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Merged: Ahahaha. Once a cheat, always a cheat / DeflateGate

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by MAFishFan, Jan 19, 2015.

  1. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Just gets better and better... or worse and worse. They've got to come down hard on this. Set the example. Change the rules. Back to the days of here's the balls, NFL provided, you'll get them during warmups on the field. That's it.
     
  2. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    It is starting to sound like a lot of quarterbacks have their footballs tampered.. My guess is the Patriots will get a slap in the wrist then.
     
  3. heylookatme

    heylookatme Well-Known Member

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    I'm sick to my stomach.
     
  4. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    We know.




    See how easy that was.
     
  5. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    ESPN sports science breaks it down

    [video]http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=12207314[/video]
     
  6. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    He's clearly a Patriots fan... jk I guess the advantages is purely mental for the quarterback. But the advantages for a running back's grip is not explained on that video.
     
  7. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    nope, but thats not what the hysterics are all about.
     
  8. Agua

    Agua Reality: Try It!

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    http://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/blog/?p=2917

    The Patriots and Tom Brady Suspiciously Outperform in Wet Weather:

     
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  9. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm a huge fan of Sherman. I haven't always been, but I came around. Once you start digging, he's actually kinda hard to dislike.

    One thing about that prior meeting: Brady may have called Sherman a nobody, but I found it interesting on re-watching it that he only threw to Sherman's side of the field 3 times. 1 INT and 2 incompletions. Brady didn't approach the game as if he was playing against a nobody; he was probably just trying to get into people's heads. I don't have a problem with that, but I have a problem with the double standard that Sherman's trash talking makes him a thug and Brady's trash talking goes into the memory hole and never existed in the first place.

    I think Brady's reputation is pretty much untouchable in the sports media right now; he does have a lot to lose, but I don't think anybody with any power is going to look at him any differently. IMO, the issue will go away if it's about Brady and not Belichick. I predict a fine for Brady and maybe a bigger fine for Belichick for lack of oversight. No draft picks.

    Gannon's former teammate, Jerry Rice, tweeted that it was cheating.

    I think Boomer is just resigned to the fact that it's 10x easier to be a QB now than it was when he was playing. He probably wants all these young QB's to get off his lawn.
     
  10. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Or.....

    The Colts are now on record as having complained about it in November.

    See how easy that was?
     
  11. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    ?

    before we go back and forth on ******edness


    i dont buy that rumor. not yet. i'll give it time though.
     
  12. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    Oh there is no way this was the first time. It's not like Belichick woke up and thought "Let's deflate the balls this week!" Especially against the overrated Colts. (Yes, I think a team can make it to the Conf Champ. overrated, ask the Jets. The Colts beat the Bungles who haven't won a playoff game since 1990, and an injured Manning. Without Luck they're a 6 or 7 win team. Pats-Ravens was the real Championship Game). So I really doubt a home game against the Colts would be the first time, why risk it. He must've been comfortable doing it by this point, figuring nobody would notice.

    I just wonder when they have done it. Did they do it against the Ravens in their 4 point win? Last season? A couple seasons? Have they been doing it for years but only in wet weather? We'll never know, but any benefit of the doubt is not going to go towards Belichick.
     
  13. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Junk Science since they tested with a machine and not with actual living and breathing human beings that play QB in the NFL.

    Snuck in there in the last 4 seconds...he does say it makes a big difference in the rain...so there is that.

    Look...it's simple, Better grip= better ball = better passer. Softer Ball= Easier to catch= Easier to hold on to.
     
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  14. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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  15. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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  16. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I didn't watch the game. Did the Patriots perform considerably worse in the 2nd half when they were forced to use the properly inflated balls? That doesn't excuse them for cheating, just wondering since I didn't watch. I'm trying to find a breakdown of the game per half
     
  17. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    They played better in every aspect. Which makes their efforts to cheat all the funnier.
     
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  18. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    are you seriuous? that's been a lot of peoples arguments,17 points first half, one run, one throw, one FG



    28 points in second halt.

    2 runs, 2 throws.

    also brady was 9 for 9 in the second half.
     
  19. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    You really are gonna do this?
     
  20. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    Are you gonna attack me? I've been nothing but transparent since this started.
     
  21. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    attack you? you are on a slow troll through this thread the last few pages after a "decent" start.

    Enjoy.
     
  22. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Don Shula had a draft pick taken away for tampering with the Phins when he went to Indy? I do not recall Shula going to Indy.
     
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  23. Lionbush

    Lionbush New Member

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    This has gone beyond the game with the Colts. It doesn't matter if they had won or lost, what the issue is is that they broke two specific rules to try to gain an advantage. Also, if this is proven they cheated, it isn't the first time. For me, they have to be hammered to get the message sent home to any team that this behaviour will not be tolerated. Obviously the punishment after the spying scandal was insufficient to make them think twice about cheating in the future.

    The game and result against the a Colts is an irrelevance.
     
  24. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    That was a controversial decision because the negotiations happened before the AFL-NFL merger, and there was no tampering between rival leagues. i.e you could be found guilty of tampering within your own league, but not tampering with the other league.
    Also Don was being offered a promotion from HC to being HC and GM, so the Colts could not have stopped him going anyway.

    The tampering case was brought about because the Dolphins did not ask for permission to speak to Don Shula before they contacted him, but the did tell the Colts prior to any agreement being signed. At the same time the commissioner had given preferential treatment to Vince Lombardi moving to Washington, in a deal that was not disclosed to the Packers at all, but no penalty was applied to Washington.
     
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  25. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    When Shula was the Dolphins' head coach, I saw the Dolphins play the Colts several times in Indianapolis, so he technically did go to Indy. I just don't think there was a penalty involved. ;)

    Wasn't it the Dolphins who tampered with Shula when he was with Baltimore? I'm just not sure how Shula was guilty of tampering with himself...

    Thanks, Pauly, for the explanation.
     
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  26. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    i was thinking colts and just typed indy. coming from Indy/Balt

    Don Shula is also the only coach to lose to the Jets in the superbowl..

    just let that sink in for a minute... :shifty:





    before Section says i am trolling, i am not, i am joking..
     
  27. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    ok buddy.
     
  28. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    good read man, thanks.

    so Lombardi/Washington got preferential treatment and didnt get punished but the Phins did? I had no idea about that part.
     
  29. shamegame13

    shamegame13 Madison & Surtain

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    Robert Kraft has called Bill Belicheck a schmuck lol And I'm hoping they suspend TB12 for the SB. They are saying how is it fair for NFL to talk about suspending M. Lynch for wearing gold shoes but won't suspend TB12 for a way worse 'crime'. Haha NFL shot themselves in the foot now with them telling Lynch that. Now the NFL's golden boy has to take a worse penalty or eyebrows will be raised.
     
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  30. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    To me this whole thing is blown out of proportion and pretty ridiculous. It really is stupid of Belichick because the benefits are rather marginal, imo, relative to the costs/risks. Same with the "spygate" deal.

    I think that Belichick is a master of using every tool in the box to get a win - as with the "eligible/ineligible" reporting against the Ravens. But, his problem is that in doing so he crosses the line here and there - and often it's on something that ultimately is not overly significant - but gives a minor edge in one part of the game.

    It's a funny thing because this kind of stuff happens in basketball and baseball all the time. Even, in football. NFL players do everything they can get away with, intentionally so, in order to win. There are O linemen who hold on every single play and they do so because they know the refs are not going to call it every down, so to them it's worth it if they only get flagged once in a game. The Seahawks notoriously have their corners play bump and run sometimes 20 yards down field - essentially illegal contact - knowing they may get flagged a time or two but they know the refs won't do it every time and that the officials will generally get used to seeing it, which then allows their physicality to give them an advantage. Are they really trying to play within the actual rules of the game? If they are seeking integrity then they need to stop.

    Gaylord Perry through a spit-ball for 21 years - not getting called on it until his final season - and is in the MLB HOF. It's nearly a mark of honor for him. But, it was cheating, plain and simple.

    I don't know if there has been an athlete in history who tried to get away with more rule-breaking than Michael Jordan. He was a master at breaking the rules and doing everything possible that he could get away with on the court. Is that "integrity" when you do something you know is a foul or a flop and yet try to disguise it so you can get an edge and beat your opponent? Especially if you know you are going to get favored treatment? And when there are other players who won't do that - at least not to that degree? If I saw that once in MJ I saw it a 1000 times in his career.

    Ultimately, it was a foolish move by the Pats to go that far under given the risk/reward (because while it has a benefit it's not going to radically change the outcome of the game).

    It's funny how the media is so up in arms about this when it pales in comparison to something UNC did for a decade with their A-A studies program - and yet, nothing has happened there (Even respected professors at UNC have called on the sports programs to vacate championships).

    There's just way too much hypocrisy involved all the way around in the whole 'deflatriots' "scandal" imo.
     
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  31. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    They were not going to suspend Lynch. They were simply not going to let him on the field with the shoes on. That comparison is just not the same.

    The real problem is with the officials checking 2 hours + before the game instead of having someone on the sidelines for each team checking the balls 15 minutes before the game. It's a Trillion dollar business and you can't have some guy on the sidelines to check this?

    But, even more ridiculous than that, is the rule in the first place. It's rather arbitrary. Rogers wants the rule to be changed to something else entirely. It's just overblown.
     
  32. shamegame13

    shamegame13 Madison & Surtain

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    Lynch was still being threatened of getting tossed from game over cleats, its the same as a suspension. What NE/TB12 did is way worse.

    It doesnt matter if YOU think the rule is stupid, its still a RULE that NE violated, they deserve punishment for it. Its no different then a seatbelt ticket, most people think its a dumb law (because they are only harming themselves) but people will still be suffering consequences if caught not wearing their seatbelt.
     
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  33. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    [​IMG]

    I think we need to petition the league for the Pats to change their logo.
     
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  34. McLovin

    McLovin Resident Pats fan.

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    I guess you could say, the story about Rodgers and his footballs is....






    overblown..


    [​IMG]
     
  35. shamegame13

    shamegame13 Madison & Surtain

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    They should get a name/logo change. They are called the Patriots, which is a representation of the history of America, and they are possibly the most corrupt team organization in all of team sports. New England Snakes is more like it... bunch of snowballs.
     
  36. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    [​IMG]
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    Take your pick :knucks:
     
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  37. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    According to what I just heard on Sirius NFL radio... Bill, in his PC this morning said something along the lines of not knowing about the rule, not knowing anything about it, not touching the balls, not caring about them. He basically said you need to talk to Tom Brady about it. Apparently Brady is scheduled to speak at 4pm today...

    I can only go by Booger McFarlane, and Ross Tucker's brief synopsis after the PC was over, I turned it on too late here in the office to catch the entire PC.
     
  38. shamegame13

    shamegame13 Madison & Surtain

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    So funny, they are gonna slither their way out of this one using the 'stupidity/ignorance' tactic... "We didn't know....."
    If this was any other team besides maybe Dallas, they would be facing major sanctions but its NE, they will get a tickle on the wrist.
     
  39. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What you're missing here though... Rodgers says he likes them over inflated, yes, we know that. Great. However, Rodgers isn't over inflating balls AFTER they are inspected by the officials. He may have either had the equipment guys, or himself, who knows, over inflate them prior to handing them over to the officials. Because Rodgers also said, that he hates that the officials let the air out of them. So clearly, he's had someone over inflate them. The officials have inspected them, deflated them to within the proper range allowed by the NFL, that's what Rodgers' complaint was about.

    The difference here, is the New England footballs apparently passed the inspection by officials pre-game, but were found deflated after the fact. That's blatantly circumventing the rules. To me, if you do it, hand them over to the officials for inspection and they miss it, well, then so be it. To do it after the fact, is just blatant cheating.
     
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  40. Marino420TD

    Marino420TD New Member

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    I believe that the Dolphins obtained permission to talk to Shula from the Colts president. However, the owner was out of the country and threw a fit when he found out because the president (his son) didn't have that authority.
     
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