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Fins interested in UCONN DB Butler

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Lane1974, Mar 7, 2009.

  1. Lane1974

    Lane1974 New Member

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    among other tidbits

    http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/columnists/barry-jackson/story/938301.html
     
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  2. GISH

    GISH ~mUST wARN oTHERS~

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    interesting to say the least. id prefer we take a corner with our 2nd pick. we need to take the biggest strongest player available at 25, IMO.
     
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  3. emeraldfin

    emeraldfin All I've got is insane

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    Would prefer Alphonso Smith myself.

    Has great instincts and a sharp ball hawk.
     
  4. FinFan_Est.1984

    FinFan_Est.1984 Get Aggressive!!!

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    Darius Butler

    http://www.walterfootball.com/pro2009dbutler.php"]http://www.walterfootball.com/pro2009dbutler.php[/URL]
     
  5. BrazForPhins

    BrazForPhins From south

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    interesting

    I think the FO is trying to snag a guy like McFadden not only because we need CB help, but because it would make our draft much more unpredictable too.
     
  6. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Sean Smith comes to mind, but we also need a #3 Cb who is quick to handle the slot?

    Butler is a smaller Cb, he'd be a great #3, we also need a #2 who is more durable.
     
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  7. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

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    i think he will be there at 44 but we need taller CB Jason Allen is the tallest one at 6-1 and cant cover any one so i think we should go with sean smith if he is there at 44

    1 Hakeem Nicks
    2a Sean Smith/ Darrius Bulter
    2b Ron Brace if available
     
  8. late again

    late again Senior Member

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    One thing that will help Smith's stock here is that he can return kicks. (Alphonso Smith, that is)
    And it's highly doubtful Alphonso Smith will make it out of the 1st round
     
  9. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    I'm a bit surprised the interest in Cody Brown. He is a very talented player, can set the edge and has good strength but he takes many plays off. I've compared him to Brian Orakpo in the past, a top five seleciton in the draft. They both watch plays when they are away from them. I wouldn't be shocked to see them be more intrigued in Julius Williams, whose a second day selection. Williams has been called the strongest player on the team by coachse and he plays with strength on the field. He's blown up double teams with brute strength in the past and he also displays good quickness off the edge. He's not as talented as Brown but he does more with less (talent).

    The management going after McFadden is interesting to me. He's been banged up a lot and the management is usually strict about that. They also re-signed Channing Crowder, whose had knee issues in the past, and they've shown interset in Kevin Burnett who had seven surgeries in college on his knees I believe. Maybe they're letting up on that.
     
  10. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    One other thing on Julius Williams, many times on third downs UCONN would slide Brown over to left defensive end and move Williams down to DT or even NT when they went with a 3 man line. This guy only weighs in 258lbs mind you, and he's asked to play the nose on occasion. And he can hold his own and still split the double team on the inside.
     
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  11. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    Yep, your correct. That's where I saw him blow up the double team with brute strength that I referred to. I believe on the play - can't remember against who it was - he gave a quick outside jab step, moving the Guard laterally and then bulrushed back into the interior to the Center. The Guard recovered on the play but he went through the both of them for a sack.
     
  12. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Don't be that surprised Alen, things boil down to a numbers game, it's hard for a player to break through that game.

    Is Cody Brown that much better then Larry English physically? Probably not, however if given a chance either player could develop, that is the way the NFL works, taking plays off is not as serious as coming up short athletically.



    Derry Beckwith is or may be the "new" Kevin Burnett.
     
  13. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    What does Larry English have to do with Cody Brown? Random.

    Correct but my belief is that you can't change how a person has done something over a long period of time and watching Brown, he's often taken off plays. I'd rather take a guy whose going to bust his *** every play than a guy whose going to take plays off and think he can get by it.
     
  14. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Extremely underrated player.
     
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  15. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Is Cody Brown that much better than say Lawrence Sidbury? I'd say Sidbury's ceiling may be higher when looking long term.
     
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  16. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    Love Sidbury. He's a good looking player and an underrated one.
     
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  17. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Comparisons between the two, objectively does it matter that Brown had 2 sacks against a scrub tackle at Harvard? Does it matter that English owned some Tackle from SW Missouri?

    Not really, what is looked for is athletic explosion and upside.

    For example, that is why Caleb Campbell was taken over Kendall Langford.

    What we are lacking is a DE who can prush so Roth or whomever can also prush...

    As for Butler, from what I've seen, he is a competitive smaller Cb who if given a chance would not tackle a shoe, but who is also very very quick.
     
  18. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    :hi5:

    The thing about Sidbury is he plays out of control sometimes to make an impression, I would not give him a gap responsiblity and expect him to handle it just yet...


    Guy I like is Pierre Walters, last year it was Bryan Johnston from Gardner Webb.
     
  19. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Draft DeAngelo Smith. He'll put his head in and plays the passing lanes very well for a guy only 5'10''. he may time at a 4.5, but he plays faster than that.

    He lead the Conference I think, with 8 INT's as a Junior. Mike Mickens gets the pub, but Smith is a better all rounder.
     
  20. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    Would they really just pick one OLB though in a lower round? I doubt they pass up a front-line guy again this year.
     
  21. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    You say it does not matter but you constantly bring up the level of competition.

    I'm aware what is looked for and I think that Larry English has more explosion than Cody Brown. He has more explosion, quickness, better motor as well. We go over this with every player it seems.
     
  22. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Mentioned that about 2 months ago and got scorched...:lol: (undersized, avoids contact, runs around blockers etc)

    to me, he takes good angles in pass coverages, his drops are really good and he knows how to clog a passing lane.
     
  23. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Oh yeah, he's a one way guy right now, but projecting him down the line his length is intriguing.

    Walters has the measurables, but you have to examine the competition too at Eastern Illinois.
     
  24. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    IMO, player pros do not overthink things, objectively, we scouted Don T heavily last year, so we know what Thomas thinks of Butler and Brown, there is no such sound board for English.

    Now specualtively, what about English playing ILB?

    Do you think he can man that position? Every Admitted weakness for English would become a strength on the inside...nice fist step, good motor, does he recognize plays quickly? Drop back into Zones quickly?
     
  25. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    I appreciate the info. and I am an addict for any tidbits and rumors, true or false, but the thing is that we'll be hearing millions of these types of rumors and speculation between now and draft time. Take them with a grain of salt or whatever. :)
     
  26. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Sidbury is a beast, but you can tell on the halfway plays that he played down at Richmond, but can play standing, but when an option/drop back/Cover flat happens he tries to fly to the ball in fast forward, he hasn't learned to drop back and read and react as of yet.


    He's carrying a UDFA grade at the moment, he could be the type of player Ireland takes a shine to, or he could end up in St Louis as a UDFA because he has a better shot with the Rams then to fight through Roth and Wake in Miami.
     
  27. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    That's true but they probably have some connections out there. Team scouts build long-lasting friendships and get other connections and it gets to a point where you know so many people that you have a good grasp of knowledge on a large amount of these players.

    Haven't really thought about it to be honest. I think that you would be taking away his strength, his qiuckness, and possibly limiting his potential. I think he has good lateral speed to pursue after ball carriers and get sideline to sideline but he hasn't dropped much in coverage from what I recall. I'm not at home so I don't have my notes with me but watcihng him, I don't recall him dropping much in coverage if any at all.
     
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  28. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    True, we took a guy in the 6th and he was Day 1 starter, UConn's is a fertile ground for us now, maybe HI as well.


    ILB's who can stuff and read and react and also get outside to make plays are what Defenses are built around, sort of a stand up DT who can also go sideline to sideline...THAT is a Tuna ILB.
     
  29. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. That's the part of his game that he needs to work on the most, IMO.
     
  30. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    1) I wonder if Parcells/Ireland wouldn;t prefer an overachiever to an underacheiver anyways. Shows harder work ethic.

    2) Williams shows at 6-2 263. Great size.

    3) DOnald Thomas should be able to personally attest to whether Williams is hard to block, and how he plays against O-linemen. The same way Ferguson was able to tell SParano how good Thomas was from having to practice against him every day, Thomas practiced against Williams... so has first-hand experience with the boy;s abilities.

    He could be a second day gem who finds his way into a back-up relief role for Matt Roth.
     
  31. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    It's not Roth that I think he might take over for. It's someone else.

    Akin Ayodele's cheap successor?
     
  32. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Oh, well. I just couldn't deal with that. How could you think to replace a player like Akin? That's sheer luncacy. Who could possibly measure up.



    Translation: Great idea. Especially if he plays with strength and leverage... send him up the gut for some inside pressure.
     
  33. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    There's something that a team has to gain to be able to take it to the next level. Currently this team is solid 3-4 in that it has few holes (please let's not talk about #2 CB for just one day). However it also has very little pressure in the middle, with Ferguson, Crowder, Ayodele, and even Torbor non-existent in the pass rush. While OLBs and DEs are your main threats for that you must be able to flush the QB to the side and make him feel uncomfortable. For this reason I've been obsessed with finding players capable of taking all responsibilities of the ILB, including superior stack-and-shed ability as well a strength.

    Clint Sintim is another guy I could see being a monster at this. Rey-Rey is number one. I'm not just looking for a strong ILB like a Larry Foote. I'm looking for a thumper that can also cover decently well in a zone. I was hoping that we'd even try a slimmed down Matt Roth in that role but he's too much of an asset at LOLB on first and second down and he probably doesn't have the ability to go to the sidelines.
     
  34. FinFan_Est.1984

    FinFan_Est.1984 Get Aggressive!!!

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    I have to agree with you Jaj. All this talk about Corner's, which we do need but can be addressed in the later rounds. This is not what takes priority, for me at least. We need to shore up the front especially the middle in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Maualuga, Stintim and Brace would be heaven in that order.

    As far as Corners go Domonique Johnson from Jackson State has the speed and size we should look for in a CB. He has been compared to a Rodgers-Cromartie. He may be had in the 4th round.

    http://www.nfldraftdog.com/Small%20School%20Football/studs_for_the_2009_NFL_Draft.htm
     
  35. Boomer

    Boomer Premium Member Luxury Box

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  36. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Larry English could not play ILB.
     

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