Don't be reasonable..diffuses the lynch mob. I really wanted to see what Thiggy and Miller have anyway.
Here are Matt Forte's stats http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/11278/matt-forte Here are Daniel Thomas's http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/14056/daniel-thomas He has ONE more TD than Forte does this year, while not doing anything else as well and being given only 91 carries. Forte also has 24 other TDs in his career. Anyone who wants to argue that somehow Thomas has been Forte's equal this year is being ridiculous.
Actually, inside the redzone, Forte has 19 carries for 3 TDs (and 4 1st downs). Thomas has 21 carries for 4 TDs (and 7 first downs). Just stating the facts.
Matt Forte is not, nor has he ever been, a strong goal line runner. Prior to 2012 he had 87 carries inside the 10 yard line and produced only 10 touchdowns. This year he's got I believe 8 more of those carries and only 1 TD, same as ever. His effectiveness (12%) is very, very low in that area...hence the Bears having Michael Bush (who this year has 5 TDs on 11 such carries) hawk those touchdown opportunities. Thing is, Daniel Thomas has 25 carries inside the 10 yard line during his young career, yet only 4 touchdowns (16%). The effectiveness is virtually the same as Matt Forte. What's interesting to me is people bringing up the most impressive aspect of Daniel Thomas' game and pointing out that it's about equal to the least impressive aspect of Matt Forte's game, and somehow I guess there's the implication that there's a good point hidden in there somewhere that favors Daniel Thomas or the man that picked him. I mean, if you want acknowledgment that the worst aspect of Matt Forte's game is about equivalent to the best aspect of Daniel Thomas' game...OK. Fully acknowledged.
I was wondering how soon someone would complain about people discussing the Dolphins GM on a Dolphins board.
But yet if he would've entered the first season without Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams with Reggie Bush as the starter and no backup plan, given Bush's history as a starter, that would've been real stupid, too, and if Bush would've failed it would've been harshly criticized a la the "he traded Brandon Marshall and didn't replace him" sentiment. If you want to see the guy as bad, you're going to see the moves he makes as bad.
When a simple injury to a running back has a ripple effect the equivalent of a cognitive tsunami all the way to Jeff Ireland in the minds of some of the membership, I'd say you're incorrect.
Because it reminds people what a horrible pick it was. And simple injury? This is the second time in two years in the league he's been hurt. Factor in his underwhelming performance when healthy, and it's only natural to question the guy who decided that not only was he worth drafting in the 2nd round, that he was worth trading up for.
Anything relating to personnell leads back to the GM. Thomas was a controversial selection at the time and he hasn't really panned out. Hence, there is some criticism warranted
Yeah. Do you think the Panthers are fielding a lot of calls from teams eager to trade for Jimmy Clausen? And at least the Panthers can try to say they didn't lack confidence in Clausen they just had the No. 1 overall pick and there was a unique and elite talent available at QB that they just couldn't pass up.
That's a pretty good comparison. Ronnie definitely lacked a second gear, but had pretty good vision and always "fell forward". Thomas runs into the line like it's a brick wall (usually head first, hence the concussions).
Ricky and Ronnie were both let go. I wanted to sign DeAngelo Williams (like an idiot), a lot of people wanted Ahmad Bradshaw as well. Instead, Ireland traded a 5th and Jon Amaya for Reggie Bush. Anyone have a problem with that? He spent his first round pick on Mike Pouncey. He didn't have a 2nd round pick b/c of the Marshall trade. Mark Ingram goes 28th to Nawlins. Ryan Williams, Mikel Leshoure, Shane Vereen all come off the board by pick 57. So, the 4 RBs drafted ahead of DThomas have all had problems either getting hurt, or getting on the field even when healthy. Ingram leads the group with 984 yards, DT is second at 906. Back to the draft, with no 2nd round pick and the RBs in an already weak RB class coming off the board, Ireland traded up to take DT. Demarco Murray goes in the 3rd round, but he's had injury problems throughout his career as well. Stevan Ridley and Alex Green came next, not exactly world beater material there. Let's recap. The RB class sucked, all of them have been disappointments thus far. But Irish cant go into the season with Reggie Bush as his only back so he rolled the dice. As it turns out, Bush goes over a 1000, 5+ ypc, RB is a strength of the team, and Irish augments DT with Lamar Miller as an additional backup in this years draft. The only thing that's horrible is people's inability to follow a basic series of events. Half the board wanted Ryan Mallett at 15, or at 62. That alone should tell you how idiotic it was to even consider him in the 1st round. And yet we have the same clowns in here now talking about DT was a bad pick and Irish is a horrible GM. LMAO.
He rolled the dice unnecessarily on a low-ceiling guy though. You just described perfectly why he didn't need to make that pick. If Reggie is your guy - and that was a great pickup btw - why the desperation? Why not get value in the later rounds (or simply wait for Thomas to fall to you in 3rd, which he likely would have)?
It's amazing when you look at Thomas in college, and compare him with say, Lamar Miller. Night and day. That's why you didn't need to trade up for him. Those guys are there later in the draft at the running back position. Like you say, unless a guy really wow's you, and let's give Ireland some of kind of credit here and assume Thomas didn't, why give up that much? It was a head-scratcher.
I do find it funny that Ryan Mallet not being worth a 2nd somehow justifies Ireland's decision to trade up for Thomas though. As if those were his only two options.
Daniel Thomas wasn't a physically outstanding specimen, but that hardly makes him a bad decision either. He was a guy who had good vision and made really good cuts in college. Those are admirable traits, and I think it was very much reasonable to have hope that those would make up for pretty pedestrian power and speed. I think his problem is way more that those skills haven't translated than any physical inadequacy. It seems very much to me like he's never made the leap to NFL game speed, for whatever reason you'd like to give. Daniel Thomas doesn't look like a good pick in the context of some of the meat-market tossery of some draft analysis, but I'm not sure a lot of that has really caught up to the reality either where so many physical specimens fail to do ****.
In hindsight Bush was a great pick up, Thomas appears to be a journeyman backup type but no one knew that at the time. So IMO it was prudent to go after a safety net in case Bush didn't work out. Sometimes things work out n sometimes they don't, that's the nature of the biz.
He had other options. You don't put the resources into a guy as he Ireland did Thomas if you're simply looking for a "safety net."
Daniel Thomas was a mistake by Ireland. Hell, Gates was a bad pick too. I don't believe there's such a thing as a bad pick in rounds 6 or 7, but there can be good picks in those rounds, and Wilson qualifies.
