At some point, some people are gonna realize that Thill made that POS a two time 1000yd receiver.

 

Or was it QB17s fault he was a two time 1k receiver?

Too many targets to his buddy?

 

What do you think I was saying? They weren't buddies, btw.

 

Dolphins won't bring him back but he will land somewhere.

 

I think what you mean to say, and what is probably the reality of the situation is this. Brian Hartline's best years were in Miami because he had a much more talented QB in Ryan Tannehill, than in Cleveland. But, he was also helped by circumstance (not a ton of WR talent here, until he was released). He was helped by situation (good chemistry with Ryan and opportunities/targets). He was helped by a better scheme with Mike Sherman that played to his strengths.

That's the reality of the situation, but if you want to package it all up as it is only Ryan Tannehill, then by all means go ahead. Live in those clouds my friend.

 

New England loves white WRs who are "grinders" with "great motors" and are "blue collar". They also "love the game of football".

 

Also waiting for some people to realize he made Mike Wallace a 10 TD receiver.

:couch:

 

Or a 12.7 ypc WR. Or an 862 yds over 16 full games WR (all career lows after coming to Miami).

But, you'd argue that the offensive system wasn't a fit for that. As a WC hybrid, you have more short passes. The chemistry wasn't there, mostly due to Wallace, etc.

I'm just saying that this idea that Ryan Tannehill made Brian Hartline is only a half truth. There were other factors present that allowed Brian Hartline to get that. One being that, Hartline when used correctly can be a very serviceable/valuable WR. Maybe not now at 30, but early on in his career, yes.

To me, I just don't see how Hartline being released is used as a feather in Tannehill's cap. There are plenty of other reasons why Tannehill is better than people thing. Foremost being the amount of hits/sacks he's taken and the numbers he's still been able to produce - #1 being starting every game. Health is a skill and Ryan has it - so far.

 

What are his stats after leaving Miami? That's the point. Roethlisberger is a great QB, it's not surprising he would have a decline in production after going to Miami. But I could have sworn there were some people saying Wallace would get back to Pittsburgh form after going to Minnesota... what happened to that? (not saying you were saying that, by the way)

 

Oh, you were also being critical of QB17? That is a surprise, but a welcome one, he just relied way too much on Hartline, throwing to him whether he was open or not, and ultimately wasting a lot of passes going that way.

QB17 was a rookie and 2nd year player though, on a team that was certainly not rife with WRs, so we can't kill him too much for it.

 

No need for wasted breath on Brian Hartline, but my point is what you just made. Just looking at stats and saying he was better here than there, and it's purely because of QB play, is short-sighted. There were other factors that made Hartline what he was here, including Tannehill.

It's like saying the Dolphins have sucked because of Tannehill. Or that Suh had a terrible year last year, or Mike Wallace was worse here because of Ryan Tannehill.

So many factors in play with everything. I'm not arguing that Tannehill wasn't a reason for success. I'm arguing the insinuation that Tannehill was the ONLY reason he was successful, or that he couldn't have been successful elsewhere.

 

I agree with this.

It's what most "pro-Tannehill" guys on the board believe... that a QB isn't soley responsbile for the wins and losses of the team. I don't think Tannehill by himself gave Hartline and Wallace that production.

What I'm saying (and what Fin D I think wanted to point out) is actually more of a criticism towards people who think QB's are the end all be all of a team and believe that "a good QB should make the players around him better".

Tannehill did exactly that with Hartline and maybe even Wallace, yet "Tannehill does not make the players around him better" per the anti-Tannehill crew.

There are people who think Tannehill held Wallace back, then he leaves and posts terrible numbers in Minnesota, yet they don't change their stances on Wallace nor Tannehill... a lot of double standards.

 

Oh....

People claim QB is "solely" responsible for our teams W's and L's!!!!???

Please name these idiots so I can make fun....or???


Do they even exist?


Stay tuned.

 

I legitimately like four, maybe even five (I have a soft spot for Jakeem Grant) wide receivers on the roster more that I liked Brian Hartline even back in his prime. And I wasn't nearly as down on him as most.

 

Stop.

I said Thill MADE Hartline.

He didn't over feed him the ball. And they weren't buddies.

 

Also.

If one is to believe Tannehill "made" Hartline into a 1k WR by no more reason than volume, then I guess it is fair to say Chad Henne made Davone Bess into one of the best slot guys in the league.

Alrighty


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Fairly typical.

- "Blah, blah, blah, good QBs elevate the talent around them, bull****, cry, bull****"
- Ok, Thill made a really terrible receiver in Hartline a 2 time 1000yrd wr.
- "So it was excuse, more bull****, more blah, blah, blah"

 

You have no idea how the game of football works.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Yeah....

W/Ls are a QB stat, but ****ty receivers doing better then they should.....nothing to do with the QB.

But I need to learn the game...

 

So how do you feel about Chad Henne?

In all seriousness, when a WR gets #1 WR targets they are quite likely to exceed the 80 some ypg it takes to reach that milestone.


Actually it really isn't a milestone anymore, just a number. Too much passing in today's game.

 

Yeah, the pro Bowl invite and bigger contract were probably figments of my imagination.

 

Pro Bowl invite.

I rest my case on my "other" statement.

 

By your pro bowl standard I guess it is safe to say Winston Carr and Bridgewater are all better QBs at a younger age than Ryan.

I mean....

They DID make the pro bowl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I am Brian Hartline's polished comeback route...

 

You were right phinsanity...

I'm an idiot for getting sucked in. I'm stopping. I'm sorry to the board.

 

Book this.. New England will grab him..

 

If we weren't so stacked at WR I would say take a flier on him. Always had great chemistry with Tanny. He would make a great #4 receiver with the weapons we have

 

The guy played hard for us. He produced well, especially considering the round he was drafted in. I wish him luck in the future

 

I doubt it, they could have last year and did not.

 

he only had chemistry with Tannehill because that is all tannehill felt comfortable throwing too.... he was locked onto that.

 

You guys realize he holds the franchise record for most receiving yards in a game right?

Against the Cardinals in overtime...

And actually, it was Sparano that had Henne throw to draft prospects. Henne chose Hartline and the rest is history.

 

Something that was very sad for me was when the Dolphins solidified the WR unit as being Mike Wallace, Brian Hartline and Brandon Gibson...with the three of them combining for like $23 million a year. Everything about that combination felt wrong. The sum was even less than the parts, and I strongly disliked the parts relative to the money being paid.

Miami is in so much more favorable a position right now with Jarvis Landry, Kenny Stills, Devante Parker, Leonte Carroo and Jakeem Grant. And that's before even considering that the five of them combine for $6.2 million on the salary cap this year. They would be more attractive than the former group even if they combined for the full $23 million that the other group was costing.

 

Hartline doesn't fit the Patriots mold (i'm thinking of Welker-Amendola-Edelman)in anyway IMO: he's not a particularly tough WR and he is not a YAC guy

 

He fits a similar mold as Brandon LaFell, whom the Patriots relied on for certain roles in the offense. I think they'll go elsewhere just because they want a more physically impressive player, but Hartline could certainly find work in the Patriots offense.

The Dolphins won't be interested because they have the version of Brian Hartline that adds RAC ability to the mix in Leonte Carroo.

 

Agree 100%.

Besides Stills of course, to me he has been every bit as a disappointment thus far as the others.

 

Hartline was just as efficient with Tannehill as he was Henne. The only difference was the amount of targets he received.

 

Thill didn't make Hartline. Whether he overfed him the ball is a different question. IF he was our best WR then he deserves all the targets because they have to go somewhere. In 2012 there really was nowhere else to go with the ball. As Ireland said, we needed 1s 2s and 3s but we fielded 4s 5s and 6s.

2011 Hartline got 66 targets.
2012 Hartline got 131. Almost exactly 100% more targets.
2013 Hartline got 133 targets.

2011 550 yards.
2012 1083 yards. Almost 100% more yards.
2013 1016.

2011 1 TD.
2012 1 TD.
2013 4 TDs (a career high!)

His YPC from 2011 - 2013 is 15.7, 14.6, 13.4. He was progressively getting less efficient actually.

His catch rate was about the same average as the two years before 2012. Tannehill did nothing magical to make Hartline a 1,000 receiver. Hartline became a 1,000 receiver because he got a lot of targets. Someone of Hartline's ability should not be getting 131 targets. For example, Amari Cooper and AJ Green received as many targets last year.

The notion he was a 1k receiver other than by function of more targets is silly.

EDIT: Damnit Stringer beat me above

 

Most of us on the anti-Ireland train were livid at the deal he gave Hartline.

Golden Tate was had for the same money just a year later. That's how bad the deal was.