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Rumor:Coles signes 3 year deal with Miami | Coles to Cincy

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by gunn34, Feb 27, 2009.

  1. Georgia Fin

    Georgia Fin Fin For Life

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  2. aesop

    aesop Well-Known Member

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    What exactly has Brandon London done again? Besides getting very excited on the bench..
     
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  3. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Amen. I'll admit our schedule will be tougher next year. But judging how much tougher before the season starts is a fools game. We thought the Cardinals would be one of what we thought would be only a few wins last season. Turns out they handed us one of our toughest losses and went on to a championship bid.

    Also spot on with the fact that we ARE NOT rebuilding anymore. Parcells and company have laid a brilliant foundation of which to build on, not rebuild.

    As far as Coles goes, how bout trusting Parcells and Ireland. Some on this board poo pooed the Pennington signing and had to eat a gut-busting amount of crow. Let's see what Coles can do for us before questioning the signing (if the report is true).

    IMO, he will (could) be the missing piece at WR. His presence will allow Ginn to blossom in that magical 3rd year for WRs.
     
  4. RalphX19X

    RalphX19X >:)

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    Good blocker and very good on special team.
     
  5. vmarcilfan75

    vmarcilfan75 blah...blah...blah... Club Member

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    were re-building little by little through the draft and patching up the holes with veterans.
     
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  6. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    Nice! We now have a solid veteran to go along with our young crew at receiver. So far, the off season has been good to us.
     
  7. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    I disagree, I think Coles will become Pennington's favorite target because of familiarity and Ginn will be fighting with the rest of the group for catches/playing time. If Ginn was going to take the next step he would need to be put in a position to be the #1, he won't get that now IMO.
     
  8. sking29

    sking29 What it takes to be cool

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    I would love this move if true it only would make the offense better. Of course a WR in the draft would be nice as well, I'll wait and see but this signing makes sense.
     
  9. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    I disagree. Pennington is not going to play favorites. He's too smart for that. He'll throw it to the open receiver. He certainly did not play favorites last year. He spread the ball all over the field and consistently got the ball to the open man. Having Coles isn't going to change that. Sure, he'll enjoy having a receiver he's familiar with, but that doesn't mean he's going to ignore the others. If Ginn is struggling, it will be because he's struggling to get open and not because Pennington is playing favorites, IMO.
     
  10. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Sorry Mike, but if Laveranues Coles is the reason Ginn doesn't take the next step Id say it wasn't meant to be for the kid anyhow.
     
  11. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Not to be too confrontational, but this is a really overly-simplistic way to look at the situation. It is not a zero sum game. It would not a Ginn vs Coles situation at all. Pennington's "favorite" receiver is the open man. He's one of the best at going through his progressions and finding the best guy to throw to, not his favorite guy to throw to.

    Besides, it doesn't matter who the #1 guy is and who is #2. If Ginn is gonna "blossom" in his third year, it either will happen or it won't regardless of the other WRs on the field.
     
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  12. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    See, Coles is actually a lot faster than people think. :up:
     
  13. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    It's not about ignoring or playing favorites, it's about the QB locking in on a guy that he's familiar with, who he is comfortable throwing the ball to in a tough spot and make the catch. Coles, if he is indeed signed, is going to be brought in to be the #1.

    Ginn was able to improve upon his rookie season this year and in order for him to "take the next step" he would have to improve upon his numbers last year (56/790) by more than just a few catches. He isn't going to put up 70+ catches and 1,000 yards in this offense as a #2. Add to the fact that Cammy is coming back and will get playing time, Bess will be looking to improve upon his rookie campaign, we may still grab a WR at some point in the draft....there are only so many passes to go around. Will Ginn become more of a "deep threat", if there is such a term with Penny at QB?

    I'm all for whatever makes the team better, but I don't see how bringing in a #1 is going to help Ginn take the next step, I just don't see it. We're not the Cardinals, I don't necessarily expect Coles to put up 70+ and 1,000 in this offense, let alone the #2 WR.
     
  14. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    I cant believe some of you guys. If this does happen its a GREAT addition to the Fins, not only do we IMPROVE our team, we make the JETS HAVE MORE NEEDS TO FILL!

    Coles is a SOLID receiver and better than ANY receiver we currently have even GINN who is going into his 3rd year and not lived up to #9 Pick so far in my humble opinion. Being the best reciever on a team full of suspect receivers doesn't make you great.

    I love the signing if it's true as long as we didn't spend 50 Million on him!
     
  15. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Coles in 09!

    Come on people. Gibril could be good if he plays to his potential, but Coles is a good veteran to teach Bess and Ginn how to catch th ball. He has chemistry with Pennington and we won't have to pay him too much. Yay or Nay?
     
  16. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    The Jets released him, regardless with whether we sign him or not, they have to fill that hole.

    It generally takes WR's 3 years to reach their potential, 3 years before we can make a valid assessment on what type of player they are going to be, Ginn's career so far has mirrored that of Steve Smith. Ginn is going into his 3rd year and this move would make it more difficult for him to take that next step IMO.
     
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  17. Styla

    Styla #1 Davone Bess Fan!!!

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    Teach Bess how to catch????? Hmmm seems like he caught the ball very well last year.Bess was a catching machine,as if he had super glue on his hands.Not too mention his days in Hawaii.Bess doesn't need anyone to teach him how to catch, he may be the one doing the teaching.:yes:
     
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  18. PhinishLine

    PhinishLine Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Trouble Coles was a trackstar at Ribault. He's a burner. To think he's not is inaccurate.
     
  19. syborg

    syborg New Member

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  20. phinman13

    phinman13 New Member

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    This is a complete lie and will never happen.
     
  21. Tiki

    Tiki New Member

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    11-5 typically won't be considered a team that is rebuilding. However, yes Miami continues a rebuilding process from years of horrific mis-management. We played a VERY weak schedule this season and surprised. Especially with the wild cat that did become less effective the more we used it.

    We still have to build the oline, plug in another starters as well as add depth. We have work to do at WR, which why Coles may have been signed. Haven't seen anything like this and if true, would figure this would be news.

    Our D-line needs help and youth. Secondary we made some moves for certainly, but now has to be built into a unit.

    So yeah rebuilding is not a completely inaccurate term for where we are currently.
     
  22. Tiki

    Tiki New Member

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    Coles' name just went by on the NFL Net ticker as still on the market. He has NOT signed with Miami. Maybe there are talks happening, but no deal in place apparently.
     
  23. vmarcilfan75

    vmarcilfan75 blah...blah...blah... Club Member

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  24. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    the latest from sun sentinel

    http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-dolphins-coles-0227,0,324315.story

     
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  25. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Agree with the first part. Definitely not the second. If Ted Ginn takes the next step we'll know it. If Ted Ginn progressed to the next level, let's be optimistic say a Steve Smith type player, do you really think this would be overshadowed by having another good WR on the team? I don't think really good players don't get a chance to prove they are good because another player is stealing their opportunities. Ted Ginn will be on the field no matter which WR we bring in. If he's open, Pennington will throw him the ball. Chad has done nothing in his career to prove he's the type of a QB that will throw it to one player over another because of familiarity.
     
  26. Lt Dan

    Lt Dan Season Ticket Holder

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    Coles is still in Buffalo
     
  27. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    Again, there are only so many balls to go around. Steve Smith was able to take the next step because he became Delhomme's #1 target, Smith hauled in 88 passes and the next closest WR had 54. Is anyone here going to be happy with Ginn if his numbers stay the same, if he doesn't show any improvement statistically? Or will we be having the same "Was Ginn worth the #9?" type of threads next offseason as well? In order for Ginn to develop into a potential #1 we need to give him the opportunity, he's not going to get that opportunity IMO with Coles on the field.

    Actually there is, and it's not just Penny, every QB has their "favorite" target who receives more passes their way due to confidence or playcalling. Unless you have 2 allpro WR's like Fitz and Boldin and an offensive gameplan and strong armed QB to match, you're not going to have 2 guys put up great numbers.

    Looking at Pennington's career, the numbers support that.

    So you can see that Penny did have one WR that he passed the ball to more throughout his career. The only real anomalies were 2004 where they spread the ball evenly and 3 WR had 45 receptions or more, but none of them really had a better year statistically than Ginn had this year. And the other year was 2006 where both Coles and Cotchery had great years, but that's a bit misleading because they really had no run game to speak of (Leon Washington 650 yards, team ranked 20th in rushing, team ranked 30th in Y/A) and they passed the ball alot, that isn't the case here.

    I guess what I'm getting at is I won't be able to see improvement, the type of improvement that tells me that Ginn stepped up his game to the next level and can be a #1 WR, if he's only pulling in 50 catches and 700 yards. To me that isn't improvement, it's the same type of season he had this year. So will anyone be happy with those numbers? Will anybody be happy if Ginn has 80 catches and 1,000 yards and Coles only has 50 catches? Will anyone be satisfied that we got our moneys worth with Coles if that's the case? Will anyone be happy if Ginn and Coles both have great years but our run game is ranked #20? We just don't have the type of offense that will support 2 #1 type WR's, one of them is going to suffer and I don't think that this FO is planning on spending all of this money on Coles (potentially, he isn't signed yet) just to see him put up the same type of numbers that Bess and Cammy are more than capable of putting up.

    Now with that said, this is a team game and we shouldn't be concerned with individual numbers. Whatever helps us win, right? But when talking about the development of a player who is going into his crucial 3rd year, it's a fair argument to say that his numbers and opportunities to make plays are very important, and I just don't see Ginn getting the same type of opportunity to prove that he can be "the man" like a Steve Smith had. I have a feeling we'll be seeing the "Was Ginn worth it?" threads next year, and it won't be his doing IMO.

    We'll see what happens, I hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see it.
     
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  28. finsbuck719

    finsbuck719 New Member

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    i would not mind Vern and Penny hooking back up for one more year. that would fit a huge need at WR, and he is 31...it isn't like he is 35, so he has a few more years, to help out Henne in his first couple of seasons as an NFL QB.
     
  29. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    If anything these numbers should ease your concerns. in 2006 Coles was only slightly more targeted than Cotchery and in 2007 he had significantly less catches than Cotchery. Doesn't look like Pennington was trying any harder to get the ball to Coles.

    Even if your fears were to come true and Ginn didn't have the chances to rack up the #'s to show he's improved, we'll just have to deal with it. I sure hope the FO isn't worried about an individual player's chances to rack up statistics in their decision making and talent acquisition thought process.

    I've said it once, and I'll say it again. Bill Parcells, Ireland, and Sparano don't care where players were drafted in the past. If a past regime spent too high a draft pick on Ted Ginn and he doesn't pan out, it's a sunk cost. Personally I don't think that will prove to be the case but if it is, the only thing the FO will be upset about is that a player on the team isn't producing, not that a high draft pick was spent. All this is my opinion of course.
     
  30. Califin

    Califin Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any problem with Coles if he lands here, nor any doubt Henning would reap whatever potential, or chemistry he might still possess.
    Is he washed up?
    Well, he's certainly no Moss, who also had once been written off as dead, but actually was entombed in carbonite, under Al (Lord Raider) Davis, and later resurrected by Belichick, I'm just less likely these days, to assume a reciever is done, merely because he hasn't produced lately.

    For me, its more of the Thurman Thomas syndrome. A player who's been a recognized nemesis for so long, associated with a hated rival for so many years, that he permeates the enemy's stigma, or in Cole's case, the putrid stench of the NY Jets.
    Nothing that won't eventually pass, but a bit nauseating nonetheless, and likely to linger until September.
     
  31. CrunchTime

    CrunchTime Administrator Retired Administrator

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    http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolp...g-the-offensive-line-with-the-signing-of.html

    Brian Biggane of the Palm Beach Post conducted an exclusive interview with Chad Pennington, and you might be surprised to read the Miami Dolphins quarterback isn't lobbying for his good friend Laveranues Coles to join the club.

     
  32. GISH

    GISH ~mUST wARN oTHERS~

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    i think this rumor is dead. can someone change the thread title to say lie instead of rumor.
     
  33. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ya, it's obvious Coles isn't coming to Miami on a 3 yr deal....at least right now.

    Reading a lot above regarding the offense. I think what made our offense work was that we took advantage of whatever mismatch we had. It might have been different if we had a dominant WR, but I think it was clear that we got the ball to whoever was open. Camarillo had that 11 catch 110 yd day against Denver specifically because Ted Ginn had torched Buffalo the week before. We got our RBs involved and our TEs. It was an offense predicated on "taking what the defense gave us". I think Coles could give us another guy that could give us an advantage or mismatch against another player.

    Regarding the signing of Laveranues Coles, I would be on board with it for a couple of reasons. Any time you can weaken a division opponent and take one of their productive players and add him--you do (at the right price of course). The Patriots have done it for years and it has worked. I don't think you can underestimate the rapport that Coles and Pennington have--just like we underestimated the rapport Pennington had with Henning (ended knowing the offense quickly like the back of his hand and having a great season). If you can add a productive, quality player at a good price you do it.

    Regarding the hinderance of Ted Ginn, if Ted Ginn is going to get better and take the next step, he'll do it whether he has Coles on this team or not. Maybe he gets a few more balls, but it wasn't a problem for Cotchery to become a very good WR when he was on his team, nor has it been a problem for other "#2 WRs" to come up. It's the same for any other position--if a guy is ready to take the next step he will do it no matter the competition.
     
  34. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    Actually they don't. Again, in 2006 the Jets had no running game to speak of, they ranked 20th overall and 30th in yards per. Would you be happy with that sort of production from our running game? We're not the Rams of 2001, there are only so many offensive plays to go around and someone is going to end up taking a backseat. If Coles is the guy, Ginn takes a backseat. If Ginn is the guy, Coles takes a backseat. If the WR's are putting up the same type of numbers that Coles and Cotchery put up in 2006, our running game is going to take a backseat.

    This all seems to be for nothing, Coles hasn't shown much interest in the Phins and all earlier reports appear to be false. Hopefully that means that we will look for a big redzone target via the draft instead. :yes:

    Nor should they, I already prefaced this by saying "whatever helps the team". But I guarantee that they are looking and concerned about player development and their chances to improve, otherwise they wouldn't be a very good FO and history shows that isn't the case.

    True, Parcells and Co. don't care about lables, but they care about getting every ounce of talent out of their players and the higher the draft pick the more they will expect. They aren't about to throw up their hands on a player that is showing improvement. They inherited all of Saban's and Cameron's players, they aren't going to instantly disassociate themselves from them because of it, they'll wait to see what each player can bring to the table and then make an assessment. I think Sparano gave Ginn one of the highest compliments just a week or so ago, that shouldn't be overlooked. :wink2:
     
  35. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    The Jets released him, we wouldn't be weakening them at all, they already decided that they didn't want him.

    You have to take the style of offense into account as well as how it effected other areas of the team. Sure Coles and Cotchery put up great numbers in '06, but their running game was horrible (ranked 20th and 30, respectively). Would you be satisfied with our running game if they were performing like the Jets RB's of 2006? We just don't have the type of offense to sustain 2 very good WR's and a dominant running game.

    IMO thinking that we can add players to a team and expect them to put up the same type of stats that they put up elsewhere...is a Jerry Jones (or Al Davis) way of thinking. Jones tried it last year by adding Roy Williams to the Cowboys offense and look at how that turned out. The excited fan in all of us would think that having 2 WR's that are capable of 70 catches and 1,000 yards is a recipe for success, but take a look at Williams' numbers and it's apparent that wasn't the case, infact quite the opposite. Something has to give, the players have to play within the offense out on the field, there is a reason they don't play the games on paper. :wink2:
     
  36. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    I would say that in Dallas, or even involving Coles, without solid, competent Qb play, very few Wr will excel in the NFL, that has really hindered us for at least 5 years before Pennington arrived here.

    Now that we have a Qb who can deliver the ball we should see our current Wr improve quickly, what a player like Coles does is allow that learning curve to happen without hindering our offense.

    That is his value to us IMO, but it could be a Coles or Holt or even Harrison but IMO we need that sort of player in Miami or our offense will not make strides.

    I love power offense, but to be realistic, the teams that win and went deep in the playoffs could go 3 wide and win shootouts or drive the ball down the field through the pass.
     
  37. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    That probably holds true for players they have drafted. But not players other regimes have drafted. They inherited a mess of bad drafting, questionable signings and a whole slew of other problems. It was a complete rebuild. IMO, they didn't expect anymore or any less of a player based on where a past regime drafted them.

    I never even came close to hinting at that. Nobody would toss aside somebody that can help their team simply because somebody else drafted him. My only point was they don't factor what round that player was drafted in when making that decision.

    Whose overlooking it? I think you have me confused with one of those anti-Ginn guys. :wink2:
     
  38. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    Ted Ginn sucks
     
  39. PENNSYLVANIADOLPHAN

    PENNSYLVANIADOLPHAN Well-Known Member

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    No Comment. I don't wanna get banned.
     
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  40. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    Why would it be any different, especially for a young player? This is their team now, the players that are here belong to them, they are going to do everything in their power to make sure they can make those players successful. Which regime drafted which player is irrelevant when talking about potential. If you wanted to make the argument that Ginn didn't fit the system, then regime would come into play (Satele is a good example).

    That's what I'm getting from your above statement, that the FO is judging players differently based on who drafted them. If I'm wrong I apologize, but explain what I'm missing here.

    I don't think you're an "anti Ginn" guy, I just think that you're applying a different set of rules for him than you are players Parcells and Co. drafted (see above).
     

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