Game of Thrones - Season 6

Episode 5 leaked early. I won't post spoilers. Suffice it to say, all stories are moving forward (some faster than others), game pieces moved around the board, and the crescendo moment of the episode was fantastic to put it mildly.

Holy ****. Hold the door.

Overall a solid episode, though I want something to come to fruition with the Arya line. But damn, that ending though. Some feels man. Right when she said it the first time it was like daaaaaaaaaaamn noooooooo!

Anyone else think that shot was in response to this Southpark?

https://youtube.com/watch?v=XjzC2DRgEo4

:sad:

although... must have gif of this.

:sidelol:

That was the saddest death to date.

Hodor, Hodor.

Moving past that though ... apparently the White Walkers are a

weapon of mass destruction created by the children of the forest to combat invading mankind. Curious to see what kind of effect that has on things down the (getting shorter) road. Seems an awful big detail to include if they don't have a plan or need for it.

Minor nitpick. Bravo to Hodor for holding the door ...

but really how far is Meera going to drag Bran before the wights finally break through. It's not like the fog is a physical barrier - thousands of wights could pretty easily track and find her. Oh well, maybe that will be next week, or maybe just left to "fantasy."

"Paul 13 wrote:

:sad:

although... must have gif of this.

:sidelol:

First though

My take on the White Walkers, Bran, Hodor, and the three eyed Raven.

Obviously, the highlight of the entire episode. Every scene had importance to the overall story. Lets start with the White Walkers... Apparently, they're not beings that exist within the world naturally. They were created from men, to kill men, from magic. Magic also appears to be their biggest weakness, if not their only weakness (Dragon Glass and Valyrian Steel).

Even despite getting an origin or sorts for the White Walkers, we don't yet know their motivation. Are they simply mindless killers, executing their mission for which they were created? Or did the Children of the Forrest royally **** up, creating super soldiers that would eventually become "self aware" and evolve into having their own ideologies and culture? Given that they're creating more of themselves, I'd say the latter. I'm not sure how I feel about the origin of the White Walkers... I always liked believing they were natural beings from a distant time, slowly but surely acquiring numbers, and planning their attacks for an agenda that was truly purposeful, beyond just being "evil." Having said that, their origin being rooted in magic, does still leave some interesting possibilities for plot lines. Especially if their endgame motivation is ultimately satisfying, so I won't complain just yet.

Poor, poor Hodor. I was pretty neutral on Hodor as a character. He lacked depth to make him interesting, but I always liked that he was without an agenda, just trying to protect Bran. This season, we've seen a little more character development with the flashbacks/time travel. When I saw his young self transform in this episode, I couldn't help but think of Bran's amazement that "Willis" wasn't always a simpleton a few episodes back. And the conversations with Hodor following played in my head, asking Hodor what happened to him... Ouch. That scene was sad and heart breaking. Bran wargs into Hordor, forcing a future/destiny onto Hordor, for which he never had a choice or understanding of, leaving his mind broken until death.

Magic has a price. That seems to be the most important message to take away from this episode. It's not an all-powerful dues ex machina. GoT has always been about consequences, this is just another reminder.

Now... the problem. I'm worried about the time traveling element. While the 3 Eyed Raven suggested that you cannot change the past, it's apparent that the past can be... I don't know the right word, but tampered with to create unnatural event with echos (literal and figurative) created. Ned Stark hearing Bran before climbing up to the Tower of Joy and now Hodor. What does this mean for the show? Was the 3ER lying? Maybe the past can be altered and he just says it can't be because he knows Bran is mature enough to grasp that power and the consequences just yet. Or maybe he's being honest and the past cannot be changed, but echos can be created and he knows Bran isn't mature enough to grasp that power and the consequences in turn. I'm nervous that this episode that opened a can of worms that might really undermine the plot and endgame.

No doubt that Bran will continue his Jedi training and D&D described the final moments with 3ER and Bran, as the 3ER "uploading" his knowledge into bran at breakneck speed. Too fast for Bran to truly comprehend at the moment I imagine, but the pieces of the puzzle are now in his head to put together. Maybe we'll get more past events. In order to truly understand the White Walkers, I think Bran will have to travel back again. Perhaps we'll get the "Long Night" fight, when the realm banded together to defeat them the first time and in doing so, finally understand their motivation (assuming they have on, besides wanting to kill simply because that's the purpose for which they were created).

edit:

Anyone play the Mass Effect video game series? I feel like there's a lot of parallels between that series and GoT.

"Clark Kent wrote:

My take on the White Walkers, Bran, Hodor, and the three eyed Raven.

Obviously, the highlight of the entire episode. Every scene had importance to the overall story. Lets start with the White Walkers... Apparently, they're not beings that exist within the world naturally. They were created from men, to kill men, from magic. Magic also appears to be their biggest weakness, if not their only weakness (Dragon Glass and Valyrian Steel).

Even despite getting an origin or sorts for the White Walkers, we don't yet know their motivation. Are they simply mindless killers, executing their mission for which they were created? Or did the Children of the Forrest royally **** up, creating super soldiers that would eventually become "self aware" and evolve into having their own ideologies and culture? Given that they're creating more of themselves, I'd say the latter. I'm not sure how I feel about the origin of the White Walkers... I always liked believing they were natural beings from a distant time, slowly but surely acquiring numbers, and planning their attacks for an agenda that was truly purposeful, beyond just being "evil." Having said that, their origin being rooted in magic, does still leave some interesting possibilities for plot lines. Especially if their endgame motivation is ultimately satisfying, so I won't complain just yet.

Poor, poor Hodor. I was pretty neutral on Hodor as a character. He lacked depth to make him interesting, but I always liked that he was without an agenda, just trying to protect Bran. This season, we've seen a little more character development with the flashbacks/time travel. When I saw his young self transform in this episode, I couldn't help but think of Bran's amazement that "Willis" wasn't always a simpleton a few episodes back. And the conversations with Hodor following played in my head, asking Hodor what happened to him... Ouch. That scene was sad and heart breaking. Bran wargs into Hordor, forcing a future/destiny onto Hordor, for which he never had a choice or understanding of, leaving his mind broken until death.

Magic has a price. That seems to be the most important message to take away from this episode. It's not an all-powerful dues ex machina. GoT has always been about consequences, this is just another reminder.

Now... the problem. I'm worried about the time traveling element. While the 3 Eyed Raven suggested that you cannot change the past, it's apparent that the past can be... I don't know the right word, but tampered with to create unnatural event with echos (literal and figurative) created. Ned Stark hearing Bran before climbing up to the Tower of Joy and now Hodor. What does this mean for the show? Was the 3ER lying? Maybe the past can be altered and he just says it can't be because he knows Bran is mature enough to grasp that power and the consequences just yet. Or maybe he's being honest and the past cannot be changed, but echos can be created and he knows Bran isn't mature enough to grasp that power and the consequences in turn. I'm nervous that this episode that opened a can of worms that might really undermine the plot and endgame.

No doubt that Bran will continue his Jedi training and D&D described the final moments with 3ER and Bran, as the 3ER "uploading" his knowledge into bran at breakneck speed. Too fast for Bran to truly comprehend at the moment I imagine, but the pieces of the puzzle are now in his head to put together. Maybe we'll get more past events. In order to truly understand the White Walkers, I think Bran will have to travel back again. Perhaps we'll get the "Long Night" fight, when the realm banded together to defeat them the first time and in doing so, finally understand their motivation (assuming they have on, besides wanting to kill simply because that's the purpose for which they were created).

edit:

Anyone play the Mass Effect video game series? I feel like there's a lot of parallels between that series and GoT.

White walkers were not created by man in the episode I saw

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The time travel thing... just in general... seems like some great shows always use that as a way to explain things in the end. Lost... Fringe... I could go on. It irks me.

"Paul 13 wrote:

The time travel thing... just in general... seems like some great shows always use that as a way to explain things in the end. Lost... Fringe... I could go on. It irks me.

When they start using it to undo characters dying, that sort of thing it tends to derail good shows/books/movies. See the bad stuff never really happened! I thought it worked well with this episode though and worked into the storyline and created a great moment in the show's history.

Couldn't one travel in time and prevent the whitewalkers from being created?

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Damn, 5 episodes in and still no Ian McShane yet.

He must be one of the guys Jon Snow needs to fortify his force.

The 3 eyed Raven told Bran that the past was "written in ink"

Everything that is happening now has already happened. We just saw Bran fry Hodor's brain now, but to Hodor it happened decades ago

Hodor is the only significant character on the show to die heroically, that I can think of.

"Paul 13 wrote:

The time travel thing... just in general... seems like some great shows always use that as a way to explain things in the end. Lost... Fringe... I could go on. It irks me.

I kind of feel the same way (although, I didn't mind with Fringe given the nature of the show). I liked that 3ER/Bran could visit the past as a means of learning and understanding, sort of like a magic history book, but I feel like GoT/ASoIaF took a step too far in the wrong direction. Hopefully they tread lightly.

"Fin D wrote:

Hodor is the only significant character on the show to die heroically, that I can think of.

Ned Stark? He was willing to sacrifice everything to save his children. Mance Rayder in his own way too, but he may not be "significant" enough.

"Clark Kent wrote:

Ned Stark? He was willing to sacrifice everything to save his children. Mance Rayder in his own way too, but he may not be "significant" enough.

Ned Stark did not die heroically.

I think he meant literally doing something heroic in the process of dying. Maybe Jojen?

"BlameItOnTheHenne wrote:

I think he meant literally doing something heroic in the process of dying. Maybe Jojen?

Maybe Jojen. (I'm only saying "maybe" because I can't for the life of me remember how he died)

Ned was doing nothing heroic when he died nor did he die under heroic circumstances. He died an ideological fool, on his knees. He got played.

"Fin D wrote:

Maybe Jojen. (I'm only saying "maybe" because I can't for the life of me remember how he died)

Ned was doing nothing heroic when he died nor did he die under heroic circumstances. He died an ideological fool, on his knees. He got played.

He did sacrifice his ideals to save his children.

Joffrey just reneged on his deal

"Dol-Fan Dupree wrote:

He did sacrifice his ideals to save his children.

Joffrey just reneged on his deal

He was tricked into it though. He had way more power and influence then he realized and could have saved his family. In the end, his actions killed his wife, son, daughter-in-law & unborn grandson while also putting his eldest daughter through torture and his youngest daughter and son on the run for their lives.

His intentions were noble, but he did not die heroically.

"schmolioot wrote:

The 3 eyed Raven told Bran that the past was "written in ink"

Everything that is happening now has already happened. We just saw Bran fry Hodor's brain now, but to Hodor it happened decades ago

We have seen Bran essentially talk to Ned Stark in the past.