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Phins vs Pats

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Finatik, Sep 12, 2023.

  1. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    If the oddsmakers are to be believed, however, this game will also not end up positively for the home team. According to the opening odds over at DraftKings Sportsbook, the Patriots are 2.5-point underdogs to the Dolphins. The over/under for the game has been set at 47.
    Miami is -135 on the moneyline, while New England is +110.

    New England being listed as underdogs is no surprise. Not only did they lose their Week 1 game, the Dolphins also won theirs in impressive fashion: behind a 466-yard effort from quarterback Tua Tagovailoa, Miami beat the Los Angeles Chargers (-3)

    The game between the Patriots and Dolphins is scheduled for an 8:20 p.m. ET kickoff on Sunday, Sep. 17.
     
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  2. Rick 1966

    Rick 1966 Professional Hipshooter

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    I have concerns about this game, simply because I feel we may sell out on the run in this game as a reaction to last week, which could open things up for Mac Jones to look better than he actually is. Also, the Pats' defense is better coached and won't allow the sort of wide-open passing game we put up on the Chargers. We're going to have to run the ball in this game to win.
     
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  3. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I haven't seen much from their game last week. Anyone watch it?
     
  4. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    “That’s a great defense,” Eagles receiver DeVonta Smith marveled. “They hold their coverage and disguise it until the last second. They are a very athletic, fast, physical defense.”

    There are no moral victories in New England, but the play of the D was an obvious silver lining in Sunday’s loss. The Eagles scored on a pick-six, settled for four field goals, and their lone touchdown drive on offense was a short one, coming after they recovered running back Ezekiel Elliott’s fumble at the New England 26-yard line.

    Hurts, who was held to just 170 passing yards and lost just the third fumble of his career when safety Jabrill Peppers delivered a bruising hit late in the fourth quarter, noted how effectively New England disguised its intentions.

    Said veteran Patriots safety Adrian Phillips: “Ultimately our defense is very multiple, and we do a lot of different things. What you see on film might not be what we do, and I think that’s hard for a quarterback."

    The Eagles went three-and-out on four straight possessions during one stretch Sunday, which has been a rarity since Hurts became the starter. Last season, the Eagles had only one game with four three-and-outs.

    Patriots coach Bill Belichick often says that the most effective defenses sync their rush with coverage and tackle well. He said the tackling was sound Sunday, which is always a wild card in Week 1 with limited full-pads practices to prepare. “There’s a lot of good players on that Patriot defense, starting with [Matthew] Judon,” noted Eagles coach Nick Sirianni. Meanwhile, the ability to pressure Hurts was critical, as he finished 1-of-9 for 9 yards and three sacks under duress, according to ESPN Stats & Information. Hurts was 21-of-24 for 161 yards and a touchdown when not pressured.

    How, then, might they create the same type of disruption against the speedy Dolphins?

    Coaches will begin putting a game plan together Tuesday, but even before that happens, players have already highlighted one area of note: more urgency at the start of the game and second half. Phillips didn’t like how the Eagles held the ball for 7 minutes, 18 seconds on their opening drive Sunday, which culminated in a field goal, and then strung together a 10-play march early in the third quarter that also ended with a field goal. “Those are tone-setting drives,” Phillips said. “We have to be able to win those.”

    The Patriots returned every player but safety Devin McCourty from their 2022 defense; no other team retained as many players on that side of the ball. Then they used their top three draft picks on defensive players -- starting cornerback Christian Gonzalez (all 66 snaps, 7 tackles, 1 sack, 1 pass defended in Week 1), reserve defensive end/outside linebacker Keion White (multiple pressures), and versatile linebacker/safety Marte Mapu.

    The combination of retention and having versatile players that Judon refers to as “unicorns" helped contribute to the strong start. “We know what our defense can do, how we can move pieces,” Judon said. “Everybody’s interchangeable.”

    Few pieces move as fast as Dolphins wide receiver Hill, who had 11 catches for 215 yards and two touchdowns in the season opener against the Chargers.

    This will be the eighth time the Patriots face him, and veteran cornerback Jonathan Jones is likely a key cog in the plan to try to slow Hill down -- something he did well in a signature performance in the AFC Championship Game that preceded the Patriots’ Super Bowl LIII win (helping to hold Hill to one catch for 42 yards).

    And then there’s Tagovailoa, who is 4-0 all time against New England.

    “We all know the standard,” Peppers said. “I think we played pretty close to it [Sunday], but it wasn’t good enough to win. So you have to do better.”
     
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  5. DolPhinPhan7

    DolPhinPhan7 Well-Known Member

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    McCourkle is not Justin Herbert, so we've got that going for us.

    The New England Secondary is probably better than LA's, so maybe we can't expect a historic passing day from Tua. But they probably won't need it.
     
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  6. Wilkimania

    Wilkimania Well-Known Member

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    If we turn up and just expect to win then we'll get embarrassed. We know that the Pats will be well coached and will have a gameplan. The Eagles almost ran into exactly that on Sunday and barely survived with the win.

    Thankfully there's nothing about this group of players which makes me think that they'll turn up with that mindset.
     
  7. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    The Miami Dolphins Are AFC East Frontrunners
    There’s no team better positioned to win the AFC East in 2023. They have the division’s best-performing healthy quarterback (Tua Tagovailoa has inarguably outplayed Josh Allen since the start of the 2022 season).

    They have the division’s most innovative offensive mind (Bill Belichick will be the best overall coach for as long as he does this). And they have a suddenly favorable schedule, continuing Sunday in New England, where they’re 2.5-point favorites over the 0-1 Patriots. Bettors from coast to coast are now embracing the Dolphins as the new division frontrunners.






    Sponsored Content
     
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  8. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think they could be the best D in the league so it’s gonna be a serious test

    We win this game on the road we are favorites to win the #1 seed
     
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  9. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think their secondary is better, but I do think they will play a different scheme.
     
  10. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    I think their offense is terrible, so hopefully our offense will score enough to get the win.
     
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  11. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    27-10 Dolphins
     
  12. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    The longer Belichick coaches without Brady, the more it will become obvious Brady was the key to those SBs.

    Belichick + Brady = 219 wins and 64 losses = 77.4 win% and 6 SBs
    Belichick without Brady in NE and Cleveland = 79 wins and 89 losses = 47 win%
    Belichick without Brady in NE = 43 wins and 45 losses = 49 win%

    Belichick without Brady is no better than average.

    Brady without Belichick was still very impressive: 64 win% and 1 SBs in just 2 seasons
     
  13. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Something I saw in here caught my eye. Could this be a trap game? Coming off a huge win and playing what's expected to be an inferior opponent?

    As the sun sets this Sunday, the spotlight will fall on Foxborough, where two AFC East rivals, the Miami Dolphins and the New England Patriots, are set to lock horns. This prime-time NFL clash promises high-octane action, strategy, and possibly a few surprises along the way.

    This might be the perfect trap game. The Patriots have glaring issues, particularly on the offensive front. Labeling them “one-dimensional” might not be far off the mark. Their aerial game seems to be on life support, relying on players like Kendrick Bourne – who, despite a decent outing last week, doesn’t consistently instill fear in opposing defenses. As for Hunter Henry, his glory days in Fayetteville feel like a distant memory compared to his stints with the Chargers and, now, the Patriots.

    Furthermore, New England’s ground game doesn’t inspire much confidence either. While seasoned, running backs like Rhamondre Stevenson and Ezekiel Elliott don’t exactly bring breakneck speed to the table.

    It seems the odds, and perhaps the game might favor the Dolphins. Despite their storied history, New England appears to be in a period of transition and struggle. As for Sunday night, Miami might just be the team to bet on, both figuratively and literally.
     
  14. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Division games are never a trap game.
     
  15. Pennington's Limp Arm

    Pennington's Limp Arm Well-Known Member

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    Defense needs to wake up and figure out how to stop the run. Completely dominated by the Chargers Offensive line. Don’t think Van Ginkel playing inside linebacker is going to work. We need to move on from that quickly. Although a lot of the Chargers rushing success was from off tackle runs to the left, so the edges were not getting set either. Whole thing needs to be cleaned up.

    If Fangio and the defense go out and embarrass themselves again like last week. I doubt we can win.

    Keep in mind the Vaunted Eagles offense looked terrible and only had 251 total yards against Pats defense unit.
    - 1st TD was a defense pick 6.
    -2nd TD was a 25 yard drive off of a NE Fumble.
    -Kicker made two 50+ yarders.

    Without the Defensive production and kicker… the Eagles offense might have only scored 6 points in Foxboro.

    We Can’t expect our offense to put up 30+ points on the road in a divisional matchup.
     
  16. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    No! division game, some think Pats are better then Dolphins, people saying Jones is better then Tua, plenty of locker room material to stoke the flames.
     
  17. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    They will get 30 against the Pats. Our defense will play better and shut down the Pats. Our defense was terrible likely game planning for the pass instead of the run. When it came to crunch time the defense shut them down.
     
  18. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    This game does concern me. I watched Mac Jones hand the ball off some 45 times and only threw 3 passes the entire game to beat the Bills in prime time.

    The way the defense played last week, they’re going to have to force the Patriots into 2nd/3rd and long. Belichick has zero fear running the ball and has had pretty good success doing it. I suspect that will be a major part of the game plan, to control time of possession and give the Dolphins fewer at bats.
     
  19. ExplosionsInDaSky

    ExplosionsInDaSky Well-Known Member

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    I don't expect an offensive explosion. This will be a tough game for us to win. Don't be surprised if we lose a close one, but FWIW I do like our chances. Again, this isn't a Tua game where he goes off for 400 yards and 6 TDs. This looks and feels like more of a conservative stat line for him, which is fine as long as he limits his mistakes.
    Defensively, can we stop the run? Elliott and Stevenson make a hell of a duo and if the Pats gash us with the run and frustrate our offense, it could be tough sledding.
    The thing against Belicheck coached teams is that you can't make mistakes. Jason Sanders can't miss field goals, and we'll need at least one TD in this game in order to win.

    We can beat them, but we'll have to earn it. Expect some of our guys to get beat up. Tua takes his first hit of the season in this one.

    Dolphins 16
    Pats 13
     
  20. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    What is the record just in NE? There are many reasons why I don't think the Cleveland stint necessarily is important Webb considering BB with and without Brady.
     
  21. cbrad

    cbrad .

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    You mean Belichick's record? It's right there in the post you quoted. 43 wins and 45 losses.
     
  22. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Another example of why I like coach D. You rarely hear coaches talk like this.

    Miami Dolphins Practice Report: Will Terron Armstead Play vs. Patriots?
    Armstead was in the red non-contact jersey during the portion of practice open to reporters Sunday and had a compression sleeve on his injured lower right leg. He hurt that leg during an Aug. 17 practice against the Texans.

    That injury kept him out of the opener. Kendall Lamm started in his absence and presumably would again Sunday against the New England Patriots if Armstead is unavailable to go.


    “When players always wanna play, and then we obviously want him to play,” Dolphins coach Mike McDaniel explained.

    “But you know, there’s some, I don’t know, gut feeling that he might have to resort to a style of play just to get through, I don’t think that’s fair to him or his teammates. If there was a scenario that it was the only human being possible, you know, you maybe consider that, but probably not.

    “The biggest thing is that you have to have depth in your football team. For him and the Dolphins, you just don’t want him gut through it for a cause. … It’s part of our personal relationship, and he respects those types of decisions.”
     
  23. Fishhead

    Fishhead Well-Known Member

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    Can you picture Bear Bryant, Woody Hayes, Tom Landry or Vince Lombardi talking like that?
     
  24. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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  25. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    It's still early in the week, but...

    Patriots’ entire starting offensive line is now dealing with injuries

    By DOUG KYED | dkyed@bostonherald.com |
    PUBLISHED: September 13, 2023 at 4:22 p.m. | UPDATED: September 13, 2023 at 4:27 p.m.
    FOXBORO — The Patriots’ offensive line injury woes are not going away.

    Patriots starting left tackle Trent Brown missed practice Wednesday with a concussion, according to the team’s injury report. Rookie Sidy Sow, who started Sunday’s season opener at right guard, also didn’t practice due to a concussion.

    Here’s the full list of Patriots injuries:

    DID NOT PARTICIPATE
    OT Trent Brown – Concussion
    OL Sidy Sow – Concussion

    LIMITED PARTICIPATION
    C David Andrews – Hamstring
    WR Kayshon Boutte – Hamstring
    OL Mike Onwenu – Ankle
    WR DeVante Parker – Knee
    G Cole Strange – Knee

    The Patriots went into the summer with Brown, Strange, Andrews, Onwenu and Riley Reiff as their projected starting offensive line. None of those five players are healthy, and Reiff is on injured reserve for at least three more games.

    There’s a possibility that quarterback Mac Jones could be playing Sunday against the Dolphins behind an offensive line made up entirely of backups.

    Patriots head coach Bill Belichick said Wednesday that the team is taking things day-to-day with Strange and Onwenu, who have been practicing for weeks but weren’t cleared to play Sunday against the Eagles.

    Andrews spoke to the media on Wednesday, but it’s possible that he suffered his hamstring injury during practice.

    Brown and Sow finished Sunday’s game. It’s unclear when they suffered concussions.

    In Week 1, Brown started at left tackle, rookie Atonio Mafi was at left guard, Andrews was at center, Sow was at right guard and Calvin Anderson played right tackle. The Patriots have Jake Andrews, Vederian Lowe and Tyrone Wheatley Jr. as depth options. James Ferentz, Kody Russey and Andrew Stueber are on the practice squad.

    The Patriots kept 11 offensive linemen on their initial 53-man roster to hold additional depth on the unit. Reiff has since been placed on injured reserve, and five of the remaining 10 players are now hurt. The Patriots swung smart trades for Lowe and Wheatley before roster cuts. Now both players could be counted on in Week 2.

    Wide receiver JuJu Smith-Schuster, who didn’t finish Sunday’s game, is not on the injury report, meaning he was a full participant in practice.
    https://www.bostonherald.com/2023/0...-offensive-line-is-now-dealing-with-injuries/
     
  26. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I think the Pats will always be a tough match-up and I do agree that Tyreek will have a pretty pedestrian day since they'll be all over him in zone. What that does though, the real value in Tyreek, is leave Waddle and everyone else in 1:1 coverage to make your defense look stupid all day long. Eventually they'll adjust though and Tyreek will make them look stupid too.

    I don't think this will be a blowout, but I expect us to win by multiple scores. Someone else said 27-10 and that feels pretty right to me.
     
  27. Fishhead

    Fishhead Well-Known Member

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    This is why Miami was linked to every RB in the offseason. Wilson is on IR, Achane was hurt in preseason, and Mostert is hurt after one game.

    They might have to make a play for Taylor, or give Hunt a call.
     
  28. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    Mostert is fine. It was a "vet rest" day.
     
  29. Fishhead

    Fishhead Well-Known Member

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    The report says Mostert has a knee injury. If that’s smoke, then great. Still think the RB room is a little thin.
     
  30. Deus ex dolphin

    Deus ex dolphin Well-Known Member

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    Will weather play a factor? Hurricane Lee is supposed to be passing by over the weekend, right? Mostly missing the area, but I'd think strong winds and maybe rain for the game?

    That could favor a New England game plan liked they used against the Bills (three passes was it?) a couple years ago.
     
  31. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    The hurricane remnants are forecasted to be out of there by Saturday. It's going to be a beautiful New England night on Sunday.
     
  32. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    We're going to need to win a game by being able to rush the ball this season. We're probably going to face a lot of dime defenses to account for Hill so the OL is going to have to get push against six-man fronts to make them pay for it. We definitely have the guys to take advantage of space so we're almost in a "pick your poison" scenario for opposing defenses. But only if the OL wins on the line of scrimmage.
     
  33. Pennington's Limp Arm

    Pennington's Limp Arm Well-Known Member

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    Mostert practiced today. I’m sure he’ll be good to go.

    Achane will probably be active this week just in case.
     
  34. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    This is going to be another boring slugfest. Coach is going to have to prepare the team to take what's available. Waddle, Berrios, River, and the backs might have the opportunity to benefit from the attention Belicheat is going to give to Hill. We'll win if those players can win one-on-one with the ball in their hands.
     
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  35. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

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    Armstead is practicing sans a red jersey, too.
     
  36. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think we have a very proud defense.

    They’re pissed I bet.

    Love angry football players
     
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  37. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I almost forgot that Giesiki is going to be in this upcoming game.

    Tight end Mike Gesicki was a Dolphins second-round pick and spent his first five seasons with the franchise before signing with the Patriots in March. While Gesicki still caught five touchdowns for Miami last year, his other numbers took a significant dip in the team’s first year under head coach Mike McDaniel. He recorded 73 receptions for 780 yards in 2021 but just 32 catches for 362 yards in 2022.

    Nevertheless, Gesicki noted he’s not looking for any kind of get back this week when the Patriots host the Dolphins on Sunday Night Football. “I was excited to play in the game last week. I’ll be excited to play next week,” Gesicki said, via Mark Daniels of MassLive.com. “It’s the National Football League. I’m excited to play football every single Sunday. Obviously, people are going to try to make it something that it’s ultimately not. It’s a football game and an opportunity to go out there and play.”

    In the Week 1 loss to Philadelphia, Gesicki had three catches for 36 yards. All three of his catches went for first downs.

    So, Gesicki is enjoying his time with New England and is looking forward positively, not backward. “People were awesome down there,” Gesicki said. “I was always thankful for them and grateful for it, but I’m definitely happy where I am now and I’m happy to be a Patriot.”
     
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  38. Wilkimania

    Wilkimania Well-Known Member

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    We know how this game is going to be. They're going to run a lot, try and limit the amount of possessions that Tua and the team is going to get. This isn't going to be like last week with 2 teams going blow for blow and seeing who is left standing, this is going to be a game of hard yards and tiny margins.
     
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  39. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Their OL is banged up and trash to begin with and they have a starting corner out.
     
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  40. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    That’s exactly how I see it. The Dolphins defense did a really poor job against the run last week in LA. The Patsies are going to run the and force Miami to try and stop it.

    I have a feeling this is going to be a repeat strategy the Pats used against Buffalo last season where Jones didn’t throw the ball until what, midway in the 4th quarter.
     
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