YES YES YES!!!!

Cut wheeler asap

 

hate to say it but Ross is paying wheeler 5m this year whether he's on the roster or not because of how his contract was set up. We're stuck with that bum for another year unfortunately.

Hopefully we can get Jackson.

 

Interesting. Despite the fact that they'll have to eat his cap number, I do think the Dolphins will look to cut Wheeler and improve at that position. This way Jackson plays MLB, and Ellerby moves over.

 

I targeted him a few years ago when he became available, but they resigned him, we know he is a tackling machine, he's thirty, but we haven't had that type of consistent presence in the middle since Zach..Keep lineman off him and he will make a lot of plays, plays that we that we can take for granted at times but can be very effective in playing great defense.

 

It would be a huge leadership upgrade, but his run stopping has been atrocious the last couple years.

 

Is worth whatever we'd pay him + Wheeler's cap hit? Because that's what it would be. That's a really big chunk for what might be a short term upgrade.

 

Do you have a PFF breakdown of that? I'd be curious to see whether he's been better or worse when Cleveland's been in a 3-4 or 4-3 since he's been in both styles. Again, I can appreciate them wanting go bring in a guy like Jackson...I just don't see it unless they're not afraid of dumping Wheeler (which they shouldn't be, regardless of the dead money issue).

 

You've made great points about why we should look at Jackson, but if he moves on to someone else, it'll be portrayed as him using the fins to get more money elsewhere...

Besides...I don't see how they fit Wheeler/Ellerbe/Misi/Jackson in the lineup...they are paying Wheeler a lot whether he's here or not...so I still suspect that Jackson is a pipe dream for Fins fans...

 

Even if you don't want Wheeler to start and cannot trade him it makes no sense whatsoever to cut him. At least keep him as an expensive backup since ya gotta pay him anyway. Same with Ellerbe who is really not any better from what I can see. If Wheeler is on the roster, he counts $6.4 mil against the cap. The dead money would be over $10 mil. It costs far more to cut him than keep him. Next year when his salary is not guaranteed, cutting him would be far more practical.

 

Don't we have a new LB coach?

 

In theory I agree with you. It just seems you rarely see a guy making that much sitting on the bench. Personally, I'd be fine with it though.

 

I don't like the way PFF grades LBs.

D'Qwell isn't a guy who is going to shed off a ton of blockers and make plays. He is fine against the run when his line can keep vlockers occupied and allow him to use his athleticism. Plus most thumpers are poor against the pass and vice versa.

 

I don't know the guy and haven't researched him yet, but if that's true then I'd be pretty wary.

 

He's possibly the best leader at MLB left in the game as well as a ridiculously good pass defender. He's a three down backer.

His run stopping is bad based on PFF grades...which like I said I personally hate for LBs. He's a tackling machine.

Good article here

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_lb_dqwell_jac_8.html

 

Aside from all the reasons I like Jackson, this makes me happy bc it shows that they are awaremof what a big issue it was last year. Ireland would not have done this simply bc they were his picks

When you start looking at packages Jackson could play all three downs...well. Ellerbe tried that last year but he just isn't a great pass coverage guy. Not horrible but not good. So that would put us, players already signed and adding Jackson, with:

Misi Jackson Ellerbe
Vernon/Jordan Odrick DT Wake

And passing downs:

Jackson Jenkins
Jordan Vernon odrick wake

If Patterson can stay healthy and our young guys develop, the backend might not need much work.

 

I too am happy that they are at least looking at the LBs and realize that there was definitely a problem. I couldn't watch a game last year without screaming about Ellerbe being pushed back 8 yards away from the play or Wheeler just whiffing totally on a block or hole. Playing Ellerbe outside intrigues me. He looked woefully out of place in the middle. Wheeler was just plain bad

 

I don't really like Jackson at all. He's got the same issues getting pushed around our linebackers had last year, and I don't really give a **** if he can cover. They drafted a coverage linebacker last year who filled the role pretty well in Jelani Jenkins.

It's nice they are considering their options, I'd prefer they not sign another bad player.

 

Its your right to not like him but I could not disagree more. Also did you really compare him to Jelanie? Riiiight.

 

I had the same thoughts. Wheeler has to go, give Ellerbe one more shot at olb, and get a MLB in here that can control the middle.

 

Give me Chris Borland from Wisconsin. The next Zach Thomas!!!!!

 

Yeah, truth be known Ellerbe was worse then Wheeler, Jackson is an upgrade, unless Ellerbe can channel his inner Ray Lewis, he is very upgradeable.

Wheeler is more of a run around player, Ellerbe is flat out weak at the poa

 

Agreed, Jelani Jenkins is waaay underrated, if anyone pushes Wheeler out, it should be him.

To me, the guy has massive potential

 

Since we're stuck with wheeler and Ellerbe, maybe we can put their game checks on the opposing TE or RB. They'd never be able to catch them and cash the check. Boom more money to sign Jackson.

But in all seriousness our LB play was atrocious something HAS to be done.

 

The 2nd Patriots game might be pretty telling as far as the allocation of snaps goes moving into this year. I was surprised Ellerbe covered as well as he did, but I think Jenkins, if he learns to time his blitzes properly, could be very dangerous in sub packages.

 

he did play solid in certain situations and flashed a bit..more than I thought he would.

 

They can't cut Wheeler without a significant cap hit. He will likely be on the roster opening day, but starting may be a different manner.

 

Next stop Indy: http://t.co/hGcSbieDmn

 

If we wait until 2015 to cut Ellerbe, there would be a cap savings of $5.6 mil. This year it costs 6 mil to keep him and over 11 mil if we cut him.
Wheeler costs 5 mil to keep and over 10 to cut. Next year it would be a $200k savings to cut him.

Of course, if we found some team that would trade for either one, that lessens the cap hit, since we'd not have to count the guaranteed base salaries against our cap. Who would trade for either one, and what would they give? I wouldn't expect many suitors.

 

I'll pass

 

Cleveland fan here, having watched every one of his games as a pro across four different defensive schemes I'd say he's a plus level MLB for a 4-3 team. He's very good in pass coverage but hasn't been used much to attack the line of scrimmage. His best years came in a 4-3 two and three years ago. He will be a volume tackler in any scheme, but was miscast last year as a SILB. My guess is he will get $5-$6 million per year, but I'm no contract expert.

 

MIA meeting w D'Qwell Jackson

Players who do well for other teams and don't do well when we give them a big payday could have a character problem, or they could be square pegs that the coaches have stuck in round holes.

I may not be too happy with Coyle if this rumor is true. If Wheeler and Ellerbe played well for their previous teams, it may be worthwhile to try to motivate them and/or adjust the system so they can succeed rather than throwing them in the trash the year after we brought them in.

 

I'm a little worried that Ellerbe versus D'Qwell Jackson may be six of one, half dozen of the other.

But then again, Jackson was purely better than Ellerbe in 2013.

The delta is really the leadership angle. Dannell Ellerbe is not a leader and I don't think people in Baltimore regarded him as one. There were even publicly visible signs he was not a leader when he got here. The locker room definitely lacked leaders and D'Qwell is a noted leader and high character guy.

I'm neutral on the move to be honest. Miami will not have ot pay Dannell Ellerbe $6 million of guaranteed salary in 2014. They will have to pay Ellerbe whatever he doesn't make from his new team, and that includes signing bonus he receives as part of the new contract. Whatever compensation he makes in 2014 offsets the $6 million Miami owes. That's what I've been told by two agents.

 

wut teams want ellerby? maybe think trade is a better thing

 

Say you cut Ellerbe, the cap hit is $11,600,000. As long as he's on the team the cap hit is $7,425,000. If he is cut, why would another team sign him for more than the veteran minimum? I doubt they would. That is how much? About $1 mil? So, there is still over $10mil in dead money counting against the cap if cut and another team does sign him. That does not look like a lateral move to me from a salary cap standpoint.

 

For the same reason D'Qwell Jackson will sign for more than the veteran minimum. For the same reason Brandon Spikes will sign for more than the veteran minimum. Because they'd all be FREE AGENTS and will be free to sell their services to the highest bidder.

If Baltimore and Cleveland are interested in Dannell Ellerbe and Cleveland is offering the veteran's minimum whereas Baltimore is offering the veteran's minimum plus $1 million of signing bonus, can you guess which team he'll sign with? Exactly.