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Every Tannehill dropback against Tampa

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Mainge, Nov 19, 2013.

  1. Mainge

    Mainge Season Ticket Holder

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    [video=youtube;1wjT8php3I0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wjT8php3I0&feature=youtu.be[/video]

    Sorry for getting this out so late, busy week last week. I'll post the Chargers game later this week.
     
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  2. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    On that deep ball miss to Wallace he clutched twice. I think he if just throws it up right away it's a TD or at the least a completion.


    Edit: My god do we suck at throwing WR screens to Wallace. Screens in general actually.
     
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  3. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Think Tannehill hits the slant really well.
     
  4. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    The lack of RAC on that video is kinda depressing. The only real catch-and-run was the TD on that screen/pick. Because no one does much after the catch, it always looks like our offene is just stuck in a box. A short passing offense with no RAC does very little to help the QB, and the explosive plays just never happen.

    Is that a scheme issue, a personnel thing, a ball-placement thing? I'd guess it's largely scheme with allllll these comeback type things, but I don't know enough about typical play design. I just wish we'd hit some more guys as they're running downfield instead of at a stop as they square up to Tannehill.

    What I do know is that the play that got me most excited about Wallace was a slant that he housed against the Giants - looked like he was dead-to-rights when he caught it, but the good angles the defenders had couldn't even contain his speed. We need some of that.
     
  5. Griese's Glasses

    Griese's Glasses Well-Known Member

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    I missed this game....Is Ryan getting taunted at 0:34? If so...was it called?
     
  6. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    Thanks as always Mainge!
     
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  7. Mainge

    Mainge Season Ticket Holder

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    Looks congratulatory to me
     
  8. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Hartline and Matthews are not yac guys, Matthews has some potential but not our starters.
     
  9. Rhody Phins Fan

    Rhody Phins Fan Well-Known Member

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    We've got Charles Clay. He's all the YAC we need!
     
  10. Shamboubou

    Shamboubou Well-Known Member

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    You have think twice about throwing it up to a WR who won't fight for the ball for you.
     
  11. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    I didn't know throwing a screen meant, "throwing it up".
     
  12. Shamboubou

    Shamboubou Well-Known Member

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    Throwing a screen usually mean me throwing up, but I was talking more about the "Double clutched on the deep ball part"
     
  13. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Oh. In that case, if Ryan would lead his WRs then maybe they wouldn't have to come back and force our 6'0 WR into constant jump ball scenarios.
     
  14. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The ball was fully catchable. On a 50 yard throw, that's what you want. It's not productive to obsess about 3 feet of ball placement on a 150 foot throw. Reality isn't what people imagine in their minds. Reality isn't a trick shot video. If you put quarterbacks 50 yards away from a 5 foot wide garbage bin and asked them to drop the ball into it, they're going to miss it at a rate that might alarm you.

    Tannehill placed the ball well enough that no defender was going to get involved in that play. He hit the hole between the corner and the safety and the ball was within range to be caught in-bounds. The problem is that Mike Wallace did not get his head around and locate the football in a timely fashion (note: he does that A LOT) and so by the time he really located the football and saw where it was going, he had to put on the air brakes very suddenly, putting him off balance and resulting in his stepping out of bounds.

    Other receivers if they get their head up and locate the football in a timely fashion, they adjust their speed and run through that catch and many onlookers wouldn't even realize the receiver had done a lot of adjusting on the play.
     
  15. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    I know its a hailmary, but man Id like to see Mike Wallace give a **** and fight Revis for that ball.
     
  16. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    My biggest problem with Ryan Tannehill is the mistake factor. It's just too high. It isn't the same mistakes over and over, IMO. He just keeps inventing new ways to put a fly in the ointment. And I don't think it's a coincidence that in his college and pro career he has a high percentage of 3+ turnover games.

    There are SOME mistakes he seems to make with consistency. One of them continues to be bad decisions with the clock ticking as he's running to the sidelines on a roll-out. You're running to the sidelines, you're probably behind the line of scrimmage, and you know that if you go out of bounds it's basically a sack. But the sideline keeps coming at you because you're rolling toward it. You've got to figure out something to do with the ball before the clock is up. In that situation he seems to have a consistent tendency to panic and make a bad choice. We've seen repeated bad mistakes in that situation.

    The only other bad tendency I think is somewhat consistent is his tendency to eye-bang his receivers before he throws it.
     
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  17. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    Do you think this is because of how raw he is? That a lot of what he sees when he looks at the defense is still new to him?
     
  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Doesn't strike me as that. I think it's a concentration issue.

    Not saying he can't become a great player. He could be a great player and still have this same mistake factor. Other things could improve. The fit and chemistry and talent level of the players around him could improve. The system could certainly improve. But he's probably always going to have a brain fart factor that keeps him from being consistently elite.
     
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  19. Shamboubou

    Shamboubou Well-Known Member

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    Also, if your going to have your QB miss a deep pass you would want it to be short. That gives you a chance to make the catch, PI call, or just an incomplete. If you overthrow the guy, all you get is the incomplete pass. Your WR should be able to adjust to the ball in the air and at least give a good fight to protect you from the INT. I dont care if he has to horsecollar the guy and pull his helmet off a the same time to do it. There is no reason a player just quits on a pass like that.
     
  20. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That's exactly right. I've heard Chad Pennington and others talk about it as well.

    If you overthrow by 5 yards...incomplete.

    If you overthow by 5 feet...incomplete.

    If you overthrow by 5 INCHES...incomplete.

    But you can underthrow a guy by 5 yards and he might still catch the thing.
     
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  21. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think Ryan just has to throw the football without trying to hit the guy in stride and just put some whip behind the throw and move on, whatever happens happens, it's probably in his head now and he's trying to take something off or aim, if you overthrow it so be it, better to do that then under throw..
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I cannot come up with any objective justification for the above statement.
     
  23. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    In the Bills game, EJ Manual severely underthrew his wide receiver. Some of that was due to the ball getting caught in the wind. It looks like it was underthrown at least 5 yards. Wide receiver adjusted, scored a touchdown.

    If he overthrew him, that touchdown would be impossible. I find it hard to believe that an incomplete pass is better than a touchdown.
     
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  24. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That's what I think. I understand that an underthrow risks an interception, especially a severe underthrow. But an overthrow risks an interception in some situations too, especially a severe one.
     
  25. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Back shoulders aside, you think the under throw in this particular case would be more effective than letting Wallace catch up to it?
     
  26. Rhody Phins Fan

    Rhody Phins Fan Well-Known Member

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    He means that literally overthrowing him is worse than under throwing because an overthrow is an incomplete pass that was too far. An under throw still gives the wide receiver a chance to catch it.
     
  27. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    I will speak for CKParrotHead, that a vast majority of the time, hitting a wide receiver in stride is better than both over throwing and under throwing.
     
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  28. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    My caveat was saying "in this particular case", meaning Wallace's skillset?

    Im not sure what were debating here, I'm saying we've seen some results of some under throws with this particular player, I don't think Ryan is letting it go 100 percent power because I think he's trying to hit the guy in stride, so my point is, I would suggest to Tannehill if I was his coach, to just set his feet, find his spot, and let it rip, I mean the guy obviously doesn't like to slow his roll or compete in the air, so lets see if he can find another gear when the balls in the air.
     
  29. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If Wallace can catch up to it then I think by definition it's not an overthrow...
     
  30. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    Tannehill said today that he's been told to let it rip on deep balls. It looks like they've finally started to address it.
     
  31. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Tannehill has definitely shown more of a comfort level with the 50 yard ball than the 55 yard ball when it comes to hitting Mike Wallace. By telling him to let it rup they're telling him to go with the 55 yard ball. But people might discover that's not such a great thing if the 55 yard ball ends up overthrown, like the one against Cleveland.
     
  32. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    All True except.....

    First of all, the pass traveled 44 yards in the air. Second of all, it was thrown toward the sideline because he was nervous about the safety help. Third of all, that makes it a bad throw.

    he just throws it, without trying to be so perfect...he hits him in stride. OR..he is terribly inaccurate on deep balls.
     
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  33. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Panic under pressure. New ways to make mistakes (to me that is mental/emotional lack of mastery as opposed to technical). And locking onto receivers (in fact, I rarely if ever in that video saw him look at more than half of the field. If he started off looking left he MAY come back to the middle of the field at MOST... if he started off looking right, he never made it back past midfield with his head. Half field at a time. Safeties must love playing us)

    Also, he looks left 5x as much as he looks right, where Wallace is. Probably a combination of being more comfortable making throws to his left mechanically/habit-wise, and also Hartline and Matthews seem to have more of his trust than Wallace.
     
  34. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Don't be surprised if his INTs creep up too. If we finish the year at near a 1:1 TD:INT ratio I'll be very concerned.
     
  35. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Unless that receiver is Mike Wallace. Then it is...

    If you overthrow by 5 yards...incomplete.

    If you overthow by 5 feet...incomplete.

    If you overthrow by 5 INCHES...incomplete.

    If you underthrow 5 yards... intercepted.
     
  36. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    In other words..it is either his Brain...or his mastery of the game.

    This is where having so little experience at playing QB comes in.
     
  37. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm going to go with mastery of the game. I haven't seen anything yet were his brain appears to be an issue.
     
  38. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Well, the lack of experience clouds your ability to decisively diagnose if this is a fixable issue or a more-likely permanent one.

    This is why you prefer more starts in college.

    It's expensive to delay decisions in the NFL.
     
  39. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    [video=youtube;k56aIsZ3hOo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k56aIsZ3hOo[/video]

    here... in case that anybody is under the impression that Mike Wallace never adjusted for balls or adjusted his stride to run under balls.
     
  40. Rhody Phins Fan

    Rhody Phins Fan Well-Known Member

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    Well then screw him for not doing that in Miami. He is one of my least favorite players I've seen in a Dolphins uniform. His lack of effort on most of these contested balls is incredibly frustrating.
     

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