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DB rankings: Jets #1 - via Yahoo sports

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by cobrajet, Jul 19, 2010.

  1. cobrajet

    cobrajet Mr. Ross - sell the team!

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    dolfan7171 likes this.
  2. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah, Revis is the flavor of the offseason and the sports writers can't help but slobe the nobe all offseason, until someone else emerges next year.
     
    DolfanJake and dolfan7171 like this.
  3. findifference

    findifference Member

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    Personally I would take Champ over Darelle and Nnamdi
     
  4. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Revis is the real deal. Sorry. Cromartie is a punk. Their safeties are nothing special.
     
  5. PhinsRock

    PhinsRock Premium Member Luxury Box

    As our young corners Davis and Smith mature, then Clemons matures, we should move up in this ranking a long way I hope after next season. Otherwise hard to argue much with someone's opinion, they have their right to it.
     
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  6. jupiterfin

    jupiterfin Mild Irritant

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    Antonio Cromartie vs. Ronnie Brown.... Not worried about Cromartie.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

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    Shaking my head at Atari Bigby with the Packers. We had first shot with him and let him go. Does anyone on here remember why we let him go?
     
  8. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I doubt Cromartie is going to be happy that Marshall is still in his division.
     
  9. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    A friendly reminder: Jason Cole was the other half of Highfivegate.

    Even setting that aside, I'm not a big fan of his positional ranking articles. His criteria is entirely subjective. Now, that's his right: he can rate anyone any way he chooses. But that doesn't mean we automatically have to give his rankings some weight.
     
  10. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    His DL note was downright awful.

    His LB note was much better, until he decided that "good" was too boring and so he literally edited it after the fact to include Manish Mehta's bogus report that Channing Crowder might miss the season.

    As for the DB notes, saying that Cromartie could be the next Deion Sanders is kind of ridiculous. Not even mentioning Brodney Pool is sloppy. Ranking Miami #19 overall and then saying that they have arguably the best nickel package of corners in the league, is also kind of ridiculous. If the Dolphins have the best nickel package of corners in the league and they have Yeremiah Bell coming off a Pro Bowl appearance then I don't care if Cameron Worrell is your free safety, you probably have a good secondary. Well, ok as long as Cameron Worrell isn't there. Still.

    Also of course there's Jason Cole's token blatant inaccurary/misrepresentation, saying that Culver "won" the job by default. He hasn't won anything. He wasn't the starter last year and he hasn't won it yet this year, in fact Chris Clemons took all the snaps during mini camp.
     
  11. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    You know what kills me about stuff like this is you get the feeling these guys don't even do any research before they write these articles. At least, not research that goes beyond looking at an NFL.com roster, and then looking a very broad team statistics page.

    The very concept of actually watching tape of the players involved or doing a bunch of digging with NFL personnel execs in order to get quotes and their feelings on the players, in order to come out with a piece like this...is just ridiculous to them. Work? **** that. I'll just write some BS.

    And if you ever write to Cole or someone like him and openly ask why he doesn't bother to take to the film in order to do his rankings, he'll probably reply that he's not a scout and doesn't pretend to be a scout. Which of course begs the question, then why should I even bother reading player rankings from a guy that knows so little about the players that he doesn't even bother to try to learn more because he'd rather not pretend that he's informed enough to create an accurate ranking. Except, here's my rankings.
     
    2k5, xphinfanx, PhiNomina and 11 others like this.
  12. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Couldn't have said it better myself. Is there a way to thank posts more than once? This deserves it.
     
  13. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    How about I thank it too, for you.
     
    Desides likes this.
  14. PhinishLine

    PhinishLine Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Bruh, you're turning into our version of Jim Rome. Pretty soon we're gonna start a thread called CK is Burning (no pun)
     
  15. mikenc28115

    mikenc28115 New Member

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    Going into the season they are right, but let's wait till mid way and see were we are at.
     
    findifference likes this.
  16. cobrajet

    cobrajet Mr. Ross - sell the team!

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    I took the liberty of posting the rest of our team ratings from the same link in my initial post. Unfortunately I found most of them to be disappointing, especially LB, and DL.

    Read on. . . .


    Offensive Rankings

    OL: Ranked 5. Miami Dolphins: This is the best run-blocking unit in the league, hands down, showing the emphasis head coach (and former offensive line coach) Tony Sparano puts on line play. This group is the embodiment of what Bill Parcells loves in a line: a bunch of big, intimidating maulers. Some people might question having so many big guys in a place where the weather takes its toll, but the Dolphins are making it work, starting with the outstanding play of left tackle Jake Long. The interior line is still problematic, but if Jake Grove(notes) can stay healthy, that should solidify the center spot. If Richie Incognito(notes) can keep his head straight, this unit could take a step forward.

    QB: Ranked 22. Miami Dolphins: The Dolphins start a run of six teams with relatively young (if not rookie) quarterbacks who have a significant chance to improve. Chad Henne(notes) personifies the group with his strength and accuracy. No question, Henne can throw it. He just could use a bit more control on some of those rifle shots.

    RB: Ranked 14. Miami Dolphins: If Ronnie Brown(notes) was healthy and/or Ricky Williams(notes) was younger, you might rank this duo higher, certainly higher than the Saints and the Bears. But Brown is trying to come back from a difficult foot injury (he had a significant knee injury earlier in his career) and Williams turned 33 earlier this month. That said, Brown is going into the final year of his contract, so he could be motivated, and Williams has been amazing in his ability to play like a guy who is still in his mid-20s.

    WR: Ranked 19. Miami Dolphins: The Dolphins finally landed a No. 1 receiver in Brandon Marshall(notes) after years of not having one. The question is whether Marshall will be enough.


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    Defensive Rankings

    DL: Ranked 26. Miami Dolphins: It’s three years into the Bill Parcells Project and the best the Dolphins have to show along the defensive line is Randy Starks (notes), Phillip Merling(notes), rookie Jared Odrick(notes) and reserve Kendall Langford(notes). There’s not one serious or potential playmaker in the bunch. Thus, even by 3-4 standards, this is the ultimate collection of plugger types.

    LB: Ranked 16. Miami: Hmmm, the Dolphins felt so great about their linebackers last year that they let go of Jason Taylor and Joey Porter(notes) … their two most accomplished pass rushers in the 3-4 scheme. OK, that’s questionable. Of course, Miami fans are excited about the arrival of Karlos Dansby(notes), the highest paid inside linebacker in the history of the game. That’s what free agency in a shallow market will do for you. If fans are expecting the second coming of Zach Thomas(notes), they are going to be sorely disappointed. Dansby is good and has pretty good pass-rush skills for an inside guy, but he’s not a great player. Fellow inside linebacker Channing Crowder(notes) is a lot smarter than people know, but there are reports that he will miss the season with a foot injury. The real key for this group is whether Cameron Wake(notes) or Koa Misi(notes) can be serious pass rushers. They better be.

    DB Ranking 19. Miami Dolphins: The top three cornerback combos in the NFL reside in Cincinnati, Green Bay and with the Jets. However, if you’re looking for a pair who have the talent to break into that realm, second-year CBs Vontae Davis(notes) and Sean Smith(notes) have all the talent. If you throw in veteran Will Allen, the Dolphins have arguably the best nickel group of CBs in the league. The safety situation isn’t quite as good, which is why the Dolphins allowed an obscene 8.2 yards per pass attempt last season. SS Yeremiah Bell(notes) is solid, if he can stay healthy, and FS Tyrone Culver(notes) won the job by default. Not great, but you’d rather be good at cornerback first.
     
  17. AbideN703

    AbideN703 Yes, I'd hit it

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    It does appear that there are a ton of boobs who call themselves sports writers out there
     
  18. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Everyone, even sportswriters are entitled to their opinion, but this kind of thing:

    ...drives me up a wall. Its just too damn stupid. I mean really, who the hell drafts the o line based on weather?
     
    jupiterfin likes this.
  19. jupiterfin

    jupiterfin Mild Irritant

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    I thought the same thing. Are we supposed to believe he would have given us a higher rating if our O-Line was full of skinny players, because they do better in the heat? Assinine assumption.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  20. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    What kills me about this note is that when Jason Cole originally put out the LB Rankings, the underlined line was not there. He actually edited, after the fact, to include a reference to Manish Mehta's bogus report...well after everyone realized that Manish had made an idiotic error.

    To me that just proves that Jason Cole is not satisfied with anything of his being satisfactory. He has to **** it up somehow.
     
    findifference likes this.
  21. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    Karlos Dansby's not a great player? What? Any fan of an NFC west team would wholeheartedly disagree with that statement. He may not be a future HOFer, but he most certainly is a great player.

    ...He just played in Arizona so nobody knew it...
     
  22. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    Why? He'll never be covering him.
     
  23. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    No, he isn't great. He's very good.
     
  24. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    Come on, that's not how football works. If Revis is covering Marshall on every play, then Miami knows where Revis is on every play. We could completely take Revis out of the game by using Marshall as a decoy whenever we wanted.

    That would give us a pretty good advantage to control where your best player has to line up. We may have to give up Marshall, but our running game and Lower tier wrs would be able to take advantage of not having revis anywhere near them.
     
  25. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    I'm not understanding the scale here. So is Dansby like, an A, and Great is an A+?
     
  26. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Maybe, but Brandon Marshall's history suggests that coaches like to move him all around the field, and that would make it hard, maybe even impossible, for the Jets to keep Revis on him the whole time.
     
  27. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I do think Revis is so good it skews the perspective that jets fans have when it comes to their defense..without him, their swimming in mediocrity...but, he is their's, and he is that good, they just better hope that nothing happens to him, or they will be exposed.
     
  28. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    I don't see how it would be hard. Revis follows his man everywhere. Left side, right side, slot or wide, it doesn't matter. If Marshall is on the field, Revis will be covering him 97% of the time.
     
  29. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    He isn't on the elite tier of ILB's. Willis, Beason, Lewis, Ryans, Harris, Vilma, etc. are all better.
     
  30. LandShark13

    LandShark13 New Member

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    Compare their stats. Dansby has been more productive than Harris.
     
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  31. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    indeed. And Dansby hasn't had the kind of help in the front 7 that Harris had last year.
     
  32. cobrajet

    cobrajet Mr. Ross - sell the team!

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    For what it's worth I think both the Dolphins and the Jets are going to have great seasons this year and their match ups will be huge. I don't know if its possible to predict who will cover who at this point because if it was there would be no surprises on the field. In fact I am almost willing to bet Parcells throws a monkey wrench in that just to be a prick and keep everyone guessing. That's why they play the game boys. We'll have to continue this discussion a few weeks down the road.

    The Jets have a great defense because they play well as a unit. Likewise with the Dansby debate. It's true that other ILB may have better stats. But individual stats don't make defenses great, the numbers of the whole unit playing together do. Dansby is a great step up for us and I am proud to have him around. Once he gets into a groove with his new defensive scheme and the new abilities of his teammates it should really be something to behold.

    I wish we could start the season tomorrow. The suspense is just killing me!
     
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  33. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    if thats the case (and it isn't) then the dolphins control where Revis is on every play. That's an advantage for us. Not to mention, if Revis follows marshall every play, it tells Henne the jets are in Man coverage. No defense is that open about their coverage all game.

    There's no way the jets go a whole game without going into zone coverage. You're implying they run man every play. Which no defense can do. that would give the offense so many advantages. LBs in man coverage on RBs and WRs, on every play? No way.

    If Revis is in zone, even if that zone is the entire left side of the field, and Marshall lines up on the right side of the field, Revis will not be covering marshall on that play.
     
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  34. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    Hahahaha

    Are you serious with this? Revis eliminates the best opposing target on every play, and that is an advantage for you guys? Get real. Revis was rarely used in zone, otherwise, the top receivers he faced would have had much better stats. The Jets did not play a lot of zone last year, at all. Rex's scheme is man-based, not zone.
     
  35. PS17

    PS17 NYJ 2010!!!

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    Dansby is 28 years old and has already been in the league for 6 years. He is at his absolute peak right now. Harris still out-produced him in tackles and sacks. I'd take Harris but of course, I am biased. :lol:
     
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  36. LandShark13

    LandShark13 New Member

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    Explain to me how Harris has out produced Dansby in sacks? Not only does Dansby have more sacks 25.5 vs 11.5 but he has also averaged more sacks throughout his career than Harris 4.25 (Dansby) 3.75 (Harris).

    As for tackles you're smart enough to know that tackles are not and have never been an official NFL stat. Tackles are assigned by the individuals team. In fact it has been mentioned numerous times that if we added up the total number of tackles awarded by each team it would by far our surpass the number of plays the defense was even on the field.

    With that said Danbys averages 92.16 tackles per season and Harris averages 109. So on unofficial stats lets give Harris the Nod. If we factor in Passes defensed, Interceptions, and Touchdowns once again I would take Dansby Hands down.
     
  37. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    No I don't expect you would see how it would be hard, would you? But that's more because you don't know a whole lot of the intricacies of the game.

    Would it surprise you to know that 5 of the 7 times that Matt Schaub threw the ball to Andre Johnson, he was being covered by someone other than Darrelle Revis? Or that 3 of the 6 times that Marques Colston was thrown the ball by Drew Brees, he was not covered by Revis? That 3 of the 6 times that Mike Sims-Walker was thrown the ball by David Garrard, he was covered by someone other than Revis? That 5 of the 10 times that Roddy White was thrown the ball by Matt Ryan, he was not covered by Revis? That 8 of the 10 times that Vincent Jackson was thrown the ball by Phil Rivers, he was covered by someone other than Revis?

    Andre Johnson, Marques Colston, Mike Sims-Walker, Roddy White and Vincent Jackson share something in common. They are all CLEARLY the #1 WRs on their respective teams, head and shoulders above the next best guy on the unit. And yet, only 15 of the 39 passes thrown in their direction during games against the Jets were thrown into Revis coverage.

    But that's the thing about Revis Island. It's just one little island in a sea of possibilities.
     
  38. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree with you that he isn't elite or great, but very good. But, Harris and Vilma are overrated as well if Dansby is overrated.
     
  39. Phinatic425

    Phinatic425 MIA State of Mind

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    :hi5:
     
  40. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    thank you sir. This is pretty much the argument I was making earlier but i was far too lazy to dig up these statistics. Great work.

    In the end, he's just one guy. And he has to play the game in a scheme just like every one else. Guys like Cromartie will be tested, along with their safeties.
     

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