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Free Agents/ Breakout Season Candidates

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Phoenician Fan, Jan 29, 2014.

  1. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Who do you think are the free agents out there that are likely candidates to take it to the next level with a new team next year?

    I'm not talking about the established starters. I'm talking more about guys like say.......guys like Randy Starks was when we signed him.

    For example:
    I loved the little bit we saw of the Steelers NT/5-tech Al Woods last year. Because of injuries Al saw some time at NT for the Steelers, and he flourished. Al is a freak athlete with 36 inch arms, a sub 5.0 40 and a 37 inch vertical. Woods was obviously slow to grow up. It appears he is taking things seriously now. Maybe he is the next Randy Starks.

    Maybe our own Nolan Carroll will nab a starting gig and take it up a notch from solid to good?

    Which ones should be targeted by the Dolphins?

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/01/07/2014-pff-free-agency-tracker/

    What about former Hurricane OT Jason Fox?
     
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  2. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    John Jerry will be a good guard in a man blocking scheme IMO.
     
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  3. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    I agree Jerry could go from mediocre to good in the right situation if he is able to fully motivate himself.

    Guys like Jerry and Soliai frankly, scare the crap out of me. They aren't 100% effort guys and I wouldn't give a long term contract to either of them. One thing Jeff Ireland did do right IMO was never giving Paul Soliai a long term deal.

    But anyway, Jerry is an established starter. We're looking for the up and comers here; the rotational and spot duty young guys who are just starting to show.

    Does anyone remember Jason Fox playing for Miami?
     
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  4. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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  5. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    Just looking at running backs...

    Andre Brown
    Ben Tate
    Knowshon Moreno
    Phillip Tanner
    Toby Gerhart

    With the exception of Moreno, all relatively low mileage, who have been riding the bench behind the #1 guys. Tate did split carries with Foster lately (he's in the Michael Turner mold as far as it's now his time). I've always liked Andre Brown but he has a history of getting hurt.
     
  6. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Cincy's Vincent Rey at linebacker please.
     
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  7. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    restricted. Dakoda Watson is more likely.
     
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  8. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    Is Toby Gerhart a FA? That dude runs harder than anyone the Dolphins have on their roster.
     
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  9. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    Al Woods would be one of my top guys as well. He won some Steelers people over down the stretch this season - maybe not as a full-time 'don't draft a NT' kind of guy, but he was definitely solid. Sadly, I doubt the Phins will get a shot at him. He loves it here in Pittsburgh, just had a kid as well, I believe.

    - Jason Worilds has the best chance at jumping into the top-10 at his position. Pittsburgh just started figuring out where to play/rotate their OLB rushers at the end of the year, and Worilds got in a serious groove.

    - Stevie Brown could launch himself big time coming off injury.
    - Manny Sanders was playing great ball down the stretch this year. He'll be a big contributor for whomever he ends up with (I think he'll thrive if he stays with the Steelers, who are going to run no-huddle almost entirely).
    - Does Alterraun Verner count? He'll be considered a star by this time next year, imo.
    - Linval Joseph is going to turn some heads with the contract he'll ultimately get, imo. Could be more than Starks/Soliai given his age.
    - And you just KNOW one of the RBs is going to go off as the feature guy on some new team. My bets would be on James Starks and Anthony Dixon.
     
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  10. Clark Kent

    Clark Kent Fighter of the Nightman

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    Moreno has pretty low mileage... He didn't even really play much in his career until last year. All purpose RB too. Can run, catch, and block.



    Evan Dietrich-Smith, C, Green Bay Packers. Obviously the GB connection. He's young and still improving as a player. Cheaper alternative to Alex Mack. Kicks Pouncey to G where his athleticism can be on full display.
     
  11. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    you're saying Watson is more likely to break out than Rey?
     
  12. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    You guys are getting into a whole different arena with top tier free agent discussion.

    If we do sign a top tier free agent or two, it will most likely be offensive linemen, and that's a different thread.

    I agree with Toby Gerhart. He is exactly the kind of guy the Dolphins should sign IMO. Trade Daniel Thomas for a 6th or 7th, if we could get even that. Gerhart is way better, and he won't break the bank. Dolphins could offer him the right to compete for feature back and at least a significant number of snaps every game.
     
  13. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    How the Hell does a guy like this go undrafted? This is just another reason why I believe the vast majority of pro scouts are lazy jagoffs who just follow media hype and don't do much real work.
     
  14. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    no, I thought you listed Rey as a guy Miami should target.
     
  15. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Identity player, need those in this market.
     
  16. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    He has the physical tools.

    The problem is he currently is not a good guard in any scheme. He lacks motivation in Miami.

    He is one of those players who tends to mature when he is forced to be let go by a team and goes to another team - having been humbled, developed some maturity and then, out of the blue, he is playing really well - with some more mature players and a better team atmosphere around him.

    It is not at all likely he will flourish in Miami.
     
  17. BuckeyeKing

    BuckeyeKing Wolves DYNASTY!!!!

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    I like Toby. Decent power back but struggles with fumbling.
     
  18. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Schwartz and Asomoah on KC are both talented but different types of players (one goes 340 the other 305). Beadles dropped off this year but he also fits (as does Asomoah) well for a zone blocking scheme. However, his inconsistency year by year is a red flag. That said he's still in his 20's (as are Schwartz and Asomoah).

    At OT there are several potential candidates if their team does not either franchise or sign them prior to hitting the market: Monroe, Collins, Albert, and Saffold are all still in their 20's and O-linemen can often last into their mid-30's.

    I think the first order of business is to rebuild the entire offensive line. At this juncture I would approach the off-seasons with the idea of only one fixture. Both starting OT's are gone. The LG spot has no legit starter and the RG is average and has a questionable maturity and work ethic; plus does not likely fit the zone scheme Miami will be using.

    So, basically, Miami has to look at rebuilding the entire OL and given the play of last year, that has to be a priority. The other priority has to be maintaining key cogs from the D who could leave via free agency: 1) Brent Grimes; 2) Soliai; 3) Starks; 4) Carroll; 5) Clemons. I would hope we could sign a couple of those (at least one of the DTs) and then franchise Grimes if necessary.

    After that, if Hickey wants to really improve the team he has to go after O-linemen in free agency and the draft. He doesn't need makeshift players there but bonafide starters.
     
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  19. ConvenientTruth

    ConvenientTruth Member

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    I would be shocked if Asamoah doesn't hit FA as he lost his starting position to Schwartz halfway through the year (not due to bad play, but how well Schwartz was doing). I think he would be a nice fit in Miami offense and hope Hickey makes a hard play for him.

    Tackles are a little harder and could end being pricey, but one player I think the Dolphins could make a play for is Marshall Newhouse (GB)....I think he could be had at a good price and could take over one of the tackles spots....that if they don't go all in on Albert (as some reports have suggested, Philbin wanted him last season).

    As for the guys on the team...Grimes and Soliai are the only two the teams "needs" to make a play for. the biggest sticking point is age and for Big Paul....his motivation, but I wouldn't be opposed to a 3 year deal for either as long as the team could cut ties with either after year two with little to no cap hit.
     
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  20. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Toby. Great catching the ball, can pick up the block. Was not aware of his fumbling issues. He would be solid, not a threat, but solid.
     
  21. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    I would be vehemently opposed to giving Soliai a three year deal. They might as well send me the money.

    Don't get me wrong. He could be a top three NT in the NFL every year if he wanted to be. I've seen him out there a few times when somebody really pissed him off and he was a world beater. He just wasn't capable of ever getting up, and staying up for games, and now, he is getting old.

    Grimes is going to get a big fat contract. If Grimes is going to stay a Dolphin it will cost us dearly. It will mean sacrificing quality and/or depth at other positions.
     
  22. ConvenientTruth

    ConvenientTruth Member

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    I would only sign Soliai if the was an out after two seasons...the guy has some value and is a space eater. The biggest issue is if you let both go....you have two guys to replace and finding a guy with Soliai's size and experience at his position is one of the harder things to do as a GM. Then again, having a smaller guy who can penetrate could open things up on the defense.

    If I had any faith in one of the two rookies to step up and take over on the CB positions then I would have no problem moving on from Grimes, but as neither have even shown any promise I wouldn't make that gamble.
     
  23. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Thee...Ohio State University
    Maybe not for Miami, but Dane Sanzenbacher has that Danny Amendola like breakout potential

    Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk
     
  24. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Yes! I would definitely sign a quality veteran CB; however, Grimes had a phenomenal year, and he was elite previous to the achilles injury, so he has a huge contract coming from somebody. My guess is that we don't franchise him because our rookie GM doesn't want to wage a media war with Miko during Brent's holdout. Brent has already come out publicly and disdained the tag.

    I predict the Eagles will hotly pursue Brent Grimes. They are cap rich and CB poor. Grimes is from Philly. We could lose him.

    There are plenty of options though.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    It's possible. I wouldn't bet on it but he has always had potential if he could get his head on straight and get serious. Sometimes these OLs just keep aging well until they're too old...but they're not where you want them to be within the first two or three years and so they weren't necessarily good draft picks, but they end up good free agent acquisitions.
     
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  26. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    You think our GM is going to say, "no we aren't going to franchise him because we don't his wife getting pissed"?

    Seriously?
     
  27. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I haven't really begun my round of tape watch on free agents. You guys are giving me some great names to start with.

    I like doing it. I honestly sometimes find it easier than scouting college players.

    So I guess I'll be taking a close look at Al Woods, Garry Williams, Toby Gerhart, Vincent Rey, Dekoda Watson, Jason Worilds, Linval Joseph.
     
  28. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I was a huge, huge fan of Stevie Brown a year ago and even would have considered sending a RFA offer sheet to him and giving up a 2nd round pick (not like we did anything worthwhile with those picks anyway). I would absolutely pursue him HARD in free agency. Believe in the player, even if he's coming off an injury. It's not like that injury is a career killer anymore.

    Another safety I like a lot is Major Wright of the Chicago Bears. I've been a big fan of his since he was coming out in the draft.

    I would also consider giving Kurt Coleman a lower money deal and see if he couldn't improve on some of the things that were a problem in Philadelphia, while continuing to show some of the strengths (he creates turnovers).

    I think Sam Shields would be a win as a corner. He's already established so I guess he's not in the spirit of this thread.

    But E.J. Biggers was a guy whose tape with the Bucs impressed me. The Redskins for some reason made him a free safety. That didn't work. This is a guy that Dennis Hickey will be familiar with though and I think Miami might be able to get him on the cheap.

    I agree about Alterraun Verner.

    I also think Dekoda Watson could be a likely candidate for Miami. This is someone that Mark Dominik specifically noted that Dennis Hickey pounded the table for and he's become a good versatile sub player. He could end up more than that, too. I was a big fan of his coming out of the draft. I could see the Dolphins dumping Philip Wheeler and signing Watson in his place.

    I'm not nearly as anti-Soliai as some in here seem to be. Opposite, really. I don't want to lose Randy Starks but I'm pretty sure Randy Starks wants to lose Miami, so I've come to grips with the idea of losing him. I wouldn't want to lose both of them.

    There has been a lot of speculation about trading Dion Jordan to the Eagles for their 1st round pick. It's not based on much. We know that Tom Gamble is a believer in Jordan as a 3-4 OLB. The talk seems pretty persistent. You have to understand that Jordan was a Jeff Ireland call (and perhaps Brian Gaine?) and the elements that made that call are now gone. We don't know what Dennis Hickey thought of Jordan. We do know that Jordan has massively disappointed the coaching staff. You don't need inside information to be able to tell that (although it helps).

    One thing I heard on the inside last year was that the Dolphins were really high on Michael Johnson as a potential free agent acquisition. The Bengals precluded Miami's bidding by putting the franchise tag on him. He's now coming off that tag and who knows if the Bengals will be able to re-sign him. He's not in the spirit of this thread in any way. He's a potential high cost acquisition. But I could absolutely see the idea being backed heavily by both Joe Philbin and Kevin Coyle that they need to ditch Dion Jordan and get what they can for him, and take on a Michael Johnson in his place. I'm not espousing the wisdom of this, I'm looking at what's realistically possible.

    Most of my attention thus far for free agents has been directed at offensive linemen...for obvious reasons.

    Anthony Collins is a guy that I isolated and even created videos for your perusal about way back in 2012. He signed a 2 year, $2.5 million deal to stay with the Bengals and I thought it a big mistake for Miami never to get into the bidding. Well, now his bidding is going to be much higher than that. But how much higher? I think when you've isolated a winner, to some degree you stick with it and don't just move on because he broke out the way you thought he would. There's more meat on the bone with Anthony Collins. He's not going to get "I'm a proven top left tackle" money. He's going to get a mid-sized contract. Buy him for that and I don't imagine being very sorrowful about it.

    Geoff Schwartz is another in the same vein. Another guy several of us actually really liked as a potential free agent acquisition in 2013. He signed a 1 year minimum deal with the Chiefs and Miami never got in the bidding, which was a mistake. I figured Jon Asamoah would be the top paid guard free agent this year, partly because it's such a bare market...but this guy Schwartz actually supplanted him on that line in KC. Again, I doubt you go from having a 1 year minimum deal one year to making $7 million a year the next year. His value has undoubtedly risen...but there is probably still meat on the bone here.

    I had originally isolated Rodger Saffold as a possibility because he's so versatile and may have actually found a natural home at right guard (according to PFF's grading). But now that Jake Long tore his ACL I think there is a possibility the Rams focus on keeping Saffold.

    The Rams had lots of injury protections in Jake Long's contract. Since he ended the year on injured reserve, it's possible they can cut him painlessly. At this point with his medical folder being so thick, he can't expect much money as no team will sign him with the idea of counting on him to start. That would be true in Miami as well. There's no way Miami could count on him to start. They'd have to have essentially a Plan 1A with Jake Long as Plan 1B. But you know...this guy was EXCELLENT in St. Louis this year, and if his career isn't over then the team he's most likely to sign a low money deal with would be the Miami Dolphins. That's the truth. And if you can get him on a very cheap contract I'm sorry, I don't care what you think about it, that's like finding money in your couch cushions.

    I would keep an eye on Jared Veldheer's price tag, since he's also coming off injury.

    Our new offensive line coach just came from the Houston Texans. That means he's very familiar with free agents Wade Smith, Ryan Harris and Andrew Gardner (formerly a Dolphins draft pick). The most likely of these would seem to be Ryan Harris...formerly a 3rd round pick of the Denver Broncos in 2007, drew positive PFF grades with the Broncos in 2008, 2009 and 2010 (very strong positive grade in 2008) but didn't play in 2011 and resurfaced with the Texans in 2012, once again drawing positive grades before drawing some marginally negative PFF grades in 2013. He's a right tackle all the way and Miami needs a right tackle. It's something to keep in mind.

    At tight end, Jeff Cumberland will be a guy that draws Miami's attention I think. This was formerly a guy on my favorites list as a UDFA or late round pick. He's got true wide receiver athleticism on a 6'4" and 250 lbs frame, having run an absurd 4.45 at his pro day at Illinois (which everyone knew was coming because at Illinois he was a WR convert). I don't know that anyone will ever confuse him for a good blocker, but he worked his way up with the Jets from UDFA status to eventually playing 650 snaps per year in 2012 and 2013, which is a starter's workload. He's only produced 1.37 yards per pass snap in 2012 to 2013 but the Jets have had woeful QB play. He did produce 7 touchdowns to his credit in those two years. I like that he created 4 missed tackles on 26 catches. Among the 46 tight ends with at least 20 catches, that ranks #10 (Charles Clay ranks #6 btw). He had the #4 ranked yards per target in that group as well.

    I could be wrong but I think of tailback as sort of a source of pride for Dennis Hickey. It's the position where I think he has the best track record of getting it right. Therefore, I think he's going to want to draft it as opposed to acquire it. I don't see a Toby Gerhart in Miami's future necessarily. But our new OL coach has some experience with Deji Karim. And perhaps more importantly, Hickey has some experience with RB Brian Leonard and FB Erik Lorig...both of whom will be on the market.

    Leonard in particular will appeal to a Joe Philbin because he does damage in the passing game as both a pass catcher and pass protector. Additionally, the Bucs gave Leonard three carries this year in short yardage. He gained 3 yards on 4th & 2, and then twice gained 2 yards on 3rd & 1. In Cincinnati from 2011 to 2012, he had 7carries in short yardage and converted 4 of them. He gained 6 yards on 3rd & 2, he gained 2 yards on 3rd & 1, he gained 5 yards on 4th & 1, he gained 3 yards on 3rd & 1...and then he failed to convert on three different 3rd & 1 situations. In his defense, one of those failed 3rd & 1 situations led directly to the 4th & 1 attempt on which he gained 5 yards.

    The caveat there though is that Leonard could have been in Tampa due to Schiano's influence rather than Hickey's preference, as Schiano coached Leonard in college.
     
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  29. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Yes, really. This is reality. This subject has already been openly discussed by Brent and his wife. They Hate The Idea Of Him Being Tagged Again. They won't take it lying down. They are going to refuse to sign it, and it's not like Miko is shy or reticent when it comes to Brent's career. Brent's awesome year leaves them loaded for bear and you can bet your *** they will raise a ruckus.

    It isn't what the Dolphins need right now. I think the Dolphins will surely make a fair offer, but he may get offered substantially more than fair. In which case I think they will let him go.

    I also expect Hickey to try to sign Nolan Carroll as soon as possible to give the team some leverage in negotiations and stability at the position.
     
  30. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Worst case they would franchise him and say "If you want to hold out and miss a year of your career, thst is your problem."
     
  31. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    I don't like either. I think Biggers is similar to Carroll, if Carroll continues to play like last season. I'd rather have Carroll.

    I think Wright is over rated and has been since he was drafted. Again, id rather have Clemons.
     
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  32. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    I think Charles Tillman is going to be a badazz FS somewhere next year and I hope it is in Miami.

    You couldn't find better veteran leadership anywhere in the NFL and when was the last time the Dolphins had a bonafide playmaker on defense?? Jason Taylor?
     
  33. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    ...Cameron Wake?
     
  34. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    That's what the franchise tag is for, dude. It won't hinder the cap much at all if we franchise him. And, sometimes, the threat of the franchise will get a guy to negotiate a longer term deal that is a bit fairer because they don't want to risk a year where injury could derail them or where they don't perform as well.

    But, the franchise tag makes your observation on Grimes unnecessary fear.
     
  35. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Great rundown!

    Thanks.

    Someone (you?) mentioned Kuhn as a possibility at FB. Don't know if the acquisition of Lazor may change that. Even though Hickey wants his guys I suspect he'll probably work a bit more closely with Philbin / Lazor.
     
  36. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I believe Joe Philbin will push for John Kuhn.

    But he's now got to work together with Dennis Hickey and I could see Hickey trying to convince him that Brian Leonard is a better version of John Kuhn. He might even be right. Leonard has legit athletic ability and that's why he's got such a history catching passes and gaining yards. He's 7 out of 10 from 2011 to 2013 in short yardage. That's about league average, which is to say way better than Daniel Thomas. Leonard will never get confused for being a good ball carrier, I don't think...but neither is Daniel Thomas or John Kuhn.
     
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  37. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Well, he should be a target until we know what Cincy tenders him for.
     
  38. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If he's a restricted free agent then there's like a 0.1% chance that he becomes relevant to Miami. No offense man. I haven't watched him so I haven't had the chance to get excited about him as you have but if he's restricted AND he's good then there is about a zero chance.
     
  39. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Homer. :lol:
    Man, I would have loved to have gotten league average for short yardage plays. Those plays can be huge. Keeps the O on the field, 3 more plays, field position, etc. I hate to think what we did short yardage.
     
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  40. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    I love Michael Johnson but I can't see any way that trading DJ is a realistic possibility.
     

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