Michael Vick May Return

"opfinistic wrote:

I think he should be required to host a show on Animal Planet for 5 years as probation, call it "Mike Vick Gets Attacked By Pitbulls." I'd Tivo that ****.

dude you made me snort.

"Hero13 wrote:

dude you made me snort.

:pointlol:

Yes, if it were universally applied.

Like these CEO's that legally steal money and write items off while the tax payers have to bail them out.

Belichick should have been suspended for several games for admittingly cheating.

The NFL should have been fined for destroying evidence and so on.

I followed the Vick case very closely and you may be aware or not, that the police officer who blew the lid wide open in Vick's case, went above his bosses head and contacted the FBI, and then FBI took over the investigation and it became the circus that we have all become to know.

For the record, that Officer was fired.....

d-1

"opfinistic wrote:

I think if you are a public figure, one that is admired by many people and revered my many kids, you have a duty to the general public to live a decent honest life. Everything about a public figure is inflated, their paychecks, their egos, their reputations, shouldn't an inflated punishment follow suit?

I think he should be required to host a show on Animal Planet for 5 years as probation, call it "Mike Vick Gets Attacked By Pitbulls." I'd Tivo that ****.

not only should he get jail time and be suspended from the NFL he should have to do some kind of service to help dogs. he got off light if you ask me.

dogs = awesome.

"dolphans1 wrote:

I followed the Vick case very closely and you may be aware or not, that the police officer who blew the lid wide open in Vick's case, went above his bosses head and contacted the FBI, and then FBI took over the investigation and it became the circus that we have all become to know.

For the record, that Officer was fired.....

d-1

That officer did the right thing when his bosses were too starstruck to prosecute the local celebrity.

"dolphans1 wrote:

Yes, if it were universally applied.

Like these CEO's that legally steal money and write items off while the tax payers have to bail them out.

Belichick should have been suspended for several games for admittingly cheating.

The NFL should have been fined for destroying evidence and so on.

I followed the Vick case very closely and you may be aware or not, that the police officer who blew the lid wide open in Vick's case, went above his bosses head and contacted the FBI, and then FBI took over the investigation and it became the circus that we have all become to know.

For the record, that Officer was fired.....

d-1

You're barking up the wrong tree with me. And when an incident crosses state lines Barney Fife needs a little help.

Vick's life isn't over. In fact, he still has a chance to play in the NFL again. He didn't lose anything he deserved to have. His lack of morals, and complete disrespect for the law finally caught up with him. Quit trying to make him out to be a victim. The dogs were the victims, not the millionaire thug who thinks its cool to torture and execute animals. **** Vick, IMO, he doesn't deserve his freedom. 2 years is childs play.

I do not think a "conviction" is "child play", and are you saying his punishment should have been more severe....?

If so, can you elaborate what sort of punishment he should have received?

I am in no way shape or form trying to make him a "victim".

I am just stating I felt his punishment did not fit the crime and the fact that if anyone else commited this act, they would not have suffered the degree of scrutiny or punishment that Vick had to endure.

Again, I do not agree with what he did.

There are countries that still have bull-fighting today, and we all know the outcome of that sad event, yet some feel that is the culture and tradition of that country. What does this say of those people of that mind-set...?

Or what about people who sit in a tree, waiting to fire out a shot at a poor innocent animal with brown eyes....?

All I am saying is, that the punishment did not fit the crime and it seems that our society has this infatuation of watching famous people's lives being destroyed as entertainment value.

Yes Vick did something stupid, yes he used bad judgement, but he is only human and sometimes humans make stupid mistakes. At least he took responsibility for it and paid his life for it.

The legal system is designed to rehabilitate people back to society,

d-1

"gi§h® wrote:

Vick's life isn't over. In fact, he still has a chance to play in the NFL again. He didn't lose anything he deserved to have. His lack of morals, and complete disrespect for the law finally caught up with him. Quit trying to make him out to be a victim. The dogs were the victims, not the millionaire thug who thinks its cool to torture and execute animals. **** Vick, IMO, he doesn't deserve his freedom. 2 years is childs play.

I disagree...

1) You do not break the chain of command when your own department is handling the case.

2) Who knows what the "true" motivation of the officer was.

d-1

"Hero13 wrote:

That officer did the right thing when his bosses were too starstruck to prosecute the local celebrity.

"dolphans1 wrote:

I do not think a "conviction" is "child play", and are you saying his punishment should have been more severe....?

If so, can you elaborate what sort of punishment he should have received?

I am in no way shape or form trying to make him a "victim".

I am just stating I felt his punishment did not fit the crime and the fact that if anyone else commited this act, they would not have suffered the degree of scrutiny or punishment that Vick had to endure.

Again, I do not agree with what he did.

There are countries that still have bull-fighting today, and we all know the outcome of that sad event, yet some feel that is the culture and tradition of that country. What does this say of those people of that mind-set...?

Or what about people who sit in a tree, waiting to fire out a shot at a poor innocent animal with brown eyes....?

All I am saying is, that the punishment did not fit the crime and it seems that our society has this infatuation of watching famous people's lives being destroyed as entertainment value.

Yes Vick did something stupid, yes he used bad judgement, but he is only human and sometimes humans make stupid mistakes. At least he took responsibility for it and paid his life for it.

The legal system is designed to rehabilitate people back to society,

d-1

First and foremost,

If a drug- ringleader of the same "Illegal" stature as Vick, that is a large scale operation, would be looking at more Jailtime that Vick got.
Stop sticking up for a fellon.
Show me a case where somebody else has been in the same scenario and got a lesser sentence, bet you wont find in Google. Guess what, it hasnt happened.

The crimes Vick did were even much more henious than just the dogs in the rings that were killed. Since you covered the case so closely, you also know that he repeatedly killed dogs with his own bare hands..repeatedly....

As for him "Losing his life."... That is BS. He did indeed loose his livelyhood, and that is his own DAMN fault. Why do you feel he should be rewarded for being a felon?

I personally hope that Goodell takes the High-road and indeed bans this goon for life. Let him take on a regular job like the rest of us. Its not going to happen, but I can still say my silent prayers

What alerted the Officer to Vicks 2nd house, was a relative of his was busted when he was pulled over and found some contraband on his person, then used Vicks 2nd address as his place of residence

The officer got a search warrant to search the house for drugs, (not dogs) and the Officer knew it was Vicks house, no drugs were found during the search of his home, but the officer noticed all the caged pit bulls and some had scars and used this visual evidence to prod even further and got a search warrant to look for evidence on dog fighting.

His department according to this officer was not moving like he'd like it to, contacted the FED's and got them involved, even though his superiors told him do not go to the FED's.

The FED's used pressure to obtain confessions from certain individuals, in exhange for some plea agreement if they would testify against Vick.

Personally, I feel, if Vick had a better Attorney, he would have fared better by taking this case to trial, based on the above information I have presented.(there is more, but don't want to beat this thread to death)

Grant it, I have not seen all the evidence, but to my knowledge, he was not charged for any drug related charges.

I still stand firm with my original opinion with regard to his punishment.

Vick for what ever reason made a decision to make a plea of guilty and took full responsibility....

As for Godell, I am not sure what "high" road you are speaking of, he sure didn't take the "high" road with Belichick, and certainly did not take the high road when all the Patriots tapes were destroyed.

So how is that for a double standard....?

I do appreciate your opinion, but I do not agree with any of it...

d-1

"azfinfanmang wrote:

First and foremost,

If a drug- ringleader of the same "Illegal" stature as Vick, that is a large scale operation, would be looking at more Jailtime that Vick got.
Stop sticking up for a fellon.
Show me a case where somebody else has been in the same scenario and got a lesser sentence, bet you wont find in Google. Guess what, it hasnt happened.

The crimes Vick did were even much more henious than just the dogs in the rings that were killed. Since you covered the case so closely, you also know that he repeatedly killed dogs with his own bare hands..repeatedly....

As for him "Losing his life."... That is BS. He did indeed loose his livelyhood, and that is his own DAMN fault. Why do you feel he should be rewarded for being a felon?

I personally hope that Goodell takes the High-road and indeed bans this goon for life. Let him take on a regular job like the rest of us. Its not going to happen, but I can still say my silent prayers

I also dont agree with Goodell's decisions on Pacman, Billicheat and his entire incident. By High-road, I of course mean, that I hope Goodell, does what is right, and that is ban this fellon for life, unfortunately his track-record says he will indeed let Vick come back again, especially if it means more money for the league :pity:

Now then, a better lawyer? Are you kidding me? He had the absolute best lawyer money could by (He still had millions at the time), yet Vick comes out and claims Guilty. Doesnt that mean anything to you? He didnt even try to drag this thing out as he knew, and his very highly paid and high powered Attorney Billy Martin
Billy Martin (lawyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
pretty much informed him he had zero recourse and the best thing he could do is plead Guilty.

As for "Paying a harsh penalty, pffff. Here is what he couldve been facing:

If convicted, Vick could face a total of up to six years in prison and $350,000 in fines. He could face additional discipline by the NFL, even if he is not convicted.

And in perspective to him being treated unfairly:

There have been cases in Virginia where there have been convictions and people sent to prison with far less evidence," John Goodwin, a dogfighting expert with the Humane Society, said recently. "They can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that dogfighting took place on that property."

He was indeed convicted and got less than 2 of those 6 years. Hardly a "Harsh" penalty

Also lets keep in perspective EXACTLY what was going on:

Federal officials twice searched the property -- which was purchased by Vick near Smithfield, Va., in 2001 -- after suspicions were initially raised in late April. Officers reportedly found equipment associated with dogfighting, blood stains on the walls of a room and a bloodstained carpet stashed on the property. They reportedly removed more than 60 dogs from the property.

and....

The indictment said that in April 2007, Peace, Phillips and Vick "executed approximately eight dogs that did not perform well in 'testing' sessions by various methods, including hanging, drowning and/or slamming at least one dog's body to the ground." Vick also is alleged to have consulted with Peace before Peace killed a losing dog by electrocution in 2003.

Falcons' Vick Indicted In Dogfighting Case - washingtonpost.com

Sorry, but in my eyes, if this was Joe Shmoe, he wouldnt be seeing the light of day for an additional 3 years....

"azfinfanmang wrote:

I also dont agree with Goodell's decisions on Pacman, Billicheat and his entire incident. By High-road, I of course mean, that I hope Goodell, does what is right, and that is ban this fellon for life, unfortunately his track-record says he will indeed let Vick come back again, especially if it means more money for the league :pity:

Now then, a better lawyer? Are you kidding me? He had the absolute best lawyer money could by (He still had millions at the time), yet Vick comes out and claims Guilty. Doesnt that mean anything to you? He didnt even try to drag this thing out as he knew, and his very highly paid and high powered Attorney Billy Martin
Billy Martin (lawyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
pretty much informed him he had zero recourse and the best thing he could do is plead Guilty.

As for "Paying a harsh penalty, pffff. Here is what he couldve been facing:

And in perspective to him being treated unfairly:

He was indeed convicted and got less than 2 of those 6 years. Hardly a "Harsh" penalty

Also lets keep in perspective EXACTLY what was going on:

and....

Falcons' Vick Indicted In Dogfighting Case - washingtonpost.com

Sorry, but in my eyes, if this was Joe Shmoe, he wouldnt be seeing the light of day for an additional 3 years....

The fact that he ran dog fights was bad enough, the whole so called 'culture' argument made me sick to my stomach, but when I first read about the cruelty inflicted on the dogs, like you mentioned, I was appalled. I am a dog owner, have been most of my life, and this cocksucker got off light. We're not in a third world country Vick, you are (supposedly) an educated man, or did your questionable football skills coast you through college? I hope he's never re-instated and he spends the rest of his days living in squalor remembering the foolish acts that cost him his career and the good life.

"dolphans1 wrote:

I disagree...

1) You do not break the chain of command when your own department is handling the case.

2) Who knows what the "true" motivation of the officer was.

d-1

So you're saying if a cop knows something is wrong but his immediate superior refused to pursue a case that he should not try to find justice for a wrong?

f**k the chain of command - sometimes those chains are corrupt, starstruck or don't want to be known as the guy that busted the local celebrity.

As to your other statement - he picked his attorney you live and die by your own decisions.

OK, so having relatives stay at your house that are dealing drugs isn't a matter of another stupid decision he made?
I watched the animal planet special as well and the neighbors reported seeing him there quite a bit - are you going to say that he didn't know what was going on at his own house?

Once the police were there don't you think they had the right to pursue a second criminal search with the evidence provided by the caged / scarred dogs?

That would be like saying that a cop goes to a house for a noise complaint and sees a body lying in the bushes but can't look into it because that wasn't the original reason they went there. All they need is reasonable suspicion of a crime.

My "intent" is not to debate this issue as a morality issue. Nor do I attempt to convince or persuade either of you who may disagree with me over to my side.

Let's just say that I respectfully disagree.

d-1

"dolphans1 wrote:

My "intent" is not to debate this issue as a morality issue. Nor do I attempt to convince or persuade either of you who may disagree with me over to my side.

Let's just say that I respectfully disagree.

d-1

Fair enough bro. :knucks:

"azfinfanmang wrote:

First and foremost,

If a drug- ringleader of the same "Illegal" stature as Vick, that is a large scale operation, would be looking at more Jailtime that Vick got.
Stop sticking up for a fellon.
Show me a case where somebody else has been in the same scenario and got a lesser sentence, bet you wont find in Google. Guess what, it hasnt happened.

The crimes Vick did were even much more henious than just the dogs in the rings that were killed. Since you covered the case so closely, you also know that he repeatedly killed dogs with his own bare hands..repeatedly....

As for him "Losing his life."... That is BS. He did indeed loose his livelyhood, and that is his own DAMN fault. Why do you feel he should be rewarded for being a felon?

I personally hope that Goodell takes the High-road and indeed bans this goon for life. Let him take on a regular job like the rest of us. Its not going to happen, but I can still say my silent prayers

I'm with you 100% Kenny.

"dolphans1 wrote:

If Joe shomo commited something like this, 1) we would not even hear about it, 2) he/she would have received probation and paid a reasonable fine.

I understand that politics and the league's reputation plays a huge role into the harsh punishment Vick received, but this guy lost millions of dollars and his life was destroyed.

Now again, I do not agree with what he did.

But his punishment, in my opinion was unjust and unfair.....

d-1

what about all the dogs he killed who never got a chance to live with a decent family?

Vick wants to play, but what team would risk it?

Week 11: Our locks to win Top QB controversies Can Quinn save the Browns?
More NFL Videos

Michael Vick lives in a prison in Kansas, making 12 cents an hour while plotting his return to the NFL. His houses and farms will soon be gone, the two yachts are history, and he’s down to his last couple of Range Rovers.

A race horse he bought for $60,000 died of colic, the Atlanta Falcons are still trying to hit him up for millions they paid him, and the IRS and the state of Georgia want nearly $1 million in back taxes.

In 2006 he made nearly $15 million. Recently he reported total income of $12.89 for an entire month.

That’s $12.89 as in 12 dollars and 89 cents. This from someone who, before things went terribly bad, categorized a $1,000 check to his mother as “chump change.”

The numbers are cold, but they have to warm the heart of any animal lover sickened by what once went on at Vick’s Bad Newz Kennels. To many, seeing Vick stripped of the material things he and his fellow millionaire athletes like to enjoy is almost as good as watching him go to prison in the first place.
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Best of all, the dogs who survived the terror of Vick’s dogfighting ring are having the last laugh.

They’re the stars of a recent National Geographic Channel television special. They live in comfort in a Utah ranch, thanks to $928,000 Vick agreed to contribute to finance their care.

And now they have their own wine.

Yes, there’s Meryl, looking anything but ferocious on a bottle of Syrah. And there’s Lewis, peeking out from the front of another Vicktory Dog bottle.

Maybe Vick can pick up a $40 bottle when he gets out of prison next July, assuming things go as planned. If he’s careful about not spending his prison earnings in the commissary, he could be paroled with enough to buy a couple of them.

He shouldn’t drink too much, though. Because he’s still got some football to play.

Buried in the hundreds of pages of paper detailing Vick’s financial woes the other day in federal bankruptcy court was the declaration that not only does Vick expect to be reinstated in the NFL upon his release but also believes he will “be able to earn a substantial living” playing quarterback once again.

Good luck with that.

Just what team he believes will employ him to do so wasn’t mentioned, but the Falcons are surely out. They severed their ties with the quarterback they once were sure would lead them to a Super Bowl and are now being led by a quarterback who has been so good in his rookie season that he just might.

Vick is supposed to be released July 20, so he could be out just in time for the opening of preseason camps. But how many teams are so desperate for a quarterback that they would risk the ire of PETA-types and other animal activists to sign an ex-con who admitted to doing some heinous things?

The other question is how much would they risk for a quarterback who has a career passing rating of 75.7, fumbles the ball once every 10 times he carries it, and hasn’t played a down in two years. Quarterbacks who could run were once the rage in the NFL, but most teams today look for the traditional pocket passer.

If a team did take a chance on Vick, it would likely be for little or no guaranteed money with incentives kicking in only if he produces—something that can never be certain in the NFL, where injuries and age can quickly take their toll. Even then, Vick won’t keep all his salary because under his bankruptcy plan he must pay part of any future earnings to creditors.

Indeed, Vick’s financial mess is as much a cautionary tale to his fellow athletes as his criminal woes are.

He has assets of $16 million but owes creditors $20.3 million. His attorneys had to hire forensic accountants to find out where the money went, $18 million of it over the last two years alone as Vick bounced from one business deal to another and seemed to hire financial advisers he met standing in line at the supermarket.

Flush with bonus money from the Falcons, Vick bought houses by the handful, invested in a rental car franchise in Atlanta and poured money into a liquor store and restaurant. He hired friends, gave away money and cars, and could never say no to his mother, who got $700 for an Easter Egg hunt one year and $317,000 for a new church building the next.

Now he sits in a prison in Kansas after a staggering and quick fall from the top. Once a favorite of fans who couldn’t buy enough of his No. 7 jerseys he’s now vilified and hated by millions who will never forgive the despicable things he and his buddies did to their dogs.

A comeback is still possible, but my guess is that this story will not end well. Upon his release from prison, the odds are Vick will spend more time dodging creditors than defensive linemen.

The dogs are a different story. Those that survived will live in comfort the rest of their lives.

And for that, we should all raise a glass of Lewis red in celebration.

D-1.

In the future I strongly suggest you only put snippets of an article, and always always add a link.....
Thanks :up:

Vick got what he deserved, but everyone deserves a second chance at life. Maybe he's learned nothing, maybe he's learned a lot, who knows.

He has to make a living in society somehow and it wouldnt be fair for the NFL to reject him after he's already paid his dues to society.

"Alex44 wrote:

Vick got what he deserved, but everyone deserves a second chance at life. Maybe he's learned nothing, maybe he's learned a lot, who knows.

He has to make a living in society somehow and it wouldnt be fair for the NFL to reject him after he's already paid his dues to society.

Au contraire Alex.
Here is where the double standard does indeed help the Professional athlete.
If Vick were to deal with a Conventional Resume like the rest of us, this henious crime would indeed render him a much lesser, less profitable occupation.

Like it or not, with the exception of Pro-Athletes and topless dancers, being a convicted Felon does indeed garner a tougher professional life

"azfinfanmang wrote:

Au contraire Alex.
Here is where the double standard does indeed help the Professional athlete.
If Vick were to deal with a Conventional Resume like the rest of us, this henious crime would indeed render him a much lesser, less profitable occupation.

Like it or not, with the exception of Pro-Athletes and topless dancers, being a convicted Felon does indeed garner a tougher professional life

I'm not saying it doesn't, I'm saying it shouldn't.

I think if you've paid your debt to society and aren't a danger to other human beings (which I don't think Vick is) you should be given a second chance. If you've really changed then the guilt within yourself is enough to carry without the rest of the world on you too.

Obviously what he did was sick, but I'm willing to give him another chance to become a better person.