1) the trifecta does not believe in trying to develop two quarterbacks

2) The trifecta believes that one bird in the hand is better than two birds in the hand

3) The trifecta does not have forsight. They enjoy living in the now

4) The trifecta seems to believe that signing a crappy quarterback to a decent amount of money and then releasing him would be more embarrasing than the potential of releasing a young promising quarterback who's value can increase a lot in a few years

5) They like to make the team worse just so they can feel better about themselves.

 

Say what you want, but I'll tell you what I saw last night. I saw a team falter out the gate and pull it back together. I saw an offense that has looked like mush for a while show signs of life and rally behind a veteran. Once they scored, you could see them start to believe in themselves and really buy into what this group has been preaching. Our rookie Qb showed why he was coveted by this group showing very good presence, and working with what was on the field. The defense played well and I feel was inspired by seeing the offense carry their load. All in all, I saw improvement and that is way more than we've seen around here in a long time. Whoever they keep or get rid of, it seems hard to argue it because like it or not, they have us going in the right direction.:up:

 

I really don't see where Beck has a whole lot of promise. Not any time in the near future any way. He may have something down the road a few years but not anytime soon.

I think the Miami coaching staff are a little smarter than me or you. That's why they are where they are. You just gotta' have faith in Tuna and Company. He and his ways are proven winners in the NFL.

We have seen more out of both Chads in 2 games than we have seen out of Beck who is going into his second year. I just don't think he has the right mind set for a Pro game right now. If and when he calms down and things slow down for him he might become a good QB.

 

uh....hm

 

What the hell is the trifecta?

 

Actually Josh may be getting some calls soon. After the Vikings Lost their QB for a few weeks they might be looking?

 

6) The trifecta knows more about football than everyone that posts in this thread put together^2.

 

:up:

 

Riiiiiight. The Trifecta doesn't have a history of success in this league.

If only they had the "forsight" and wisdom of Dolphan Dupree. Oh well, you can't have everything.

 

No doubt. Good call, MB.

 

I would say they done well in Dallas:shifty: How can you say BP hasn't had success?

 

He needed a [sarcasm] tag... :up:

 

I don't get where the love affair with John Beck comes from around here.
The way some of you are acting, you'd think the Phins were on the verge of cutting Marino.
I don't get why everyone sees so much promise in Beck.
Let's all just realize that a crappy regime made a crappy draft pick and move on hope Henne is the real deal.

 

way what you will silly man.

There is an age old saying

The only thing better than having one young promising quarterback is having two.

 

Why hope Henne is the real deal when you can hope Henne or Beck is the real deal?

 

The problem is I don't see it in John Beck. Never did.
Apprently, the new regime doesn't either.

 

What you say is true, but if John Beck is the real deal or a promising young QB then he won't be cut. I think we have to trust BP, JI, and TS to make that call. This is not a dig on you or anybody else on this board, but John Beck is not a promising young QB just because we say he is. He has to prove it, and so far he hasn't, IMO. And unless I missed it, John Beck hasn't been cut yet. He still has a chance to prove he is that promising young quarterback.

 

logical.

 

getting cut doesn't mean he isn't a promising QB.

 

:up::up:

 

dupree is just being sarcastic.....don't sweat it.
One big limitation with the internet is that sarcasm, obscure humor, whatever isn't always conveyed.:up:

 

This is the main reason that and mcklown has no value.... they might be able to get a 6th or 7th for beck... maybe

 

I'm so tired of people who have never seen McCown play a single down in an NFL game making fun of his name.

FYI - His career QB rating is better than Beck's, his win/loss ratio is MUCH better than Beck's, ALL of his pro stats are better than Beck's. He was drafted in the 3rd round, one round later than Beck and has shown much more talent than Beck has in his career so far. He managed to win games on truly horrible teams.

There isn't any grey area here. The problem with the Beck supporters who are really over the top with their enthusiasm of this guy I must say, is that they somehow believe that they have some kind of QB talent evaluation skills, they 'just know' that Beck will be great even though he hasn't shown any signs of even being average, and they 'just know' that McCown is horrible without having seen him in ONE SINGLE Pro game.

Let's see if Beck's career lasts as long as McCowns has so far. Beck was beaten out by a rookie even after he spent the entire off season working at the Dolphin's facility. He had the first look and longest look at the new offense and was still shown up by all 3 of the other QB's in camp.

 

I won't argue with that. But it will mean he wasn't able to prove it while he was here.

 

McCown's Career win/loss ration.... QB rating is higher.... LMAO.

You could say the same comparing him to most recently drafted QB prospects.

You've got a guy that's a veteran here. He's had the time to develop and show EXACTLY what you're going to get with him. There is no starter ceiling.
He is what he is. A wildly inconsistent performer that can make some great plays from time to time but more consistently will kill you with huge mistakes.



That's not going to change. He has proven himself backup potential and nothing more.

Your citing a guy who's built a 11-29 record (.275), a 35 TD - 40 INT tally and a 71 rating as a strong point. LMAO.

If that's the type of QB you're willing to hold on to over a developing 2nd year prospect with a much higher ceiling potential so be it.

As for people citing McCowns talent limitations after "not seeing him in one single NFL game", I have no idea where you are getting this gem.

He's been in the NFL for 7 seasons dude.
Plenty of time for anyone to have seen him in "one single NFL game", so where you get that absurd argument is beyond me.

If you compared the win/loss or TD's thrown or QB ratings, etc. etc. of most NFL backups to most rookie QB's after their first season you'd see an advantage to the vet backups. To think that makes some argument as to proof that any of those prospects are doomed to be a back up based on that comparison of his rookie year performance is absurd.

No one here is saying that they KNOW Beck will develop into a quality starter.

What people are arguing is that there IS a developmental time for young prospects transitioning into the NFL. Especially at a position such as the QB spot. It's taken some very quality starting QB's today a few years to make that transition. The supporters of keeping Beck over McClown are citing that growth curve as a very good reason to keep Beck over a guy who you know for a fact is a backup quality QB. No future benefit for the Phins in keeping him.

There are many that feel Beck is the one that should be cut and that's fine.
Just bring something more to the table than this silly argument.

 

A+

While I agree with your assement because of the facts, mostly media driven, of Johns demise with the FO. I do feel that a change of address would be a breath of fresh air for John plus put him with someone that he knows wants him. I can't imagine how he must feel after the rollacoster ride he has had this last year +; can you? I will none the less hate to see the waste if he is traded or cut.

 

Umm...yeah I would hope that his career numbers would be better seeing that he is a 7 year NFL veteran. What you fail to point out is that Beck was never prepared by the coaching staff to be game ready last year, even after he was named the starter.

Oh but there is.

McCown is a 7 year NFL vet who has gone through 7 years of training camps to prepare himself for each and every year of his NFL career. He has had 7 years to develop as a player and he is what he is.

Beck on the otherhand was treated with kid gloves last year because the plan was to keep him on the bench for the whole year (ala Philip Rivers in SD) behind Green. He was given time in preseason, but was never seen as a real option so his time and preparation was minimal. After Green went down and it became apprarent that Lemon couldn't handle the job (Keep in mind that Lemon spent 3 years in Cam's offense and knew it better than anyone else) that's when Cam turned to Beck who had been sitting on the bench and not getting reps with the first team offense to build chemistry. Even after he was named the starter Cam was splitting reps between Beck and Lemon, how was he supposed to look? Add to that the fact that our OL took a huge step backwards, Ronnie was gone, Chambers was in SD, Booker wasn't motivated (and as ckparrothead pointed out) would run his route right to the bench, Ginn wasn't utilized properly and Cam's playcalling (The reason we brought him here) was extremely bland.

So how was he supposed to look?

That isn't an excuse, that is fact for fact of what happened last year. So yeah, I would hope that McCown's numbers look better, but when you do an honest comparison and stack him up against other starting QB's in this league, his numbers don't look good at all. I think it's safe to say at this point in his career that he peaked and he is what he is.

Again this is getting a little old. Noone here is putting Beck before the team and noone here will excuse poor production. Labeling our members as "Beck lovers" as some have or insinuating that people are so blind that they will make excuses for a player is rude and insulting.

The blue text could be directed at you as well. You obviously made up your mind about Beck, what are your qualifications to make an evaluation? Turnabout is fair play, instead of making such a bold statement in an effort to discredit peoples opinions, realize that it can be turned around on you as well. Instead of trying to turn the focus onto the members here by questioning their ability to evaluate talent, why not just focus on the facts?

So who is qualified to comment on Beck? How about the people that actually get payed to do so? Guys like Cam, Martz, Wolf, Ireland, Jaws, Young, etc all have a high opinion of Beck and think that he has the talent to succeed in this league. They are all known for their ability to evaluate NFL talent and they are all respected by their peers for that ability, so who are we to argue?

As for your quote about not seeing McCown play in a single game, I have and I can tell you that he isn't anything special. He is a good backup and that's about it. He has peaked in terms of his talent and development and this is as good as he's going to get. Beck on the otherhand is still developing, he will still continue to get better and we should make sure we know what we have before we decide to move on. You can say that's an over the top statement by a "Beck supporter", but I say that any team that would throw talent (any talent) off to the side with such a small sample to go off of and evaluate isn't doing it's job. And if a team does that and the player in question goes to another team and develops into a quality NFL player then I can't think of a better textbook definition of incompetence.

The purpose of an NFL front office is to find, acquire and evaluate NFL talent to make the team better, if they aren't doing that and they are basing their decisions on whether or not a player is "their guy" like some people here have suggested, then they aren't doing their job.

Can we please have a quote from Sparano or a link from someone in the Dolphins FO that says that's the case? Sparano explained why Penny and Henne were getting the lions share of the snaps this week, but that hasn't stopped the random speculation that Henne has leapfrogged to the #2 spot. Go back and reread his presser and he states it pretty clear.

And lets be honest, Henne has looked good but it's come against 2nd string defenses and a Jags team that was as lifeless as they come. I would hope that Henne (or any QB) would be able to do well in those conditions. Heck, Brady Quinn was doing well last year during preseason against 2nd stringers and look how far that has gotten him. Browns fans are as happy as clams with Anderson and the ones that I've talked to aren't all that enamored with how Quinn has turned out. Preseason is a time when players are supposed to be preparing for the seaosn and some of them make names for themselves against the 2nd and 3rd string defenses. While I hope Henne does well, just like I hope all of our players do well, lets not jump way ahead of ourselves and annoint him as "the one". He's still a rookie and he has alot of developing left to do, just like John Beck does, just like Ted Ginn does, just like Langford, Merling, Long and Satele do.

All anyone here is hoping for is that Beck is given time to develop, it's not because he's "their guy" it's because we want to see this Miami Dolphins team be successful and maximize their assets. If Henne finds himself in this position next year you'll be hearing the same arguments from me.

 

I'd give page 3 a five star rating! Some great posts Phin fans! :up:

The way the rumors have been flying about Beck if I were him I'd want to get out of here. I feel bad for the guy.

 

How could Browns fans or anybody have an opinion on how Brady Quinn turned out? He played great during the preseason and in his only regular season he led the Browns on a field goal drive. It should have been a TD drive but a receiver dropped a ball that hit him between the numbers. The knocks on Quinn are completely unfounded.

 

I was referring to the Brady Quinn situation. Some Browns fans didn't want to waste draft picks to trade back up for a player that they felt was mostly hype, now they are paying him a huge chunk of change to sit on the bench while Derek Anderson is leading the team. The Browns were impatient, they didn't want to develop their players and they took a risk, now that risk is riding the pine and Browns fans are upset because they felt that those picks could have been used elsewhere on the team.

 

The point is that Quinn would be getting trashed on these boards just like Beck is here.

Can you imagine.
Quinn, the top QB prospect of last year getting beat out by a 6th round prospect like he did in Cleaveland.......

Please!

This place would be holding burning pitchforks ready to run his failed butt out of S.FL.

 

Yep, another group of fans needing to see immediate success.

As I've said before, the avg. fan is clueless when it comes to development of players.

 

I don't know what fans you're talking to, but the fans I've talked to are thrilled to have a competent quarterback like Derek Anderson with a young prospect waiting in the wings that they also feel can get the job done. It's a "problem" most teams would love to have. The Browns did not have enough information on Derek Anderson to know he was capable of playing the way he played last year. Teams don't guess that a player might become a good NFL QB and ignore the position. They draft another guy if they aren't sure about what they already have. Just like we did this year with John Beck and Chad Henne.

 

Well I'm a mod on another board made up of fans from all over the NFL, so that's who I'm talking to. Browns fans would have loved to have Quinn if it didn't cost them so much in draft picks and in $$$ that they are currently paying both him and Anderson. That's the point, the Browns were impatient and made a risky move and they are now paying Quinn big money to warm the bench and those picks could have been used to upgrade another part of the team, that is what Browns fans are objecting to and that isn't even getting into their evaluation of his play.

 

Hindsight is 20/20. If the Browns had not drafted Quinn, and Frye and Anderson both crapped the bed, then they would be belly aching that they didn't take Quinn with the first pick, or trading up.

 

But the point being that they did have young talent that they saw flashes from and they didn't want to take the time to develop it because they wanted to win now. They signed some FA's and were trying to turn the franchise around quickly, and in their haste they wasted draft picks. The Phins can make the same type of blunder if they choose, but a smart FO would learn from other teams and FO's mistakes.

 

You make a lot of sense Tomfish :up: