No. Not even a little bit. Don't even see your original point.

 

He is his own guy. His arm is decent, he's extremely accurate (about as much as Pennington) and his timing is what makes him incredible.

 

He has had great success but I'm not that sold on him purely as a talent. His success in St. Louis was in my opinion due to the talent around him.

His passing in ARI is a result of three terrific receivers, a lot of his throws are short, long, wide it seems. His receivers are constantly making unreal plays on balls that should not be completions.

I do give him credit for his stats, they are very good. Another area i believe he is good at is avoiding sacks.

It will be intersting to see how he performs with that ballhawk from Pitts. in the superbowl and if his throws are right on the money or if his WR get beaten by the PItts secondary. Should be a great battle and to me determine if his throws are great or if a great secondary can expose the shortcomings that his WR usually compensate for.

But considering his career path, his determination and success with different teams, its hard not to give him props, I just would never consider him in the same bracket as Marino at least in terms of pure talent.

 

As I said in another post; if Warner pulls off another SB win he is a shoe in for the Hall IMHO. And, I might add, it couldn't happen to a nicer guy or be better deserved.:up:

 

Um he's also had Issac Bruce & Torry Holt in their prime, and Fitz & Boldin in their prime.

 

Two men can't make a baby Gish... Geez...

 

This is exactly what I've been saying in the Anquan Boldin thread. Warner is very good, yes, but the guy has been playing on some loaded teams! (only the one season with the Giants was a sub par team talent wise, and look how he played there. Benched and replaced by Eli)
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Edited cuz of the stupid iPhone autocorrect feature. Nazi ally? WTF?

 

If memory serves me right he was benched at the Rams once he lost Marshall.

I see no Dan Marino in Warner.

 

The only thing i think Warner does like Marino is wear the number 13.

 

Wow!...
He's had success with 3 different teams - 3 different systems.
3 Pro Bowls
2 1st team All Pros
2 NFL AP MVPs
1 Super Bowl MVP
QB rating:
St L: 97.2 (66.4 cmp)
NY: 86.5 (62.8 cmp)
AZ: 91.5 (64.8 cmp)
Overall: 93.8 (65.4)
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WarnKu00.htm

With football a QB has to have talented teammates on OL as well as skilled positions in order to be successful.

Come on AC, your bias is showing.

 

I wouldn't put Warner or Big Ben in my top five all-time QB's.....probably somewhere between #10 and #15. I hope the Cardinals win it. The people in Phoenix haven't had much to cheer about other than a D-Back's World Series, the Suns are always good but never a winner, and the Coyotes are always average. Pittsburgh has five SB rings,,,,,I think the Squeelers deserve a good beat down.

 

Nah, I live here and I am still rooting for the Steelers. For all the true die hards here (honestly not many) I feel happy for them to finally see the turds known as the Cardinals turn it around. For the rest of the "Sea of Red," the wheels on the bandwagon are flat because there are so many on it. Phoenix is honestly one of the biggest fair weather cities and the weather here has never felt this sunny for the Cards. With all that said, I can see the Cards winning and this city going nuts :pity:.

 

1. Warner is and was an excellent QB. Yes, he had studs at WR, but you shouldn't criticize him for that. Marino had Duper and Clayton in 1984, and nobody claims he threw for 48 TDs and 5,084 yards just cause his receivers were great. Let's be fair here.

2. Sure he reminds me of Marino in that he can wing the football. Both Warner and Marino are/were great at hitting the WR in stride on deep passes. Not sure why so many of you are so opposed to this comparison.

3. I hate Warner's constant Jesus talk. We get it. You love the Jesus. There's really no need to begin every interview with Jesus. I'm waiting for him after a loss to tell Pam Oliver that he threw 3 picks cause Jesus didn't want him to win. If he's gonna praise the Jesus when he wins, he should condemn the Jesus when he loses.

 

Here's a list of QB's better than Warner and Roethilisberger:

Troy Aikman
George Blanda
Terry Bradshaw
Len Dawson
John Elway
Dan Fouts
Otto Graham
Bob Griese
Sonny Jurgensen
Jim Kelly
Bobby Layne
Dan Marino
Joe Montana
Warren Moon
Bart Starr
Roger Staubach
Fran Tarkenton
Y.A. Tittle
Johnny Unitas
Norm Van Brocklin
Bob Waterfield
Steve Young

 

Bigger question is that if Trent Green and Dan Marino had a son would be figuring out who pitched and who caught?

 

Wow you don't even have Brady, Peyton or Favre in that list.
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I just cut and pasted all the modern-era QBs in the Hall of Fame.

 

You can't compare Duper and Clayton (5'8" no less) to Warner's WR... Dan made them great, not the other way around. Dan Marino did more with less then any QB in the history of the NFL. Not up for debate.

 

What the hell is a 'baby gish" ?

 

No need to rewrite history for the purpose of making your case.
Duper and Clayton (as well as Nat Moore) were all listed at 5'9. Yes, I know it's only 1 inch. But the "5'8" thing in how you're using it is just hyperbole.
As great as Marino was, Duper and Clayton and Moore were all very, very talented WRs regardless of their height.
Not to mention, Marino always, always had talented TEs as outlets.
He also had a great OL - blind side was always protected by one of the best ever LT and LG combos. How about the guy snapping the ball? Alot of folks consider Dwight Stephenson to be the best ever Center.

 

Yes, your right my bias is showing. I think he's hard to rate because of his untypical career path. His statistics are good in certain years, not in others. Which i also mentioned.

He didn't have "Success" with the Giants. He went 5-4 in 9 games with them, throwing 6 td's to 4 int's. Based on the link you provided. He was no longer with them after that. That is not success with three different teams. He also didn't have any success with the Cards until this season, his first in 4 years when he actually had a winning record for games he played. One winning record in 4 years is nothing to beconsidered "successful", especially in the what have you done for me latley league. But to his credit, he played very well for the cards this year.

I agree Warner is HOF bound when its all said and done. But in my opinion he's not as good of a qb in terms of talent as some of the great qb's of all time. He has found success in a variety of ways and put up some great stats along the way, including numerous personal achievement accolades, a great completion %/passer rating, but i'm still not sold he's even remotly close to the other great qb's the league has seen.

In the past 10 years he's only started 16 games in a season 3 times. That is not highly successful. Guys who are being talked about with the best qb's of all time, start every season, every game. And they get locked up for long, long contracts.

Look at the details closer and you will get my bias that even though he has great stats in certain years, and some great accolades to his name, i still wouldn't put him in the class of qb's like the Marino, Elway, Manning, etc etc etc.

 

But some of us keep trying :tongue2:

 

I have to agree totally

 

huh?

 

1. You might want to tone down your rhetoric. When debating someone, try not to claim the subject is "not up for debate". You are debating the subject, and thus, you are contradicting yourself.

2. As to the actual debate (which I believe is valid), are you trying to say that Warner is a product of his WRs, and that Marino's WR's are a product of Marino? If so, please explain why. And merely citing Clayton and Duper's height, or lack thereof, doesn't really cut it for me. Clayton and Duper were studs. They were fast as all get out and could run superb routes. Besides, Isaac Bruce and Torry Holt are both six feet flat. There's really not a big difference between 6' and 5-9.

3. Of course I think Marino is better than Warner.

4. I'm not ready to concede that Holt and Bruce are better than Duper and Clayton were.

5. I'm not ready to concede that Boldin & Fitzgerald are better than Duper and Clayton were, but in a few years, I probably will.

6. I hate to pull this card, but you are 22. You didn't see Duper and Clayton play. Hard to diss them when you didn't see them.

 

:lol:

 

Nothing wrong with faith or loving jesus. more people should do the same!

 

Its impossible for them to have a son together... a female would need to be involved

 

I got no problem with those who love Jesus. My problem is hearing about it in EVERY interview.

 

how many times a day do you listen to kurt Warner interviews? personally, I hear maybe 5-6 all year. it's a very small part of the interview, and if you know it's coming and don't wanna hear it, use the mute button.:up:

 

Look, while these are valid points someone has to make the throw to these guys dont they?? Warner is great, and proven great. While he isn't all that similar to Marino i could see why the original poster would believe he is because they both have pretty quick releases. He's a great guy and has come from nothing, almost twice, to make his name heard. He will be in the Hall of Fame someday and deservedly so.

 

Excellent point, except for the fact that Warner is not the only athlete who feels the burning desire to thank Jesus at the start of every interview. Those jesus thank-you's add up.

Would you like it if a good portion of the interviews you watch open with the athlete thanking Wendy's? No. Its kind of annoying to hear about Wendy's all the time. That's the way I feel about Jesus. He's not a part of my life, nor is Wendy's. Its annoying to hear about the guy all the time.

 

Your post was great until you hit this point. No need to be critical of him over this. He has the right of freedom of speech and religion. While it may get somewhat repetitive it certaintly isn't something that is tormenting society. You yourself also have the option of not listening.

 

Please see post #34. I don't think you'd like it if athletes were constantly thanking Wendy's all the time.

Of course he has the right to thank Jesus. I have the right to whine about it. I have not said it was tormenting society. Please do not put words in my mouth. I find it extremely annoying.

 

I doubt he quits just because you don't like it. I suggest you stop listening to interviews. it's a free country, and he, like you, has the freedom of speech.
if I knew someone was going to say something I didn't like everytime I heard them, I wouldn't listen to what they had to say. you have that same option.

 

1. I agree that Kurt Warner will not stop his Jesus thank-you's cause of me.

2. You have the same option not to listen to me or read my posts.

3. How would you react if a good number of athletes began all their interviews with the following: "Before I answer your question, I'd like to thank Wendy's. Without their tasty hamburgers and lovely shakes, I wouldn't have been able to perform on the field of play today. All praise and thanks to Wendy's". Would you not find that so annoying that you'd complain about it on an inconsequential message board? I would.

 

I really wouldn't care. that whats wrong with this country... to many people bend so as to not hurt others.


and yes, I could add you to blocked members. but why would I do that? my undies don't get in a bunch because we don't agree.

 

Would you rather hear about the dog fighters, thugs or those that can't form one complete sentence and have an ego the size of a VW that think the world revolves around them?