I think that's a rather simplistic way of viewing the situation, at least in terms of this thread...I think certainly there are factors of Tannehill being a rookie that lead into poor play - not stepping up in the pocket, staring down receivers, having balls batted at the line, etc. But, there are also personnel issues that haven't helped him. I believe Miami was leading the league in dropped passes going into the Jets game. You've had Jonathan Martin and John Jerry struggle badly at times (see vs. J.J. Watt), Lamar Miller running the wrong way to take a hand off, Charles Clay has all but disappeared, other than the occasional burst from Hartline, none of the receivers have shown a propensity to create separation down the field, Legedu Naanee, etc. I didn't vote as I think there's a mix of things that you have to take into account of both his struggles and his successes (having familiarity with the offense, coaches on staff for example). I don't think there were too many people thinking he'd come in and play like Cam Newton did last year; if anything, I think most thought he'd sit this year. I think it's actually a good thing that he's out there getting experience and taking his lumps now. Clearly Miami should have even MORE talent on the roster for him to use next year based on cap space and draft picks available for 2013. I see too much confidence and resilience in him to become Chad Henne part II, even if things start to break down (I think most people generally were anticipating a generally rocky season anyway, regardless of who the QB was going to be once training camp started, at least on this board anyway). So, I think it's great he's out there and developing along with a good portion of players who should reasonably be back next year, and hopefully be even better - Jonathan Martin, John Jerry, Lamar Miller, Hartline, Bess for example - when the team has even more firepower to work with.
And a good WR makes that catch 29 out of 30. I don't know about you but I'm tired of average on this team. I want a Super Bowl in my lifetime and making excuses for piss poor WR play is not going to sway my belief that Tanny has the arm and potential to improve in to a very good QB
I would also venture that QBs with mediocre arms cants place that ball in stride for a potentially big play like QBs with superior arm strength and velocity
And Tannehill's receivers at Texas A&M dropped a ridiculously high number of passes, which scouts have attributed to Tannehill's failure to adjust his velocity. When does it become his problem? But how much of those kinds of errors do other teams get? Is he getting any greater degree of poor support around him than the average QB? I mean I'm sure we can take a look at the rosters of other teams and find better players than we have in some spots, but is he getting such an inordinately low degree of support that it makes sense to think it's the difference between how he's playing and how Robert Griffin III is playing, bucking the odds for rookie QBs?
I havent read every post or every thread, so i gotta ask, who thinks that RT is palying like RG3? I mean to start a poll and a thread about it you'd think it was a massive amount of people, so who is it? Who had this "fantasy" that he was going to rip it up in his rookie year?
Disagree, same thing was said about Henne, when we added Marshall he was supposed to "turn the corner" That did not work out so well. Now personally, I'd rather have THill tossing passes to Ted Ginn rather than Naannee, at least he could make stuff happen.
Did you see RGIII's game last week? He looked worse in the 1st half against the Bengals than Tannehill did the entire Texans game. If that's your barometer, I'd suggest you alter it. He played better in the 2nd half because Cincinnati backed off coverage-wise, and missed a ton of tackles, allowing his receivers to get a lot of YAC. Both Miami and Washington are 1-2, and I'd argue that Miami's played a tougher schedule through 3 games. As far as support, again, Miami was leading the league in dropped passes going into the Jets game - I think that tells you exactly what you're asking regarding the receiving corps - I'm not sure how you could argue it differently; that'd seem like an exercise in futility if you ask me. Of the drops they had in the Jets game, I don't think any of them you can lay at the feet of Ryan Tannehill, no pun intended. Honestly, what were you expecting Ryan Tannehill to do this year? And when has anyone on this board claimed he was going to have an RGIII, or Andrew Luck for that matter, type of impact? I honestly can't think of anyone doing so.
Now wait a minute, Tannehill's college problem followed him to the league, there is a reason for this R4. Perhaps it is his issue to deal with.
I agree with your comment I was Watching the NFL network and they were showing highlights of other QBs, I very rarely see the Dolphin receivers really open like other team receivers and TEs, I think if it wasn't for Bush RT has no real weapons, the OL has improved but all the receivers leave alot to be desired, did you see the Armstrong drop. I like this kid I haven't seen a better QB in this team since Marino I hope he keeps improving and Ireland gets him some help.
Which are you referring to? Batted passes or dropped passes? I think the batted passes issue is more on him, the dropped passes, not so much, especially from what I've seen of him with the Dolphins. IMO, he does fail to recognize times when he should move up in the pocket or slide-step to avoid pressure in his face. I think that sort of comes with the territory of him having started like 22 games in the past season and a half at Texas A&M and the 3 games he's played thus far in Miami.
Why dont we look at this a different way. Lets compare the 5 starting rookie QB's through the first three games. Tannehill: Record: 1-2 Throwing to: Hartline-Bess-Fasano as his primary weapons, Bush/Miller/Thomas in the backfield. Biggest deficiency: Low release point Stats: 21.7PPG (20th) 194 YPG Passing (25th) 54Completed/102Attempts/615Yards/52.9 Comp %/1 TD/4INT/6YPA/58.3 QB Rating VS Houston/Oakland/NYJ Summary: Played the toughest set of defenses and has the worst stats? Go figure. Has the worst weapons and has the worst stats? Go figure. But outside of 1 stretch vs Houston hasnt cost his team games or really played bad at all. RG3: Record: 1-2 Throwing to: Pierre Garcon, Santana Moss, Fred Davis, Leonard Hankerson. Backfield: Alfred Morris/Evan Royster/Roy Helu Biggest deficiency: Accuracy Stats: 33PPG (1st) 224YPG Passing (22nd) 60completions/89 Attempts/747 Yards/67.4Comp %/4TD/1INT/8.4 YPA/103.5 QBR Vs New Orleans, St Louis and Cincy Summary: Mike Shanahan hand picked him because RG3 is perfect for his offense. Shanahan is a great coach and that team is on the rise. Good weapons, a surprisingly good running game (2nd in YPG) and RG3 has made the throws hes had to for the most part. Played 1 very soft D (N.O.), 1 D that has talent but below average results (St Louis), and 1 average D in Cincy. Andrew Luck Record: 1-2 Throwing to: Reggie Wayne, Donnie Avery, Austin Collie, T.Y. Hilton, Coby Fleener, Dwyane Allen Backfield: Donald Brown/Vick Ballard Biggest deficiency: Red Zone Efficiency Stats: 20.3 PPG (23rd), 266.7 YPG (12th) 65 Completed/122 Attempts/53.3 Comp %/846 Yards/5 TD/4INT/6.9 YPA/75.4 QBR Vs Bears, Vikings, Jags Summary: Has shown brilliance (1st half of Jags game) and times when he looked like a rookie (Bears, 2nd half of Jags game). Talent around him is respectable if not good. Two talented TE's taking turns playing well, a WR who still got it (Wayne) and two emerging WR's (Avery and Hilton). Played 1 elite D (Bears), 2 average D's (Vikes, Jags). Russell Wilson Record: 2-1 (Should be 1-2 but thats a different story) Throwing to: Braylon Edwards, Golden Tate, Sidney Rice, Doug Baldwin, Zach Miller Backfield: Marshawn Lynch, Leon Washington, Robert Turbin Biggest deficiency: Height, Making plays instead of constantly checking down Stats: Team is 27th in PPG at 19, 32 in pass yards per game at 128. 43Completed/75Attempted/57.3 Comp rate/434/4TD/1INT/5.8 YPA/86QB rating VS GB, Dallas, Arizona Summary: Has done nothing for quarters at a time (1st 3 quarters of GB game in particular), backed by a top D and a running game. Throws a great deep ball when given a chance. Suffers from CWS (Thats Crappy Weapon Syndrome) just like Tannehill. Tough to perform against 3 of the leagues top 7 D's in your first 3 games. Weeden Record: 0-4 Weapons: Greg Little, Travis Benjamin, Mohammed Massaquoi, Ben Watson, Josh Gordon Backfield: Richardson, Montario Hardesty, Josh Cribbs Biggest deficiency: decision making Stats: 18.3PPG (28th) 235.2 YPG Passing (18th) 90/167/53.9 Comp %/997 Yards/3 TD/7INT/6 YPA/60.8 QBR Vs Philly, Buffalo, Cincy, Baltimore Summary: Faced two top D's in Philly and Baltimore and 2 average D's vs Buffalo and Cincy. Suffers from CWS like Tannehill and Wilson though at least he has some young weapons with talent like Gordon, Benjamin and Little who are just a bit raw. Makes some throws that just make you scratch your head.
Think about R4, that is like saying a Rb who fumbled in college, and is fumbling in the pros is not at fault The Qb is handing him the ball wrong.
Very few people claimed such a thing... sounds like you're taking a quote from Philbin about how the offense is progression based not "get the ball to this guy" based and just spinning it how you deem necessary.
Has he lasered a few check downs, sure, I don't see an inherit problem with pace, I've seen it live and he's got the ability to throw with touch and proper pace..there is a little problem on screens when it comes to lofting the ball, I will give you that, but in terms of down the field, I don't see enough to worry.
I admit I am one that preferred Weeden over Tannehill, but I am glad we went with Tannehill in retrospect. But the jury is still out on both QB's because they are both rookie QB's on teams that struggled last year. But so far after just 3 weeks, Tannehill seems like the best pick and I am excited about his potential and his poise and decisions for the most part.
I was going to put this in a previous thread on Tannehill, but I was late to the party. There's a lot like about Tannehill. It is early to judge a rookie QB, but it's not an overall or final judgement, it's just some opinions and gut reactions as to what we've seen so far. Again, there's a lot I like about him. I really like his moxie and command. He doesn't seem to get rattled when he makes a mistake. He has a good arm and can make some solid throws when rolling out, etc. He can make some good, quick reads to pick up the first. He, obviously, for a rook, has good knowledge and command of the O. At this point, for me, there is nothing that has really put me off about him. Depending on what type of team they continue to build around him, I think he can have a really solid future. The issue with some of his passes being batted down does kind of give me an eerily similar feeling about an issue I had with Henne. I'm not saying it's the same, but just that it could be similar. I always complained that Henne had one trajectory and velocity. There are times to laser it in there and times when you have take a bit off the ball and give it an arc, etc. It's touch. I'm not saying Tanne is the same as Henne, but it just sometimes looked eerily similar, but Tanne has, at times, even shown better touch than Henne did at the same point. Again, I know it's early. I would also like to see more and better deep passes. He's been very good at the short and intermediate throws. I would just like to see his accuracy on some deep throws. Just a little concern. I understand that also can be due to a lack of opportunities given the group of WRs, etc. So if I had to list any concerns it would be the last two issues which I mentioned, but as I said in the beginning, there's a lot I like about him. My excitement and hope and enthusiasm or what have you, has not at all wavered nor diminished. He seems to have the right moxie and character and personality, etc, which I always maintain is the most important part of being a great QB in the NFL, so I have a lot of hope. We shall see.
From the guy who does more educated, informed, and objective analysis of this than any of us could ever hope to: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/09/29/3026400/miami-dolphins-suffer-from-indentity.html
And I am sure Joe realizes he is about to start his 4th game in the NFL with marginal talent around him with no playmakers outside of Reggie Bush and Lamar Miller to an certain extent. I bet Joe also realizes he faced Houston (a pretty damn good defense) in his first ever game, Oakland, whose attempts to confuse Ryan by disguising schemes did not work on him, and New York, who also has a damn good defense that Tanny drove the ball on, put this team in position to win at the end of the game and in OT (he had the INT for TD but it was bound to happen eventually for the rook).
My point in posting the quote from Philbin is that it supports the idea that Tannehill is playing like a typical rookie QB (and not in some way that's consistent with a fan's fantasy) because of things he's doing himself. Are there external factors that contribute? Sure, and Philbin mentioned that, but Philbin also mentioned that he thinks some of it has to do with Ryan Tannehill himself. How much, he didn't say, and I don't think you or I or anyone else here has sufficient mind-reading ability to know for sure. The take-home message, IMO, is that he's playing like a typical rookie QB, which is normal, we can probably put to rest any fantasy that he's going to come in here this year and play like Dan Marino did in 1983, for example, and it's not completely because of his supporting cast. Could he play like Dan Marino did in 1983 in the future? Sure, and I'm not disappointed at all with what I'm seeing from him this year, but I do think we can put to rest the "rookie QB fantasy" at this point, and not because he's "only a supporting cast away" from playing that way.
Then too, he had the Hartline over Bess threads, or was it Bess over Hartline? Whichever it was, he beat that poor dead horse to a bloody pulp too.
RG3 has the best comp pct of the group, but you say accuracy is his biggest deficiency? I wish Tannehill was as inaccurate as RG3.
That seems to be a particularly surreal point to be made in an argument when proposed about a team which had Dan Marino for a QB. The old adage goes that if a receiver can get his hands on the football, he should catch it. Period!
Flip this around. If scouts were saying Ryan Tannehill "throws a very catchable ball" (i.e., Chad Pennington), would you consider that characteristic to have no value because receivers should catch all passes that hit them in the hands, or would you be glad he had it? Because what they're essentially saying is that he doesn't throw a very catchable ball.
Can you confirm if they were salty? Some scouts claim that salty balls are harder to catch than sweet balls.
Rush..I'm not sure what your alluding to here, but I think we have a forum for that if you want to share anything with us.
Actually the argument was that Hartline is no more a deep threat than Bess, who himself isn't a deep threat.
