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Armando's Article, which I agree with.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by KB21, Mar 3, 2012.

  1. Die_Nasty

    Die_Nasty Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't Brees Damaged goods that was deemed expendable by his former team? Just because one teams situation doesn't merrit a player valuable, doesn't mean he isn't in another situation.
     
  2. fin13

    fin13 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't buy anything the press has to say about the Dolphins plans, they've been wrong about everything so far.
     
  3. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    You know as well as I do that the reason for the QB rating being so different is that he had the season of a lifetime with a 121 QB rating in that time span. I'm not stupid, I'm not going to let you spin stats on me. His QB rating was where it has been for most of his career in that span. Mid to upper 90's. Not that QB rating should even be used as a barometer.

    Career QB rating: 94.9

    That four year span you are speaking of (07,08,09,10): 98, 95, 100, 92

    Those are not ridiculous jumps or declining numbers at all.

    Career Average YPA: 7.6

    Numbers In Your Time Span: 7.8, 7.2, 7.9, 6.9

    Yes you have two seasons below his career average, but by decimal points. Also two ABOVE.

    Way to reconstruct stats to say what YOU want them to.
     
  4. PhinPhanatic

    PhinPhanatic New Member

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    THANK YOU!! Absolutely. What is the down side?? It would be an incentive driven contract so there is not financial liability...unless of course he does well. LMAO.
     
  5. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    The Chargers had Rivers who was ready to take over. It was questionable whether they were going to keep Brees even before the injury, which was on the last play of the last game of the season for them. He was a FA and to keep two starting caliber
    QBs on the roster didn't make sense and a fiscal impossibility.... The injury just made the decision a bit easier for them...
     
  6. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Down side....how about CPep Part Deux?? What if he does not do well...sure, you may not have lost much in salary and bonuses, but how about the affect of another losing season, Philbin's development as a HC, lack of developing another QB to step in (do you think MMoore, for example, can replace Manning mid-stream and run his offense effectively ???).

    The down side is being back in the same boat again next year at this time if things don't work out or worse than that, two years from now if he's still not Manning from 2010, what do we do then ??

    There is risk any way we go. Flynn, Manning, draft...which is the biggest risk ?? I can't say that Manning isn't the biggest risk...he might not be, but he affects the staff and players going forward much more so if he isn't the guy we need...
     
  7. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Well-Known Member

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    If Matt Flynn weren't such a great fit for Miami I would be 100% supportive of signing Manning. But to sign Manning would mean to pass on a player that makes so much sense to be running the offense next year and possibly the next 8-10 I am hoping Miami passes on Peyton.
     
  8. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Yes I do believe Moore can come in and run Manning's offense. Reason being? His "offense" isn't any different than any other offense in the league. What makes Manning different is that he changes plays and makes insane calls at the line based on the defense. When Manning goes down all that happens is you run a normal base offense with normal pre-play adjustments.

    Secondly Manning doesn't have an offense. It's not like he walks around with the Peyton Manning playbook.
     
  9. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    Manning, Moore, Tannehill (also WR) will be the QB stable & they will all just be fine! :deadhorse:not to worry!
     
  10. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Ok, you're right...Manning doesn't have his own private playbook, however, the offense that we run will be directed at Manning's strengths and likes...that much I think we can all agree on as it would be the most logical thing for a good coach to do...adjust his scheme to the players he has...

    Those strengths and likes are not MMoore's forte. That we can all agree on. So the offense will have to be adjusted, mid season or whenever it is that Manning is deemed as not being the best option for us or he is re-injured... Will it be as successful, an adjusted offense with MMoore running it as opposed to a healthy Manning running his version ?? I don't think so...do you ??
     
  11. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Whenever there is a downside then there has to be an upside somewhere.........



    Signed:

    Drew Brees
     
    Larryfinfan likes this.
  12. DrAstroZoom

    DrAstroZoom Canary in a Coal Mine Luxury Box

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    I haven't even read the rest of this thread, because this statement almost made me jump out of my chair. It is an equivalency so absurd it is offensive. Having a win-now mindset has absolutely nothing to do with a desire to lose games on purpose to improve one's draft standing.

    I will now read the rest of the post and the thread.
     
  13. JMHPhin

    JMHPhin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    my concern isnt Manning himself its passing on addressing the position for the long term and then potentially not getting the reward you strived for in passing that up
     
  14. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    With regards to Armando... as Grandpa used to say, "every once in a while even a blind hog finds an acorn!"

    or, it it is so obvious that even Armando thinks it's right... then it must be a plain as a wart on a witch's nose!
     
    rafael likes this.
  15. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    If Manning can play well it is a no brainer for a team to sign him. That does not mean that same team cannot address the position in the draft for the future. I highly doubt Manning would try to block that team from picking a Qb to develop
     
  16. JMHPhin

    JMHPhin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    never said MANNING would stop us from taking Tannehill, but because mannings window may be short, the braintrust may bypass a qb to put weapons around Manning. for that run. great if it works, huge backfire if it doesnt
     
  17. Vinny Fins

    Vinny Fins Feisty Brooklyn dolfan ️‍

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    My problem with Manning is this: Flynn or Griffin give us stability. They'd be the starter here the next 3 opening days. Something we haven't had since Marino. I don't know if Manning can offer that right now. I don't think this team as equipped, with Peyton, is superbowl caliber, so why forgo a longterm solution for a couple playoff wins?
     
  18. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  19. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    People have been waiting for some long term solution since 1999...I'm sick of watching a bottom feeder, I want to see if Peyton works out for 3 years.
     
  20. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    That was my thought. It's so obvious that even Armando can see it. LOL. I would say that the only ones who can't see are those that choose to ignore the medical facts, ignore the bad fit, ignore the long term and just keep saying the old Manning was really good we should sign him.
     
    KB21 likes this.
  21. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Medical speculation. You don't know the facts as they pertain specifically to Manning.
     
  22. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    All of this Manning speculation is starting to make my eyes sore.

    Do you really think Philbin and Sherman would have signed on for this gig knowing that their 1st order of business was going to be completely abandoning their philosophy and taking a flier on an aged QB? NFW

    If Manning is signed, another QB will be taken in the first round of the draft or in FA. Book it.
     
  23. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    Unfortunately, neither do you nor anyone else speculating on the strength of Manning's arm. I would probably be a very good cover to bet that from either or both sides we are being fed a gracious plenty of bovine scatology. All we do know is that he had/has/may be recovered from an injury which kept him out for over a year, and affected his throwing. Seems to me that action has something to do with being a successful quarterback in the future.... not the past.
     
  24. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Being clear here. I don't want Manning at this point. However, if he comes out and SHOWS teams he is healing well, then I would seriously consider it. If Manning can play 3 seasons at a high level, I would not be concerned if they took a Qb later in hopes of development.
     
  25. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    So, how many people have you seen and personaly treated for their cervical disc herniation, cervical spondylosis, or cervical stenosis?
     
  26. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Which is exactly what they have been doing ever since Marino retired. Sign the veteran guy, hope that he is good enough to lead you for 2-3 years, and then use a non-first round pick on a quarterback who can "develop" in the system. It's the reason this team currently does not have a long term solution at this position, and if they sign Peyton, they will continue to lack a long term future at this position. There is little doubt in my mind that if they sign Peyton, they are all in to win now and will not use a first round pick on a quarterback. They might take one in the 2nd or 3rd round, but the chances of them being the guy is probably less than the chance Peyton will give the team 4-5 years of strong play.
     
  27. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    It's kind of weird how you skip over the posts that blow your theory put of the water.
     
  28. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Like which one? I have seen zero posts that blow my theory out of the water. All I see is a bunch of fans who are blinded by what Peyton was and have no forsight for what he is probably going to be if he can come back. There is also a disconnect in just how long these fans think Peyton will be able to play. There is this idea that he will come back, play like he did in his prime, and give this team 4-5 years of that kind of play and basically look like he was never injured. That is a laughable stance. Laughable.

    There is also this idea that Peyton will be the savior of the franchise and is what this team needs to win a superbowl. A 36 year old quarterback coming off a serious nerve injury, and he's the savior.
     
  29. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    I highly doubt they just up and sign Manning without knowing he can make the throws. I also doubt that if they do sign him that they just forget about the position since it has bit them in the *** once with Pennington and before that with Culpepper. This draft is not overwhelming with 1st round Qb talent either. There is Luck, RG, and MAYBE Tannenhill
     
  30. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    We know Manning had a severe nerve injury. We know that Manning's nerve did not regenerate immediately. The medical facts are that people who have nerve injuries severe enough that the regeneration does not start immediately almost never recover 100% of those connections. We know Manning is 36 years old and that recovery rates and longevity as you age are lower for this type of injury. So if you're expecting Manning to recover to what he was and play as long as Farve, you are ignoring the medical facts.
     
  31. Califin

    Califin Well-Known Member

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    Had it not been for Pennington, showing us first hand the smooth, efficient, productive play that a skilled field general can deliver with a noodle arm, I probably wouldn't be as open minded to the idea of signing a considerably diminished Peyton, who perhaps with linguini appendage in tow, will still possess a rare, inherent savvy, and invaluable intelligence to direct a offense with equal, if not superior deft.
    But just as with Pennington, it will all depend on just how diminished he is. Let there be no surprises. If he's signed, it should not be for what he "may or might" yet rekindle, but for the bottom dollar value of what he brings with him through the door, and nothing more.
     
  32. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    How many times have you examined Peyton Manning?
     
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  33. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

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    this or they just could move on, because they have the 1st overall pick and the chance to draft the best QB prospect to come out in years and also don´t wanna pay 28 Million
     
  34. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    While Chad was very savvy, a good leader and played well. IMO, when he went up against a good defense, he crumbled because of his limitations. A healthy P Manning can pick apart a really good defense. A Manning with physical limitations will likely have those limitations exascerbated. If the regime feels confident that Manning will be at/greater than 95%, then I'm on board. If they lack that confidence, then stay away from Manning. A physically limited Manning makes us a team with a winning record, and maybe a wild card playoff team, but not a true contender. WHile that's an improvement over our current situation, is that really what we want to settle for?
     
  35. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    But the problem is you're applying medical "facts" about other people / players on an overall basis, and applying them specifically to Manning. There's no problem with doing this, since absent of anything else, it's the best way to predict what might happen. The problem is there is medical evidence about the specific player coming to light which present a different outcome. He seems to be improving and already throwing the ball pretty well. I'm not poo pooing the medical evidence you and KB21 present. Only pointing out that the medical facts you are supplying do not pertain specifically to Manning. NFL doctors will take a close look at him before anything gets done with any team. And I trust them to examine the facts as they specifically pertain to Manning.
     
  36. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    So, with your statement, you're assuming then that Manning is the 5-7% of people that have had this injury that have recovered to almost 100% ?? How is that any different than saying 93% of the people, at his age that have had this type of nerve damage do NOT regain full regeneration of the injured nerves... It's using part of the stats to prove your point ?? It's a perspective, but Raf and KB have never said he cannot regain near full regeneration, just that it's not likely that he will.

    Kind of like the power of positive thinking...the odds are certainly against Manning ever being the Manning of 2009, but is there a chance ?? Well, yes...but its a slim one and what's more important is that we really won't know that when he's signed...we'll only learn just how far along he is and how far along he will be after he's on the roster...If it works out...great, we're in fat city...if not...it's CPep all over again...
     
  37. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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  38. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    I'm only saying that I trust the NFL Doctors to do their job. I hear reports that Manning is progressing very well, and looking good throwing the ball. When I hear and see this, the medical facts of the past have less significance to Peyton Manning's current status.

    Medical science is a field that is exponentially improving over time. Peyton Manning has the world's best doctors at his disposal and the most current methods of treatment. In my humble, non-medical, opinion it's time to let the Dolphins do their due diligence and make a decision. They'll have access to the only FACT that matters and that is the health of Peyton Manning.

    But the rest of us will continue to speculate because that's what we do here. But that's all it is is speculation. It may be well educated speculation, but it's speculation nonetheless. Unless KB21 is Peyton Manning's doctor.
     
  39. PhinsPhan23

    PhinsPhan23 New Member

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    So you and Armando are saying that only b/c Stephen Ross is saying we should get Manning that the coaching staff and fan base are buying into that? Believe me, I don't listen to Stephen Ross as a football messiah who knows how to select the right players.

    Could it be that everyone is loving the idea of Manning coming here b/c he is one of the greatest QB's of all time and if he brings 90% of what he had it would be a huge win for this team?

    Also, we fail to forget that maybe Sherman doesn't believe in Tannenhill. Maybe Philbin doesn't believe in Flynn. Maybe the cost to get RGIII is more than anyone would give up (2012, 2013, and 2014 1st round picks along with Jake Long and our 2nd this year).

    All of that is besides the point. Armando basically stated that the fans don't know what they are thinking and are foolishly getting behind the owner as the only one wanting Peyton. I think Armando needs to take a few steps back from this journalistic career and re-evaluate his future.
     
  40. shaunm000

    shaunm000 Well-Known Member

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    All I care about is winning the Super Bowl next season. Peyton Manning give us the best chance to do that.
     

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