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How Many Of You Will Be Disappointed?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Jul 1, 2019.

  1. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    If we come out of this season with a losing record?

    I honestly have no expectations for the team this season. Too much has changed on the squad and the staff for me to have any sense of what to expect. Personally I would think it reasonable for me to have some line of expectation for this 'all-change' season.

    I have the hope that the coaching is good, that we see some interesting looks, that we see flashes of things to come, but I don't have specific expectations.

    I think the one thing that will leave me disappointed is if it seems like we've got a hopeless look like we did last season, where it was bubble-screens and long runs way too often.

    My outlook approaching this season is to just observe, learn, and hopefully see some things I can be happy about. Get a sense of new players. Hope to see some exciting things and a glimpse at the future.

    BUT, if this season just isn't that much fun, particularly because we're losing a lot, that's not going to disappoint me because it's year one. A year of new things. A beginning. And it's going to take time before this teams gets good. I hope they win. I want them to win. But hoping for high level play and lots of wins this year is, to me, unreasonable. So I won't be disappointed if/when I don't see it.

    How about you?
     
  2. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    Won’t be mad as it’s expected. Only way I’ll be mad is if we don’t see progress. Heck a lot of people here think we’re going to tank for Tua or others.

    I believe we will win at least 4 games maybe even 6 and be out of the race for the top 2 QB’s.

    I will also be upset if Rosen isn’t our starter. We all known Fitz is talented but flawed and not the long term answer. We need to kick the tires on Rosen and what we got.
     
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  3. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Seriously.. sometimes losing now is better for the long term health of the franchise, and what will really disappoint me is if we find out Rosen isn't the answer (he most likely isn't) AND we win too many games, missing out yet again on a franchise QB while other teams keep finding their solution at QB. At some point you have to fix the QB position and you can't be blinded by short term goals trying to do so.

    So 5-8 wins is the worst IMO. If Rosen is the real deal we're easily winning 9+, and if he isn't we better be picking top 3 or 4 at worst because you're going to have a hard time finding trading partners if there's real competition for a hot QB prospect.
     
  4. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    Will be interesting to see how the QB situation plays out. If Rosen isn't up to it or is struggling to learn they might have Fitz in there in order to help the WR's, o-line etc. get a fair chance of performing and learning. Flores might want to use a known like Fitz as a measuring stick for the rest of the offense...?
     
  5. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    If Rosen is NOT up to it, then I definitely start him the whole season. It's only if you think he's the real deal but also think he needs some time to develop that I'd start him later in the season (or if it's obvious he's the real deal then sure.. start him the whole way).

    I think you always play to win given the players on the field, but you don't have to put the best players on the field to maximize your chances of winning if you think it's in your best long term interest to do otherwise, either by giving younger players more experience or in our case to potentially solve the QB situation for the next decade and a half.

    Either way, I want to see good game plans and in game adjustments by Flores.
     
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  6. firedan

    firedan Well-Known Member

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    I'm hoping for a winning season but not expecting it but there is always disappointment in losing.As long as they play hard and not rollover and quit I can hope for the future.
     
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  7. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    Well, I have zero expectations of a winning record. That's not even on the table. My feelings are somewhere around six wins on the season, most if not all at home.

    However, more importantly than that, my expectations are about the details. Are the coaches going to do their best to establish an offensive system that's reliable and repeatable? Will the team make an effort to run more plays and gain more first downs and Red Zone visits? Will the defense be able to scheme to stop the run and force incompletions, rather than relying on big turnovers?

    If the team looks to be setting the groundwork on both sides of the ball for the future, and making the most of what they have now, then I'll be satisfied, almost regardless of record. If its somehow more of the same as under Gase, with any and all success coming off of big plays, tricks and gimicks, then I'll be really down on them.
     
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  8. Losferwords

    Losferwords New Member

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    Hell no... dream season would be competitive high scoring games that we lose in the last 2 minutes of the 4th Quarter.

    I want 0 - 16
     
  9. Miamiforlife

    Miamiforlife Active Member

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    Seeing how none of us really knows what we will be?
    I am rooting for ten wins and a playoff victory.
    Why predict a losing season when you really don’t know? Just to be negative?
    We have new blood and new life. Why not give them the benefit of doubt? At least until we start 0-4. Then we can all start the negativity?
    If coaching was really our main problem?
    It appears we have taken care of that?
    It really feels like we have real coaches now?
    We shall see. Let’s go fins.
    And the qb. Situation seems better so far.
     
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  10. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I dont care about the record just wanna see a team that plays like the head coaches personality..

    Hopefully if Grier is the right guy We’ll add talent over the next three years to compete for championships.
     
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  11. Hooligan

    Hooligan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Not long ago we went from a one win season to division champs in one year just by changing coaches but mainly, changing philosophy and attitude with a sprinkling of the Wildcat. It didn't hurt having Ricky and Ronnie Brown in the same backfield. I for one would be disappointed if we weren't an improved team.
     
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  12. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    I expect it and think it’s long overdue. Tear it down and rebuild it the right way.

    I’m more interested to see how our younger players develop and hopefully see Rosen earn a starting spot.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2019
  13. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    Yeah, Fitzpatrick starting more than a handful of games at QB would be one of the biggest disappointments.
     
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  14. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    I don't care what their record is this season as long as Rosen wins the starting job and plays all 16 games.
     
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  15. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I will be disappointed if they don't lose enough games.
     
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  16. Miamiforlife

    Miamiforlife Active Member

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    I’ve been through 1-15. Please never again. How can some of you root for a losing season for picks that might not pan out? Never root for my team to lose.
     
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  17. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I'll be disappointed if we lose due to scheme. If guys are running wide open, we are missing blocks, so forth I will be disappointed.

    If we lose because guys just can't handle their assignment talemt wise I dont care if we lose every game.
     
  18. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    They're not a good team right now. They have no identity and plenty of question marks. Vegas already has them at the lowest odds to make the playoffs this season. They will open every experts power ranking this season at #32.

    Don't get your hopes up. Hopefully they find their quarterback and develop some kind of identity this season. But, they aren't winning 8-10 games I'm sorry.
     
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  19. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    I fully understand that point of view, but everything depends on expectations. No one expected 1-15 in 2007. Vegas had us at 7 wins that year before the season started. If however you expect to lose a lot.. it doesn't hurt that much. I know because I follow the Astros to some extent (not as much as the Dolphins though) and I remember their deliberate tanking from 2011-2013. Totally drove fans away from the team, but it didn't really hurt that much because I knew what they were trying to do.

    And they did it.. several years later they won the WS with guys they picked up high in the draft during those years.

    Look.. this franchise hasn't won a SB since the 1973 season. I think it's FAR worse to keep up this mediocrity than to do what's necessary (tanking included) to finally win the championship. And for that you'll very likely need a very good QB. If Rosen isn't it, then how are you going to get that guy in the draft when so many other teams want him??

    Anyway, I won't criticize anyone for thinking the way you do, but from my point of view prioritizing short term gain over long term gain isn't worth it unless you're trying to win the SB right now, and that's clearly NOT what we're doing. So I'm happy with losing a ton to get a very high draft pick. I however would prefer not to see a 0-16 season because that does stand out in history. At worst 1-15 lol.
     
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  20. Miamiforlife

    Miamiforlife Active Member

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    I Appreciate your realism.
    But I sure hope your wrong?
    I don’t have exact references.
    But I swear teams get new coaching, have basically the same players and do way better quite often?
    What keeps me from being cocky. (As I really feel we will be a better team) is the schedule. It appears to be a really difficult schedule.
    Oh ya I would bet on 8 wins if we had a seemingly easier schedule. But 0-4 to start might happen.
     
  21. Phins_to_Win

    Phins_to_Win Well-Known Member

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    I need to see some direction to be happy. If we only win 2 or 3 games, but I can see our defensive (for example) starting to take form then I'll be ok with it.

    If we win 2 or 3 games, and the defense and Offense look exactly the same as they did under Gase/Philbin then I'm going to hate this entire season. To be clear I'm not looking for that 1 or 2 pieces that we seem to keep getting excited about year after year. I want to see the product on the field looking good like a strong unit.
     
  22. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    In regards to 2007, that team simply wasn't that bad on paper going into the season. They were certainly better than the 2004 club who came close to going 2-14. But they lost starting QB Trent Green in the 5th game, RB Ronnie Brown in the 7th game (in the middle of an All Pro type season), traded WR Chris Chambers after six games, lost HOFer Zach Thomas in the 5th game, lost LB Channing Crowder in the 11th game, and had numerous other players miss time as well.

    If something like that happens to any team, their record is going to massively suffer. It turned that team from a 6 to 8 win quality club into a disaster. But there's now this notion going around that they were just this historically bad group from the get go, and that's just very wrong. They were very close to being 3-2 after five games before all the wheels fell off, as well.
     
  23. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    Some of the comments I have seen about Rosen and "He'd Better Win!" lead me to wonder who has smuggled in about three capable offensive lineman and a possibly even adequate defensive line, let alon a couple of linebackers who can imitate a starter in the NFL with more success than our costumed masked men in those position the last three years.
     
  24. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I have very mixed emotions here. As a Gase supporter who believes that we could have had a heck of a run last season without losing so many starters to injury, we were told the team just wasn't good enough to become a sustainable contender. Okay, fine...I'll buy that. But what if we do go 3-13 this season? How can you spin it that we're now one step closer than we were before?

    Some of you will say, "Well, 3-13 means we're in a prime position for the Tank for Tua sweepstakes." And sure, that's one way to build a contender....we just watched Cleveland go from being a joke to a possible SB team in a three year span. Great defense. Awesome QB prospect. That's definitely a blueprint.....but Cleveland didn't "tank" on purpose. They were just managed that poorly. So if that's really our plan, it sort of pisses me off- you don't tank a few seasons in the NFL and expect fans to remain loyal. I'd like to think we're better than that as a team and I definitely want to think all of you as fans deserve better.

    As I've said before though, Gase went to a division rival, plus Flores has a division rival of his own in Belicheck. So we're going to have an apples to apples to apples comparison in order to gauge where each team is at. If we're 0-6 or 1-5 in the division, then I'm looking at that as a failure no matter what....that's Miami pride and it means something. We'd better get two wins against the Jets though and at least one vs NE- those four games are almost more important to me than overall record since our head coach is moving within the division and facing the exact same coaches.

    So for me, a step FORWARD would be to come close to last year's record while scratching all the big contracts...which means I'm content with a 6-10 season and at least 3-3 in our division. Anything less is a failure in my book....anything more and I'll be ecstatic.

    But let's say we do go 4-12. What does that mean? Do we say, "Well, we cut all the expensive folks, ditched a QB so it's a necessary growing pain?" I personally can't say that- as a competitor, I can't pretend to be happy about "phoning it in" and taking a few seasons off. How does that affect our young players who are being asked to buy into this system? If I was a player, I'd want out....I can't think of 3 years from now since that's the average length of a career in the league. It may be an advantage to a few players that are Landry-like and carry the team on their shoulders, but the vast majority are going to be pissed off. And then all that culture people want to preach about is going to collapse.

    I'll say one last thing- winning cures all. The opposite is also true though- losing creates a losing culture where players just don't give a darn. I do not want that in Miami....for one week or one season. So I'm definitely not giving Flores, Grier or anyone a pass on 2019- they'd better give us at least 6 or 7 wins.
     
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  25. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End

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    Winning Good. Losing Bad.

    That said I don't expect much of the good this year but if it gets us off this mediocrity treadmill going forward I'll survive.

    Whaddya mean we aren't going to the playoffs? LOL
     
  26. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I'm not really sure we should have won 7 games last year. I know we did, but it took starting 4-0 against mostly bad teams who weren't rolling yet and a crazy miracle play.

    I also do believe the injuries played a role of course, but even healthy I dont believe we were the team that started so hot.

    Also, injuries will happen, though we did seem to have quite a few. It's important we put a scheme and roster in place that can at least mitigate the issues when the next guy in line gets his chance. Hopefully it wont be so many guys in a row next time at key positions.

    That said....our pass rush was going to be abysmal either way as was our run defense. Not a great winning combo. We relied almost 100% on the talent of our secondary to limit teams and that needs to change.

    I have no hard feelings towards Gase...I think he is the definition of an average and passable Head Coach. My one dislike of him is his way of passing blame along, right or wrong noone likes to hear that.
     
  27. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member

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    This thread represents a terrible point of view.

    We can't control the team, but we can have a positive fan attitude. By definition, a fan is "an enthusiastic devotee (as of a sport or performing art) usually as a spectator". Clearly, someone with a negative attitude about their team is not a fan.

    It has become clear to me that many on this board are here solely to complain about the Dolphins. When we do well they disappear or show a muted appreciation while waiting for any reason to debase the team. That is their pleasure and their prerogative. They are a new class of idiot that I refer to as lemmings. They are in effect "anti-fans" because that is what they take pleasure from; being anti-something. I suspect they are like that in many aspects of their lives.

    I now just classify their ravings as lemming juice or lemming droppings.

    I am looking forward to how the Dolphins can surprise me with what promises to be a competitive team. That's because I'm a fan of this team, not an anti-fan.

    If you are offended by this post, good! Maybe there is still hope for you as a fan. If not, you can consider this a banquet of lemming fodder. We all know what you will do with that!
     
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  28. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Flores doesn’t have to beat Gase twice to be proven he is the man.

    Putting a number on Flores isn’t the right way to go in this evaluation..It’s not the year for that..Too many moving parts and positioning of the organization.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2019
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  29. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If we go 3-13 there might not be any semblance of direction to get excited about, but I don't think we have the dearth of talent to be that bad. You're most likely to see Flores on thin ice if the season ends up like that. I'd like to see a steadily improving, 6-8 win team with the flexibility to be maneuverable in the draft next year. Of course, the best outcome is Rosen becomes a revelation and we use all of those picks next year to continue to collect young talent, but that's a bit of a dream right now.
     
  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ok let’s try it this way..

    You are suggesting we are “phoning it in” and “Taking a few season off” if we go 4 and 12, that’s based on what??
     
  31. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    In summation I think this year is about getting to know the coaching staff more than the actual players on the roster.
     
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  32. AGuyNamedAlex

    AGuyNamedAlex Well-Known Member

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    I dont think anyone here hates the Dolphins or just wants to be negative.

    They are more negative about the moves we have made in the past and up to this point. It's natural to be angry if you feel like something you love is being destroyed by bad decisions.

    Example: I'm a big fan of Sonic The Hedgehog....I grew up playing it and watching the cartoons. The new games are HORRIBLE though generally and no matter how much nostalgia I have....I cant blindly support trash.

    I try and stay positive and supportive myself but it's not crazy that some people feel discouraged and negative about the last....what 20 years?
     
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  33. Galant

    Galant Love - Unity - Sacrifice - Eternity Staff Member

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    While I hear you about teams tanking intentionally, that is, putting out a poor product in order to lose, I'm not sure the Dolphins are doing that. I think they know that the team isn't what they hope it to be, but they believe that they've got some distance to travel before they can get there from where they are right now. Either way, the players on the field are going to give their best, Flores and co are going to give their best - and they had jolly well better do that. What I can't do, however, is hold Flores, or even the FO, responsible as negligent for not having a team this year that performs as well as other divisional teams. I can hold the organisation responsible for past in managing things so poorly that they've reached a low point (thought that remains to be seen). But if Flores is out matched this year because of talent on the field, the question has to be asked, why? And I think the answer is that they wanted/needed to clear house and build a team that wins more than it loses year in and year out. To that degree, a losing/worse record season this year can be progress - in the same way that bankruptcy can be progress. Bankruptcy isn't a success. It's an indication that something has gone badly wrong. Nevertheless, sometimes it's the only way to level things out and start all over again. It's a horrible step in the path to building something new.

    Financially, the Dolphins were clearly clearing cap space and preparing to do something new. The clearing has to come first, but the building can't happen in a year. Therefore, this year of clearing can be progress even if we don't have the pieces to compete. And that also excuses Flores for a potential losing year. The reckoning will come if, with all this power and freedom and space, he can't build what he promised. And that does start this year, but won't be visible properly until next year, and maybe the year after.
     
  34. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    I really disagree. A fan can be deeply invested in the long term best interests of the team, and have an educated opinion that things are likely to, or even need to, get worse before they can get better. Frankly, people who are invested in a pro team 365 days a year and follow every little move are more likely to take that view than someone who only turns their TV on Sunday afternoon and watches the live game action.

    Now, you are of course free to take a totally different approach, and there's nothing wrong with that. But being a fan doesn't need to be all rose-colored glasses 100% of the time. A fan can dislike the coaches, the players, the owner, the stadium, the uniforms, ect.......and still love the team. They may just want things to be very different from how they are.
     
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  35. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think he’s talking about the illogical syndrome of connecting present eras to the past.
     
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  36. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Moderator Staff Member Club Member

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    I would not be disappointed with a losing record so long as the team:

    1) Cuts down on mental mistakes/penalties.
    2) Shows progression on a weekly basis (i.e. be the best version of themselves in game 16 as opposed to fading).
    3) Able to sift through roster and solidify roles for young talent.
    4) Has definitive answer either way on Rosen (i.e. yes, he's the guy or no, we're drafting a QB in 2020).
    5) Remain competitive in losses, especially road games. Don't get Gased...I mean blown out by 20-30 points seemingly every road game.
     
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  37. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    Exactly.

    Rest assured we will have fans somehow validating Gase as a HC if he beats the projected worst team in football. Just the world we live in.
     
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  38. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member

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    RONG!
     
  39. Unlucky 13

    Unlucky 13 Team Rosen Staff Member Club Member

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    Um, ok then? Peace, man.
     
  40. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough!
     

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