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2014 draft thread

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by ToddPhin, May 3, 2013.

  1. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    My eyes could be wrong but I think he may have improved upon his speed from last year.
     
  2. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Not really sure. I'm trying to pay attention to the players around him and how hard they're working to keep up with him. The guys he's even with or beating, they're still mostly 4.58 to 4.63 types. So it wouldn't shock me if after training hard for the 40 he runs something like a 4.55.
     
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  3. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    regardless, I think we need more pass catchers like Evans & Watkins who have great body control, strong hands, routinely attack & pluck the football, and can make those tough catches in traffic. I think that's a prerequisite just to be drafted in Green Bay. Would love to have it that way in Miami. Makes me LOL every time I hear someone say Jordy Nelson & Co only put up good stats b/c of the scheme and QB. Just draft us some goddam playmakers for once.
     
  4. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Based on what we're seeing with Mike Wallace...

    I appreciate what Brandon Gibson brought to the table in 2013 before ripping up his knee. I really do. But that's the position and kind of player on the field Tannehill clearly shows the MOST comfort with, as far as using that player. You go back to Texas A&M with Ryan Swope, and you look at the production Tannehill had with Davone Bess, and it all fits together.

    So really what you need IMO is a guy that is as dynamic as you can get for THAT position, that role, that kind of player. That's why to some degree Tavon Austin made a ton of sense. I still had some reservations about him because of size, but it still made sense. If Tannehill's going to lean on whoever is playing that role, you better make the guy who plays that role as good as you can.

    So what we really need is kind of a Randall Cobb or a Victor Cruz. Just a thought.
     
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  5. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well, come Thursday nite, I might be joining y'all in here, during the season I make a promise to myself not to watch a lot of film so I can focus on our season, so yeah, like I said, maybe I'll see Here Thursday nite.
     
  6. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Here are some guys I think might fit the role that CK mentions. I haven't taken extensive looks at any of them, but I know they all have low drop rates, good YAC, and solid production.

    Seniors:

    Jalen Saunders (Oklahoma) - Mentioned him before the season in the Club forums, but last year he only had a 3.1% drop rate while averaging 7.1 yards after the catch. He's a smaller guy at 5'9", but pretty quick. Maybe in the Ryan Broyles mold. Production is down this year due to Oklahoma's offense, I don't know if that'll drop him in the draft at all.

    Eric Ward (Texas Tech) - I personally haven't seen much of him, except one or two nice catches this past weekend. Good hands, although he did average 5.2 yards after the catch in 2012. That's not spectacular, but it's above-average. Concern that he could't get any receptions against Jason Verrett and TCU.

    Devin Street (Pittsburgh) - I've already written about Devin Street. From a stats perspective, in 2012 his drop rate was a low 4% and he averaged 5.7 yards after the catch. He's a big guy at 6'3"/6'4", but he has experience playing in the slot. Could be an interesting fit in the Dolphin offense.

    Michael Campanaro (Wake Forest) - I've heard the name a bit, but don't have any intel on him. Fits the mold of what you'd want in a receiver: drop rate < 5%, YAC > 6 yards. Looks like he's really blown up in some games for Wake.

    Juniors:

    Josh Stewart (Oklahoma State) - Another receiver in the state of Oklahoma with a down year. Had 1200 yards in 2012, only ~400 so far this year. 5'10", a 2% drop rate in 2012 and averaged 7 yards after the catch. Despite a down year in overall production, his YPC is up to 14 yards. Here's a video of his returning a 95 yard punt: http://youtu.be/H_sgNJYxXWs

    Brandin Cooks (Oregon State) - I've been really interested in Cooks since watching Markus Wheaton. According to an article I read and linked here on the forums earlier in the year, he's supposed to have been faster than Wheaton at Oregon State. There were signs of his breakout year in the 2012 season. He had a 4.2% drop rate and averaged 8.3 yards after the catch, which is about the same as Tavon.

    Jamison Crowder (Duke) - I don't know how likely a Duke player is to come out his Junior year, but I'll put him here anyway. Good YAC at 7 per catch, his hands last year were on the verge of where you feel comfortable at a drop rate of 6.5%. Another smaller slot guy at 5'9", 175.

    Sammy Watkins (Clemson) - Obvious, but just in case you were worried, he has a low drop rate.

    I'm going to go watch a few of these guys and will update this post as I go along.
     
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  7. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Of those guys the ones that interest me are Brandin Cooks and Devin Street, for different reasons.

    Cooks is to me a lot like Tavon Austin. He's not quite as fast but he does have that whole, "I'm quicker than everyone on the field and know it" thing going for him. He'll just stop and wait for defenders to come to him, knowing he can get up to 88 mph so fast it won't matter.

    And I think when you boil it right down, this guy's got much better pure receiving skills than Tavon Austin did. That was always one thing that made me nervous about Austin. You try and find tape of him running real routes and catching real footballs and you're going to be digging a long time. It's an expedition. Brandin Cooks is out there running routes and catching the ball like any wide receiver, he's just got that demon quickness on top of it.

    So definitely, Brandin Cooks interests me. Which reminds me I really have to put that guy on my board.

    Devin Street also interesting as a bigger slot guy, inside-outside flexible, fast, good hands, etc.
     
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  8. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Those are my two favorite guys out of that list as well. However, I'm finding Michael Campanaro interesting.

    He's a very QB-friendly wide receiver. He does a good job of sitting down in the right spots, as well as continuing to get open when his QB his scrambling. Something that could be valuable to Tannehill. Just in the NC State game alone (Draft Breakdown: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gp2VueZTWsc) you can see a pretty wide range of routes; crossing, post, he had a TD on a deep corner route, screens. Body wise he reminds me a bit of Stedman, 5'10" or so, but not skinny. However, he only has 6 TDs on the year. So he's nowhere near Bailey's TD catching ability (how many are though?). Good hands and good YAC like I mentioned.

    Here are some more Draft Breakdown videos for those interested.
    Boston College: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kk61G1pCfY
    Clemson: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXT8dqhPKKQ
    Maryland: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0G7Fc59DZI
     
  9. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Good post. I was watching a bit of the Oklahoma vs. Texas Tech game over the weekend, and I'm pretty sure Jalen Saunders got injured at some point. Unfortunately, Fox switched to the World Series coverage and I wasn't able to see anything further.

    Does anyone know what happened, if anything?
     
  10. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    It's a good thought. It does seem like Tannehill has developed a comfort level for that type of player. Sammy Watkins fits that dynamic reliable Victor Cruz mold IMO. He spends more time on the perimeter but I think he would excel like Cruz in the slot b/c of his body control & tremendous hands. Plus, until our Oline displays reliability, I wouldn't mind having a great slot receiver to lean on a little in the 3 step game.
     
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  11. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    agree on Campanaro. Intriguing player for the slot.
     
  12. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If Miami does part ways with Wallace, I think a free agent/draft combo of Hakeem Nicks plus Sammy Watkins or Brandin Cooks would be pretty nice.

    Todd, what do you think of Sammy? Truthfully, I've not watched many Clemson games and with coaching this year, most of my spare time has been eaten up on the weekends. I'd like to view some more of him and Brandin Cooks.
     
  13. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Absolutely love Sammy. Great kid. Massively motivated. He's a Torrey Smith clone but perhaps plays with a smidgen more physicality & suddenness, has elite hands that routinely pluck receptions, and might contribute a little more in the short passing game than Torrey b/c he can start and stop abruptly and has great lateral speed/agility.
     
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  14. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Nice to have an abundance of pass-rushers like Seattle does to where you can send a Bruce Irvin in coverage on a TE like he just did on the INT. Would love to have that here with Vic Beasley [or with Dion Jordan if we grabbed another RE].
     
  15. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    How is Brandon Gibson's contract structured though? You have a guy on a three year deal who has proven to be an effective target for Tannehill. Does the GM really roll the dice, release him, and draft somebody that's gotta learn that position on an NFL-level? Especially with the way players come back from sports injuries nowadays, and when you'd need to allocate resources to other positions?

    Maybe I'm wrong, but I think we need the most help on the offensive line, more safety depth, we're most likely going to need a defensive tackle, perhaps another tight end. Just not seeing a receiver unless Ireland bucks his trend.

    I'm waiting for that day when he just says **** it and starts drafting exclusively BPA.
     
  16. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Or the day he's fired?
     
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  17. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Or that.
     
  18. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Brandon Gibson doesn't have to play the slot. He didn't very much in 2012, and was still a pretty similar quality player.
     
  19. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Watching the Michigan vs. Michigan State game, the battle between Taylor Lewan and Marcus Rush has been pretty good thus far. I think I'd bump Taylor Lewan into my list of offensive players I'd be comfortable with Miami spending a first round pick on. Rush is just a solid football player. Not real big, not real fast, but just good. Reminds me of Ohio State's John Simon, but a little more nimble and instinctive.
     
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  20. UCF FINatic

    UCF FINatic The Miami Dolphins select

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    I really like Nick O'Leary the junior TE at FSU. They ask him to do a lot of blocking, but he is a decent reciever too. Isn't going to burn anyone but has solid hands and won't go down on first contact.

    Doubt he gets taken early due to his size (6'3 248) and slower speed, but with his blocking ability and all around game I think he could be a decent Pro. You could possibly try him at FB and get some interesting results.
     
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  21. NolesNPhinsFan

    NolesNPhinsFan New Member

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    Agree.. Not fast, but tough with good size.
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    O'Leary looks nice but I'm not sure of his overall athletic ability, especially in relation to his size. Whenever I look at both guys who are listed about the same size, I always steer toward Chris Coyle of Arizona State as a better version of what Nick O'Leary will need to be in order to be successful at the next level. Or Gator Hoskins of Marshall. Another guy about that same size. Hoskins has 17 touchdowns in his last 19 games.
     
  23. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    purifoy the corner from Florida is light..don't like his build, see him getting out physicaled at the college level at times..
     
  24. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    CK, you wrote about Eric Ebron at the beginning of this thread before the season started. I was curious what you think about him now after he's declared for the draft? He has looked pretty impressive. Also, what are your thoughts about Austin Seferian-Jenkins?
     
  25. Bjorn

    Bjorn Season Ticket Holder

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    Ebron is out of reach. I was actually thinking about the TE position earlier today with that kid from Michigan, Funchess. After analyzing it on my own, TE is on the back burner for me. They say it takes 3 years for receivers to show what they are in the NFL. Well this was Clay's 3rd year. I am willing to give him another year, as well as see how Simms progresses. I feel the positions that need to be addressses are LT, OG, RB, OLB, DT, and FS.
     
  26. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I think Eric Ebron is a great pass catching threat but I have some concerns as he doesn't have the look of a real tight end. He doesn't block well. I think some people kind of stare at the magic eye painting so long they're convinced they see the sailboat, with respect to his blocking...but it is what it is, which is not even good blocking for a wide receiver. Is that important? In today's NFL maybe not. Charles Clay is still a sh-tty blocker and he is a top 10 fantasy TE. Ebron probably has a little more big play ability than Clay but then again it would not surprise me if he became Charles Clay exactly, including the brain farts.

    Austin Seferian Jenkins is to me a lot like Dion Sims except a little better. Where Sims had genuinely good hands, ASJ has GREAT hands. He will catch everything. My problem with him is like Sims he's heavy as a truck and has the turning radius of one too. Miami's scouts ended up feeling with Sims like they could get him to drop weight and be faster, more agile. He wasn't impressive in his college form and I don't think ASJ is either. Whoever takes him will probably go the same route, have him lose weight and see what they can do with a faster, more agile version of Austin Seferian-Jenkins. But there is no assurance that will work, IMO. Like Sims, he's a good blocker in theory but not necessarily in practice. Inconsistent. Also with ASJ there are BIG off field character and attitude questions you must answer. Not to be understated.

    The two tight ends I like more than those guys are Jace Amaro of Texas Tech and Troy Niklas of Notre Dame. I think those two have it all.
     
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  27. UCF FINatic

    UCF FINatic The Miami Dolphins select

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    ck what are your thoughts on Kelvin Benjamin? Do you see a 2nd or 3rd round kind of guy? His skill set is so unique and I feel like he is just coming into his own. Excellent blocker too but I have a hard time getting a read on him for some reason...
     
  28. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Benjamin is a 1st rounder imo.

    Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
     
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  29. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Tajh Boyd is showing more and more that his unflappable performance vs LSU was more the exception than the norm against better competition or when the going gets tough, and he's dropping to probably the 3rd round b/c of it. He just can't stop from putting too much on his shoulders to a fault when the team is playing stagnate, when instead he needs to focus on playing within himself so he doesn't add to the chaos, especially when there still might be ebbs and flows left in the game that can swing some momentum back his team's way.
     
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  30. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I've liked Benjamin for some time. Back when everyone was going nuts over the huge guy playing for Rutgers, I always thought that Kelvin Benjamin just had a bit more solid and sound look to him than that guy, in terms of comparing unusually tall receiver versus unusually tall receiver.

    The problem is that sometimes I wonder how much Ernest Wilford there is in Kelvin Benjamin. He could be a Plaxico rather than a Wilford, but I'm going to have to take a much closer look to be sure because a guy that breaks the mold like him must stand up to close scrutiny as they walk a fine line between being unique and unfit.
     
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  31. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I've been disturbed as well. He's a play-maker but you're right, he seems to struggle with consistency and that means he could be falling into the Troy Smith category.
     
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  32. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Unfortunate b/c when the team isn't off track around him he's pretty damn good, not just at making plays but managing a game. I fear if he goes to a bad organization he's done b/c of how much pressure he puts on himself to pull the weight, but on the other hand if he lands on a good one he could end up thriving. Just too volatile IMO to risk a 1st or 2nd rounder on him. It's really annoying b/c he doesn't actually get rattled to make him play erratically; he plays erratically b/c he continues trying to play outside himself. He's such a class act that I hope it's curable for his sake. Kid came back this year to help the program and see it's development through when he would've likely been a 1st rounder, and in Tajh's hindsight I bet he'd do it all over again.
     
  33. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I think Plaxico is pretty fair, more so than Wilford IMO. I guess Benjamin is too and big tall to suggest he might be what a healthy Britt should've become.

    I don't know if you get this way but sometimes it seems awkward to properly gauge or notice the players on the team you root for b/c you're constantly watching the collective rather than isolating individuals like you would if you're watching a game to assess potential draftees. IDK maybe it's just me.
     
  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Don't know. I think I've generally had a good feel for USF players' pro prospects. Maybe a little bit of a soft spot in that some standouts I felt should "get a chance and then ya never know", when in reality there are probably half a thousand guys you could say that about in the college landscape every year. But I was pretty firm that Terrell McClain was overrated and he did indeed end up overrated. I was very high on Jason Pierre-Paul's talent to the extent he had to go on the favorites list but also wary of his character based on things I'd hear and seen, and I think both of those points of view have been right. I thought Mistral Raymond showed the talent to play in the NFL and even though he's not a standout the guy has taken 1000+ snaps in less than 3 seasons. Jacquian Williams same thing.

    Quarterbacks are a slippery slope. The good ones are a pretty exclusive club. It can be difficult to gauge whether a guy can be in that exclusive club and then once you start to see why he's not in it, it tends to pile on until it's obvious he never should've been considered up there. That's why I always caution everyone against these quick and easy super high opinions on the likes of Marcus Mariota and Brett Hundley. But then I am just as guilty as I made the same flash decisions on the likes of Andrew Luck, Teddy Bridgewater and (shamefully) Logan Thomas.
     
  35. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    it's the borderline draftable Clemson players that I sometimes have a tougher time gauging b/c I'm not sure if I'm being either too favorable b/c they're Tigers or too critical b/c I see them every week and are thus harder on them than I should be. It's not until after the season when I go back to the film and watch them objectively that I get a better feel for the borderline guys, but by that point I sometimes get lazy and don't wanna spend time watching players I've already seen all year. lol
     
  36. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    So ideally, somewhere in between the two is what we'd be looking for? Ebron looks like a real nightmare of a seam threat, but is that what the Dolphins are looking for? They might be looking more for a guy that can be in-line and that was why I mentioned Seferian Jenkins, but it sounds like you don't see him as much of a dangerous pass catcher.

    On a completely different note, I'm curious what your thoughts of Andre Williams are? I have watched BC play a couple of times, and I came away thoroughly impressed with this kid. I really can't believe he isn't getting more draft hype. Kiper doesn't even have him in his top 5 seniors at HB. I see him as a perfect complement to Miller if he's there in the middle rounds (which is no sure thing if he times well).
     
  37. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm in the process of charting Andre Williams, so I'll speak a little bit on him. I've gotten through three games (which is already an absurd 109 carries) and watched a bit more. The comparison that keeps coming up for me is Daniel Thomas. Of course that's going to sound bad to Dolphin fans, but there's a few reasons for it.

    I think Williams has better pad level than Thomas, which is something I remember DT was knocked for coming out of K-State (although I was only partially following the draft then). But I still don't think Williams plays like a bigger back, a trait he shares with Thomas. Williams goes down way to easily and his overall YPC is propped up by the 1-2 long runs he gets every game. In the 3 games I have so far, 53% of his carries are less than 3 yards, that compares to only 35% for Carlos Hyde. I don't think that Williams drives through contact enough which causes him to get stuffed for more short runs than someone like Hyde.

    Other than that, I think there are a few other things. I don't know if I've ever seen a running back trip more than Daniel Thomas, which I've seen a bit with Williams as well. Open field in front of him and he's just down, which is to say his balance is a bit suspect to me. It's pretty clear when watching Williams that the majority of his big plays come on those outside stretches off tackle. When he's not running those, he tends to run into his blockers trying to find a hole inside. He's rarely contacted on those stretch plays, allowing him to get huge gains - I'm not sure if those will be there in the NFL every time.

    I'm being harsh on him because I'm not understanding the Heisman invitation/2nd round hype that a lot of people are trying to push. He's a nice player, but I think he's a mid to late rounds kind of guy. If we're looking for a big back I'd be much more intrigued with Carlos Hyde or Jeremy Hill if he comes out.
     
  38. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Kevin Smith was a 3rd rounder after amassing 2800 scrimmage yards and 30 TDs '07, and I'd have a hard time dubbing Andre Williams a better prospect than Smith.
     
  39. Claymore95

    Claymore95 Working on it... Club Member

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    Marcus Mariota has announced he's returning to Oregon for his junior season. Probably the best decision for him, he'll feel that he's got unfinished business in Oregon plus his draft stock is more likely to improve rather than decline with another year's experience.
     
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  40. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I think it's OK to be harsh on Williams because he's getting so much pub due to his production. I like the guy. I looked at him a long time ago and came away liking him as a role player back when he was off the map. But we're talking Heisman stuff now, people drafting him as high as Daniel Thomas or higher. It kind of reminds me of what happened with Thomas himself. There were things I liked about Daniel the year before his final season at K-State. I thought he might be a nice prospect to be a role player at the next level, a bit of a roll of the dice. But then his stock got away from itself and suddenly I'm finding a lot more things I don't like than things I do.
     
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