***Official 2011-12 MLB HOTSTOVE OFF-SEASON THREAD***

Do you think San Francisco laughs at the Yankees before hanging up or simply just hangs up without wasting any energy to laugh? Seriously Montero and Nunez for Lincecum and Huff? Really? Why would SF do that when they would have nowhere to play Montero and come on Nunez is a back up player for one of the top pitchers in the game? I mean that's just lazy writing at least put Brett Gardner, Phil Hughes/Nova and one of the B boys to make people stop and think for a minute.

 

the calm before the hot stove storm....people are bored...

 

I guess it's a pet peeve of mine when a writer throws out a completely done trade proposal without even thinking about why or why not either team would do it.

 

See it the NBA a lot as well, just massively impractical trades or FA signings proposed, or the current fad of hype "inside information about the lockout!"

You are more of a stat head then I, would you be surprised if a sort of Jimmy Johnson style "value chart" emerged that makes it clearer "when" a young star heading toward FA a team cannot afford should trade them? And for what level of prospects at what positions?

I could actually see that being useful, avg dollar amount of expected contract, or arbitration, and the success or failure rate of prospects in such deals and what positions they played.

 

It would probably be tough to determine a specific model that says exactly when a team should trade Player X. It would depend on multiple factors that would probably change each year such as how good the MLB team is, how good the farm system is, payroll, how much money the player will cost in arbitration, which players/prospects you can get, how good do you think the player will be in the future etc. And really each player/situation is really a case by case basis.

Obviously the length of control a team would have on a player would help to determine how good the prospects/players the team gets back. Perfect example is the two Mark Teixeira trades. The Braves gave Texas a ton of prospects because Teixeira had a year and a half of control left. When the Braves traded him to the Angels they got basically nothing for him because he only had a half a year left.

Most teams already have models in place that determines future arbitration earnings and have done research on past trades, what worked and why or why not though.

Obviously using stats is important and even though I am a stat head it's also important to actually watch the games. Stats only tell you so much and they could be misleading (as can your eyes). I'd never base trading/keeping a player strictly on stats.

I think the biggest mistake teams make is that they overvalue their own prospects. Although I think in 5 years free agency is going to be extremely different as teams will be more focused on building up their farm systems and developing their own players and signed them to long term extensions to cancel out their arbitration years and keep them with the team during their peak years. Free Agency will never be dead but I do think a lot of teams are going to be more and more causious with it moving forward.

 

fielder and reyes to seattle! cheaaaaaaa

 

Man, the Giants would be so stupid to trade away Tim Lincecum.

 

All I am saying in this is whatever package NY would have to give up for Linecum, the same package would get Kershaw.....

I would even throw in more....and you have a better pitcher, 4 years younger, with less innings on him....

 

The other thing is RF, the MLB draft is probably more important then it was 15 yrs ago, the quality of player coming out of NCAA programs has improved that much, the picks for losing guys in FA should be in that mix as well.

MLB will never have a draft that has a NFL type of impact, however it has risen in importance in my view.

Another issue, that somewhat surprises me, is the death of the platoon system at positions, any idea why that happened?

 

In theory you'd think that but I bet Kershaw would command a higher package. He's young, a lefty and has more years under team control. I'd rather have Kershaw, I think he's better.

No question the draft is much more important. Hell I'd say it's more important now than it ever was. The MLB draft will never have the importance as the NFL or NBA draft only because it takes so long for the guys drafted to reach the majors and only a certain % of the guys even drafted on live TV will even make it to the MLB.

I wouldn't say the platoon system is dead but I don't understand why more teams don't use it. Especially with the older more established players it seems like managers are afraid to hurt their feelings yet they have no problem sitting a young LHH against a LHP.

 

I suspect a part of the reason why it takes so long is it is the "way we have always done it" syndrome, there are no flags that go up on a player saying "he's ready" or 'he's not ready" the only real way to find out is to play them and clubs just hesitate to do so.

Even Rizzo, whom I'm not a fan of, should have been tossed into the fire to see what he had, the key is to continue to toss him out there, BUT with FA I suspect teams just don't want to risk losing the service time while training the player.

When that system was really in place, platoon Catchers and platoon OF were commonplace, heck Baltimore won WS with a couple of positions manned by platoon players.

 

If the player is ready and especially if the team isn't good yes by all means bring him up and just play him. Let him take his lumps along with his successes, it will make the player a better player in the end. Regarding Rizzo, it was obvious he wasn't ready. The problem was he was just killing Triple A pitching he forced SD's hand. But that happens with younger players, not everyone is going to come up and hit like Braun or Pujols. Heck Pedroia was terrible in his first 50 plus games in the MLB and then turned into a monster. It happens. Same with Roy Halladay, he was awful in his first MLB stint. Baseball is the hardest game to play, sometimes it takes guys more time to figure it out. On the flip side sometimes you get non talents like a Shane Spencer or Chris Shelton that come out of nowhere and dominate for a month or so then flame out.

 

Didn't expect to see him in the NL.

 

laff laff

He has played 4 games in the field since 2005.

Now it'll be fun to see them give a ****load of money to Rollins.

 

...

 

we as Yankee fans measure success soley on championships my friend, 1st round KO's bore me, and are the same as not even making the playoffs to me...at least if they didnt make the playoffs, maybe they would wake up and see that the reason why they didnt win is because they couldnt string 2 hits together......and it has been that way for a few years now once the playoffs come....

As the ages go up, I suspect the results will stay the same, maybe even curtail a little...just trust me BDH I will let you know when they can win the WS....
Lets see after all the chips fall in place and ST begins...

 

I thought you measured yankees success on games against the red sox now..

 

We can only hope.

 

I believe he came out and said there will be no hometown discount. I might be wrong, though.

 

This...pay attention Nappy.....everything else is trival...

 

The Duke is back.....

 

I think it speaks volumes to what a disaster that franchise is and how badly the owner truly is. They had multiple candidates turn down the job and even interviews and had to get someone that hasn't been involved in the game at the MLB level in 10 years. Granted I didn't think Duquette was a bad GM, as he had strengths at being someone very good at making trades and signing FAs but he was terrible when it came to drafting players and also dealing with players. He had a part in that 2004 championship as he brought in a lot of the core group that was there.

 

This alot of those guys were Duquettes......he will be okay if they get a strong scouting group with him...

 

I miss the Melk-Man....

 

The problem with Duquette is that he completely ignored the draft after 1994 when he got Nomar. From 1994 to 2002 when he was let go the Sox just had terrible drafts. His goal was trade the 'prospects' for MLB level players. He didn't really believe in the farm system process. He needs to change that mindset if he wants to survive this time around. Also he needs to work on his player communication skills too. He was awful at that as well.

 

So 26 as in 37?

 

ooh

https://twitter.com/#!/ESPNJoeyMac/status/133649921403404288

 

lmao

seems madson & phils are talking about deal for about $11M a year. (@jim_duquette said 4 yrs). so that'd be 4 for about 44M

 

Fools......with a 5 year possibly....

 

Unreal.

 

Because history of any RPer signing a deal longer than 3 years with the last name not Rivera has worked out so well in the past....

 

Not done?

 

....

 

whenever I see Bloomquist, this is all I can think of: