Official WWE/TNA Wrestling Thread

This. Well said.

 

People complain that WM is always predictable.

Now they complain when something unpredictable happens.

Only complaint...cena winning. No reason for it. Heel turn cena is what should have gone down.

 

rewatch the ending, there was no Botch, Taker was suppose to lose

 

btw WWE network is awesome and man 10$ for a PPV each month plus all that context, steal. Shame that it will go up one of these days, id think 19.99 a month by next year

 

for me im not complaining on Taker losing, Im complaning on who beat him, just doesn't make sense UNLESS the WWE has a deal worked with Lesnar to work more shows and be apart of the WWE more. Granted Lesnar can leave today and still be a name people will remember.

 

Why not lesnar? Dude was ufc champ for christs sake. The guy has credentials

 

http://gfycat.com/RaggedFlawlessDachshund

lol.

 

/mandatory wm contribution.

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 4

 

because he doesn't need it. WWE does not have, as a now, a long term plan with him. As of now, hes done next year at this time. Seems like a waste to me.

 

Also the buildup was weak too

 

Brock Lesnar is perfectly acceptable to end Taker's streak. He actually has more credibility than anyone else. He is a personal favorite of Vince's and obviously, Taker is fine with it since he wouldn't have gone on with it if he wasn't.

As for Lesnar not gaining anything out of it, I disagree. This just became the top line of his pro wrestling resume. This win solidifies him as a Hall Of Famer and, much like how Jericho still talks about being the first Undisputed Champion, Lesnar and Heyman will lord this over the audience for the remainder of his career. I was shocked he won, but If Taker was hell bent on losing it, Lesnar is on the short list of candidates that I would consider. The match was awful, by the way, until the ending.

Other thoughts:

-Opening segment was a lot of fun. Cool visual to see those three in the ring together at The SilverDome... The WM set might have been my favorite one ever (WM Goes Hollywood was my favorite until this year). I was actually shocked that HBK didn't make an appearance considering his status as Mr. Wrestlemania and this being a nice reunion type show considering the 30th anniversary.

-HHH vs. Bryan was the technical match of the night. Started a tad slow, but built to a logical, great conclusion wi crisp spots and an amazing story. Lots of credit to all three involved as I thought Steph added a TON to the match with her ringside presence. Even the small stuff like telling HHH where Bryan was and encouraging him to finish him were awesome touches. Mg thinks she has a future in this biz...

-Shield match was a dominating squash, and probably needed to be. My guess is that their time was cut short due to the opening segment and match going long. Either way, nice showcase for those three, and their entrance attire was pretty bad ***.

-That Battle Royal was garbage with the exception of Cesaro's spots. I liked the Kofi visual, however, he was clearly out of the ring, and on his back. Far be it from me to nitpick a scripted show with fake, arbitrary rules, but the refs blew that one. Cesaro deserved to win, but I felt bad for Big Show who might have the worst WM record ever.

-The Cena-Bray match was okay. I am not sure why Bray wrestled in his pajamas, but whatever. I didn't really mind Cena winning since the entire match was built around his "legacy." They aren't going to have him lose a legacy match. Also, I want someone at WWE to look up and define the word legacy, because this match didn't fit the bill. The in-ring story was much more compelling about having Cena opened up to a dark side. They should have built the entire story around that and kept the legacy stuff out, or transferred that tag line to Undertaker's match which legit changed his legacy. Also, Cena winning by shenanigans would have been the proper way to go, or having him lose for refusing to use shenanigans. Having him "overcome" his dark side stuff and win clean was blah. It doesn't hurt Wyatt, however. He is almost Teflon at this point. Plus, this was his first singles loss so this should add to his character.

-Taker match was already discussed. I am fairly positive you saw Taker's last match.

-women's match was...better than it should have been, but still sort of lame.

-Bryan's win was great. The match itself was tremendously botchy and overbooked. But it needed to be overbooked to get the crowd back. I assume Brock becomes the top contender for Bryan, with Batista sticking around the too of the card due to his movie coming out. I would love to see a Brock-Bryan main event at Summerslam.

 

The Lesnar/Undertaker match wasn't called on the fly this was something that was planned along. Taker has wanted to have Brock end his streak as far back as 2 years ago. This was 100% Taker's decision. Also apparently the betting lines on the Lesnar/Taker match really turned in the hours leading up to WM with Lesnar starting out as an underdog and becoming the favorite yesterday afternoon so perhaps word got out what was going to happen.

While I wouldn't have ended the streak myself, I have no issue with Lesnar being the one to end it. The guy like others have said is a legit tough guy and is completely credible. It probably doesn't do much for him in terms of getting over because the guy was already a top star but there's a lot of risk in giving someone like a Roman Reigns or another young guy the rub and having him end the streak too.

I think Extreme Rules you'll probably see Bryan vs. Triple H for the title with Batista and Orton facing each other for #1 contender and having Bryan feud with both guys until Summer Slam where Brock will probably face Bryan and win the title.

And the WWE is apparently calling Extreme Rules a "WWE Special" so I guess that's the new lingo instead of saying PPVs.

 

Undertaker was taken to the hospital after the match because the WWE thought he might have suffered a concussion and possible neck injury. No word on whether he'll be at RAW tonight as scheduled.

Billy Gunn was also injuried after taking the double super powerbomb and was coughing up blood.

Christian still hasn't been cleared for in ring action due to his latest concussion. No word on when he'll be back to come back, if at all. Personally I'd like to see the WWE give him a shot at being a color guy ala JBL. I think he'd be pretty good at all.

 

Silverdome...Superdome..I don't think it was as clunky a screwup for Hogan...and in fact, it made the first part of the segment funny.

As for the lesnar-Taker match.. I didn't mind it. As far as a brawl, it was fine considering no chairs or color (blood) was going to be involved.

As for the match being called on the fly.....

First of all, the 21-1 graphic.

I know a little about this (to be modest). Those graphics take about 4 minutes to create, but they do take about 30 seconds to load. I know a guy that has worked WWE shows before, and specialty graphics, they always create TWO as to not give away results.

Now..here is the screw-up....the graphic showed up almost instantly. Which means that it was already loaded in the segment number file. Anybody that has ever worked in a production truck realized this was lazy and poor producing.

Match of the night? HHH - Bryan.

Bray vs. Cena...PASS. Cena needed to turn heel. Simple ending, when Bray begs Cena to hit him with a chair....Cena hits him with a chair over the head....gets disqualified and then feuds with Bray through to Summer Slam, as Bray tries to get Cena to embrace his darker side.

Instead....we got Cena.....Cenaing. I'm tired of it.

Cesaro I thought needed to wrestle BIG E for the IC belt, as they have good matches, and Cesaro having that belt would have brought it "back".

 

I thought Hogan, Austin and The Rock did fine handling Hogan's screw up. Hulk also almost said WWF too. I don't think it was a big deal and they turned in around as a nice running gag. 3 pros who know how to work the crowd.

I'm interested in watching the Brock/Taker match again, I tried to view it right after WM ended but the WWE Network didn't have the PPV loaded up yet (or maybe I just couldn't find it), to see how it held up. First viewing it was probably the worst match on the card, it was just slow and heatless. Taker looked pretty bad, although maybe he was exposed because he didn't have an opponent bouncing around the ring like he did the past 4 years.

Yeah the match wasn't called on the fly in retrospect, but people were speculating that it was last night due to the camera angle and the finish kind of came out of nowhere, also the ring bell didn't ring and Brock's music didn't hit right away (which was the right choice). Most people have no clue about the computer jumbotron images and how long it takes to make etc, I didn't, so I don't think the average fan would have thought that, although seeing how you have knowledge in that field I can understand your point of view.

I'm actually surprised I really don't care the streak ended. I've been very vocal that the streak never ends because it really doesn't make sense business wise but after seeing the match and The Undertaker and maybe because I'm a huge Brock fan I'm kind of meh about it.

And no Cena doesn't need to turn heel. He's already a heel to the fans that are over 15 or so anyway. He's the WWE's #1 money maker in terms of merchandise and ticket sales etc and he's the most asked for "Make A Wish" star which is something he and the WWE takes very seriously, rightfully so. If Cena turned heel what would really change with him? Nothing except he'd be boo'ed by the same kids that make the WWE so much money off of him. It really makes no sense for the WWE to do that. Once he loses the younger audience and his popularity slides and sales go down, sure but now isn't the time.

And why would you want to punish Cesaro by giving him the IC title? Everyone that wins the damn thing just goes on a huge losing streak afterwards. Seriously though Cesaro got a huge rub last night and was the featured star in 2 matches. He's getting the rocket push now.

I'd love to see the IC title mean something but it's clear the WWE isn't interested in doing that for whatever reason, especially since they finally have a strong mid-card with young guys that could use the title and feuds to get evaluated.

 

I don;t think that Cena hitting Bray with a chair, turning heel, and then doing his Cena thing at Summer Slam as he destroys Bray is all that bad.

You have him wrestle as a heel at extreme rules and then turn him Hustle/Loyalty/Respect on RAW the next night for all I care...then build toward a Summer Slam showdown.

But no. Instead we got a microwave feud where Cena fired two lightning bolts from his *** to disintegrate Bray. YAWN.

 

But why would Cena turn heel if he hit Bray with a chair? The whole turning Cena heel thing just doesn't make sense to me. I don't know I'm just not a fan of yet another "let's try to get Cena to turn to the dark side" angle/feud it never works. In your pitch isn't it exactly what they did with Daniel Bryan and The Wyatts? Only it happened over a course of 3 weeks instead of 4 or 5 months?

If/when Cena finally turns heel it has to mean something, it can't just be because of a random thing or only last for a few months or so or it won't work and turn flat ala Stone Cold's turn in 2001.

I guess we should just be thankful that WM turned Bryan, Cesaro and The Shield into bigger stars and showcased them well.

 

If he hits Bray with a chair, it means he "stooped to Bray's" level, and thus took a dump on Hustle/Loyalty/Respect. You can even have him destroy Bryan at Extreme Rules as a mean spirited evil heel with Bray in his corner "guiding him".

Then of course Bray takes it too far. He causes Cena to lose the title....Voila..Summer Slam showdown.

Instead..Bray was a beat up boy.

 

Something interesting is happening.

Yesterday..the EAT. SLEEP. BREAK THE STREAK. T-SHirts were at full price....

Today..the price is cut by $4 as they have run out of almost all the sizes.

http://shop.wwe.com/Brock-Lesnar-Pa...or=Black&start=3&cgid=superstar-current-brock


So..the "WWE Universe" freaks out and gets all pissed off that the streak is over..but they sure line up and buy all the t-shirts?

 

[video=youtube;UkM48Kmk0yY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkM48Kmk0yY[/video]

 

Pardon my ignorance on the subject, since I don't really bet and don't watch wrestling...They allow BETTING on WWE? If the results are predetermined before the matches take place, it would create a very obvious conflict of interest, no? Plus, it's not like only the Wrestlers know who wins, I'm sure there are ALOT of people who know before the matches take place? I recall sometime last year there was a guy on reddit posting all results, before the matches took place claiming that that info was easy to come by.

How is that allowed?

 

Las Vegas does not allow it but Internet sites do. Having slept on the taker loss, I'm move okay with it because I do like Brock, just wish he was more commuted to wwe and I'm hoping he is now.

 

Eh, I don't really love that idea. Sorry.

 

Yeah you'd think that huh? I think the sites that allow the betting limit the dollar amount being put down on each match. I don't bet personally so this is coming from 2nd hand knowledge of it.

 

Very transitional WM.

Bryan beats HHH, Orton and Batista.

Undertaker loses his streak.

The Shield squashes the Attitude Era guys.

Cesaro wins a battle royal that had at least five world champions in it.

About the only one that did not win of the new breed was Wyatt, and I really don't think he was hurt by the loss.

Every tenth WM, you seem to get this sort of transition. WM10 had the Ladder Match and Bret Hart winning the title.

WM20 had Benoit win his title and Eddie Guerrero retain his (Bryan's win now replaces that moment since they can show this one now).

And WM 30 has Bryan.

I think we have an official changing of the guard on our hands.

If I have time later, I will put together a quick booking of where I would go heading into WM31.

 

Lesnar never became the favorite, but did ABSOLUTELY get bet down to only +850 and +600 on some sites when he was at +4000 on those same sites.

We are talking about a lot of people canceling their bets at -3000 for Undertaker and plenty more taking Lesnar at +1500 or so.

My guess is that a lot of WWE creative people got bonuses yesterday. Which is unethical, but it is what it is.

 

Ok, I had read that Lesnar went from underdog to favorite by late Sunday afternoon but have no clue if that was factually correct or not.

You would think that if the WWE found out about employees or wrestlers betting on the matches that they would get in a bit of trouble if they were caught but who knows.

Bottom line is if a website is willing to take bets on a sport that's predetermined it's kind of on them.

 

While I think Wyatt should have won because the win would have done more for him than it does to Cena, I don't think the loss hurts him. He's still going to be a main feature on the shows and the "specials".

And I agree this absolutely was a transition show. WM was great because it showcased the newer talent and let them have their spotlight/moments. I just hope it stays that way moving forward.

 

Sect kinda makes my point, no?

 

Incorrect about how many people know the outcome of matches ahead of time. Often times, only the performers and ref themselves know the outcome, along with the promoter/booking agent. This would be one of those cases. Everything I am hearing is that about 6-8 people knew. That includes, Taker, Lesnar, the ref and Heyman. Which means the other ones are probably Vince, HHH, Stephanie and the agent assigned the match.

The ref was probably not told until he was in the ring or just before heading out for the match, so the odds of him telling anyone ahead of time are slim. The betting shift clearly knows that word got out though, so my guess is someone told a friend and asked them to keep it under wraps, those friends did not, and of course, it started to spread.

On the indie level, often times, even when I was reffing I wasn't told anything until I was headed to the ring. I would relay instructions to the wrestlers while "checking" for foreign objects. When I wrestled, the same process of last minute changes was given to me in the same manner, while also informing the ref of how we were going home.

As for a RAW tonight. I think you have to start with DB. Have his music hit, have him celebrate with the Yesses and start his promo, and be interrupted by Brock/Heyman. Have Heyman congratulate Bryan on his tremendous feat, but also remind him that what he did (win the title) has been done before, and will be done again at Wrestlemania. What Brock did, was unprecedented and will go unmatched, etc.

Have him explain to Bryan that his time as champion is limited, because now that Brock has disposed of UT, his sights are firmly, and intently, on capturing the WWE World Championship.

From there, perhaps have Batista or Orton interrupt Heyman and demand a one on one attach with Bryan, etc. before StepHHHanie comes out and declares those three in some sort of match to declare a #1 Contender for Nryan's title at the next PPV.

Then you have Orton RKO Batista, only to be F'5d by Brock, who stands up and walks right into a Knee Plus from Bryan who escapes the ring unharmed, as The Authority watches from the ramp, fuming.

I think that would be a great way to tie in the top two stories of WM and set up the Summer programs for your top of the card.

 

Samphin....

as evidenced by the production (I re-watched it) the Producers knew as well, because the 21-1 graphic was loaded right away.

The process is like this...

If it is already loaded..the producer just says "run it".

if it is not loaded.....

Producer tells graphics to load the file....he then tells the director that he is re-filing the graphic line ..the director then directs the graphic guy to run it and it usually then takes about 30 seconds for the computer to upload it onto the disc.

SO it was ready. and you cannot have TWO graphics in one graphic line. if you have it in two graphic lines and you just kill one of them, you still have to do the process of killing the graphic line which goes through 2 guys.

 

Interesting info Section. I will be honest with you I never really thought about that stuff. I figured it was something that could pretty easily be done on the fly.

 

So last year I said I thought it would be better if Taker lost his streak. Some interesting opinions at the time.

 

Kevin Dunn probably was made aware of it as well, which dovetails into what you are saying.

However, if you re-watch the match and listen to the commentary, it is obvious that word was leaked DURING the match. JBL pretty much foreshadowed it from about the halfway point on. So much so that Cole even verbally checked him on air (which may or may not have come from Vince in the back).

To that point, it would not surprise me if Kevin/Vince had the 21-1 graphic loaded during the match, in order to have it ready once the three count landed.

Also, going back to the process, it is possible that the ref was told in his ear DURING the match, about the ending. I knew when the endgame was happening as Taker was a little too loud about telling Brock they were going home, but obviously I didn't expect the outcome we got.

 

Also, if Taker truly is retiring, he probably should have acknowledged the crowd on some level in order to milk that last cheer. It sounds like he was in pretty bad shape though, so I will give him a pass. In fact, I will give the entire match a pass since Taker was pretty much a zombie throughout (pun partially intended).

But if you do go back and watch, JBL is clearly in the know, or is given a signal during the match, because his tone and overall commenting took a severe turn.

 

More interesting stuff.

it is on WWE network now. The "new" edited show is now 3:55:01

They edited almost 3 minutes out of last nights broadcast.

The 1-2-3 happens on Taker at 2:53:50

The big screens in the Superdome have the "broadcast" which is sent out to wwe network and the PPV providers. So whenever ANYTHING shows up on those screens, it comes from the digital feed that the truck gives out. If you watch it..the 1-2-3 happens....and the Big Screens go out at 2:53:55. The 21-1 graphic then shows up at 2:54:27. So the screens are dark for at least 32 seconds. Which suggests that they probably had a dead line in their graphic log.

Which means.....

They had TWO graphics ready, and they killed one of them, then ran the one left over.

Now, it is entirely possible that they edited this to make the graphic appear later than it actually did.

The truck does have many people that have access to the Producers log, so they might have loaded both graphics to keep these people in the dark as to who was gonna win. Then the 1-2-3 happens...and they "kill" the 22-0 graphic, and then click "run" on the 21-1 graphic.

 

I would have to go back and check. But I don't think that much time elapsed between the pinfall and the graphic being up. I am judging this on the second audible gasp from the arena, as I assume that is what they directed it towards once the graphic went up.

 

Wonder if RAW ends with a Triple H, Batista and Orton beat down of Bryan only to have The Wyatts run out for the save. That would blow the roof off the arena. Although a Shield save would work too just not as well because of the Bryan/Wyatt history although The Shield has history with The Authority.

Sets up Orton/Batista vs. Shield/Wyatts for Extreme Rules too.

 

That Heyman promo should be saved and shown to every wrestler backstage and at NXT everyday for a month straight.

 

Cesaro jumping ship to Heyman is freaking awesome. Whata great RAW so far. Heyman is going to push Cesaro to another level. Well done WWE.