Michael Bennett is visiting the Dolphins today\Signs with Seattle

"slickj101 wrote:

A little more proven and a lot older.

Sign them to short deals.

"Anonymous wrote:

Sign them to short deals.

And draft players to take over.

"Anonymous wrote:

Sign them to short deals.

"ckparrothead wrote:

And draft players to take over.

Why? I mean sure you could do that but if you really like Bennett and think he can play both sides (maybe he moves to Wake's after he's gone) why not lock him up now?

"slickj101 wrote:

Why? I mean sure you could do that but if you really like Bennett and think he can play both sides (maybe he moves to Wake's after he's gone) why not lock him up now?

Well, he may not be able too. It's a risk.

But the reason I want Abraham is because I think he's much better. It's hard to believe he's out on the market, honestly. He's an elite pass rusher and he could be signed to a good deal. That doesn't happen very often. And he mainly rushes from the right side, which is convenient for us.

PFF had him 7th against the run and had 3rd most QB hurries last year at 48, which was more than Wake...

Interesting...

"Anonymous wrote:

Well, he may not be able too. It's a risk.

But the reason I want Abraham is because I think he's much better. It's hard to believe he's out on the market, honestly. He's an elite pass rusher and he could be signed to a good deal. That doesn't happen very often. And he mainly rushes from the right side, which is convenient for us.

Well obviously we don't sign him if we don't like our odds of him being successful on the right :lol: I think Coyle will have a better idea on those odds than any of us.

With Abraham you're just waiting for the decline, imo. I like what he does but if you can get a long-term option who's as good if not better now then you do it.

"slickj101 wrote:

Well obviously we don't sign him if we don't like our odds of him being successful on the right :lol: I think Coyle will have a better idea on those odds than any of us.

With Abraham you're just waiting for the decline, imo. I like what he does but if you can get a long-term option who's as good if not better now then you do it.

I'm not denying that he can't play on the right. He probably can. It's still a risk, though. But hey if they sign him, I'll be on board because they do know better.

I don't see why we're just waiting for the decline on Abraham. What makes you say that?

Having a good stable of pass rushers is a boon. I hope we get him.

For some reason when I make a case like this people assume I'm being absolutely adamant as if I'm just explaining facts. I'm not. I'm explaining my opinion. I have an opinion on how well the guy fits left or right and so I'm explaining it.

For starters it's no coincidence the very FIRST thing I mentioned when talking about whether Bennett can move to the right side, was observations related to his tape. I've watched it. Before I knew ANY stats whatsoever, I came to the conclusion he would struggle in pass rush if forced to move to the right side. Why? Because consistently he shows between poor and mediocre initial quickness and speed getting into his rush. He makes up for it in other ways. He's a player I like, trust me. But I think when you're rushing the other side you're going to need that athletic ability more.

So that's when I chose to look at the stats I'd dug up for someone else. He's in there. I've got the entire league of pass rushers from 2008 to 2012 in there so I checked. I personally think the stats there back up what I noticed on the tape. He was able to affect the QB on 11.3% of snaps on the left, only 8.0% on the right, and I think that makes a lot of sense when you consider his athletic limitations and what you see on tape.

As for the athletic limitations, he ran a 5.00 at the Combine (unofficial) and followed it up with a 4.86 back home on his pro day track.

"Anonymous wrote:

I'm not denying that he can't play on the right. He probably can. It's still a risk, though. But hey if they sign him, I'll be on board because they do know better.

I don't see why we're just waiting for the decline on Abraham. What makes you say that?

It's FA, everyone is a risk.

14 years in the NFL.

"slickj101 wrote:

It's FA, everyone is a risk.

14 years in the NFL.

Some Free Agents are less riskier than others.

I don't get your second sentence. He's played 14 years in the NFL, so he's going to decline to sign here?

"ckparrothead wrote:

I love the player. But I assume he's going to get money, and I don't like the gamble.

You're essentially trying to hope that he can make the switch, and he's not really shown (yet) that he can do it. Maybe he can. Who knows. But it's an unnecessary risk versus guys who are a little more proven on that side.

Yet your dream draft is to pick up Bjoern Werner, with the 12th pick who played on the left DE in college. I love Werner by the way, think he got a great motar. But not buying that Wake & Bennett would not be a great pass rushing combo. Hope Ireland can pull it off, have my fingers crossed.

It could just be that the players he faced on the left were better than the right not so much his adjustment or anything of that sort. Still a great DL, very good LB group, good safeties, and mediocre CBs.

"Anonymous wrote:

Some Free Agents are less riskier than others.

I don't get your second sentence. He's played 14 years in the NFL, so he's going to decline to sign here?

:lol: I meant decline as in his play.

"Anonymous wrote:

Some Free Agents are less riskier than others.

I don't get your second sentence. He's played 14 years in the NFL, so he's going to decline to sign here?

I think he means it's a risk because he could decline in production pretty quickly.

"Perfectville_USA wrote:

Yet your dream draft is to pick up Bjoern Werner, with the 12th pick who played on the left DE in college. I love Werner by the way, think he got a great motar. But not buying that Wake & Bennett would not be a great pass rushing combo. Hope Ireland can pull it off, have my fingers crossed.

Bjoern Werner is a guy that I've seen on film actually rush the passer better and more efficiently from right defensive end than from left. That's important. Any time I've talked about Miami drafting Bjoern I have made it a point to make that clear.

Michael Bennett is visiting the Dolphins today

"slickj101 wrote:

:lol: I meant decline as in his play.

Haha, that makes more sense.

We'll see. That's a possibility. I'll be behind whatever Miami does whether it's Bennett or Abraham.

"ckparrothead wrote:

Bjoern Werner is a guy that I've seen on film actually rush the passer better and more efficiently from right defensive end than from left. That's important. Any time I've talked about Miami drafting Bjoern I have made it a point to make that clear.

I love Werner but Bennett only costs us cap space. Plus free up the 12th pick to take a player at CB, OL, TE or WR. Plus what happens if Werner does not make it to the 12th pick? If we can add Bennett? I hope Ireland pulls the trigger on the deal.

"unifiedtheory wrote:

I like it. Means Odrick kicks inside as insurance or is trade bait.

Keep Odrick and rotate him. Starks and Soliai are both free agents in 2014.

"Perfectville_USA wrote:

I love Werner but Bennett only costs us cap space. Plus free up the 12th pick to take a player at CB, OL, TE or WR. Plus what happens if Werner does not make it to the 12th pick? If we can add Bennett? I hope Ireland pulls the trigger on the deal.

I don't know why this became all about Werner all the sudden as if I'm saying Werner or bust. Not the case at all. First off you could take Carradine at 12 and I'd be just as happy. Second, you could get other guys later, like Washington or Taylor. And in the mean time, low priced veteran to serve as pass rush specialist.

And the thing about Mike Sherman...he coached Bennett for like one year, many years ago, and Sherman was an offensive guy. How much valid input is he REALLY going to have here? I think Kevin Coyle's opinion is going to matter more. And he's going to look at the tape and either see a guy that can move to the right side...or not.

But as for Bennett's visiting...I'm not positive we should read much into it. If they sign him we know how Coyle came out on the film watching. But if not it could've just been Sherman doing a solid for one of his own, pumping up his interest.

That would've changed if he knew we were signing his brother too

I don't know if that is necessarily true.

What happened with Barnes? Bennett looks to have had his only decent year in his contract year no? I'm not one of the members constantly losing sleep over money that isn't even theirs BUT I hope we get 1 of these guys for a value. CK and his analysis of him being a better LDE has me a bit worried too.

Best De available some said ? I'm getting impatient though with all this work on the front 7 when we should have signed a Db/TE/OL already.

Either way all this martellus Bennett talk is confusing guys. I watch every giants game, had him on my fantasy team, etc. Nice player who got thrust into the right situation. Showed flashes of being Antonio gates-like. Terribly inconsistent, benefitted from their loss of manningham and injuries to nicks/ Cruz. Not a big money player and certainly not better than cook or Keller.

I don't think the left side/right side thing is a huge concern for Michael Bennett. Wake is more of an exception than the rule, and while it's certainly something to be wary of it's hard to compare Bennett with a single year of prominent play. If you're using PRP and like the player, you should probably be using it for the year he's been successful, and in that case he's been pretty reasonably close. PFF has him at 9.9 on their PRP metric on the right side and 8.6 on the left this year. There's a drop-off, but it's still quite good production and I don't see how you can say it's all that significant.

You can't really apply positional stereotypes either. The Dolphins right defensive end position plays more like what's normal from a left side end traditionally is. He's suddenly not going to be asked to be a 9-technique guy sprinting around end, it's a lot like he does now.