1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

jason allen

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by shula_guy, Oct 29, 2008.

Tags:
  1. i dont know if its been debated here or not but i think he is an outright bust and was not draft worthy in any round, let alone a first rounder.




    opinions?
     
  2. he has moments here and there but i really think to say he played well against buffalo is an over exageration
     
  3. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

    20,810
    8,965
    0
    Jan 7, 2008
    Hollywood, Florida
    He played extremely well against Buffalo.

    The only times he got beat were when we blitzed and didn't get there. It's a general rule of football that if you blitz and get no pressure your corners will get beaten more often than not.
     
    TheAnswer385 likes this.
  4. im just a dumb fan but he has done nothing to impress me at all since he has been on this team. Hehas done plenty to disappoint me. The only positive i see him in is special teams coverages
     
  5. and for the record not getting beaten by buffalos recievers is nothing to brag about at all
     
  6. so your point is that he is a better corner then what stl has? not being a smart *** sincerly asking a q uestion here?
     
  7. Brown42000

    Brown42000 Chillin

    8,474
    1,991
    0
    Nov 24, 2007
    RI
    I thought he played well and he does a great job bumping the receiver at the line. Don't know how someone could be disappointed with a player that just played his first game at a new position and didn't get burnt. Another thing some I don't realized is he was always around the ball this past week.
     
    funkdat and alen1 like this.
  8. Brown42000

    Brown42000 Chillin

    8,474
    1,991
    0
    Nov 24, 2007
    RI
    You talking about Tye Hill? If you are then yes Allen has a much better chance of becoming a good player. Tye Hill has not been good and has terrible ball skills from what I have seen.
     
  9. I just think he is really bad maybe not draft worthy at all was a bit of an exageration but i really dont think he is going to make it around here more then maybe one more season out of desperation unless he gets a fulll time special teams postion
     
  10. alen1

    alen1 New Member

    52,811
    20,365
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    At the time, he was a pretty good looking first rounder. He had a lot of potential. He was the most athletic player in the draft, he could play both Safety and Cornerback, he had all the measurements and the speed. Right now, I would say that he's not lived up to his expectations for sure. I don't want to put the 'bust' label on him just yet for the simple reason that he hasn't seen a lot of PT. That could be on him or on the coaching staff(s). I think he can be a fine player in this league if he is settled on one position and continues to develop from there.

    Regarding his play this past weekend, I thought he played very well. On a sideline pass to James Hardy, he covered him very well but Edwards just threw a great ball and Hardy ended up with it. I thought that Jason Allen did a good job of being around the ball often, making plays and had a couple pass break-ups I believe. Only thing I thought Allen should have done is not have such a big cushion between himself and the WR. On a sideline route, he gave up about a seven or eight yard cushion and the pass was completed. I think he should play a little closer to the line because I feel that he can be a physical player but may be worried about getting beat deep. I think that in the future, the more playing time he receives, he will get better and this team will get better in the secondary because Allen can make a play as we witnessed on Sunday. He's inconsistent but with playing time, hopefully that will improve.

    Also, in reference to the comment of not getting beaten by Buffalo's Receivers, I think that they are a good bunch. Reed is a good slot man, Evans is becoming a very good WR in this league as he can stretch the field and can come up with the ball in difficult situations. James Hardy has a lot of potential and is a nightmare to match up with because of his stature.
     
  11. Just for the record i am noy a negative nelly type poster. I jut think allen has bust written all over him as a corner or a safety. im very high on alot of our players just not him, like I really think we are going to see big thinggs from matt roth. I read alot of people down on him and I think he is going to a great player. Ill tell who scares me is ricky williams, not seemingly to be holding onto the ball tight enough. ooops sorry drifting off topic here. Topic being jason allen is a bust imo.
     
  12. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,327
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    I love it. Jason Allen doesn't see the field, and people are on here talking about how bad he is. He has probably the best preseason, IMO, of our safeties/corners, and doesn't play until the sixth game, when he forces a fumble, doesn't get beat deep (as opposed to our OTHER CB's who have been getting TORCHED deep all season long), and we have people on here talking about how bad he is. Seriously, give the guy a break. He had a good game. He's had what, three different coaches, and been flipped from position to position over and over again. Is he Champ Bailey? No. Is he a bust? I don't think so.
     
    funkdat likes this.
  13. Puka-head

    Puka-head My2nd Fav team:___vs Jets Club Member

    8,605
    6,743
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    Slightly left of center
    The only reason Allen hasn't been on the field is because the coaches have asked him to learn a new position, again, in a new defense, again and it takes time for that to happen and the coaches to feel comfortable and secure the player has learned his responsibilities. If not for the hip injury he wouldn't have been available at the 16 pick that year.
    Coach called him out and he responded, led the team in tackles and played solid in coverage, his first game at CB since High School. Coach even praised him in the post game presser. I bet he ends the season with 6 or more picks and is in the top three in tackles.
    And can we please stop with the bust threads, the man is still on the final roster of 53, and on the active 48 each week, on one of 32 teams in the NFL. Do the math, that makes him one of only 1936 men in an NFL uniform this Sunday, out of how many people that would if they could? That alone is enough to keep any of these guys from being "busts" in my book.
     
  14. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

    11,035
    4,419
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    The problem is, Jason Allen gets yanked from one position to another. And when one person is yanked from position to position, how do you expect him to develop in either area?

    So far, after seeing the way he plays, the man is just a playmaker. While playing as a safety last season, he has outplayed every safety that started in front of him, including current safety Renaldo Hill. And it wasn't like he was going up against scrubbed receivers. I've seen this guy go step to step with Randy Moss and deflected a ball. Randy Moss couldn't do to Allen in the second 'Phins/Pats game of '07 what he did to Cameron Worrell in the first game. And as a corner, he had a heck of a game.

    One has to wonder why it took him so long to hit the field though. I've heard so many theories but none of them add up when you think about it. Bad practice player? Wouldn't he be called out by the coaching staff? Because they already called out Wilford. Dumb? I highly doubt it. Sure he had a bad wonderlic score at the combine, but quite frankly, there are quite a few players in the league right now that are more intelligent than their score, and after seeing his last interview, he seems really intelligent (though his public skills could use some work).

    Jason Allen is a mystery. But it is my utmost opinion that if a coaching staff that is over Jason Allen puts him in a spot and cement him their, we would potentially have a Pro Bowler in the secondary for years.
     
  15. funkdat

    funkdat New Member

    1,461
    350
    0
    Dec 12, 2007
    The post funk era
    Based on Jason's play i don't know how anyone could think he's a bust..........All the guy does is make plays.

    Last week was the 1st time he had any real playing time this year, and all he did was lead the team in tackles and force a fumble.

    Did you also want him to get a few picks and some sacks as well??
     
  16. pennphinfan

    pennphinfan Stelin Canez Arcade Scorz

    5,820
    2,511
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    Los Angeles
    3 safeties and a 76 yard rush for a TD would do it in my book i think. add in a 98 yard KO return for a TD and i'm definitely sold. :up:
     
    funkdat likes this.
  17. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

    5,659
    5,268
    113
    Dec 8, 2007
    NJ
    I have to disagree here. Many of us ( I would go as far as saying Most of us) thought that J. Allen was a reach at #16 overall.

    IIRC, he was projected by draft experts and scouts to be no higher than a 2nd round pick.

    And again IIRC, if we were to draft a DB in the 1st that year, most fin fans wanted Cromartie who went #19 3 picks later.

    Don't get me wrong though, I like what I saw of J. Allen last week and even the end of last year. I'm willing to see out the rest of this year before using the "B" word because he IS a ballhawk and he does make plays. He's got the best ball skills by far in our secondary.

    I like him better at CB too because out wide and in man-to-man coverage there's less thinking and more use of pure athletic ability, which he has plenty of.

    here's to hoping he succeeds:up:
     
  18. Well it is clear that most if not all of you like him. Personally I do not but am not going to beat a dead horse to death about it. Honestly I hope your all right and I am wrong about him.
     
  19. Vengeful Odin

    Vengeful Odin Norse Mod

    21,837
    10,818
    113
    Dec 2, 2007
    Kansas City, MO
    Allen has been a disappointment in his 3 seasons, there's no denying that. We've seen other players from that same draft making plays, so it's hard for us to be patient with him. What's compounded his situation in Miami is that he's been moved from CB to S to CB to S to CB to S to CB.

    Now he's a CB.

    It's also been said that Allen has had trouble recalling and adjusting to the complicated defensive schemes, slow to catch on and so forth. Compounded with 3 regime changes and upteen position changes, and it becomes a bit easier to understand why he's had challenges getting on the field.

    When he's been on the field, he's played well, for the most part, particularly last year when he finally saw action. I thought he played well enough to start at FS in preseason, instead we went with the now unemployed Chris Crocker; Allen then disappeared and emerged as a CB this week, playing pretty decently, and more importantly, not giving up any big plays.

    With Will Allen possibly missing time or limited, this Sunday could be a big opportunity for Jason. I would expect to see him singled up on Brandon Marshall at some point during the game. Should be a good test for him.

    As far as the "bust" label or not, I still want to see him on the field more - but there's no denying he has underperformed in his tenure here.
     
  20. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

    27,364
    31,261
    113
    Apr 6, 2008
    This week J. Allen leads the team in tackles, forces the fumble to seal the game, makes several STs plays and doesn't make any major mistakes. Last year he leads the team in INTs and is third in tackles despite very limited playing time. Now he hasn't been perfect but he's clearly shown the ability to make some plays. I can only assume that anybody who hasn't seen anything impressive about him is either not looking or doesn't know what to look for.
     
    sgtphin, alen1 and Silverphin like this.
  21. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

    27,364
    31,261
    113
    Apr 6, 2008
    I had him as a first rounder and so did most of the sources I frequent. The main question I had about him was health. But if he was healthy (or at least expected to be) than he was unquestionably a mid-first round talent.

    BTW while I don't think he was a reach (assuming medical clearance), he wasn't my choice there. I had Manny Lawson as my pick and in the secondary I had Cromartie rated above Allen as well.
     
  22. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    It's about trust. They didn't trust him out there with the responsibilities of his position. Yes he made plays. We all saw it last year and this. However, the coaches said, as the defense got more complicated (behind closed doors later in preseason and the season) JA started falling behind.

    They didn't trust him enough just to "put him out there and let him play." They wanted him in a position where he wasn't doing a lot of "reading" just reacting.
     
  23. dolphan117

    dolphan117 Premium Member Luxury Box

    7,600
    2,574
    113
    Nov 24, 2007
    According to our HC he "Had a heck of a game Sunday" :wink2:

    I went back and watched the game with special attention paid to Allen and he did in fact play very well. Coach also said that he has been playing better and better in practice, also has great athleticism and very good ball skills. We will be seeing quite a bit of him in coming weeks.
     
  24. alen1

    alen1 New Member

    52,811
    20,365
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    I believe he shot up draft boards because of his athleticism, had the total package and that's how he became a first rounder. I saw multiple draft sites that had him going in the first round. It may have been a reach at #16 at that time but we liked him so we took him.

    I wanted Cromartie as well. :up:

    I agree.
     
    Eop05 likes this.
  25. The Aqua Crush

    The Aqua Crush New Member

    6,152
    1,600
    0
    Jun 15, 2008
    Calgary Alberta Canada
    Ive been dissapointed in him this far, but the fact he's still around in the NFL says there is a slight bit of hope for him yet.

    Remember he played pretty good against buffalo, and were talking about a guy who since being drafted has not had a lot to be confident about. It seems unlikely but if he gets some regular time and his confidence does start to come back, he could slowly start making plays and one day turn into a good player.

    The verdict as much as we all want answers on whether he is any good or not or if he's a bust is still out in my opinion. The next few weeks if he gets his chance like he did against buffalo will determine if he's still around next season and beyond.
     
  26. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    It seems to me he's the classic "nothing between the ears" case...he plays pretty well when he's on the field. I would have to guess that he's not much of a 'practice player' either, since his history of NFL coaches are 'no practice well, no play' types.

    It's been rumored that he has a hard time learning the D, yet he played well (IMHO) in Saban's complicated secondary in his rookie year. The signals just seem to be mixed up for this guy...is he a poor practice player, a locker room cancer or just not smart enough to pick up the nuances of his position. Add to that the back-and-forth-ness of his time here and you have a guy that, depending on how you look at things is either a bust or hasn't gotten the right opportunities...

    The only thing I can say in his defense is that given the history of the Saban-Capers-Pasqueloni DC's, the case of him not getting the right opportunity is pretty strong...

    Is that a fair assessment...again it's how you look at it...Shula-guy seems to think he's a bust while most of the others here seem to think he just hasn't had the right opportunities yet...
     
  27. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    Jamar fletcher was still here this season. If he's any good, he'll get his chance. Hopefully it's with us as a great CB
     
  28. TotoreMexico

    TotoreMexico Your retarded

    1,976
    1,613
    113
    Jan 4, 2008
    Mexico
    So, making a team-high six tackles as well as one on special teams, forcing a fumble and a pass defended is an over exageration?
     
  29. miamiron

    miamiron There's always next year

    2,354
    1,402
    113
    Jan 4, 2008
    Your first sentence sums up Jason Allen
    He did score an 11 on his wonderlic...
     
    funkdat likes this.
  30. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    Dan Marino didn't score much higher ...

    just sayin.
     
    Silverphin likes this.
  31. Onehondo

    Onehondo Senior Member Club Member

    2,671
    879
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    Chesapeake, Virginia
    Why all the speculation as to why and should he have been picked #16 in the first round? He was and he is still here good or bad and there is nothing we can do to change that. In hind sight we could have picked franchise players at every pick we've had in the 1st round for the last ten years but we didn't or we wouldn't be in the shape we are now.
    Evidently Parcells and company thinks he offers something or he wouldn't be here as shown by several other players they let go for various reasons.
    He has shown he has the physical abilities if they can be harnessed and used in game situations. I really think if anyone can make him a good player this bunch can but thats JMO.
     
  32. dolphinfn3454

    dolphinfn3454 Season Ticket Holder

    1,267
    100
    63
    Dec 5, 2007
    Riverside, CA
    For the limited playing time he gets and trying to learn the corner and safety position every year I think he does a decent job. When he's actually in the game he does his job. Nothing more nothing less. For a first round pick I expect more from him but maybe that will come in time.
     
  33. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

    11,035
    4,419
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    And that's the only piece of evidence people have to support that claim, despite the fact that it could be disputed.
     
  34. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,327
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    So, how did Jason Allen do yesterday??? Where are the haters at?

    LOL

    AIF
     
  35. DolfanTom

    DolfanTom Livin' and Dyin' w/ Ryan!

    3,169
    979
    0
    Apr 26, 2008
    Saratoga Springs, NY
    Allen is looking better and better. Absolutely shocked, but happy about it!! :yes:
     
  36. TheAnswer385

    TheAnswer385 Stay Low Run Free

    5,474
    962
    113
    Jan 7, 2008
    PA
    lol I knew someone would bring this thread back...I love it
     
  37. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,327
    9,874
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Just happy I could help.
     
  38. Vengeful Odin

    Vengeful Odin Norse Mod

    21,837
    10,818
    113
    Dec 2, 2007
    Kansas City, MO
    [​IMG]
     
    pennphinfan and TheAnswer385 like this.
  39. The Aqua Crush

    The Aqua Crush New Member

    6,152
    1,600
    0
    Jun 15, 2008
    Calgary Alberta Canada
    I thought our whole secdonary played great yesterday, even goodman. Allen of course looked good for most of the game, and great instincts on the pick, he did seem slow to realize the ball was coming to him a couple times, esp. on the off. pass interference, which i think could have been called or not called. It was close play, but he did seem outmatched on that play.

    But hey great for most of the game is somethign he can build off of. I hope he keeps progressing, and becomes a solid player for us the rest of the way. It would be nice to have another solid corner for years to come, he's playing in the right direction finally, just not sold on him yet.
     
    HULKFish likes this.
  40. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    39,159
    21,798
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    San Diego
    Think about it though, on that pick, he was step for step with one of the best WRs in the league. In his second start. If he's not in position, he can't be bumped (i.e. not close enough). This is a game of inches as proponents love to say. A tiny shove is all you need, and that's what Marshall did. I thought Allen was a little too low and was off balance when he got nudged, but that's the way the cookie crumbles.

    Don't forget, didn't he have a key pass batted down towards the end?
     

Share This Page