still would have seen it, regardless of the below avg circumstances.

    I think the crux of this is that you think the situation was among the all time worst for RT, as you have said many times, "name one QB that has excelled with X, X, and X", I and others do not agree with that.

    So if we are working off of "different level foundations" how can we actually have common ground? Philip Rivers is on a team that's worse than any team RT has played on with us, and yet he produces.

    Over the last 2 years, SD has won 9 games combined, 9-23, yet Rivers has thrown for 9000 yds, 62 TDs, 34 INTs, 63%, for a 91 rating, he is their offense.

    RT, 14-15, 6000 yds, 43 TDs, 24 INTs, 64.5% for about a 91 rating.

    Rivers is producing more with less, I know RT missed 3 games, but he wasn't going to throw for 3000 yds and 20 TDs in those 3 games.

    People want to point at his 6 game streak, that is a flawed measuring stick, all starting QBs have "runs", look at what Hoyer did with 3-13 Chi last year lol, 67%, 6TDs, 0 INTs for a 98 rating.

    Imo, it's not people not understanding, at least not in my, and some others here cases, we just disagree, all the way back to the starting point so to speak, we know there has been bad OL play, and poor coaching on an avg team, I'll take it a step further, bad ownership as well.

    However, RT has not been on a horrible team, we are a decidedly avg team in the RT era, 1 year slightly below, 1 year slightly above and 3 years of just avg.

    It is the opinion of some of us that RT should have shown more already, he had a lot going for him last year but his production didn't change much, RT's best year is still under Lazor, in the midst of all the bad coaching, but last year with better coaching and players he didn't really move the needle.

    That is usually a sign that you are getting what you're getting from that player, you can disagree, because this is just my opinion, but there's no need to get angry, you can just disagree.

    However, I want to note, to everyone here, that FinD and I are actually having a civil discourse at the moment, which I think is great.

    I have decided to stop fighting, and bickering, because it dawned on me one day, this is not why I started on these fan sites, I live in Jersey, I am on these boards to talk Miami Dolphins football, I love the Dolphins.
     
    Fin-O likes this.
  5. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Again, I'm not trying to argue Thill right now. That's not my point at all.

    The problem, in this thread specifically, is what keyfin said. Nothing more. What he said about Pouncey proves he doesn't understand the argument. If he did understand it, then why would he think the "trolls" would attack him for saying it?

    Think of it from this direction.....

    Why did he think the "trolls" (Thill supporters) would attack him for saying Thill needs Pouncey around so he can play better?

    He thought we'd attack him, because we don't agree with that. Yet, as has been said numerous times, WE DO agree with that. If he understood our argument, he wouldn't think we'd attack him for saying something....we agree with.

    And none of this broaches the fact that keyfin just started insulting people unprovoked and out of nowhere.

    I have noticed a new push by you to be civil and I respect that. I'm trying to be that way to you in kind, if I'm not, then I apologize and will try harder in the future...and feel free to call me out on it.
     
    Finster likes this.
  6. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    the stuff we see around here, IMO, doesn't excuse the passing troll remark. It all adds up to the reason why the main forum is intolerable at times - and yes I realize it's not one sided.
     
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  7. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I never said that I was a saint. I called DJ's statement unfair because the line graded above average in run blocking in several games down the stretch (according to PFF, pro-football, etc.). That doesn't equal a bad line no matter how you cut it. And sure, maybe I should have used a different analogy because we know what happens when the word Tannehill is spoken here- but it also proved my point. Fin D wasn't talking about the line, Tannehill or anything else- he was attacking me.

    You conveniently missed the part where I tried to squash the argument and move it back to a football conversation- only to have it ignored with more trolling.
     
  8. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Maybe because that's exactly what you did...in this thread and in dozens of others?
     
  9. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    It's takes more energy to hate then to love.

    Let's all wipe the slate clean and enjoy a promising 2017 run with the best team we have had since 2002.

    "It's going to be fantastic"


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  10. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    You don't get to throw out a jab like that and then back out like nothing happened.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  11. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well away from here
    I can't understand why people keep falling for this crap. Seriously, between Forrest and Forrest Jr., it is blatant what happens.

    Don't get into arguments with an idiot in public, no one will be able to tell the difference and you will lose to their overwhelming experience.
     
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  12. ChrisKo

    ChrisKo Season Ticket Holder

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    So that Jay Ajayi guy is pretty good right?
     
    Fin D likes this.
  13. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    No I won't!!!!!!!
     
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  14. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He's not a troll Key, never been, just have to understand how his mind works..great poster, keeps you in check.
     
  15. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I didnt see the numbers on our run blocking efficiency without pouncey?
     
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  16. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Actually, while i appreciate your compassion and even share it a little...

    It isn't Key's or anyones responsibility to have to "understand" someone else's mental make-up. He is simply stating how he feels based on his history with X poster. Is his opinion correct? I dunno....but who cares, its an opinion and he has reasons to feel that way.

    Again, I feel the same way you do to an extent as i have a tad bit of sympathy as well. But I also had sympathy for Landry, who was verbally berated with explicatives. I wish you would've expressed your concern for how he was treated also.

    This place needs some work, I don't want to keep losing guy's like CIF and Shouright because nobody "felt sorry" for them.

    Maybe we as veteran posters need to figure this out ourselves and present a real solution to the elected officials of this fine site. ANYTHING to help, before another good poster is forced to go hang at Finheaven.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2017
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  17. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    That's the thing- it's not anyone's job to keep others "in check" by cussing at them, calling them stupid or making fun of them. The moderators here surely don't do that, so members shouldn't either. It's completely against the site's rules and unfortunately, most threads get derailed by it.

    If you want to debate/argue with me over how good our O line was, the problems on defense, draft picks, quarterbacks or anything else....that's how we keep each other "in check". That's why we're all here and we can definitely argue all day long while still showing others respect. For instance, I disagree with you on a lot of things- but so what? We'e always been cordial with each other and that's how it's supposed to be.

    When that line gets crossed over and over again though, it stops being fun for everybody.
     
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  18. Simon

    Simon The Other English Simon Club Member

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    How did we get from a discussion about Ajayi's FF ranking to this?!?
     
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  19. Triggercut

    Triggercut Well-Known Member

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    Miami has been a middling to crappy team for so long that analysts just take it for granted to continue (as it has). They don't watch youtube video's of the draftee's or Free Agents and imagine how they will fit in the scheme. Probably never watched player interviews, nor have they seen the majesty of Burke's beard (nor do they love Wakes Dong like some dudes do). They don't debate on messageboard and squash internet trolls with their dubious wit.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2017
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  20. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    i didn't mean he literally keeps you in check..just the way he operates on the board..he debates things that he believes in, and it isn't always about football..if you think thats trolling that I believe that isn't accurate or intuitive...and, a lot of members on this board hold him in high regard and enjoy his presence and intellect so the generalization that he isn't fun for everyone is just that, and exaggerated generalization..
     
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  21. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    See post #7. It derailed the thread.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  22. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    I don't think this thread actually got derailed, or maybe it would be more accurate to say that it was a natural derailment, because I think the Jayjay part of the thread was over that quickly, there really isn't much to say on the subject.
     
  23. Rickysabeast

    Rickysabeast Royale With Cheese

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    :amen::butthead::amen:
     
  24. Rickysabeast

    Rickysabeast Royale With Cheese

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    Dude. Grow up and quit whining. We're all sick of you.
     
  25. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    Key Fin kind of summed it up. QB's have to win. You won't get the perfect offense, not in today's free agency world. I think we are behind all the excuses. The coaching staff and FO are better. We have better and enough talent and a plan in place. Look to win, we have to depend on the qb to bail us out a few times a year. The "team" effort is sexy to talk about, but a qb taking over a game happens to the best teams and against the best teams. It is the prudent, fiscally responsible thing for us to pull for RT. The depreciation is off now. The on the job training is off now. And to be honest, it doesn't matter who is qb, the first year of the Gase offense was going to have learning curves. I think we should all have higher expectations. And if we all trust Gase, trust that he is trying to make RT special.

    Look we have to also prepare for the worst. If we don't take the next steps, he will be gone. It's a reality
     
  26. Rickysabeast

    Rickysabeast Royale With Cheese

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    I agree. I don't want to put anyone on ignore. If you want to just be a jerk with each comment then you should get called out for it. We work hard to post things that are interesting. Fin D should quit derailing them or know he;s going to get called on it.
     
    Fin-O likes this.
  27. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    Dude, do you read your posts? you argue with dozens of posters it seems. what's your end game here? do you want us to all agree and succumb to you? You can have different opinions and disagree. We are all Phins fans, but have different views on who should play and the like. However, it isn't that serious, because your opinion doesn't matter. You don't run the team.

    I suggest you take a lesson in etiquette. Learn to accept the views of posters, however, stand up for your values. But just remember this is not the Russian Boards you are used to posting with Putin. Just accept the differences and move on. And if you end up right on something, then point it out and get props. if you don't like that, then get the hell out
     
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  28. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Hold on a second- it was a thread about Ajayi. DJ mentioned a bad line in #6. I said the line was better run blocking statistically than Tannehill in #7. Both valid points for this type of discussion. The only difference is, I knew that I'd get personally attacked for saying that...so I called it out in advance.

    You're acting like because we know some people will behave like two year olds, it's our fault for trying to have a conversation. I'm sorry, my friend, but it's not. I should be able to name our starting quarterback in a thread without someone ignoring every rule that's in place on this website. I did not derail anything.
     
  29. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well away from here
    :jt0323:
     
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  30. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Jesus.

    1. You brought up Thill, no one else did.
    2. No one attacked you at that point.
    3. No one would have attacked for you saying Thill plays better with Pouncey, because for the billionth time, that's precisely what we've been saying for years...Thill needs a good oline and good oline players. (Ok that's not true, people like you and the ones that agree with you, would have and have attacked us, when we've said Thill needs Pouncey and good olineman to play better.)
    4. You insulted people by calling them trolls and you did so unprovoked.
    5. You did all of this while PMing me that I'm a bad poster for doing all the things you did in post #7.
    6. No one attacked you for your statement about Pouncey. No one attacked you period. They were defending themselves, from your insults.
    7. The difference between you and me is that I'm not holding myself up telling people they shouldn't do X all while doing X. You act as if you're above it all and you're doing precisely what you're complaining about. This is not the first nor the last time.
    8. I offered you an olive branch and you literally ignored what was offered, made up your own take on what I offered and then attacked me like I'm the crazy one.
    9. For the last time, stop complaining about me, do the board a favor and put me on ignore again. For all the things you complain about with me, it makes no sense you took me off ignore in the first place.

    This was my final response to you on this subject.
     
  31. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You attacked posters because they had the audacity to want a link and then attacked more posters because of the heinous crime of providing quotes from a linked article. You deserved everything you got.

    It's funny, the only people that have a real problem with me, are the exact same people who do the things they accuse me of. Every last one, to a man.

    This was my final response to you on this subject.
     
  32. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    Can it be the final reply to everything?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  33. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    That's awesome news...it's all anyone had asked for in the first place.
     
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  34. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Some have taken issue even in posts where I was defending Tannehill, because they still perceived it as me ripping Tannehill. It's obnoxious at this point.
     
  35. dirtylandry

    dirtylandry Well-Known Member

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    So is he leaving for good?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  36. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    It actually proves we're reasonable and that you and your ilk misrepresent us completely. See the problem is you guys think we're defending Thill at all costs and what you just said proves we aren't. We are pointing out when you're wrong and we do it whether you're defending Thill or not, because we aren't here to defend him no matter what.

    You guys not understanding that is your own problem.
     
  37. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    :morning:
     
  38. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    dude you just got to this site and saying things like you speak for a consensus is so out of line and disrespectful, pisses me off that you think you can say sh$$ like that...talk about growing up.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  39. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    There was a time when you couldn't post ANY type of criticism of Ryan w/o it starting a fight. Not just with one poster either, but a handful.

    2 things happened last year.

    1.) When Ryan came out of the gates poorly many of his most loyal of backers started to agree he needed to move on.
    2.) He finally started to play at a high level in the middle of the season and there wasn't a reason to really criticize him.

    So last year wasn't nearly as bad...but yes during that stretch wherein you didn't blame the OL, WRS, OC, HC, DEF, Trump, Global Warming before having anything other than an apologetic take on 17? You got an earful.

    Moral? As long as Ryan plays at a high level we won't disagree nearly as often with each other.
     
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  40. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    I do not feel like that is the best solution. Excommunicating a member should always be a last resort IMO.
     

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