1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Lombardi doesn't understand how Chris Grier has a job...

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by hitman8, Oct 8, 2021.

  1. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

    3,040
    2,485
    113
    Nov 11, 2016
    Rick 1966 likes this.
  2. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

    4,052
    2,347
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    This part about TUA scares me


    You took a player who has been injury-prone his whole career. “Tua can throw crossers, flats, and curls. But if he has to do anything more than that, he can’t. Is Tua going to be a top 15 quarterback in the league? If the answer is no, you need a [new] quarterback. Herbert is in the top five.”
     
    hitman8 and mlb1399 like this.
  3. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

    3,893
    3,087
    113
    Mar 6, 2010
    This guy is bringing up points that many of us who were against drafting Tua. The question is, why wasn’t our GM?

    We basically drafted a smaller, less durable Chad Pennington.
     
    Unlucky 13 likes this.
  4. Tone_E

    Tone_E Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    13,777
    7,574
    113
    Dec 8, 2007
    He still doesn't understand why he doesn't have GM position any longer.
     
    Puka-head and KeyFin like this.
  5. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

    3,040
    2,485
    113
    Nov 11, 2016
    Because our GM is an absolute failure at drafting and talent evaluation. I have no idea how he has managed to stay in the organization and move up the scouting and personnel ladder for 20 years now given how god awfull our drafting and personnel decisions have been throughout that entire period.

    He must be blowing Ross on the regular or something. Ross is an even bigger idiot for keeping him around so long.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2021
    Sceeto and mlb1399 like this.
  6. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

    10,488
    12,821
    113
    Nov 1, 2009
    This article has several inaccuracies- for instance, saying Grier has been with the Fins for six years and over six drafts. When someone overlooks something that basic, I pretty much always stop reading since it's crap journalism.

    As to Lombardi's points, someone within the organization was in love with Tua. Was it Grier? Ross? Marino? I have no idea. But if Grier didn't want to take Tua and his hand was forced, then Tua's ultimately not on him and Ross knows that.

    For the other picks that Grier did actually make; Wilkins, Waddle and Phillips look pretty good so far. Jackson was a long-term project from the start and people need to stop acting like we didn't know that going in. He gave bone marrow to save his sister's life and he entered the NFL while he was still rebuilding his strength. It was almost impossible for him to develop right away and again, we knew that! If he busts, then sure, 100% on Grier...but we're not there yet. This kid will turn into a solid NFL tackle, but it will probably be another year.

    And for Tua, calling him a bust at this point is ridiculous! He's played 4 NFL quarters in the new offense and we beat the Pats at Gillette. Last year he wasn't 100%, didn't have a preseason and didn't know the playbook...but started some anyway because the same person who wanted to draft him so badly insisted on it. So all this bust talk really comes down to 4 quarters of football in a game he looked pretty good in. It makes zero sense.

    All I can say is, they can fire Grier tomorrow and Tua is still our QB1 for the foreseeable future. People need to accept that.
     
    Puka-head and Silverphin like this.
  7. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

    11,035
    4,419
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    I'm not here to defend Chris Grier or anything, but Mike Lombardi is one of the last people I'd go to for an opinion on another GM.
     
  8. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

    3,040
    2,485
    113
    Nov 11, 2016
    The article has some inaccuracies, but the overall message is not wrong. Grier has been a failure so far, the best he has to show is Wilkins, Waddle, and Phillips, all of whom have been ok, but nothing special shown yet, and they have not lived up to their draft status as of yet.

    There are a lot more misses and busts on Grier's resume than hits, and even his hits have been underwhelming.

    If Jackson was a project then he should not have been picked in the first round, same with Noah. The first round is not where you pick project players. In the first round you should be picking players who are ready to contribute significantly from day one, not 2-3 years down the line. Project players should be picked in later rounds.

    That is one of the main errors in Grier's drafting, trying to outsmart everyone by thinking he sees something everybody else doesn't see with these raw players, then falling flat on his face.
     
  9. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

    3,893
    3,087
    113
    Mar 6, 2010
    To add to your point, he’s basically rebuilt our OL and drafted his franchise QB. This OL is the worst I’ve seen and Miami has had some bad Ol’s. You could make the argument that they’re young but Jackson is rated horribly among starting tackles and no one has made any major strides. Is that coaching or talent evaluation, I’m not sure but I wanted Creed Humphrey and he’s playing at a high level already.

    To Keys point, it’s too early to call Tua a bust. Having said that, I’ve seen nothing from him that has convinced me that he has any ability to stay healthy or be a franchise QB when healthy. He looks like at best a mid tier QB who’s going to need training wheels(a good back up QB) because you can’t depend on him. The fact that we whiffed on maybe one of the top 3-4 QB’s in the league is reason enough for me to fire him. Then pile on Charles Harris, Noah Ig, Jackson who’s one of the worst starting tackles in football. On top of that, I’ll never understand trading up for a slot WR when you can’t protect your QB.

    There were a lot of impact players in the last two drafts and it seems yet again, we had all the fire power and a lot of misses.
     
    hitman8 and KeyFin like this.
  10. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

    13,501
    6,246
    113
    Oct 13, 2008
    New York
    Word up, bro.

    Less durable Chad P. Ha! That's pretty bad.
     
  11. Dolphin Dundee

    Dolphin Dundee Well-Known Member

    811
    549
    93
    Sep 27, 2015
    I find the whole way we set up our "young team" wrong. We bring in young raw players and try to coach them up by unproven promoted within coaches it's like the blind leading the blind. The only way this works is you have proven coaches along with a few veteran players to help guide them along not just throw everyone in the fire and hope it works.
     
    hitman8 likes this.
  12. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

    10,488
    12,821
    113
    Nov 1, 2009
    This I 100% agree with- Jackson is not Tunsil.

    Iggy is the most sure bust we've seen so far, but I can also accept that because everyone misses sometimes. The kid had a ton of raw talent and was expected to develop into a shutdown corner quickly....and it just didn't happen. That's okay in my book to miss like that, but Jackson was in an entire other category since he missed part of the year for the bone marrow surgery.

    I do love Jackson's story and all, but you just don't see NFL athletes in this position enough (much less linemen) to know how it will affect them long-term. If we whiffed late 2nd/3rd on him, then sure, it didn't work out and it was worth a try. But he never should have gone in the 1st round.

    With that said, what now? Firing Grier does not fix Jackson or Iggy. Some would say that the problem lies in the coaching and development side, sort of like a Dion Jordan who had tons of potential and never lived up to it. So unless we can say without a shadow of a doubt that these players were a bust from day 1, that's not entirely on Grier.

    Why am I bringing this up? I was angry when Gase left and we went on this new direction of gutting the team and bold promises. Nobody can predict building a perennial playoff contender in 3-4 years, the league is just too competitive. I was against a rebuild because we were basically an 8-8 team...and three years later with 50 new players, we look pretty much like an 8-8 team. What was the point? What did we gain from doing this?

    It makes zero sense to fire Grier, Flores or anyone else until we realize where/what went wrong. Just blindly firing people because Ross was dumb enough to believe them only ensures that we're going to repeat this all over again...and again...and again. The lesson here is to pinpoint the mistakes and learn from them.

    And besides, if we do fire Flores/Grier after they received guaranteed five year contracts, who in their right mind fills those positions next year? Not someone that can make us a perennial playoff contender, I promise you that. We can't even hire assistants at this point because of Miami's rinse and repeat reputation. In my opinion, we have to ride this out for a few more seasons for better or worse. Anything else will only bring chaos to this organization and the few players we do have worth a darn are going to bail. Sound familiar?
     
    Hooligan likes this.
  13. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

    5,820
    4,665
    113
    Jan 15, 2008
    He was 11-21 as a GM and the 3 years after he left they were 4-44. He has some responsibility for that.
     
    Tone_E likes this.
  14. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

    11,881
    4,834
    113
    Nov 26, 2007
    Detroit Metro Area MI
    Lombardi is trash and it's crazy he still has a job. He's just pointing out the obvious - we are floundering and our top talent guy (Grier) looks to be a mediocre to bad GM so far. It's a lazy take just piling on.
     
    Silverphin likes this.
  15. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Raheem Club Member

    51,930
    63,008
    113
    Apr 24, 2012
    Troy, Virginia
    I said that months before he was drafted. But anyone who dared speak ill of him was sent to the corner.

    This Fandom has an issue with developing a cult around one particular qb prospect most years, and if you aren't part of that, you become immediately wrong.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2021
  16. ExplosionsInDaSky

    ExplosionsInDaSky Well-Known Member

    3,163
    2,325
    113
    Sep 13, 2011
    I agree with everything you've said right here. I couldn't have said it better myself. Tua getting mollywhopped in week 2 I think put a lot of negative **** in people's heads. I know it did it to me. I was like "yo he sucks" and I was one of his biggest supporters on this forum last season. I finally have had time to calm down about him. It's like you said. He's going to be our quarterback for the foreseeable future whether people like that or not. I'm fine with it because...Well...We've invested in him. We need this to work, so why not be on board with it? Why not hope for the best? That's how I'm going to go about this personally. Until Tua completely fails, I'm going to support him. I took the same approach with Tannehill. The talent was there, we never got him a solid run game, we never upgraded the O line for him. He's flourished in Nashville. Good for him. You're also right about Austin Jackson. I believe he was the youngest player in the draft if I'm not mistaken? Someone can correct me on that, but that's definitely something to think about. I know he was at least one of the youngest players. He's a project, and one that I am not worried about completing. It's going to get done. He needs the experience. It's baptism by fire. Bloody Hell!!! our entire O line is getting this treatment! Sometimes that's how things have to be in life. You learn on the job! It's going to be ugly this year. We're not going to make the playoffs, but I can confidently say that this team is going to get better as the weeks pass and the season progresses. We're a young team, with a young coach. Everyone here is learning on the job.

    As far as Grier goes, I'm not ready to call for his head yet. He made a dumb pick with Noah I, and he reached with Hunter Long this past April. I thought the Hunter Long pick was the dumbest pick I have seen in a long time. Hopefully I eat those words, but WTF man!? That's my opinion on him so far. Other than that, I like most of our picks. I thought that maybe he should have kept a couple OL vets around (mainly Flowers). I think he wisely tried to replace him with DJ Fluker and it unfortunately blew up in his face. Just a busted free agent signing. Will Fuller...Meh...I was skeptical of it, I didn't think it was a necessary signing. He's been injury prone since he's come into this league, I didn't and don't expect much from him. Worth a shot I guess, but I thought we already had some decent home grown talent brewing with Bowden (also injured), Perry, and Ford (not sure where he is).

    So does the axe fall on Grier, or Flores, or someone else? If we finish the season 3-14 then yeah, I think Grier gets ousted. But Ross has proven to be a patient man. He shows faith in the guys running stuff, I don't think he's going to make a knee jerk decision. Flores is going to get at least four years here. I think Tua gets the rest of this year and next year as well. After that, I can see heads rolling if we aren't getting better and winning games. It is what is...The life of a Miami Dolphin fan. We're going to get our asses whooped again this weekend by Tampa. Take it like a man and get stronger from it is all I can say to the players. 1-4 at that point with Tua coming back and a pretty chill (although competitive) schedule on the horizon. We'll start feeling better after we put together a few wins.
     
    KeyFin likes this.
  17. Kud_II

    Kud_II Realist Division

    3,662
    1,404
    113
    Oct 15, 2011
    Seneca, SC
    I haven't had an answer to this question for 2 years running. At least not in the drafting/scouting department. Maybe keep him around if he starts making favorable pick trades again, but he had some blunders there too after big gains. But worse (and most unforgivable to me) is... He picked the wrong QB, and I and a lot of other fans said nope don't believe the hype, take Herbert. But who else has he drafted of note in 3-4 yrs? Xavien was his only memorable hit.. and Gesicki if he has a QB, idk wtf is wrong with Gesicki, but I do remember him looking like a pro-bowler with Fitzpatrick. Other than that Grier has bludgeoned the Dolphins with his drafting errors omg I can't even think about those 4 first round picks, and the one swapped this season "shoots self." Fire this fool already ROSS has no BALLS. He gots Prunes with no Balls
     
    hitman8 likes this.
  18. Waiting for clean up. - G. (Mod)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 12, 2021
  19. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

    3,040
    2,485
    113
    Nov 11, 2016
    This is a pretty good summation of the **** show we have going on in Miami. Nice job .
     
  20. phin81

    phin81 New Member

    5
    5
    3
    Aug 23, 2018
    A few issues that I have with Tua. Injuries, look at how many this mid has had. I don’t thing he has every played every game in a season even in college; maybe high school. There is a saying, hurt in college, hurt in the pros. Then, who was the QB draft right after Tua… Herbert! Herbert looks like the second coming of Marino and we had a chance to draft him. If someone would have drafted Herbert before us then I wouldn’t even bring Herbert up. Like with Joe Burrows, it doesn’t even bother me if he does good, we never had a chance to draft him.

    With that said, Grier must be fired. He missed on Tua, Jackson looks horrible and where is Iggy? You don’t draft projects in the first round. You draft players that are ready to go. Grier has been in our organization for 20 years, how many probowl players have we had? How many playoff wins do we have? Nope, Grier has to go asap!

    Grier did do a good job on getting a lot of draft picks but he is everyone in our front office is horrible on talent evaluation. They all need to be fired.
     
    mlb1399 and hitman8 like this.

Share This Page