1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

***Official 2011-12 MLB HOTSTOVE OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by BigDogsHunt, Oct 29, 2011.

  1. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    sucks for V-Mart.....

    you knew this was coming...he had a nice little career, nothing crazy stat wise...but had a good run, won a ring...

     
  2. Aqua4Ever04

    Aqua4Ever04 Write Travis Write Club Member

    33,584
    36,633
    113
    Dec 7, 2007
    Seattle, WA
    How did you know that?

    [​IMG]
     
  3. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

    15,280
    7,516
    113
    Aug 15, 2010
    Davie
    It has definitely gotten to the point where I just don't care about the remaining free agents (Cespedes included).

    I just want some Spring Training reports already.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  4. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Player X is in the best shape of his life and Pitcher Y learned a new pitch. Meanwhile Player B is reporting late because of visa issues. Is that better?
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  5. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

    15,280
    7,516
    113
    Aug 15, 2010
    Davie
    As long as Player X is Hanley Ramirez and Pitcher Y is Josh Johnson, but instead of learning a new pitch, he is perfectly healthy. And I have no idea who Player B would be :shifty:.

    But yes that is much better than hearing about where Edwin friggin Jackson ends up.
     
  6. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Player B = The Pitcher Formerly Known as Leo Nunez?

    And yes I agree about your previous post.
     
  7. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    agreed I am switching gears here and going into the Yankee thread bunker...

    you have Oswalt, Jackson, Cespedes (who is probably 50), and thats it for bigger names....nothing to see here anymore move along move along...
     
  8. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

    22,603
    9,988
    0
    Nov 27, 2007
    DC Metro Area
    Plus his "real" name is probably Saturnino Orestes Armas "Minnie" MiƱoso Arrieta! :lol:
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  9. Aqua4Ever04

    Aqua4Ever04 Write Travis Write Club Member

    33,584
    36,633
    113
    Dec 7, 2007
    Seattle, WA
    The idea of moving the fences in at Safeco is catching a lot of steam.

    What would you guys think of that? (Does anyone really care? :lol:)
     
  10. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    I wouldn't move it in now, especially considering all of their top prospects are pitchers. Field a team to your strengths.
     
  11. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Montero wants it to happen...
     
  12. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

    22,603
    9,988
    0
    Nov 27, 2007
    DC Metro Area
    E. Jackson better than R. Oswalt? You cant be serious....(miles???). wow, just wow!
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  13. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

    10,332
    4,247
    113
    Dec 3, 2007
    Bradenton,FL
    Rather face Jackson all day. Roy has a problem staying healthy. But when he's healthy he's a much better pitcher.
     
  14. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

    22,603
    9,988
    0
    Nov 27, 2007
    DC Metro Area
    I would have a hard time believing any of the 30 GMs disagree with that statement! FinYank concerns me sometimes with his out of the box thinking:tongue2:
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  15. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    I think the whole health issue is the reason why Oswalt is not only still a FA but is seeking a 1 year deal. And yes Oswalt is clearly the better pitcher when healthy but I think at this part in both of their careers Jackson is the better bet to give a team 200 innings, which as a 4th or 5th starter is huge.

    FWIW Gammons was on NESN a few minutes ago and said he talked to Boras and after the conversation he feels the Sox have the best shot at signing Jackson to a 1 year deal as Jackson wants to pitch for a winning team that would give him a lot of run support.
     
  16. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Roy Oswalt would get torched in the Al East....I am not mincing words when I say this....

    If I am wrong so be it....whatever....but I wont be.....again as a Yankee fan, pray he goes to Boston....but your the guy that still loves Tex in the 3-hole come playoff time so theres that too....:tongue2:
     
  17. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    ...
     
  18. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    ...
     
  19. Mainge

    Mainge Season Ticket Holder

    6,855
    1,458
    113
    Mar 23, 2008
    West Palm Beach
    Where do you want Tex?
     
  20. Anonymous

    Anonymous Well-Known Member

    14,163
    3,423
    113
    Jul 5, 2009
    Lead off.
     
  21. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Torched might be strong words though. Will his numbers be as good in the AL East as they would in the NL? Probably not, but it's not like Oswalt is a scrub. He is still a good pitcher when healthy. Last year he was averaging 91.5 MPH from his fastball (drop 1 MPH from the previous year which probably has to do with his back problem) but he still had an ERA+ of over 100, his walk rate, ground ball rate and fly ball rate have stayed consistent with his career. I think it's fair to say that Oswalt can absolutely put up the numbers Freddy Garcia did with the Yankees last year, especially since Oswalt is a better pitcher and has a better fastball than Garcia. Of course again the key is if he's healthy. I think Oswalt could pitch and pitch well in the AL East if he's healthy, especially with his ground ball rate and control.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  22. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    In the Independent Leagues.
     
  23. Anonymous

    Anonymous Well-Known Member

    14,163
    3,423
    113
    Jul 5, 2009
    Plus, his stats against the AL isn't that bad. Granted, it's 200 innings, but still.
     
  24. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Yeah I mean 200 innings spread out over his whole career so that's what 10 plus years now is a bit of a small sample but it's worth mentioning for sure. As is him pitching in a hitters home ball park his whole career, which is something I didn't mention. But again part of the reason why he's been so effective through the years has been his control, command and GB rate which translates to either league.
     
    Anonymous likes this.
  25. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    On the bench.....with Chavez playing 1st cuz he is a better hitter....problem is his health lol.....

    I kid I kid (kinda) but 5th is perfect for him....

    The 5 hole is a good place where your lower avg, higher power guys should be...
     
  26. Anonymous

    Anonymous Well-Known Member

    14,163
    3,423
    113
    Jul 5, 2009
    I think 5th is horrbile.

    1. Gardner.
    2. Granderson
    3. Cano.
    4. Mark.
    5. A Rod
     
  27. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Jeter leads off for most of the season....and A-Rod is a better all around hitter than Tex

    Tex will actually see some pitches in the 5 hole....but you bring up an interest point because if he was sandwiched in between Cano and A-Rod....me if I am a pitcher I am going after Tex out of those 3...

    unless it is the playoffs, then hell I am going after all of them...:lol:
     
  28. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Fink why not? I know they are budget responsible but they are well under any luxury tax penalties right? they are only what 150M....(hahaha only).....they can add a pitcher I would think...

     
  29. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    No they're not under the luxury tax penalty, they're either right at it or slightly above it last I heard. Their payroll is around the 180 million mark right now.

    As for Cherington's comments, again remember that all players, agents and FO people lie. Of course Ben would love to add another pitcher but if he says that (especially with Scott Boras lurking) the price tag for the Oswalt or Jackson would go up. But I do think that Cherington is smart enough not to overpay for so-so pitchers just to add them. He's going to be smart about the signings.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  30. Anonymous

    Anonymous Well-Known Member

    14,163
    3,423
    113
    Jul 5, 2009
    Obviously I don't know the Yankees as well as you do, but I was just going by old fashioned baseball rules. OBP guys at the top, best hitter at third, and power hitter in the fourth. However, I didn't know that Jeter had a higher OBP than Gardner. So I agree with you on Jeter leading off.
    I don't see the point of having Rodriguez at third, though. I don't think he's a better hitter than Mark or Cano at this stage of his career.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  31. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    baseball reference has them at 158.1M.....
     
  32. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    No no bro, I meant Cano everday 3rd, Tex-4th and A-Rod 5th...which would be interesting because A-Rod is a better bat to ball contact hitter than Tex, so maybe Tex actually sees some pitches in between those 2....

    The good thing that there seems like there will be some pressure from the media on Tex a little bit this year.....there has been some articles this offseason stating he needs to do more...and I agree...23M a year for a 220 hitter is unacceptable...love the power, and the glove, but I would take less power numbers in return for more hits.....

    Lastly they bat Jeter leadoff because he is best there....and loyalty really.....
     
  33. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    ...
     
  34. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    I don't think/know that's correct. Every Sox writer stated the payroll was around 180 million or so.

    Here's a good article on the Sox payroll by a must follow writer, Alex Speier:

    http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/b...udget-isnt-problem-another-look-red-sox-payro

    EDIT: That 158.1M figure is before they settle on a contract with David Ortiz and Aceves, with the max between those two players to be just under 16 million, the minimum would be 13.6. So that would bring the figure to around 170 to 175ishM
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  35. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    right right I forgot about Ortiz, I was gonna say BR isnt rarely if ever wrong...
     
  36. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Moderator Luxury Box

    9,391
    3,490
    0
    Jan 3, 2008
    How do you think Hamilton's relapse impacts his contract negotiation? Seems odd to me that he has these relapses in public places...i wonder how many times this has happened at home, or in a hotel when he's alone...
     
  37. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    I mentioned a few pages ago and also a few times on other pages that I would be worried about signing him to a long term deal based on his history. I absolutely think it's going to hurt him. I'd be really surprised if a team gave him a long term deal. If I'm Texas or another team I'd offering him a 2 year deal max with a few team option years. Or if a team does want to give him a long term deal perhaps add some clauses in his contract that state if he falls off the wagon, especially with drugs he's contract is voided if the team chooses (although I'm not sure if that's legal to put into the contract or if the union or MLB offices would approve such clauses).
     
    Mainge likes this.
  38. Mainge

    Mainge Season Ticket Holder

    6,855
    1,458
    113
    Mar 23, 2008
    West Palm Beach
    A poster on another message board jokingly said he hopes he drinks his way into Miami's budget, and to be honest, he's not that far away as is. I agree with Ray. He's one more drink away, IMO, from costing himself a lot of money.

    I wonder what's going to happen to him after he retires when he doesn't have baseball to keep him preoccupied and focused everyday. Hope he has a strong support system.
     
  39. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

    10,332
    4,247
    113
    Dec 3, 2007
    Bradenton,FL
    A part of me thinks that one drink is a big deal, the other part of me says, he had a few drinks, there's nothing wrong with that. At this point though, I disagree no one will give him a long term deal. I believe he will get one. Although like Mainge says, he may be just one more drink from that changing.
     
  40. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Well, first of all this is his 2nd public outing where he was spotted in a bar drinking, so who knows how many other times this has happened (if other times have happened, whether they were in public or privately) that we know of. The problem though is that his situation and issues are just so public there's just so much risk involved for the team signing him to a long term deal. If it was anyone else of course one drink, no big deal or even if it was a few drinks (as long as he wasn't driving) again no big deal. But when you're the poster child for substance abuse in the MLB it's a huge deal. Plus I'm not sure what his situation is as far as if he fails a drug test what would happen to him regarding suspensions or even thrown out of baseball (guys can only fail so many drug tests before they get kicked out for good). As good of a talent he is, he's simply one drink away from throwing it all away. Of course even without him getting caught drinking I still think there are major red flags with him not only being on the wrong side of 30 but even staying healthy for a full season. Either way it will certainly be extremely interesting to see him hit free agency that's for sure.
     

Share This Page