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Could our coach be....The next Lombardi???

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by djphinfan, Jun 25, 2019.

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  1. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-hired-brian-flores-leadership-nfl/1556453001



    Gases coaching style is that of a buddy, he likes to tease and joke with you to get you motivated..you won’t see him with a whistle around his neck in practice..He’s usually off to the side..couldn’t stand that about him, so glad he is gone, really, not a leader in any sense..

    Really looking forward to Flores style, I’ve always said that this team playing in this town needs a leader of men, disciplinarian type, I think this guy is the father figure type that demands a lot from his players but has the compassion to care about them and their families.

    Lombardi use to say, “Win your players' hearts and they will follow you anywhere”

    After 6 months of studying this guy, I think this guy has traits of the great Lombardi.

    I know that’s a huge leap but I really feel that Flores embodies this quote.

    “I believe everybody wants discipline, especially young people. But one has to be careful of the spirit in which it's given. They'll take it if it's done in the spirit of teaching ... even of love, like the discipline one gets from a mother and father.”
     
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  2. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    We really need the season to start.
     
  3. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Back to the topic, if anyone has really gotten into this guys style and what he stands for, and how he got to this point, and the respect of his players, and how he teaches in practice, his demeanor, his presence, it feels like he has the potential to be the right guy
     
  4. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Generally I think a more lenient approach to management can work but only with the right people around you. When those people are millionaires it's different from your average job.
     
  5. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    That’s my experience too. You can have a light touch with self motivated individuals who know what they’re doing. When half the team are people with less than 3 years experience and still learning the job in a different environment from their last job, I doubt a light touch will work.
     
  6. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Everything in that article also describes Joe Philbin to a tee. It's far too early to anoint Flores as a great head coach- maybe we can win a preseason game 1st? After all, he was the guy who traded away most of our best players less than a month ago...

    And PS- the NY media AND Jets players are saying the same thing about Gase.
     
  7. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    This isn't true, Key. Well, at least not on the stations I listen to everyday to and from work. On The Fan, especially Boningo, would absolutely trash Gase and despised the hire when it happened.
     
  8. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Team Flores

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    Not sure about Lombardi or anything, but I like what I see from Flores so far. Along with what you said, I believe that Flores has willpower to stay the course. If we are going to have a real team culture change ( for the better) then we need a mentally strong coach who our players can relate too.
     
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  9. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Interesting quote from Grier.

    I think this generation of players is just looking for a little rationalization, transparency, and constant teaching regarding football. I've been through a couple internships where I wasn't being instructed, just given work for work's sake. It was not very fulfilling.
     
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  10. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    A lot of folks did at first because of the narrative coming out of Miami. From what I've heard/read lately though, that narrative has changed since the offense has opened up so much compared to where it used to be.

    None of this means anything this early on and everything should be taken with a grain of salt....I just mentioned it since some are comparing our new HC to one of the best ever before we've even had the first practice in pads. For a team expected to be in the very bottom of the league this season, we won't have these types of opinions until AT LEAST December and probably not until next season. The first Jets/Fins matchup will certainly be interesting though!
     
  11. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Exactly.

    My boss basically leaves me alone because he knows I'm on top of anything that might pop up 100%

    There are other people here though we have to be on like Hawks.
     
  12. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    Exactly. There is never a one-size-fits-all approach thats going to work unless you have a very small group of people. The best coaches can broadly motivate everyone, lead by setting a good example and build confidence through both success and how they treat people. But individually, every player is his own man, and you can't just expect them all to fall in line, no matter who the coach is.
     
  13. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    Gase was the next Don Shula, and Flores is the next Lombardi.

    Is there any way we can pre-order Super Bowl shirts?
     
  14. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Gase is a lil boy..Flores is a man..

    Good starting point
     
  15. Bumrush

    Bumrush Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Too early DJ for any proclamations or predictions.

    It is more likely he's Joe Philbin than Vince Lombardi, given that Lombardi was one of the greatest coaches in NFL history.

    Talking points are nice and motivational slogans sound positive but before we place judgement let's see what his in game adjustments are and the philosophy the team takes on offense and defense.
     
  16. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    It's more likely he'll be fired after three or four years and We'll do the whole coaching search carousel again
     
  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Leadership traits that’s all, I’m not saying he is gonna be Lombardi,just see some traits.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
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  18. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    I tend to look at a head coach in the same manner I do a platoon sergeant in the military. Fear and respect. Troops with good platoon sergeants respect him/her but also fear the repercussions of failure through negligence.

    Football players should be the same. Respect their coaches and fear repercussions for their individual failures but as it’s been pointed out, kinda difficult to fear someone when you have a multimillion dollar contract.

    How I long for the golden days of football again
     
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  19. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    I think that you have to be aware that those tactics don't work with everyone though, right? You can have great players who will excel for a coach with a kinder approach, and absolutely tank with the drill sergeant type.
     
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  20. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Tom Landry is a great example of one of those kinder coaches who had tremendous success. You also have many successful "cerebral" coaches that are nothing like platoon sergeants. As you said there's no one size fits all, and it's important that the coach stays true to himself and not try to impose a style he's not comfortable with.. easy to spot a fake.

    Also, one problem with applying military style leadership to sports is that players are less likely to talk to you about stuff going on in their personal lives that affects on-field performance, which is especially important when the players are public figures and are on TV.

    Anyway, more important than any of this leadership style stuff is how well you prepare and how well you adapt. Hard to find a great coach that didn't have both traits. And we have no idea whether Flores has either. As was stated earlier.. the season needs to start!
     
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  21. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    IMO coaching success, like everything else, is a combination of talent, hard work, the help of others and luck. Bellichick was a talented, hard-working coach in Cleveland, but without the opportunity in NE and the drafting of Brady he may have gone down as just another failed coach or maybe a lifetime DC. Their scout, Rehbein, identified Brady as the perfect fit for their offense. If not for him, Brady may not have been on their radar. And obviously, some other team could have taken Brady before their 6th round pick. Even after they drafted him, circumstances helped Brady stay on the roster. IIRC the Pats' were way over the cap so they had to dump vets and fill the roster out with rookies. They still had to do a good job of evaluating Brady, but realistically, if their cap had been better managed they probably would have kept one of those higher priced vets over a 4th QB.
     
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  22. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Bring drill sergeant as you put it doesn’t entail screaming and yelling all of the time, nor does it always include caping the living dog snot out of your troops until they’re sweating gravy...but it can.

    Good troops understand what a drill sergeant is doing when he does go off like that. Good players should also understand as well
     
  23. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    This is why I could never be in the military. I definitely can't just trust a person to make lmk e decisions about me personally.
     
  24. Hooligan

    Hooligan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Obviously Philbin rode Rodger's coattails and Gase rode Manning's. Neither had accomplished anything on their own merit. Flores, on the other hand, led a nondescript defense, devoid of any superstars and thoroughly stifled one of the most explosive offenses in the NFC. That doesn't make him a Lombardi but, it's got me looking forward to pre-season in a year that we were expected to tank for Tua.
     
  25. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Flores rode the coattails of Belichick! Flores has been under Belichick in various duties for a long time, and it's not like NE's defense suddenly improved when Flores took over play calling duties. NE has had a very good defense for a LONG time and any success there is best attributed to Belichick not Flores. We simply have no idea what Flores can do without Belichick.

    Also problematic is that infamous Belichick coaching tree. These are the records of former Belichick assistants as NFL HC's:
    Crennel (5 seasons, 28-55)
    Groh (1 season, 9-7)
    McDaniels (2 seasons 11-17)
    Mangini (5 seasons 33-47)
    Saban (2 seasons 15-17)
    Schwartz (5 seasons 29-51)
    Patricia (1 season 6-10)
    O'Brien (5 seasons 42-38)

    That's really bad. I think O'Brien will finally buck the trend of failures and end up being a winning coach longer term now that he has Deshaun Watson. Either way, there's no real evidence Flores is likely to be a winning coach based on his time with NE.
     
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  26. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I think we should just talk about the defensive gameplan he rolled out for the last Super Bowl. That told me he deserved a shot at a HC position.
     
  27. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He deserves a shot at head coach because of the entire skill set which includes great leadership traits, the upbringing and adversity he withstood, his ability to understand and connect what a lot of the athletes have endured..His presence..and the ability to call plays.
     
  28. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    It's also worth noting that he's still in the same division....meaning he's coaching against one of the winningest coaches of all time (and his mentor), the guy that just left Miami and essentially received a promotion with a huge axe to grind, then a Bills team we always seem to struggle against. And again, I'll point out that he's doing this while firing many of our best players.

    The odds of year one success are highly stacked against Flores unless he actually is a defensive guru. And while I'm rooting for him, I just don't have a good feeling about 2019 or even the team's short term goals. I'm still debating whether or not to even buy the Sunday Ticket this season..I've had it for 10 years straight now but I don't think it's worth $300+ for a 2-14 season.
     
  29. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree I drink your milkshake! Club Member

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    I am never getting excited about a coach again. All I want is results.
     
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  30. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I honestly dont see us being any worse than last year. We may not win the same number of games but still.
     
  31. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Last year the injuries just crippled us, so I'm hoping that aspect improves anyway. My biggest worry is the trenches on both sides of the ball...that's ultimately where the game is won or lost. Coaching can only make up for so much and our defense is going to have to be INCREDIBLE for us to win 7 games. I know the secondary is mostly set and our young linebackers are coming around- but how are we going to generate pressure and stop the run?

    On offense I have the same concerns. I think I'll enjoy watching Fitzpatrick do his thing and taking chances...but can we run the football at all? Will there even be a pocket? This is a much worse line than last season and the coaching will have to be a major factor. Gase made up for it with scheme and gimmicks to grab enough chunk yards to stay in ballgames, but what I personally want to see is sustained drives of a mature offense. I'm not sure if that's possible with our current roster and it's a shame since we have so much talent at RB and WR.

    I said all of that to say this- I disagree with you, things can be a lot worse than last season. The good news is that if our defense does get there then we'll be very good for a very long time since there's so much youth...but that may be an unrealistic expectation for 2019. So I'm 100% in "wait and see" mode....I really think Gase and NY will have the better year.
     
  32. firedan

    firedan Well-Known Member

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    Well we know enough about Gase so let's find out about Flores.I hope he is the real deal.
     
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  33. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Well, for me, DJ, I think that there is cheating in NE, so I don't think the coaches are as genius as most think. Further, NE coaches are notoriously bad outside of NE, so I just in general don't trust them (much like I don't trust players that get massive paydays and leave the Pats). But, hearing that he was in control of the defensive gameplan for the Super Bowl gave me hope that Flores might be different from say, McDaniels, who I think was a compete fraud.
     
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  34. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Interesting that the team isn’t worth your money this year
     
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  35. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah I’m not indicting Flores in that stuff, I dont believe it’s in his makeup.
     
  36. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Huh??
     
  37. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    Our defense created no pressure last season. I personally believe that pressure is mainly scheme driven rather than flat out talent. Not always, but most cases. I honestly can't see us creating less pressure.

    The same basically goes for the offensive line IMO in that it's mainly scheme dependent. I thought Gase did a God awful job doing basically anything to help negate pressure. We may not be better but I doubt we are much worse in the end.

    Obviously though it's just my opinion I can see the other perspective as well.
     
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  38. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I mean the idea of following someone as my leader or telling me to do things would never fly to me. I can't stand that style of management for myself. I'd be looking at the drill sergeant like "And who the hell are you again?"

    My point is basically I hope Flores isnt a flat out drill sergeant because that type of leadership doesn't resonate with everyone. You need different approaches to different people in order to reach them.
     
  39. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Team Flores

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    Wow! I am really shocked by this. I don't mean shelling out the money. 300+ is a lot of jack. I mean it seems like you have given up on the team already. Let me be clear. I am not questioning you as a fan, Key. You are as dedicated as any of us, if not more. I get that the stats are against us and everything, but there is a reason that they say, "Any given Sunday". We just never know because team chemistry is like lightning. When it strikes and you have it, look out! Since I will have to work on Sundays I am going for the NFL game pass so I can watch the game on Monday. I believe with Roku I can watch the game on the TV so that will be nice. It won't be live, but I just can't see myself missing a game. If I don't have hope then I got nothing and I don't want to go there. Life is too short.
     
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  40. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Team Flores

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    I get what you mean and I don't think he is. You can have high standards and expectations and still be supportive too.
     
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