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Tua is not the Problem

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Nov 6, 2021.

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  1. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    So we can just pretend it was GB making adjustments then even though as you are now saying we don't know?
     
  2. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Sure, as long as you realize it was a small sample and his numbers were starting to correct to his career norms the final month of the season.
     
  3. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    Tua is never going to pass the eye test or the underwear test for some on this site. Some simply do not understand (or refuse to acknowledge) what is actually happening on the field. Last season Tua demonstrated numerous elite traits, including accuracy, eye discipline, ability to read defenses, timing, pocket awareness, foot quickness, and release quickness. Every single knowledgeable football analyst acknowledged how well he was playing. Many of the things he was doing was unprecedented.

    He does not have a huge arm and does not possess great mobility (but he is not a statue either). Finally, the concussions are a problem.

    His long term success, IMO, is dependent only on his health. I see no reason why his success should continue. The notion that defenses caught up and the end of the season is nonsense and is based on two games. The same doubters spouted their nonsense after the first game and again after the Pitt game. They must have been besides themselves after the Bal, Buf, Det, Chi, Cle, Hou, and 2nd Buf games. We should be incredibly encouraged by what he was able to do in year one of a complicated offense.

    How sad to watch a game and hope your team wins but the QB does poorly.... embarrassing.
     
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  4. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    There's no need to pretend or guess. We know GB made 2nd half adjustments:
     
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  5. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    LOL. Your argument against a small sample size is to use a smaller sample size.......
     
  6. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    we also know Tua had a serious enough concussion to miss the rest of the season
     
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  7. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Not at all. You are giving opinions from pundits.

    An actual player from the Dolphins is claiming that Tua throws to a spot, REGARDLESS of where the receiver is.

    I'M not saying that. Shurfield is.
     
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  8. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Huh? I'm all about using larger samples of career data that show Tua isn't anywhere elite.

    You want to just use a shortened 2022 as proof Tua is elite. One of us is using small samples, but it ain't me babe.
     
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  9. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Correct, but we have no idea how that concussion impacted his in-game play. Players can play through concussions. Players can sustain concussion and not have symptoms until after the game. Players pass concussion tests and continue to play. Hell, Tua did it in Buffalo earlier in the season.
     
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  10. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    Every team makes adjustments. How do we know if it was something they did or it was his concussion?

    And don't respond saying its still his fault. You are saying teams figured him/them out. How do we know it wasn't the concussion?
     
  11. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Sorry. But that's not how this works. If you are going to use the concussion as the excuse, then the onus is on you to prove that.

    Then there is this:
    “The review established that symptoms of a concussion were neither exhibited nor reported until the following day at which time the team medical personnel appropriately evaluated and placed Mr. Tagovailoa in the concussion protocol.”
     
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  12. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    Ok well he had a concussion. There is my proof.
     
  13. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yup. The official narrative is that there was nothing about Tua or his play that indicated there was anything wrong. So the poor play couldn't be from the concussion, according to doctors.

    But we're the ones with an agenda.
     
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  14. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Except the doctors say there was nothing to indicate he had a concussion. Erego, the concussion did not drastically change Tua's physical or mental ability to play.

    If you believe otherwise, then you need proof, other than your opinion.
     
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  15. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    That's proof of a concussion. Not actually proof his concussion impacted his play. As I mentioned in my other post, players can play through a concussion and even pass a concussion test. Tua finished up the game in Buffalo likely on a concussion.

    “The review established that symptoms of a concussion were neither exhibited nor reported until the following day at which time the team medical personnel appropriately evaluated and placed Mr. Tagovailoa in the concussion protocol.”
     
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  16. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    You say that as if he was examined. If he has he would have failed as he did for weeks.
     
  17. Tuanon4Life

    Tuanon4Life Well-Known Member

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    I thought the narrative ended up being that McDaniel noticed something wrong watching game tape and initiated the concussion test on Tua. So something was noticably off to the coach after watching the film. Or am I wrong? The first story I remember was that Tua went in and told the coaches. Then it changed to Tua being called in and questioned.
     
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  18. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    For YEARS in this forum, the measuring stick for a quarterback’s ability, and determining whether or not he was elite was stats. Stats, stats, stats. I had dozens of documented arguments with Brad concerning stats (not calling you out, merely illustrating a point).

    Critcism over Tagovailoa began his first year as the starter in 2022. He wasn’t putting up the stats. He was a bust based on stats alone. He was a short passer, he didn’t have the arm strength, he couldn’t throw the long ball, yada yada yada.

    Come 2023 season…Flores is out, along with the co offensive coordinators in Godsey and Studesville. In comes McDaniel and a revamped offense. 2023 is a make or break year for Tua. Those SAME STATS everyone touted Tua for being a bust over, Tagovailoa shatters that ceiling. He does EVERYTHING everyone says he needed to do to prove himself.

    You guys can’t have this both ways. You can’t use a lack of stats to determine Tua’s a bust and turn around and critique every nuance of the stats he put up (that was your measuring stick) to still claim he’s a bust. You’re being nonsensical and hypocritical, showing a disdain and disgust for a player just because he’s not THE player you wanted the Dolphins to draft.

    Tua’s ONLY concern in my book is his durability. He missed four games in 2022 due to bruised ribs and another game or 2 due to a finger injury. The latter I personally believe was Flores’ lack of faith in his quarterback. This season he suffered 2 concussions and missed a considerable amount of playing time. THESE are legitimate concerns but is in no way a critique on his play.

    Bottom line, when Tua played, the Dolphins won…period. If you’re concerned about Tua’s durability, then build an actual OL that dominates the LOS.
     
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  19. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    :sidelol: Holy ——, dude. Wt- are you talking about?
    Well…..there’s part of your problem
     
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  20. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    Yeah this is what McDaniel said but I guess it doesn't count because reasons
     
  21. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    GB started to clog the middle of the field in the second half. Go back and look at the first interception he threw, he was throwing to a spot on a timing route over the middle but there were about 4 GB defenders in the area. Tua also threw into double and tripple coverage several times against LA which should have been interceptions. Teams figured out Tua's bread and butter is throwing timing routes over the middle and adjusted by cloging the middile with defenders and jamming recievers at the line to disrupt timing.

    That forces Tua to go off schedule and improvise which he is not very good at.

    All three interceptions seemed like a result of Tua making up his mind pre snap where he was going with the football and ignoring coverage adjustments post snap.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2023
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  22. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    If it was that obvious GB would have been doing it all game

    Guess we are supposed to believe teams don't watch tape and prepare
     
  23. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    And I have played precisely as many NCAA and NFL snaps with Tua as my QB as Sherfield has.
     
  24. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    Again. You don’t understand what he is saying. Simple as that.
     
  25. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    post of the year. Voting is closed.
     
  26. hitman8

    hitman8 Well-Known Member

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    Some teams are better at preparing and making certain adjustments than others. Most coaches have a specific scheme they run and they have a hard time adjusting and going away from it. It takes them a while to figure things out, or they dont have the right personel to play things differently. Just look at our defense with the refusal to go away from the cover zero even though we no longer had two lock down corners, and our lack of adjustments all year.
     
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  27. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    You tried to use two games to discredit his 2022 season. Try to keep up.
     
  28. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    first true thing you’ve said in the entire thread
     
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  29. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    Watch the videos
     
  30. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    Yeah, stats-wise Tua showed almost everything we wanted to see in 2022. Sustained elite level play, the ability to overcome adversity and "carry" the team to wins when the rest of the team didn't show up. No QB the Dolphins have had since Marino could do that.

    Only "stats" issue remaining with Tua is demonstrating this wasn't a fluke, and showing he can do this in the playoffs. 2022 was a very successful year for the Dolphins hoping to find a franchise QB. But he has to keep this up in 2023 and win in the playoffs. I just wish a lot of Tua detractors would let 2023 play out before being so certain Tua can't be our franchise QB.
     
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  31. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Uh, I was ALWAYS against the stats stats stats arguments, going back to finheaven. I find stats to not really be the be-all-end-all some others do.
     
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  32. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Right. I disagree, so I don't understand what he's saying.

    I do understand what he's saying.

    Do you understand what Shurfield was saying?

    Like, all you are doing is confirmation bias. You ignore or try to obfuscate any detracting point. You clearly believe Tua is elite and has zero limitations. Anything that goes seeing on a play is clearly the fault of a receiver or an oline or just a bad call by the coach.

    It's really tiring, actually. You aren't having an honest discussion.
     
  33. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Honestly cbrad, it's not the posters, like you, who I really have a problem with. I think you have a realistic outlook on how to handle the QB, I just think you have a rosier overall thought on Tua than I do.

    However, it's a couple of these other posters who literally will try to argue away any criticism of Tua, as if there are no shortcomings, that are really driving the argument.

    I myself agree, Tua is not going anywhere in the short term. My points shouldn't ever be taken as me saying that there is a different QB playing right now. It's more that when I see what I consider false statements, that I just offer a counter argument.
     
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  34. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    You really need to stop commenting on posters, and just stick with your comments in Tua.

    It's trolling.
     
  35. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yep. It was those games where I realized the "throwing receivers open" was simply a mirage.
     
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  36. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    i think some folks have forgotten how truly talented Tua is, theyve lost theor path amidst his size, arm strengh, durability..

    maybe if you’re a real dolphin fan you will start all over again to reeducate yourself..

     
  37. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    You are making stuff up. I used the final month to show you how scouting caught up. Frankly, there's not much to keep up with.
     
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  38. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    More ad hom attacks DJ. Weak
     
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  39. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    Watch the videos and tell me that what they are saying is wrong. You keep avoiding that. Why?
     
  40. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

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    Watch the videos and tell me that what they are saying is wrong.
     
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