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Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Galant, Jan 10, 2022.
Yeah, but he made Sark and Koetter run variations of Shanahan's offense. Neither had experience with Shanahan's schemes and by their second season, they were running bastardized unwatchable versions of Shanahans WCO. Personally, I think either guy could have had more success with his own scheme and Quinn's insistence on keeping Shanahan's playbook without keeping one of Shanahan's disciples to run it (Matt LaFluer and Sean McVay were Falcons assistants) is what led to his demise. Expecting coaches with decades of experience to understand the nuances of another long-time coach's scheme was always destined to fail.
The Falcons lost three games in 2020 that they had a 90%+ chance of winning. The only team that I know more about than Atlanta is Miami and IMO, Quinn is a helluva DC but when the ship's tipping over, he doesn't have answers to keep it upright. I wish him all the good in the world, but I really don't want him to coach the Dolphins.
It’s been nearly 48 hours since Flores’ firing and with that time to allow this to digest a little more, I’ve come to the following conclusion…
Our next head coach will be yet another experimental coordinator being given the chance to be a head coach. It’s been the Dolphins’ MO since Wannstedt.
Nick Saban: His collegiate record spoke for itself, but wasn’t given the latitude he had in college ie; Drew Brees
Cam Cameron: Rode on the back of a good San Diego team that was built prior to arrival as OC.
Tony Sparano: Bill Parcell’s chosen HC which no one questioned since we all knew/assumed who was actually in charge. Once Parcells bailed…
Joe Philbin: See Cam Cameron above
Adam Gase: See Cam Cameron above
Brian Flores: See Cam Cameron above with this added caveat…he was a defensive position coach that was actually calling the defensive plays and not the actual DC. And was a true leader for the players.
None of these coaches had NFL head coaching experience and until Ross sells the team or dies…until Chris Grier is fired, Miami will continue to experiment in project head coaches that have no resume or reputation to stand up to the front office and win
I really hope we avoid the hot OC to HC plan again. It hasn't seemed to workout in most cases. I hope they lock in on an older coach who can bring in guys to evaluate the weaknesses of these younger players and correct those issues. I want my leaders on the field, and coaches/teachers on the sideline. Flores clearly had the pulse of the defense and those guys seemed to like and respect him, but clearly there was an issue with the offensive side of the ball. He didn't have a plan, and couldn't manage to hire a competent staff. I've heard Caldwell which I think would be a good fit.
Kellen Moore is fool's gold.
Look at what he has around him. Dak isn't Tom Brady, but he is a respectable QB.
Amari Cooper is great, but if that isn't working, he can shift to CeeDee Lamb who is also excellent.
If the passing game isn't working, he can shift to Zeke who is still good despite regressing. If Zeke is too banged up, he can shift to Tony Pollard who is a starting caliber option.
If that isn't working, he can try and get the ball to Dalton Shultz who is above average.
BTW - Dallas has a pretty good line.
Now put Moore in Miami.
Obviously, he will try to get the ball to Waddle. What is next after that? Parker? You better hope he is playing that week.
Gesicki - He is pretty solid but he completely disappears at times.
That's pretty much it.
This has the makings of Gase and Philbin all over. When we hired Philbin, we expected to have the Packers' offense. When we got Gase, we all thought that we would look like the Broncos' offense.
I know the train of thought...
Get Moore, and we will look like the Cowboys. I can see through this.
I would have to think WR would be immensely upgraded this off-season. I think they let Gesicki walk. The next time he breaks a tackle it would be his first. They need guys that can do something with the ball after they catch it.
I agree with Initial poster about Moore. I Don't trust he can duplicate results. I agree with you the WR core has to be re-evaluated. I like Parker and think he has skill, but I think he has checked out. New scenery would probably benefit him. Fuller should also be gone. I'd like for them to try and get Allen Robinson as a good compliment to waddle. Hollins is a good backup and I hope Bowden can also help, especially with returning duties. I'd keep Gesicki, personally I think they were not using his skill set correctly. Wouldn't pay him Kelce money though.
Some have flopped (re Gase!)
But when you look at current playoff teams… there are more than a few examples of ‘young, offensive minded’ hires who have hit their stride as head coaches.
Lafleur, McVay, Kingsbury, Shannahan, Taylor and Siriani.
Mike McDaniel last April (2021)
Presser in Dec:
Kellen Moore July 2021:
And before the draft:
Fair point. It could work out, but our track record seems poor. Obviously, time will tell I would just prefer a not first time HC this time around.
A look at Daboll's offense:
In the last two seasons, we have "upgraded" the running back position by signing Malcolm Brown and Jordan Howard.
Where I agree that we are going to try and upgrade at WR, it is far from certain that our unit will actually be better. In fact, there have been times where we are actually worse. Jordan Howard was supposed to be an upgrade, but not only did he wind up getting cut, he cost the team cap money.
I thought that this year's draft class was one of the best in team history, but that being said, a guy like Hunter Long barely dressed and was a non-factor. We have upgraded at WR with Teddy Ginn Jr., Mike Wallace, and Ernest Wilford in the past.
I think that it is time for us to move on from Parker, but I do realize that there is a real chance that his replacement could very well be worse than him.
My frame of referencing when thinking about a new coach is to consider how they could build a team with the current nucleus of players that are on the roster. I think about FAs and draft picks as bonuses. For example, I think we will probably sign Chris Godwin, Allen Robinson, or Mike Williams. Is it possible that for various reasons that we get none of those guys? Okay, so we will draft a WR. Could a run of WRs go before pick, and it could be a reach to grab one at our pick? The Broncos jumped us to grab JaVonte Williams this year. It could happen again. I really do think that last year we wanted to upgrade the RB more than we did. I just think that the cookie did not crumble in our direction.
Add the Dolphins to the list of teams interested in speaking to Cowboys offensive coordinator Kellen Moore about their head coaching vacancy. Ian Rapoport of NFL Media reports that the Dolphins have requested an interview with Moore. The Jaguars and Broncos have also shown interest in Moore since firing their head coaches.
Reports about the Dolphins’ decision to fire Brian Flores on Monday have centered on his strained relationships with others in the building. That included his relationship with quarterback Tua Tagovailoa, who would have one clear bond with Moore if the two men wound up working together.
Moore was the last left-handed quarterback to throw a pass in an NFL game before Tagovailoa entered the league in 2020. That’s unlikely to be enough to make him the choice, but it does give him a different perspective on a player whose name figures to come up in the interview process.
Nick Saban. Before you question my sanity, think about it.
I know I know, but I don't care what happened in the past I just want to win.
If you were a WR FA would you really want to come here? Run 4 yard our patterns or 3 yard crossing patterns?
Saban won't win without getting the right QB. That's what did him in last time, making the wrong call on Brees (or at least our medical personnel made the wrong call). I'd prefer an offensive HC that can get the most out of Tua given that Tua is likely our QB next year.
I was thinking along the lines they have a successful history together. I know that don't guarantee anything in the NFL but who knows.
The Dolphins have requested an interview with Bills defensive coordinator Leslie Frazier, Albert Breer of SI.com reports. The Bears also have requested to talk to Frazier, who has spent the past five seasons as Buffalo’s defensive coordinator.
Frazier has head coaching experience, taking over the Vikings as interim coach in 2010 before getting the full-time job from 2011-13. He went 21-32-1 and made the postseason once in his tenure in Minnesota.
The Dolphins also have requested interviews with Bills offensive coordinator Brian Daboll, 49ers offensive coordinator Mike McDaniel, Cowboys defensive coordinator Dan Quinn and Cardinals defensive coordinator Vance Joseph.
Every team throws short passes more often than not.
I think we’re going to end up hiring Brian Daboll.
Same guy who did this?
“Nick Saban literally just starts walking in, steps over Jeno James convulsing, doesn’t say a word, doesn’t try to help, goes upstairs, I don’t know what he does. But then obviously they get Jeno trauma-offed to the hospital.”
Sometimes they do, but occasionally they don't.
I knew this would come up. There were conflicting stories from players who were there at the time and some never recalled Saban stepping over James.
I wasn't there so I can't say for sure what happened. I'm not the biggest Saban fan, in fact I've been rooting against Alabama since he went there but from a fan standpoint I believe he would be successful with this current Dolphins team.
Seth McKinney said it was true and the only I can find anything close to a firmly conflicting account is Yeremiah Bell.
Saban is a college coach period. He doesn't have the attitude for the NFL. If we HAVE to do a college guy, it's Riley or Day, but if as soon skip that well altogether.
Leslie Frazier, bleh.
I thought that was no longer in question. - LOL
The question is, like it or not, who will he agree to as our new HC.
Ok fine, I'll be reasonable. We'll just have to lure Bill Cowher out of retirement then.
That would honestly be more reasonable than giving Saban another go.
I see a lot of mega-mega names being thrown around here, and it has got me thinking. Since the dawn of the Ross era, we have never signed a premier coach. I think Ross is a a terrible owner, but in fairness to him, he is more than willing to spend money on the team.
You would think at some point, it would make sense to spend a premium on a coach who is a proven commodity and skip past the "develop the assistant" road. For a guy who likes to throw money at a problem, I gotta believe that he has tried.
My guess is that people in the know realize that Ross is a buffoon. I think we are getting a lot of guys who sorta see us as their big shot and strike while the iron is hot. Philbin never got another shot. Gase showed this to be true by immediately signing with the Jets - clearly he should have passed on that. I am curious to see if Flores is smart enough to be choosy.
Problem is proven HCs who can consistently take teams deep into the playoffs don’t get fired very often. I’ll do a run on the numbers one day, but I’ll bet the majority of SB winning coaches are first time hires, not retreads.
As easy as it would be to pin it on Ross, we have to remember that Ross didn't become co-owner until 2008, and didn't become majority owner until 2009.
Going after a premium coach isn't exactly easy. Very rarely is a premium coach available because most coaches like that are either A. already in a good situation with another team or B. retired from coaching with a cushy job as a sports anchor, sports analyst, and the like. And as much as the "develop the assistant" route can be frustrating, we have to remember that the Cowhers of the world started off as just that - assistants.
21 SB winning coaches were first-time coaches, and 13 were not. So 62% were first time coaches.
I wonder of the 13 non first-time coaches, how many had gotten to or won a SB prior to being fired/re-hired. Tony Dungy and Andy Reid obviously. I can't help but wonder if Pederson is the guy to look at similarly. Would be fun to see the Eagles fans moan about it again. Still, Pederson didn't have quite the track record Reid did.
Dungy didn't reach the SB before getting fired from Tampa. You're right about Reid. Vermeil is another: went to the SB in 1980 with Philly but won his SB with the Rams in 1999. Then long time ago there was Hank Stram who won his SB with his 2nd team (KC in 1969) but won the AFL championship with Dallas before there was a SB.
Joseph has no business being out HC failed at Denver and has Arizona around 11th best defense in nfl..
I suspect our next coach will be on one of the playoff teams and not these fired or not playing DC’s right now.
Don Shula reached the SB with the Colts. He was poached from Indy by offering him HC/GM + a 5% stake in the Dolphins