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Covid-19 Inactive Players

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Nov 12, 2020.

  1. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Lock down for 6 weeks. As soon as those 6 weeks are up, virus starts to rage again. The only way is to lock down until the vaccine comes out and the government MANDATES that you take it. That is not going to ever happen in a free society. I find it funny that Joe's plan is basically what is currently being done. But somehow he's going to control something that's not controllable. You gonna get it sooner or later. Just hope the vaccine is available and you're not in the 10% it doesn't help.
     
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  2. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I don't watch much news, but when I see or hear reports on the "record" number of positive cases, I never see them talk about how many tests are being done.

    I only mentioned the American thing because the way you wrote it, it seemed you were insinuating that Australians were fine with the measures, and it was only Americans complaining about the Australian measures.
     
  3. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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  4. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity

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    In the UK the COVID tests have been reported to have high numbers of false positives. No explanation given in many accounts. It even came from the mouth of a couple of high-level government ministers. So it's pretty much a known fact. Despite that admission, there's still the idea that more and more testing is the way to go. So much of what is done in the UK is just mystifying.

    I heard a few heart-wrenching accounts from people calling in to give their view on a radio show. The impact of lock-down on the elderly has really taken a harsh toll.
     
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  5. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I see the opposite when I look at reports because the ones I read generally talk big picture and do not have political leans. Positive test rate is very important and the super high positive test rate in South Dakota is especially alarming.

    I only mentioned only America because I do not live in Australia and their protests do not directly affect me. I did not insinuate anything.
     
  6. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    You didn't say "it is rare or not reported enough", you said, "no one", which is not true.

    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-st...-sees-38-positivity-rate-in-daily-virus-tests

    there is one on South Dakota's extremely high positive test rate.
     
  7. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I didn't realize we were being held to such standards. I was not trying to say that you can't find one, but that is far from normal to have articles, print or television, that include much of anything regarding total number of tests when discussing the increasing case numbers.
     
  8. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Also, my point was that the information regarding total number of tests, or percents of tests, is something that I generally have to specifically search for, it isn't generally being reported.
     
  9. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Standards of words that we use?
     
  10. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I never have. We just get different sources I guess.
     
  11. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yes, I didn't realize that I couldn't generalize without being treated like I was writing a doctoral thesis.
     
  12. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    You didn't generalize.
     
  13. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Again, I did a Bing search for"record covid cases," and have you the first three search results, and none of them did any discussion of test totals or percent positives. They simply went on about how many cases we are having. I didn't feel like going through any more, as it makes my point. You actually have to search out the information, it isn't generally being reported alongside case numbers.
     
  14. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I did generalize. I said "no one" as a general comment, not as a specific verified stat.
     
  15. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    That is not how words work.
     
  16. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    That's only explainable if it's user error because tests for genetic material specific to a pathogen tend to be really accurate. That means a lot of people administering the test aren't following proper protocol. As I said earlier I don't know the specifics for this particular test but in general most such tests have strict protocols on how samples are stored, when and how to read the results (reading them too early or too late can affect the result), and how many samples you can process at once etc.

    Then there's the question of how strict people are in enforcing simple things like making sure there's no contamination from one sample to the next. I've seen how crappy data can be from "field work" where people who are supposedly experts on a particular disease (in this case trachoma) just make up their own protocol when they shouldn't, etc. So the reason here HAS to be people being sloppy in how they're administering the tests if it's truly a high false positive rate.
     
  17. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    248k deaths holds no water whatsoever, sorry.
     
  18. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    True, it is actually higher.
     
  19. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Absolutely not...far lower. I know people personally that have died from other things, but were attributed to Covid.
     
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  20. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I am sorry, that doesn't hold water.
     
  21. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    You, sir, have been assimilated. When somebody I know loses a very long battle with stage 4 cancer and dies from it, only to be counted as a Covid death (when the oncologist confirmed it was the cancer), and when another person I know dies from a heartattack, who had a long history of heart disease, is called a Covid death, pardon me if I have zero faith in how this government reports this stuff.
     
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  22. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah it is likely higher if you go by excess deaths (more deaths due to whatever cause during the pandemic):
    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6942e2.htm
     
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  23. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    When the base number is ridiculously off like Covid numbers are, it skews everything.
     
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  24. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity

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  25. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Yes, because Covid causes heart attacks and that person would most likely still be alive if they didn't have Covid.

    That is how all disease deaths are counted.
     
  26. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Base numbers are from pre-COVID 2015-2019.
     
  27. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    So how many people do you believe have died? If you're going to allege that the numbers are so greatly inflated you should have a handle on how many are legitimate correct? As well as a way to demonstrate how you came to that number. Go for it.

    Doctors told my grandfather he had either bronchitis or pneumonia (forget which I was young) when he had terminal lung cancer. That doesnt mean there is a conspiracy to boost the number of bronchitis/pneumonia diagnoses.
     
  28. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    You guys seriously believe those numbers? When people who have died in motorcycle crashes were designated as Covid deaths? Have at it.
     
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  29. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    "The Centers for Disease Control guidance explicitly acknowledges the uncertainty that doctors can face when identifying the cause of death. When coronavirus cases are “suspected,” the agency counsels doctors that “it is acceptable to report COVID-19 on a death certificate.” This advice has produced a predictable inflation in the numbers. When New York City’s death toll rose above 10,000 on April 21, the New York Times reported that the city included “3,700 additional people who were presumed to have died of the coronavirus but had never tested positive” – more than a 50% increase in the number of cases."

    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/05/29/us_covid-19_death_toll_is_inflated.html#!
     
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  30. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Of course, going by your logic there have been zero flu, AIDS, or cancer deaths.

    If someone with hemophilia gets in a car wreck and dies from a wound that would not kill someone with hemophilia then it is not a vast hemophilia conspiracy to count it is a hemophilia death.
     
  31. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Yea, that is how they do a lot of diseases.

    Did you know that when you look at flu death numbers that they take the total number of reported flu deaths and multiply them by about 3.9 to get the estimates?
     
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  32. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Also there are death numbers for different diseases each year and as a whole that remain relatively stable over time to the point you can determine if there is a much higher death rate in total going on.
     
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  33. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    The question that has never been answered, is how many of these wheely with almost 3 co-morbidities, would have died had they contracted the normal flu, or other sickness. I think it's important to remember that the average death is almost (or is) 80 years old with 2.6 co-morbidities. If you remove nursing home numbers from the overall numbers, covid dangers shrink even more. Basically, we have been told we have to do all these measures so that we don't potentially spread covid to a very small percent of our population. I mean, at the end of the day, we are talking about a sickness with 99+% survival rate.

    To each their own, but I'm not afraid of it.
     
  34. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I respect your opinion but to me it has nothing to do with whether I will die. I'm not sure how accurate it us, but I saw a study saying something like 20% of covid patients are at risk or have developed (forget which) mental illnesses of varying degrees that they didnt have before. Some people have lung scarring, other issues.

    It's not about whether I'm going to drop dead. It's about the quality of my life and the quality of others.

    In my humble opinion.
     
  35. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    I've read about the mental illness aspect as well but this is first time I've heard 20%, where did you see that?
     
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  36. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I'll try to find the article again, it's also possible I'm misquoting the percentage I'll say that outright but it was a much higher percentage than I'd have guessed which is why I said I was unsure of the accuracy.

    It's also possible it was something like "20% of severe cases" or some other qualifier. I'm at work now but I will check up on it.
     
  37. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    IT is not about being afraid, it is about being smart. I am not afraid of texting while driving, I am smart enough to know it is a danger.

    Again, the problem isn't the mortality rate, it is the hospitalization rate. It is a sickness that overwhelms our healthcare system and causes other issues and quite frankly burnout of nurses.

    At the end of the day we do not even know the morbidity rate of this disease. If you have Covid-19, even asytimatically there is lung damage and blood clotting.

    Here is a study that shows
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...vid-19-survivors-develop-mental-illness-study
     
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  38. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Well when the media says you're gonna die if you get Covid I can definitely see people having that reaction when they get it.
     
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  39. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I do not know what media you consume, so I cannot comment on that. The media I consume does not tell me that I am going to die if I get it.
     
  40. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    That's why the "excess deaths" statistics are so useful. There's a sudden spike in deaths with the onset COVID-19 relative to 2015-2019, even if you can't pinpoint the exact cause. So the order of magnitude of the COVID death statistics is almost certainly accurate. If they're off by some percentage, fine but we're still talking 250k-300k range in the US, and that's taking into account overestimating COVID deaths due to not getting proper medical treatment from other diseases as well as underestimating it due to killing the spread of the flu, which kills 10k-60k people usually each year in the US.

    It's closer to 97.5% worldwide based on current statistics. This country has 300 million people, and 1% = 3 million. Suggesting we shouldn't care about a few million potential extra deaths in the US is completely irresponsible if you're a politician. More people are dying from COVID than from most wars we fought. What's the survival rate from Islamic terrorism??

    Anyway, I'm not afraid of it either. I probably had it several weeks ago myself as I lost my sense of smell for a week or two, but I've never been tested. That doesn't mean I don't wear a mask as soon as I'm in public spaces where I come into contact with others. That's not so much for me (like you I'm not afraid of this) but for others.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2020
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