Former Husky Donald Thomas Ready To Resume His Rise
Nice to see that he's doing all he can to get back in there. I think he is the key to the O-line this year.
But this doesn't sound too promising:
If he misses any time, I hope it's only a week or two, as we'll really need him ready to go for that first game against the Falcons....
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Well, if this makes sense, D Thomas's injury and absence is allowing Sparano and Gugs to develop other Guard prospects like Frye and Berger and Lewis and Alleman.
Last season Thomas's injury really left us short handed, with Alleman being a street FA pick up, this season they have a chance to develop a couple of players and see who is the best out of the group to play backup Guard.
IMO, Alleman could surprise this preseason, he is a player with the physical tools, he has had a full season as a Phin and in the weight training program as well as all of the OTA's, if Alleman can play for us or not, we will know as he has no excuse not to be playing well.gunn34, cnc66, PhinsRock and 1 other person like this. -
Hard for an offensive lineman to play with an ailing pectoral muscle. He needs all his upper body strength and conditioning to be 100%. His timing with the other o-linemen won't come back without a full camp. Better to let him heal, go with one of the other guys, and let him work his way back in some time in mid-season.
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Had he progressed somewhat throughout the season in '08, I'd agree with you. But I saw nothing from him last year at all to have any confidence in him this year. I really hope he doesn't prove to be the best of the bunch of Frye and Berger because if so I think we're going to have the same problems we had last year running inside. -
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I know that he looked promising last year,but that's all we can say as fans.
The real issue will be if "the others" can step up to the plate at RG.I personally can't count on DT to be healthy.Even if he is,has he shown anyone that he can man the position long term? It remains to be seen.Stay tuned.... -
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I agree with those who think we shouldn't expect a healthy, contributing Donald Thomas until mid-season.
On a side note, I see the Pats signed Al Johnson, who played Center for us a bit last year. I wouldn't doubt that Belichick has Johnson explaining every detail of the Wildcat plays and blocking scheme as we ran it in 2008.
No matter, our plays and blocking will be different this year. It does, however, mean that we'll have to change stuff up a little more. Including our calls and signals, but that's probably standard practice anyways. -
As far as Thomas goes, both of his injuries (over the past 2 years) can have a negative impact on his play even after he gets back on the field. I don't want him out there until he's ready, if that means that he starts the season on the sidelines, so be it. Coming back isn't good enough, coming back at 100% is what he should be shooting for. I wonder how much a young player, who is worried about losing his starting job, will try to hide from the medical staff in order to get back out on the field.PhinsRock likes this. -
Thomas will return to start the season
there is plenty of depth on the offensive line -
Ndukwe is below average
Alleman is below average
Andrew Gardner and Nate Garner have yet to see the field in a real game.
Berger is a journeyman player who has never even been average enough to stick on a team.
Brandon Frye is another who may or may not be good, but nobody knows yet. What we do know is that he's in his 3rd year and he has yet to see any significant action where he has shown he can be a good lineman.
If D. Thomas turns out to be good and plays, then yes, we have a solid starting OL. But beyond starters it's a bunch of below average or unproven players. Plenty of depth, I do not see.
A couple of praising words from post practice interviews by the coaches isn't enough to sell me on these guys. -
Heck Faneca and Kendall (or whomever) are still out and about as UFA's if they don't like Berger, Quinn, Frye at RG, or if they don't feel Thomas will be back in time for the season. -
It seems to me we moderately addressed the OL backup situation this offseason. Not with anyone high profile, but they at least brought in a couple more bodies and who knows, maybe our strength & conditioning program and OL coach can get these guys up to snuff. That's what I hope for. Heck, our best pickup this offseason just might be the new OL coach.
And I agree Thomas shouldn't come back until he's fully recovered and ready to be a mauler. -
the Orca-5 will eat defense alive
I believe by the end of the 2009 season our Offensive Line will be recognized as one of the best in the NFL & is destined to enter the books with the likes of the RedSkin's infamous Hogs because:
1) we have the best set of BookEnds in the NFL: Long & Carey
2) we acquired a top-tier NFL veteran Center during the off season upgrading significantly the position
3) we have two outstanding guards & excellent back-up depth for 2009
4) Coaching & development:
(A) Bill Parcells is the power House of the trenches. wherever he has established a team, he has assembled powerful Offensive & Defensive Lines.
(B) Our Head Coach is an Offensive Line Coach. He made his bones @ both the university level & in the NFL as a premier Offensive Lines Coach. Tony knows the Offensive line.
(C) The firing of Maser & hiring of Guglielmo. Coach G. was the Assistant Lines Coach for what is arguably the top Offensive Line in the NFL, the NYGiants. They will be coached up exceeding all expectation.
(D) there exists a template to build upon: 1. size & strength 2. character (they like leaders, especially team captains) 3. history: they trace them from their HS days playing football. 4. Consistency, love of game, team players that buy into a system & a willingness to work hard & through injuries.
(E) the front line has been assembled after diligent research. the home work was done. the Orca-5 have earned the stamp of approval of the Trifecta. Both Ireland & Sparano talk with great enthusiasm about what the Orca-5 will present to the league in 2009. With the obvious support of the Silent One behind it all.
Where's the problem? -
I appreciate your enthusiasm, but I would caution not to get too carried away. :wink2: -
Stats guru says Miami Dolphins did well with signing of Jake Grove
With training camp opening Aug. 1, ESPN stats guru KC Joyner, whose analysis we often share here, gave us insight into the Dolphins' additions, plus an alarming Joey Porter statistic:
• Joyner's metrics reinforce that Miami got the better of the center swap with Oakland. (Miami signed Jake Grove, then traded Samson Satele to the Raiders for a sixth-round pick.) On running plays where Grove was at the point of attack in 2008, he had an exceptional 90.6 win percentage. That means 90.6 percent of the time, the defender that matched up against Grove did not stuff the hole or make contact with the runner at or behind the line of scrimmage. Those runs averaged 6.2 yards.
By contrast, Satele's win percentage was 79.5 percent, and runs behind him averaged 5.4 yards. Grove's success rate is among the NFL's best and higher than any Dolphins lineman in 2008. Grove also allowed just 1.5 sacks (both coverage sacks), Satele four.
I am concerned about injuries though.54Fins likes this. -
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L2G vibes are grounded in reality, IMO. We can be homers and make wishful statements as fact all day long, but it is still only wishful thinking. Until we actually SEE it on the field, it needs to be viewed with caution. Grove may be a tremendous inprovement over Sampson, and I hope he is, but history says he is an injury risk.. riding the bicycle doesn't win games. We have offensive line depth, but just how good IS it.. when the bullets were flying, some of those guys that are being considered quality backups were being mauled.
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It's beautiful baby..can you dig it?Stringer Bell likes this. -
That means 90.6 percent of the time, the defender that matched up against Grove did not stuff the hole or make contact with the runner at or behind the line of scrimmage. Those runs averaged 6.2 yards.
Grove's success rate is among the NFL's best and higher than any Dolphins lineman in 2008.
If Grove got pushed back it happened less than most other centers and/or his opponent didn't touch the runner or fill the hole. That's basically Grove's job and in comparison to all the other centers in the league he was among the best. I can't think of a better definition for top tier than that. -
As for being pushed around and somehow that's a positive, I don't buy it. On a passing play the goal is to keep defenders away from the QB, basically protect the pocket and give your QB (offense) time for plays to develop. If a guy is being bullrushed into the backfield, that's not top tier IMO, regardless with whether or not the defender was able to make a play. When you look at the Atlanta game clip that I posted before, Grove missed key blocks and was pushed around far too much for a guy who is supposed to be a top tier C. ck also took a look at that game and this was his take...
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You seem to believe that a top tier center never gets beaten but I'm sure that's not true. I remember seeing Dwight Stevenson get bull rushed on a few occassions and he's the best center I've ever seen.
And I don't expect him to be better than he was b/c he's a Dolphin. The stats show that he was the second best center in the league last year (to Mangold). If he replicates that then I will be very pleased regardless of what Raider fans think.
Actually the fan thing cuts both ways. First I don't find most fans to be particularly knowledgeable so those opinions are considered with a grain of salt anyways. But further some players become fan favorites and can do no wrong while others are demonized and can do no right. That demonization can occur for a variety of reasons. Sometimes the player is slow to develop or he just makes an obvious mistake. Whatever the reason that player is never treated objectively by the fan base again. -
What do they matter? Head to head, Grove outplayed Jason Brown last season.
As for "well he missed X number of games" that same logic should then disqualify Ronnie Brown, or whomever missed games due to injuries and it should be pointed out that missing games in the past does not mean the pattern will continue in the future, for proof, Pennington played all 17 games last season, by averages he should have missed games...right? -
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You know what that was, padre? That was the point sailing past your head. :tongue2:
The point being that in order for him to be effective and considered a top tier player, he needs to be out on the field making plays. If he's sitting on the sidelines, his ability is completely irrelevant.
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So how can any team rely on Peterson or Brown then? That would seem to be your "point", a injury plagued player should never be allowed to start for the 'Phins.
This inspite of Y Bell, Penny, Ronnie, Rickey, all playing 17 games, based on their injury histories they should have never played here..
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Another way to put it, my negative vibes are better than your homer-eroticism. :pointlol: -
And there is the fact that Grove played on some real garbage Raiders teams, it's a unpretty fact that players can and do give up on seasons or are in no hurry to return, we finished 07 with 15 players on IR for a reason.
As for Marty's view, I don't see why downgrading our own players before Training Camp even begins, sheesh, what are we Jets fans or something?
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