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Good post game write up by Wingfield.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by djphinfan, Aug 10, 2018.

  1. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    Save your breath? makes sense that you talk what you type. I'm sure you can't read silently either...lol


    You haven't seen one person condone what RT did? lol

    Too easy:

    Their own HC condoned it for crying out loud. lol...

    Chris Simms condoned it.

    Florio condoned it.

    https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/10/fridays-pftpm-has-ryan-tannehill-florio-jr-more/

    The majority of the Dolphins' beat writers condoned it.

    And next time you can keep waiting. I'm not here to show you things that are readily available to anyone not too lazy to look them up or actually follow the team.
     
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  2. Surfs Up 99

    Surfs Up 99 Team Flores & Team Tua

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    You are a very wise man, Key!

    As for Ballage, in this situation, I think RT dressing him down will end up being a good thing. 1) It will emphasis that not only Ballage, but to everyone that they need to focus and understand their assignments. 2) It isn't like Ballage is alone. We have a strong support system. Guys are competing, but they want to help each other, too. They will lift him up, especially those in the RB room. It will bring everyone closer together. IMO, more focus and a team looking out for each other = a better football team.
     
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  3. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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  4. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    your right about that, but RT is not a leader he has 6 yrs in so you can call him a veteran i guess, coaches than ok i wouldnt have had an issue. you act like RT is a strength on our team but anyone besides dolphin medium says its the weakness of the team amongst other things its time to stop looking through rose colored glasses and see exactly what this team is.

    i understand the hazing and all that none sense my particular comment was rt is not in a position nor has hes excelled enough to make a demanding call of kicking someone out of a huddle. I wish there was video because it could have been his mistake and he could have slid the protection, im on the west coast so i have to wake up at like 3am to see games so i don get much coverage except for this forum a few others and tv.

    So based on the layout i have read/watched about it was uncalled for an he is in no position to do so his career is below avg and below avg qbs shouldn't be yelling at rookies telling them to get out of his huddle, 4 weeks into training camp period.
     
  5. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    once again RT is a dodge dart and rodgers is a lambo, not even in the same category rodgers has every reason to yell at people he wins and wins and wins rt is below .500. But please list your dodge dart for 800k and describe it how you feel it is comparable to the lambo and im sure youll get alot of offers!!!
     
  6. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    if it becomes a good thing then heck yes, but this teams whole moral has been literally kicked down for years and this is not a way to change the culture, juice did his yelling on the sidelines and it was a problem of outbursts so this kind of cry out should not be allowed either.
     
  7. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    And once again your reasoning is that of a 4 year old.

    Which is it? Can a rookie be yelled at or not? Can only HoF caliber QB's yell at rookies? You're all over the place and contradicting yourself in nearly every post.

    For the sake of the rest of the board I'll say this and stop this ridiculous argument.

    The HEAD COACH of the Miami Dolphins and FORMER NFL QB's thought what RT did was the correct thing to do. And to top it off, veterans yell at rookies all the time. You just don't like RT doing it because you don't like RT. So nothing I say will make you objective about any of this.
     
  8. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    ESPN? Do you mean the organization that ranked us dead last in the league and never even mentioned RT? They also said we had the 30th overall best draft....even though our 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders are definite day 1 starters.

    Maybe an ESPN quote would help-

    Fiery leadership.....firm grasp on the team...they aren't bashing the guy at all.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2018
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  9. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    Have you ever been on a sports team in your life? if a guy with below avg talent is trying to tell you something do you usually listen? no? most guys with above avg talent and successful players usually get the right to tell players what to do which rt is neither. But you love for him is clouding the actual facts like usual.

    once asgain please find me anything to back up your facts? you state nfl qb's huh show me, of course gase is going to back RT he always has and always will you provide no examples anything and everythin non dolphin related has been that it was bad form by RT. once again like i said ill wait.
     
  10. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    thats a gase quote nothing about what he did and how espn reacts, you should watch a little nfl live and see how many ex players listed RT actions as bad, not one and i take, not 1 has said they agreed with RT except for gase or anyone associated with the dolphins. I dont take ESPN "columns" as anything, i take what actual big time ex players say, they have been there and in the huddle and has had the stress of the NFL none of us have so usually there take on things football related is pretty spot on.
     
  11. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    exactly every dolphin associated person is not going to bash there team cummon dude be real noone not associated with miami condoned it and you really are listening to a nobody in chris sims, oh maybe in your eyes he was a legit nfl qb too. you sir are down right ridiculous.
     
  12. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    I take it you either skipped my post and yet still want to debate what I wrote in that post, can't comprehend/read very well, don't know who Chris Simms is, or you're just trolling?

    I provided you not only with a NAME of a former NFL QB, but a video where he was saying that RT was right.
     
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  13. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    You said no QB and no one not associated with the Dolphins condoned what RT did? bwhahahh! I showed you exactly that.

    So instead of just admitting that you were wrong you then claim that Simms sucks and his opinion doesn't count. hahaha..

    Man, you need some help.
     
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  14. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    The only ridiculous person in this thread is you. You ramble on like a childish idiot. The only reason not to block you is your posts are good for comic relief.
     
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  15. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy Club Member

    Did I miss something?
     
  16. Redwine4all

    Redwine4all Well-Known Member

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    lol.
     
  17. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    ahhh the club member cronies gotta love em!!!!!!!
     
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  18. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    im still waiting for there article or a video of sims saying this? the fact you take advice and think it matters his opinion from a wash out qb on espn is funny to me. would accept advice from JaMarcus Russel too? and not just how to mix purple sprite?


    all that situation aside


    MR. DAN,

    what i would like to know since you have whole faith in RT what exactly to you is a fail of a season and would be a good season for RT to prove himself? what would allow Miami to keep him and what would constitute in your eyes to let him go?
     
  19. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    I already posted it. You're, once again, not reading my posts and making stuff up. No one is "accepting advice". I don't think you know the definition of many words. Advice? lol.....Simms was OBJECTIVELY giving his opinion and thoughts on the matter. Simms, unlike you, has not allowed a bias to cloud his opinion. You claimed that no one outside of the Dolphins organization and no one without Dolphins ties agreed with what RT did. I showed you a few examples and you still keep saying you're right....lol

    Just. Stop.


    As to your question. It's absurd. "Whole faith"? WTF are you babbling on about? I said a veteran QB yelling at a rookie is pretty much the norm. You have a problem with it because it was RT doing it. Your hatred for RT has blinded you and caused you to exaggerate about other people's opinions. Not only that, you refuse to look at anything objectively and allow that hatred to form your opinions. I think RT needs to play better. I also think he's played really well when he has protection and a running game. You know, like the majority of the great QB's playing today.

    My 3 yr old daughter acts like you when I tell her to go to bed.
     
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  20. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    It doesn't take a crony to point out stupidity.
     
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  21. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    "I showed you a few examples and you still keep saying you're right....lol?" where? you stating someone said something is showing me examples? and plural there was more than 1? all i seen was simms thats 1 person not associated to the dolphins.


    No what im getting at is we see very differently on this RT situation and im getting at i want to know what you think he needs to do to stay on this roster playoff win, make the playoffs go 8-8 what? then when he doesn't do what you think he should i will make a gentleman bet with you, you have to come back to this site and apologize to me and everyone else you have barraded over the last few years how RT is a top tier qb? if the opposite happens then im more the happy to say i was wrong. but im sure those words coming out your mouth will taste like vinegar and you wont do it. im just making a simple bet to squash this thing im not wasting another yr on you to tell me a guy in 13 games has less than 3k yards is an elite qb lol. just plain and simple.

    if RT does not fight for the division and make the playoffs hes gone, 7 yrs and nothing that is more then enough time that most qb's get. however if he wins the division and makes the playoffs that could possibly give him another year. if they go 6-10 again him and Gase are both gone. that is my insight im intrigues to hear yours.
     
  22. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    I didn't state it. I linked a ****ing video of more than Simms you nitwit. lol...

    Anyhow, you're pathetic and irrational. And again, nothing I say can or will change that biased mind of yours so I'm done. Really done this time. Keep flailing and being blind. It's not my job to help you.
     
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  23. bigballa2102

    bigballa2102 Well-Known Member

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    i did not see a link i will go back and check if you did my apologies i will look at them.

    Like i said you cant do it, your incapable of anyone elses opinion being correct thats why you wont take the bet you cant give an outcome because you don't have one you think at 3-13 he will still will have a job and that's fine, im not biased i hope that RT is different than what i know and he does take us 13-3 are you serious? we are all fans and all fans want is wins. once again you proved how naive and irrational you are, you think because your a club member you can attack people when everyone else gets banned for doing that. i guarantee you and i put this on my momma if you and i were at a table your mouth with be a little less slick. so one piece of advice i give to you is talk to everyone as if your sitting at a table with them you don't know me im sure you don't know alot of posters on here and we are all here to voice ARE OWN opinion some will be right some will be wrong but your incapable of being wrong is just sad, to try and downgrade people like your mr holly football god and you sir are right and wrong like everyone else just sad that you cant see it.
     
  24. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    Your "bet" is baseless. I've never claimed that RT is a "top tier" QB. You're lying. And you're lying because you need to lie in order to make RT the villain. As if the entire team hasn't been a mess since RT was drafted. In your world RT is the sole reason for the Dolphins lack of winning. In the real world, RT has played very well when he has had competent play around him. I think RT deserves a chance to play with a competent O-Line, decent run game, and good play calling before he's just dumped into the garbage. Why? Because VERY few QB's in the HISTORY of the NFL have been able to play at an elite level with a crappy team around them.

    Now, keep whining and making up things about how I "berate" people. I treat people the way they treat me. If you can't handle that maybe you should be more respectful.
     
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  25. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    It's really crazy what seems to have happened this past season and a half that Tannehill hasn't played.

    It's like everyone (except RT supporters) forgot how well he played the last time he did play. Guy was borderline elite the last time he was on the field.

    Then we have to watch Jay freaking Cutler play for us last season and I think: "well, there ya go, finally the RT detractors are going to realize what they've been missing and will be clamoring for him next season..."

    Thing is, the opposite happened... the RT detractors are coming out in full force as if he has been playing like a bottom 5 QB these past couple of seasons.

    It's baffling really.
     
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  26. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    I still think Tannehill is average or at best slightly above average, nowhere near elite, even in 2016.

    That 8 game stretch in 2016 people like to reference wasn't "borderline elite" play relative to what other QB's did in their best 8 game stretches. As I've shown before, Tannehill was ranked #12th in passer rating among starting QB's in 2016 whether you use passer rating over the entire season or just over all best 8 game stretches.

    So I think the exaggeration goes in both directions, not just one.
     
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  27. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    I'm talking about what I saw with my eyes, not really stats... most people who support him will say the same.

    Anyway, let's say he really was the 12th rated passer, that's still pretty good and nowhere near bad enough to the point where people should feel the need to criticize him every chance they get.
     
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  28. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think the mistake people make is relying on stats without context. I see the context as Tannehill has had horrible coaching for most of his pro playing career. That first year with Gase was the first time he's had competent coaching. Even that has to be tempered b/c it was still a rookie HC installing a new system. I don't see those last 8 games as just his best stretch amongst a bunch of other equal data points. I see it as the only time in his career that he's had at least average coaching and average support from the rest of the team (most people recognize that it takes time for a new offense to get on the same page). It's not something you average in or write off as an anomaly. It is what should be expected with average coaching and support.
     
  29. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Tannehill looked promising enough during that stretch that he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

    Hard not be excited after how he looked 6-7 games into the Adam Gase era.
     
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  30. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Well that's the great thing about this year. We'll find out if those 8 games were more consistent with random variation for an average or slightly above average QB or if they were indicative of a higher average level of performance due to Gase.
     
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  31. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm excited about this year. I really like Gase and his potential, but I don't think he's been great. At best he's been average, but that's not bad for a first time HC. That's a huge upgrade over what Tannehill has had in his career. When I scouted his play the year before Gase got here, he was playing individually at a top 15 level, but the offense as a whole played much worse. The team stats that people think are individual QB stats have been suppressed by a far below average situation. I expect that most of the people around the country will be very surprised by his production this year. My fantasy draft is today (far too early :no:) and I hope to get Tannehill late.
     
  32. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Gase is the other guinea pig, and a much more important one IMO than Tannehill. It may sound odd but I either want Gase to succeed really well or just bomb and show us we need to replace him. I'm not going to be happy with a potential analysis at the end of the season showing both HC and QB are "average". We've been average for too long.
     
  33. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think we've been below average.
     
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  34. danmarino

    danmarino Winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is. Club Member

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    If Gase is average I don't wan to get rid of him. A HC, especially a rookie HC, needs at least 5 seasons in order to see if he's going to be a keeper. This churning over of HC's by the 'Phins is one huge reason why they've been in the bottom half of the league since Shula retired. I'd rather keep a coach for 5 seasons and find out that he's not the one than keep turning over HC's every 1-3 years.
     
  35. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Hard to say which strategy is best. A cursory look suggests most highly successful coaches show it by year 3.
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/

    Just looking at the first 20 coaches on that list (ranked by total wins.. all have winning records and 200+ games):

    Kept after year 3 and after year 5:
    Shula, Halas, Lambeau, Brown, Schottenheimer, Reeves, Knox, Reid, Parcells, Coughlin, Holmgren, Grant, Gibbs, Cowher

    Fired after year 3 but kept after year 5:
    Noll and Shanahan

    Fired after both years 3 and 5:
    Belichick, Landry, Fisher

    Hard to say what to do after year 3:
    Owen (had a winning record after year 3 but year 3 itself was a losing record.. guy is pre-modern era anyway so we could ignore this.. I just took the top 20 without filtering by era just to get some idea of things)

    So maybe 1 in 10 such coaches you'd keep after 5 years but not after 3. You'd have to compare that to the probability of finding such a coach with the extra 2 years you get each time you fire after 3. You'd also have to know what percentage of coaches kept after 5 years ended up having losing records, etc... I haven't downloaded all that data so I don't know, but it would be interesting to find out which "HC firing strategy" is best.
     
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  36. rafael

    rafael Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I expect to see big strides from both Gase and Tannehill in year 3 (in the system, sort of, for Tannehill), but I also think they will both be much better in year 5 together. In my experience you tend to see a big change in the comfort level at years 3 and 5. I do agree that the coaching turnover has hurt us as a team and Tannehill's development specifically, but we've also had some horrid coaches who didn't merit getting to 5 years.

    IMO Tannehill has elite level accuracy, toughness and work ethic, along with above average arm strength and athleticism, but his bugaboo has been trusting what he sees and letting it rip. I think he sees it so I don't believe it's a processing speed or intelligence thing. I think its a trust thing. Part of that is the constant system turnover and part is that he's a cautious guy. I firmly believe that this is something that will fix itself with time in one good system. I think that if he gets that time (I think injury will be the only thing that prevents it), he'll be a better Alex Smith. I'm talking about the Alex Smith that was a league MVP candidate for most of last season. Smith was always a bit cautious as well. He kind of had to be b/c he has less arm strength so he had to be more precise in his anticipation. It's also more of a limitation in the playoffs against better defenses. So I see Tannehill's ceiling as Alex Smith without the limitations.
     
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  37. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    If the Tannehill detractors keep talking every season about how he needs to prove it this season or he's done, eventually they will be right. At this point, it will probably be 12-15 years into his career, when he retires a Dolphin. I mean, he's been our starter for 6 years, with three different coaching staffs. If he was as bad as you guys think, he'd have been gone years ago.

    It's beyond ridiculous to continue to talk about him as below average, and to criticize everything he does. At this point, it's pure hypocrisy, as no matter what Tannehill does, he gets criticized.
     
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  38. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    A lot of teams are stuck with average QB’s for lengthy periods. All those 6 years prove is that Tannehill is good enough to be a starting QB in the NFL, which for many posters (including me) isn’t good enough.

    What we want is a QB that increases win % relative to what an average QB would do, and Tannehill hasn’t shown that yet. This year really is the year to “prove it”, not to the coaching staff but to the fans who want a SB win sooner rather than later. So for us the benchmark isn’t whether the team keeps him as starting QB but whether there’s clear evidence he’ll make us into a winner.
     
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  39. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    What happened to Fin D, by the way? He had a running list of the Tannehill detractor excuses that keep getting checked off year after year. lol

    Need to add "He's not a vocal leader" to the list...
     
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  40. jdallen1222

    jdallen1222 He can smell your fear

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    I think you have to say his name 2 more times.
     

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