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'Playbook' QB or not QB?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Sceeto, Sep 27, 2014.

  1. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    normaldude likes this.
  2. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

  3. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Yep. :cry:
     
  4. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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  5. finwin

    finwin Active Member

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    Wow Sterling sharp sees the same thing two years in a row. We see it, Ryan T. holding the ball, not releasing it at the right time. I'm constantly yelling at the TV get rid of it.
     
  6. roy_miami

    roy_miami Well-Known Member

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    fixed
     
  7. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's like he's playing a video game with the difficulty level set too high. He could get a bit better in the new offense with repetition. Will that happen soon enough?
     
  8. normaldude

    normaldude Active Member

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    You mean like bringing back Mike Sherman, and his simplified offense?
     
  9. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    The other problem is that on plays where people aren't open right away (in contrast to the ones in the videos in this thread), he doesn't move out of the way of pressure, extend the play with his feet, and make throws downfield.

    And that's a pretty rough combination. When people are open you don't throw it to them enough, and when they aren't, you can't extend plays with your feet and make throws downfield. That leaves you with a much smaller percentage of plays than the typical QB in which a play can be made. It's little wonder the team has trouble moving the ball and scoring points.
     
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  10. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    Actually what it looks like is something that's explained very simply: a player who used to play a different position, who was moved to this position because he has some -- but not all -- of the skills required to play it effectively.

    Tannehill to me is similar to what you'd have if you put Usain Bolt at wide receiver in the NFL: a guy with great speed who can run around very fast on the field, but who would have nowhere near the ability to play the entire wide receiver position well enough to be effective. Similarly, Tannehill has an arm, but nowhere near enough of the diverse skills or abilities to play the entire quarterback position effectively. He's a square peg in a round hole.
     
  11. firedan

    firedan Well-Known Member

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    Watch him have great game against a bad team and we will be back on the band wagon.
    If not the tents fold up till next season...
     
  12. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    I remember chad henne had about 3-4 bad games and the realistic people started bashing him rightly so.Well next thing you know he pulls a good not great game out of his *** and all you see is how all the bashers have to eat crow.Well we all see how that ended up and it will hapen again because sooner or later he has to have a good game right?
     
  13. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You have to wonder if the constant pressure from having crappy offensive lines has him thinking too much. He does need to start checking down and getting rid of the ball, he holds it too long. He doesn't seem to move up or move very well in the pocket either, a lot of Qbs side step and get out of sacks that Ryan takes. I think the point Sterling makes about Ryan "not seeing or not trusting what he's seeing" is pretty spot on, he just is oblivious to check downs or open guys on a lot of plays. We need to do him a favor and run more and his receivers need to stop dropping the ball, he's been victimized by some terrible drops at times too so its not all him.
     
  14. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    He could throw for five TD's and 500 yards against the Raiders and I would still question if he is the long term answer for the Dolphins.

    The Raiders are the absolute worst team in the NFL and the Dolphins offense should be able to move the ball and Tannehill will probably play effectively against this poor excuse of an NFL team.

    It all comes down to how effective Tannehill will be over the last 12 games for me. If he plays like he did in the first three games, he will NOT be the starting QB next year under a new head coach.
     
  15. roy_miami

    roy_miami Well-Known Member

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    For some reason he's just too lackadaisical when the game isn't absolutely on the line or its time to go full throttle. I would bet if all of the above plays were the last play of the game or even in the 2 minute drill he'd actually pull the trigger on time. Its funny how much more effective he, and the entire offense, looks during the 2 minute drills.
     
  16. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    took too many hits last year. seeing ghosts on the field, hearing footsteps behind him...thank you, Philbin.
    will he shake it off & begin to fulfill his potential or fade away like so many others in the past?
    I think game four is turning point one way or the other.
    this is the type of thing that you either suddenly come back from after a few games or it destroys you.
    either way we'll know after they play the tomorrow.
     
  17. finwin

    finwin Active Member

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    Game 3 probably had more emphasis on it than it should. Because there is such a huge difference between 1-2 and 2-1. All week fans have been destroying Tannehill, Lazor, and Philbin. I've though that Coaching was the problem with game 3. Game 2 was on the D and special teams. Both games Tannehill has been sub par but not the primary reason for the losses.
     
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  18. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Obviously I hope they win tomorrow and that he plays well, but I think game 5 during week 6 will be interesting after two more weeks (although limited by CBA) of practice in the new system. If we can get our **** together there are many winnable games after the bye.
     
  19. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    In games 8 through 14 last year, it looked like he'd turned the corner, so it'll be difficult for me at least to perceive that anything is different on the basis of one good game.

    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TannRy00/gamelog/2013/
     
  20. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, Danny was a master at that or taking those one or two steps up. Most of the great QBs have that ability.
     
  21. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't see recognition, and to me that's why even though he has some speed he doesn't run, cause he doesn't recognize.
     
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  22. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    And I should amend what I said above based on what you said here. He has the diverse set of skills to play the position effectively, but he doesn't seem to have enough command of the position to put them all together in such a way that he can play it effectively. Contrast that with Russell Wilson, who has roughly the same physical skills, but who seems to play the position with such command and with such a second nature feel for it that he plays much more effectively.

    Again, though, isn't this what you'd expect from someone who was moved from wide receiver to quarterback? Contrast that with Wilson, who had more than double the number of pass attempts than Tannehill at the college level.
     
  23. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    And who has played in 30-40 more games in his career. Still not a ton of games under Tanny's belt.
     
  24. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    Right, but Wilson's trajectory is pointed upward, whereas Tannehill's is heading the other direction as of this year, even though Wilson started his NFL career playing at a much higher level than Tannehill. Wilson has less room to improve, yet he still is, whereas Tannehill has a whole lot more room to improve, but is regressing.
     
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  25. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh Club Member

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    I don't doubt the new offense is the major cause for his decline. Why is that not a factor?
     
  26. finwin

    finwin Active Member

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    Sterling Sharps videos proved that.:tantrum:
     
  27. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ok but, what are trying to say then?, that lets be patient with the player because it will eventually come?
     
  28. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    I have no idea whether it will eventually come or not, but I know there are players at all positions who have the skills to play them, but who for whatever reason don't pan out, and I'm not seeing any indication from Tannehill that he won't be one of those players. I certainly don't think we should expect him to pan out.
     
  29. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    What if it's an interaction among the newness of the offense, the type of offense it is, and his individual ability? If it is, then I think we have to ask ourselves whether someone with greater ability wouldn't be doing better under the same circumstances.
     
  30. finwin

    finwin Active Member

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    The sample size is too small for you to make that judgement.
     
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  31. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    The sample size is too small to make any judgment. We also don't know whether the newness of the offense is responsible for his decline in his performance, rather than perhaps an increase in the complexity of the offense. I think the safest explanation is that it's a combination of the newness of the offense, an increase in its complexity, and his own ability. And if it is that combination, then the possibility exists that someone with greater ability would be doing better under the same circumstances.

    Nick Foles, anyone?
     
  32. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Right. If you isolate the last two games of last season you'd think he's the worst QB in the league. Yet he had a good improvement from year one to two. So why isolate just a few games so far this season? He may regress but lets see it over some time.
     
  33. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Philly started off last year much like the Dolphins have...and they had FAR more weaponry....they were 1-3 their first four games. Try again.

    Edit: In fact, they really didn't get it clicking until their 9th game...Arians says hi.
     
  34. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Their offense was great through those games though. I don't think it applies.
     
  35. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Sure wasn't great later when they scored 3 and 7 in 2 games...against the Cowboys and Giants.
     
  36. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh Club Member

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    Since we're only at the "what if" stage, I see no sense in panicking over it. If by the end of the season no real improvement is made, THEN it may be those things, but game 3 of the first new offense he's played in since high school, I see no reason to speculate especially considering he improved from Year 1 to Year 2.
     
  37. Dolphans Unite!

    Dolphans Unite! Banned

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    They started the season 0-2 in games in which Nick Foles had four or fewer pass attempts (1 in the first game, 4 in the second). They then proceeded to go 9-2 in the games in which he either started or had at least 25 pass attempts.

    Foles's adjustment to the Eagles' new (Chip Kelly) offense as a young and relatively inexperienced QB is what we're talking about here, not the Eagles' performance as a team prior to Foles's involvement.
     
  38. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Not sure what that means here. Sure every offense has bad games, I never said we were hopeless. I said our slow start isn't the same as theirs at all.

    33
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    In their first four. I guess we can do something fairly similar with a good game.
     
  39. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh Club Member

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    Adaptability to new offenses is not a constant among individual QBs so the comparison is pointless.
     
  40. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    I don't see how 16 and 20 points is great, but to each their own.
     

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