Tua...''He's the greatest prospect ever''

Are you saying that DJ hates Tua?

I must be misunderstanding what you wrote.

 

Okay, see, this is why hate voluntary OTAs.

It was already pointed out in another thread that Tua was training with 3DQB in the offseason - the same 3DQB the likes of Tom Brady and Drew Brees have trained with. But he missed one OTA due to a charity event, and that's indicative of him not wanting it enough?

Come on, bruh.

 

Yeah, bruh.

He doesn't want it like they did. He doesn't have that drive. It's fine. Everyone isn't gonna have that drive for perfection and greatness.

It's not "one" thing.

 

He obviously does want it like they do if he's training with people that helped them become great and/or maintain their greatness.

Using one missed OTA to say he doesn't want it while ignoring all the work he has been putting in is just disingenuous.

 

You do realize that Brady missed all or part of OTAs in several years right?

 

You do realize that you’re comparing Brady to Tua, right?

 

Vmanis didn't bring up Brady. You've got it backwards.

Brady threw his family in the trash for football. So yes, not many people are willing to go that far. If some are going to act like Tua missing an OTA means he doesn't want it as bad as Brady there's nothing wrong with pointing out that Brady missed OTA's on a regular basis. In fact, more than half of the Dolphins' starters missed the 1st OTA. Rarely do veteran starters attend all OTA's. I guess 90% of the league is slacking?

 

No one is comparing Brady and Tua, they are comparing Brady's and Tua's offseason workout routines.

 

As someone else said, was that early on his career when he wasn't established?

Look, I don't understand why you guys want to argue about this stuff. There is no comparing the desire to be great that guys like Brady/Kovey/Jordan had, to Tua.

Can you ever imagine Kobe getting fat? Skipping any practice? The dude lived in the gym.

Now you can argue that it isn't healthy to be consumed with greatness like that, but that's a completely different discussion.

 

That's such a poor argument. Is Tua militant about what goes into his body like Brady? Is he constantly honing his craft, like a Kobe?

WHO he trains with has nothing to do with whether or not he is like them.

 

As I said to Vmanis, this is a completely different argument, and it's one that I find completely valid.

However, to be the GOAT requires sacrifice. For some it's worth it. For others, it's not. I'm not ****ting on someone who doesn't want to sacrifice those things...but it also is a difference in mindset that shouldn't be ignored.

 

He gained weight when the team felt it was important for him to do so. Now he cut his weight when it was established that it was best he played in the 220s. Add in the fact that, every off-season, he has taken steps to improve parts of his game, the evidence leads me to say yes.

 

Kobe skipped practices. Brady skipped OTA’s. This argument is absurd. It’s just another backhanded way of bashing Tua because so far he’s proven all the haters wrong and they need a new angle.

 

Well he clearly gained more weight than they wanted, and it wasn't good weight.

I'm just saying, I don't see that fire and drive. I'm not saying it's good or bad, it's just what I see.

 

Right. As expected, you disagree withthe criticism, so it can ONLY be coming from people who want to bash him. I'm not even really talking about practices/OTAs. I'm talking about a different mindset totally than guys like Brady/Kobe/Jordan. You arguing that Tua is as obsessed with being the GOAT as those guys?

Again, this isn't me ****ting on Tua. MOST PLAYERS don't have that drive. Over already agreed that it's a massive strain on having a family or personal life. I don't fault someone for not being that obsessed with greatness. But if he wants to be GOAT, I believe he's missing that aspect to his personality.

 

Also, I don't think it's ridiculous to criticize half the vets for skipping things, especially when the results for the past two decades have been disappointing. If vets are skipping, then that sends a message to young players (I don't care what other players from other teams do, I'm a fan of the Dolphins). These guys haven't earned the right to skip anything.

You can disagree, but that doesn't mean that my viewpoint is somehow wrong.

 

No, I disagree with illogical criticisms. No one is saying that Tua can be Brady or Kobe. Only those who dislike Tua are mad that he’s not Kobe or Brady. No one in Tua’s camp thinks he is or expects him to be Brady. It’s just another moving of the goalposts because Tua has proved wrong all the other narratives so far.
“Tua can’t stay healthy for a full season”-Wrong

“Tua can’t throw the deep ball”- Wrong

“Tua can’t be a leader”- Wrong

“Tua can’t fill-in-the-bank”- Wrong

Now it’s “Tua isn’t Brady or Jordan”… it’s absurd


And criticizing Tua for something that Brady and Kobe did while claiming they didn’t is what I disagree with. It’s disingenuous at best.

 

Who has criticized you for being critical of them skipping OTA’s? No one. What you’re being criticized for is claiming that Brady and Kobe never skipped practice or OTA’s and then using that to cement your opinion about Tua.

 

I understand. That’s why I haven’t been comparing Brady to Tua. Still though, no matter the reasons or timing, Brady skipped OTA’s. That’s the argument at hand and I wasn’t the one who made it. If people want to criticize Tua for missing an OTA that’s fine, but don’t say that Brady never did. Tua’s weight, and even his missing an OTA is fair game for criticism. We just have to be honest and objective about it. We have to realize that it’s the norm for vets to miss a certain amount of OTA’s. That’s just the way it is. I wish there was more of an offseason and more practices that includes hitting, full pads, etc. There’s not though and that’s just the way it is. So I’m not going to criticize a player because they aren’t hitting in practice.

 

Right, you're on the act of skipping practice. I'm focusing on the overall mindset.

Again, HOW MANY TIMES must I day that I'm not ****ting on Tua because he doesn't have that mindset? I've already started several times that I COMPLETELY understand that, however, without that overall mindset, you won't be GOAT.

 

*cough cough*

https://www.nfl.com/news/tom-brady-...actice-for-personal-reasons-will-not-return-u

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/10/15/t...-practice-saturday-after-robert-kraft-wedding

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...es-why-it-should-concern-fans-in-new-england/

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/tom-brady-misses-patriots-practice-for-an-undisclosed-reason.amp

 

Making things up in order to criticize a player is ****ting on that player. You have no idea of what Tua’s mindset is and you’re using blatant lies in order to pretend that you do. That’s ****ting on a player. Expecting GOAT or nothing else from any player is ****ting on that player.

Bottom line, if a person needs to make things up in order to criticize a player they are ****ting on that player.

 

My suggestion for a board motto

ThePhins.com:
Same Sh**, Different Day

 

LOL. Pump the brakes. I didn't mock anybody with that post. I didn't even take a side and you somehow took offense. For the record: I jumped out of the Tua-sucks/Tua rocks dialogue at least a year ago because it is silly and unproductive. God bless you and the opinion that you are perfectly entitled to have.

 

One goes back to 2016. One of them is a missed OTA. Brady spent as much time partying and traveling as anybody. He spent a heckuva lot of time with his trainers and throwing coaches. Like Tua does. There's no way Tom Brady was at every off-season workout because they're just not that important to success.

 

I think there are a lot of Miami fans who are afraid to get behind Tua. They're afraid of getting their hopes up in case things fall apart and Tua ends up being the next failed experiment. I'm not trying to offend but you seem to be in that group along with Resnor. I get it. Maybe I'm too optimistic but I really feel like we have our guy. ✌️

 

A lot of them are afraid their receipts will be pulled after they spent two seasons telling the world Tua was a bust. Those are the folks who said he had a weak arm until he uncorked a few genuine bombs. He also was inaccurate, but his second season flirted with 70% completions. Then, they said he was a check down king until he spent two seasons in the top-3 of YPA. Of course, there's his health (if you throw out the 18 games he played last year). Now, he can't beat a good team (although he did two seasons ago) and doesn't like to practice. The goalposts keep moving.

I'll be the first one to tell anybody Tua's not the best QB in the NFL. Depending on your criteria, he might not be a top-10 QB. He may not be anything to write home about, and I can live with anybody who holds that opinion. But if you cannot admit that he has some superior traits, then you're not objective. Some wouldn't agree that he's the best QB we've had since #13 hung them up, but they won't tell you who was better. You can't argue with people like that, so I don't know why some of us try.

 

4 seasons.. right from the gate out in most cases. Most of those posters are gone btw. Just a few remain.

So many moving goalposts. There's only one that really matters now: win in the playoffs. That's it.

It's really hard to "objectively" argue he's not top 10 the last two years. Objectively, using widely utilized passing stats (especially the efficiency stats most correlated to winning), he was #1 in 2022 and top 5 in 2023.

 

DJ, i think you're way off on the missing a random meeting/practice in April-May road.

 

Nobody would care about any of this if it was a different QB

 

This is a great post. You definitely did a better job explaining, where I just say "He's not like Kobe.". Lol

But seriously, I agree with everything you wrote.

 

I don't think it matters much what a player does in practice or even whether he misses them as long as on-field performance is great. There are so many great team sport athletes that just slacked in practice or outright missed them. One of the greatest soccer players ever — Ronaldo — was famous for constantly slacking in practice and putting in hardly any effort (even refusing to run lol). Coach even defended that because he was so great on the field. Randy Moss was also famous for slacking in practice. The list is long. So this micro-scrutiny of Tua and his practice habits is missing the point.

The real problem with Tua mentally speaking is he sometimes didn't seem to care in actual games!! He doesn't have the fire Brady and many other greats have. THAT is the issue, not what he does in practice (which is not always correlated to game play).

And to be clear I don't think you can teach this. It's just who you are. Tua doesn't have that win-at-all-costs mentality. I still think he can be a very good QB and win in the playoffs — though this has to be proven of course. The last 2 years were a great start with a new coach. I think he will continue to improve, despite some missed practices.