The Bills 13- how does a team that has not lifted themselves out of the 31st and 30th ranked offense and defense each of the last 2 years, have a coach with a losing record and not made the playoffs in nearly 10 years become the 13th best team in the NFL? Thank god teams actually have to play football, cause all these stupid grades aren't worth the time it actually takes to read them.

 

They had as many injuries as we did last season, and managed to get 6 more wins just by strength of will. I watched them in the Redskins game, and they gutted it out. With all of their returning starters I fully expect them to compete for a wild card.

I hate that the Bills have done such a good job, but they've honestly done more with their opportunities than the Jets or the Dolphins have recently. They've drafted smartly and maximized their free agency gains.

Think about it this way - if we weren't a one win team last year due to all of the injuries, then the Bills were better than a 7 win team last year because they got just as banged up. Scary, no?

 

I agree with everything you wrote. That being said, as much as it wouldn't be surprising if they made the playoffs, I also wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the Bills go 5 - 11. The Bills seem to be on a cyclical path of surprisingly almost making the playoffs then expected to compete for playoffs next season only to fall flat. Also, like us unfortunately they tend to stink it up in any year that they are expected to do well. I know this is foolish reasoning. Much like using historical stock trends to predict future trends. But until they prove otherwise, I'll keep assuming the Bills suck. It's so easy to do as a Dolphins fan!

 

It'd be easier to do if they weren't sweeping us because we suck :cry:

There are no words to describe how sickened I was by this team last year.

 

I feel your pain. I'm originally from western New York, and even lived in Buffalo for a year. An awful lot of my friends are Bills fans. (The rest are Jets fans :pity:) It's been a rough past couple of years.

 

I totally agree with everything you said here. I could see the Bills winning the wild card.

 

Name the last team the Bills beat that had a winning record, name the last time they had a QB or a coach with a winning record?! As far as their injuries, Miami had injuries to players like Ronnie Brown, Zach Thomas and lost Chris Chambers to trade all by week 5 or during the bye week last year. Name the best player the Bills lost. Trent Edwards threw more Int's then TD's last year. Granted he was a rookie, but he was anything but inspiring. The Only reason he saw game action is because JP Losman is a total waste and the new Bills coaching staff drafted Edwards not Losman...in other words, there was no loyalty to Losman and the new staff couldn't wait to get their guy out there.

I would be glad to give the Bills credit if there was reason to give them credit. I don't care how many games they won last year they were still 2 games below 500. Since when does a losing record and 30th ranked offense and the 31st ranked defense or the fact that 4 of the Bills 7 wins came against the Jets and Dolphins make them anything other then lucky as hell to have won 7 games? Seriously folks, if this were the Dolphins coming off that type of season with those type of rankings, stats and having basically the cheapest off season with 35 mil left under their salary cap, how in the world does all that equate the 13th best team in the league on the verge of a wild card berth?

I could see it if the Bills were 9-7 with wins against a couple of playoff teams last year and maybe the 13th best offense and 10th best defense. I could see it if they landed an Asante Samuel or Randy Moss as FA's. I could see the rankings being in their favor if all that were the Bills team we were talking about. But they did none of those things and they aren't any of those things so where's this coming from? Where are the improvements? Where is the steady ascent? I see none of this. Two years in a row with the 30th ranked offense and the 31st ranked defense??? Missing the playoffs since 99??? It's not like I'm just making things up and have no proof that they have done little to improve and their recent history the contrary. Common guy's, give credit to teams moving forward like the Browns or Jets cause both of those teams have done far more to deserve credit then the Bills.

 

You can not like it all you want, but they certainly kicked the crap out of their division rivals not named the Patriots, didn't they?

No proof that they've improved? Have you seen their drafts the past three years? They've been kicking both our asses and the Jets asses. This year is probably the first year in 10 years we've had a good draft, and we're not even close to seeing it out yet. Hands down, they have more talent on this team than we've got on ours, and are easily equal to the Jets in spite of the free agency splurge they did.

Is that good enough to push them towards a wild card? Considering we get to play the Cardinals, Seahawks, 49ers and the Rams, I think that they've got a great chance to do it.

 

Probowl year?

He better do it in 4 games or else.....

:wink2:

 

Eh too early for my taste to decide on teams rankings. I'll come back to this pre-season time.

 

Even with all of the changes, I still don't think that we are any better than a 4-5 win team. This is year 1 of the rebuilding process and we still have a looong way to go.

JMO though

 

They did? Funny I seem to remember a game in Miami last year that the Bills played a Dolphins team without Zach, Ronnie and Chris and the Bills walked away with a limp and a 3 point win. Hardly what I would call "getting the crap kicked out of us". This is what I'm talking about with the Bills. Miami went to Buffalo and handed them the game. Buffalo didn't beat us we beat ourselves again for the second year in a row in Buffalo. How many TO's did Beck have that had nothing to do with the Bills pressure or talent? What 3? From fumbling a wet football?

I consider what the Pats did to us as kicking the crap out of us, they owned us on both sides of the ball up and down the field. The Bills did none of that.

In week 10 Buff @ Mia

JP Losman- 12-23 157 yards and 1 INT
Cleo Lemon 16-29 131 yards

Marshawn Lynch- 19- 61
Jesse Chatman 27-124

Miami Dolphins Time of Possession- 36.59
Buffalo Bills Time of Possession- 23.01

Miami's Defense- 2 turnovers, two sacks total net yards 214
Buffalo Bills Defense- 1 sack 1 safety 269 net yards



In week 14 Mia @ Buff

Trent Edwards- 11-23 165 yards 4 TD's
John Beck- 1-2 6 yards
Cleo Lemon-22-42 241 yards 2 int's

Freddie Jackson- 15- 115
Marshawn Lynch 23-107
S.Gado- 12-52

Miami Time of Possession-29:30
Buffalo Bills Time of Possession-30:30

Miami's Defense-389 net yards
Buffalo Defense- 285 net yards


What I see is in both case the Bills having their starting RB, QB and in one game home field advantage. I also see Miami playing not only their backups to the Bill starters, but in the second game their 4th string newly signed RB S.Gado. I think there is a lot more to look at with those two games then just head to head matchups. While I think it's Miami has a slight advantage with the heat in Miami, I think it's more of an advantage for the Bills to have cold rainy weather in their house.

I also think Miami's injuries we far more significant loses then the Bills loses, especially in head to head match ups between division rivals. Miami still outplayed and outperformed the Bills in Miami, but didn't get the win. Many here want to ignore the amount of talent lost last year when giving this team it's evaluation over the entire season, but clearly we were down some serious talent most of the year.

It's also why I don't give the Bills credit for their 7 wins because not only should they have lost at least 2 of the last 4 times they played against Miami, these are the types of wins they had in their win columns the last 2 years. Wins where they didn't earn it, but the other team simply gave them the win. Hardly what I would consider dominating or even worthy of mention. Even in their win in Buffalo last year it was chock full of Miami mishaps, not Bills dominance.

 

Thats an incredibly long post to say this: we lost. Twice. So did the Jets. Twice.

There's no making excuses for what we couldn't do by denigrating the opponent.

 

Yeah you're right we suck and we always will, happy?

Honestly most people would look at that post and realize wins and loses don't tell the whole story, but you obviously wish to see nothing but the worst you possibly can, where I see far more the just whats on the surface. BTW, you want bottom line, the Bills were 7-9 and had 0 chance at the playoffs, maybe that's really disappointing to you, but it's also the bottom line.

Question, since you think my opinion is simply about disrespecting the opponent instead of blaming the Dolphins, why am I not making excuses for the Pats games or Jets games? Obviously your opinion of my view of the "opponent" is a bit flawed.

 

I think we will manage about five games won, possibly six if the chemistry is right.

 

Did we get a special trophy for coming really really close to winning a handfull of games by 3 points?

In the end, all that matters is the win/loss record. Every team suffers injuries at some point during the season, the Bills were hit as hard as any team in the league and still managed a better record than us.

Their playoff hopes died in week 15, ours died much sooner than that.

 

I was a bit wary of posting the 4-5 win prediction because our depth at WR is scary horrible, our secondary has alot of question marks (who plays opposite of W. Allen?, Can Bell stay healthy?, Can J Allen continue to make progress?, etc) and someone still has to step up and be "the man" at QB.

Here's to hoping that I'm wrong. :beer:

 

IMO that list wasnt half bad. Glad to see we werent on the bottom, there are clearly some worse off teams out there.

As for the Bills? Im not convinced by them at all. I can see them winning a wild card, or going 4-12. I see us with having 4-6 wins, but an improved team.

I see the worst in the AFC as KC. Yeah they had a good draft, but they needed it, they have drafted as poorly as us recently. And imo Herm Edwards is a joke of a coach.

 

yep, the Bills played hard and were hit just as hard if not more so by injuries than us. I know it kills people to admit that teams in our division are better than us right now, but its a fact. Can it change, hell yeah. I can hate a team and still respect what they did and what they are.

 

You are correct. I believe they had the most players on IR and we were second.

 

What does this have to do with the injuries the Dolphins suffered? Clearly our injuries played a roll in our wins and loses.

PLEASE GOD........prove to me that the Bills loses were even close to the Dolphin loses as far as talent is concerned.

Here, I'll give you the Dolphins players lost and I dare you to find the players the Bills lost that even come close to the Dolphins.

Trent Green
Ronnie Brown
Zach Thomas
Yeremiah Bell

Now Miami had many more injuries then that, but I dare to find 4 players the Bills lost that are even halfway close to those type of talent lost....GOOD LUCK!!

Really, perhaps you provide a list of teams that had winning records the Bills beat that put them in position by week 15 to be a playoff team. See I think it's funny you can play all year and not win one game against a team with a legit shot at the playoffs yet you yourself are considered a playoff team.

How exactly does that work? See it's not like the Bills didn't face a team with a winning record and they were just playing the schedule they were handed. No, they just couldn't win against good teams, but they were "almost" a playoff team? The Bills played the Pats 2, the Cowboys, the Steelers and Jacksonville that's less then 1/3 of their schedule and they could get just one win against those teams. I think my opinion of the Bills is a fair one it isn't Bias or hateful.

They have a ton of issues and it's pure luck they even won 7 games last year. I think the Bills were a 5 win team at best but a couple of things go their way and they end up with 7 wins. Good for them.

 

On a non-Dolphins note, I really expect Pittsburgh to surprise people. I understand why King would rank them where he did (#12), but don't be surprised when they are right in the thick of it for the AFC. Tomlin is a great coach and has the respect of that team. Roethlisberger now has Ward, Holmes, Sweed, and Miller to throw too. That's a potentially devastating passing attack to combine with a running game of Parker, Mendenhall, and Davenport.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't you trying to make the point that Miami's win/loss record didn't reflect the true talent level because we suffered so many injuries?

So why does that only apply to Miami? Shouldn't Buffalo have the same excuses made for them? Using your logic, Buffalo should have won more than 7 games last year.

You don't believe that the Bills were impacted by their losses? The Bills aren't a team with a ton of high priced players with big names, they have a young talented core of lesser named players that just so happen to contribute more than what we had.

Simpson
Posluszny
Denney
Lynch missed 4 games and was bothered by injuries once he returned
Ellison
Wire
Whittle
Price

Seriously though, what was Green for us last year? He wasn't Tom Brady while healthy, infact he was barely JP Losman. How was that a major loss? Bell? The guy that can't stay healthy? His loss was the reason that we lost so many games? Or was it a combination of injuries, lack of motivation and poor depth? Buffalo met the same fate last year, the only difference is that they have better depth and players that were hungry.

Slam the Bills all you like, but they beat us twice.

And who did we beat? Baltimore? :lol: :pity:

So you're ignoring the fact that they were still in the playoff hunt going into week 15, but you're going to make excuse after excuse for why the Phins only won 1 game last year? I know that you hate our rivals, but this is ridiculous, every team should be judged the same. Forget the fact that the Bills had the toughest schedule last year (Link ), forget the injuries, forget the blind hatred for every team in our division.....the simple fact is that the Bills were still in playoff contention in week 15. Had they beaten the Browns they would have had a great chance to sneak into the postseason, something the Dolphins couldn't even imagine after our disasterous year. To try and belittle them is silly. Fans of a 1-15 team have no room to talk smack, especially when the Bills beat us twice last year.

Check the standings from last season, personal feelings mean nothing after the fact. They won 7 games and should be credited for winning those 7 games without trying to cheapen the accomplishment.

 

Wow, look at that, Patriots #1 overall. Even more, King LOVED their draft.

Shocking.

:pity:

 

No, I believe what I was trying to reflect was that Miami's wins and loses were due to the fact we had so many key injuries. I guess you're trying to express the opinion not having a players like Ronnie or Chris or Trent is the same as having them. So why bother paying them more if losing them means nothing?

Hmm, I guess using your logic having a team with the 30th ranked offense and the 31st ranked defense is the same as having a team with the 5th best offense and 3rd best defense...after all they're all the same, so why not use the same logic for everyone? I guess wins and loses are just that wins and loses. Is there any reason on gods green earth stats are kept? You don't seem to understand them or have a use for them.
Your argument is simply the team with the better record is always better...thank god the Giant's don't use the same logic as you.

Would you please spare me the politically correct BS it's old and rather over the top? Seriously?? The Bills are young and "TALENTED"? I see, so this "young and talented" group of players is ranked where? Lower on offense and Defense then your own pathetic Dolphins? Wow, I love how their rankings are so non existent to you. You call them young and talented, but the only thing you can say they did better then Miami last year was in the win loss column that's it. And tell me, what did the 6 more wins get the Bills?

That's it? That's your list? Tell me one player on that list that's had half the career as the 4 I mentioned? See this proves my point about who the Bills lost. There isn't one player on that list that anyone with half a brain would choose over any of the 4 Dolphin players I listed. BTW, your list includes players that missed a few games. The 4 players I mentioned missed 10 or more games including both games against the Bills last year. But again according to you Losing Ronnie Brown is no different then losing S.Gado. So that explains your logic and the players you choose to call comparable to Miami's loses.

Wow, did you even watch the Dolphins last year? Or were you so infatuated with the Bills greatness that you just couldn't find time to watch the Dolphins??

Trent Green
week 1) T. Green (24-38, 219
week 2) T. Green (23-40, 287)
week 3) T. Green (23-36, 318)
week 4) T. Green (14-25, 158)
week 5) T. Green (1/2 5) injured out for season.

JP Losman
week 1) J. Losman (14-21, 97)
week 2) J. Losman (15-25, 154)
week 3) J. Losman (1/1 4) injured missed the next several games
week 9) J. Losman (24-34, 295)
week 10) J. Losman (12-23, 157)
week 11) J. Losman (15-26, 173)
week 12) J. Losman (27-40, 211)

On a team he's been with since he was a rookie with players he's played with the majority of that time in a system he's familiar with JP threw for just 104 more yards then Trent in two more games. Trent's first season with the Dolphins playing behind a makeshift Oline and with players he's never played with before and you think Greens impact was basically the same as JP's? Seriously, stats are your friend....don't be afraid.

Love the Bills all you want, they hardly beat us twice. As I already stated in an earlier post in this thread, we lost those games they didn't beat us. There's a big difference in the two. Sure a loss is still a loss, but tell me what difference, the wins they got from us, made in their season? Nothing at all, when they were forced to actually play a GOOD team that didn't give wins away, they simply couldn't win games. That's where wins and loses matter. "Football the sport" and understanding it, is not very hard to do. You just have to be willing to look at more then just wins and loses. Seriously,do you honestly think when coaches are looking to add talent threw the draft and FA they simply look at wins and loses and say to themselves "hey we only won 7 games last year, I hope we have more luck next year? Or do you think they look at the "statistics" to see their strengths and weaknesses??

I know this is gonna hurt, but try to deal with the pain....there was no point in the last 9 years the Bills were a playoff team. I know you think just because you get to within 2 games of 500. that somehow makes a team a playoff contender, but trust me when I say this....IT DOESN'T!!

Maybe since you seem to think Wins and loses are all that matter, you can explain why the Browns who have much more talent then the Bills and had a few more wins weren't a playoff team? But the Bills were??? I think you can see there's a real flaw with how you grade teams. Obviously you have a hidden agenda for the the Bills and if they're really your favorite team that's OK, but you're really not trying to hide the obvious.

Hmm, really? well if you feel like they deserve respect that's up to you, but the Bills are hardly a good team. I think they're statistics, streak of seasons without a playoff appearance and the fact that they haven't been above 500 since MM was their HC is in direct conflict with your opinion of their greatness.

 

What? :pity:

Miami had some key injuries, but so did Buffalo. If Miami is "better than their record indicated", then the rule applies to everyone. Again, at the end of the day wins and losses matter more than how many TD's you score or how many sacks a player has. You can try to minimize that fact all you like, but the simple fact is Buffalo won 7 games and Miami only won 1.

In the regular season, absolutely. We were the worst team in the league, every other team in the NFL was better than us last year. Stats are great for individual stats, but when evaluating a team the most important stat is wins and losses.

New England set all kinds of records last year, they had the best offensive team ever statistically and look where that got them. The Giants had the best record in the playoffs, they won the game that mattered. Are you saying that the Giants were the lesser team and NE is better because their stats were light years better than what the Giants put up? Should the Giants have an asterisk next to their win because they didn't have better stats than the Pats? Or are we going to get into a Pats/cheating discussion again? The Giants were on the verge of dumping Eli into the Hudson in the first few weeks of the season, they didn't turn it on until the end of the season and the playoffs. Even though NE had the far superior offense and overall team from a statistical standpoint, wins and losses are the only thing that mattered. Once the playoffs start, what happened in the regular season is meaningless and a new season begins. And in the playoffs, the Giants had more wins.

Hope.....excitement that they still had something to play for after the midway point. Maybe?

:rolleyes:

It's pointless. You have an agenda against any team in our division and instead of being able to give them credit where credit is due, you stretch the truth to in order to turn the tables and change direction (see bolded text).

So you're saying that Green didn't lead the league in INT's before his injury? You're saying that he didn't look clueless out there with poor judgement, weak arm, while making several rookie mistakes? And lets not forget his signature "run to the sidelines, throw the ball across his body into a crowd of 5 defenders" play that he attempted almost every week.

:pity:

:lol:

'nuff said

Enough with the condecending BS. If you don't want to have a conversation just say so. You'll save us all alot of time and energy. :pity:

I never said that the Bills were a playoff team, by all means please pull the quote to prove me wrong. I said that the Bills were in the playoff hunt going into week 15, which they were.

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/news.jsp?news_id=5719

Yeah, that wasn't over the top at all. :rolleyes:

 

Your logic here only works if every team has the same exact talent level, which obviously isn't true, so how can you say Team A which is much more talented then Team B will suffer the same if they lose players?? I think you're generalizing way to much with this view of teams and their loses. I could understand your point if you weren't trying to convince me that Brown, Chambers, Green, Bell and Thomas are all the same talent level as Ellison,
Wire, Whittle, Price and Denny . Seriously, that's not the point you're trying to make is it? Cause that wold be beyond laughable.

No it's not......and you couldn't be more wrong if you tried, in fact it's the opposite. Any team can have a good season, then turn around and have a bad season. Wins and losses are the most deceiving stat there is, unless you're the Pats or Colts. Everyone else it's a year to year thing and you can't gauge a team from season to season based on wins and loses. But you sure as heck could tell a legit team from one time wonder with statistics. I think you're really lost here. I honestly thought you were just a closet Bill fan, but the fact is you just don't understand the game. I gotta tell ya, I feel better knowing that, then thinking you just loved the Bills.

Really? Well how bout these stats...since stats mean nothing, according to you. In the last two years the Bills have played 32 games, in those 32 games they have just 2 wins against teams with winning records. Think that has no meaning? Think that's an unimportant stat? We'll you'd be wrong. There are so many times during just one season of football stats are not only important but they tell the future or at least give the odds. You seriously need to understand that stats are about as important to sports as you can possibly get.

Well if this were true, why don't I have a problem with the Pats? They have more wins then Miami! they Beat us twice last year! They actually made the playoffs. I don't have the smallest problem at all telling you they're better then Miami, cause they are. See you still don't get it. It's not about wins/ loses. It's about the Big picture and when a team like Buffalo has worse statistics then Miami on offense and Defense, but more wins, then obviously there a problem with just looking at wins and loses. The Pats were not only Better then the Dolphins in wins and Loses, but they were better statistically. It's not hard to see why they were better. This isn't rocket science, it's really rather simple.

And your saying a multiple pro bowl QB is worse then a QB that's never had a winning record as a starter much less a pro bowl appearance. Seriously, I don't know why you watch the game of football, cause everything you see and say is the opposite of the way things really are.

 

This is the age old argument against stats...the stats (including wins/losses) can tell you just about any point you want to make but they are in effect useless. Anyone can come up with stats that prove either side of this argument. But FTP makes a point that the others seem to be missing. His point is that the game stats, including w/l's don't quite tell the entire tale about these two teams. And to add to that, no where is he saying the Fins are or should be considered better than the Bills, just that for the sake of this argument, wins/losses don't tell the whole story. That's a fact folks...just as much a fact as Losman's or Green's or Simpson's or Thomas's stats from last year...in this argument they really don't tell the story.

The Bills had a better season than we did last year, but ranking them that much higher than us, considering the other underlying stats (all the team and individual stats), that #12 ranking just doesn't make sense... Tell me they've improved based on their offseason and perhaps you can project some, but if you use the actual playing stats they have accumulated....that ranking just doesn't make sense.

Contrary to their ranking, the Fins ranking looks much more realistic, offseason improvements notwithstanding. Even using the argument like some did for the Fins in 2006 when we had won 6 in a row is more valid than whatever reasoning King used to come up with these team rankings. Blind allegiance to a team is a fan's right and if you have that feeling for the Bills, fine...but the preponderance of evidence points in another direction.

 

If you're hellbent on comparing players individual stats, then yes. But that isn't what I'm doing, although watching you put words in my mouth and playing the "Go root for your favorite team, the Bills" nonsense, one would get the impression that I think the Bills are a SB team.

The Bills lost alot of core players, key players that they were counting on to contribute and take them to the next level. Those players were out, regardless with whether they missed 4 games (Marshawn Lunch, their starting RB) or a whole season. You don't think that has an impact on their play, yet losing Green (who was horrible) and Bell (who can't stay healthy) crippled our team....did I get that right? Why isn't it the same for everybody?

:lol:

I see, you know more than the rest of us and we should all kneel down and take a lesson from wise old ftp. If we don't agree with you, we MUST be Bills fans. Great logic! :rolleyes:

As far as wins and losses being the most "deceiving stat", what exactly do teams play for? What's the whole purpose of suiting up every Sunday? Is it to lead the league in passing yards or it is to win as many games as possible? Do NFL players fight in the trenches every week so that they can lead the league in time of possession? Or do they fight in the trenches to get a win? If wins are meaningless, why do they get so gosh darn happy when the game is over and their team takes the W?

Seriously?

I thought wins didn't mean anything? And how many wins against teams with winning records did the Dolphins have during that span? 3, that's it. Funny you forgot to mention that. Or did you pick a stat where Miami actually came out ahead so you could make an argument?

The fact is, the Bills found a way to beat the lesser teams in the NFL, which is something we have yet to figure out. Even so, the Bills may not have beaten the Pats 50-0, but they sure made us look silly the past few years.

There's no pride in leading in time of possession at the end of the game if you walk away with the loss. Plain and simple.

:sidelol:

Junkies mean anything to you? I can elaborate if you like? :lol:

Don't even get me started on Billszone where you have a -5121 reputation. :lol:

Again, please be honest when you type something, because I am more than happy to pull quotes. Again, you dislike our rivals and I'm not thrilled about them being better than us either, but I give them credit for being the better team while you continue to argue after a 1-15 season. Good sportsmanship doesn't only apply to the players, but the fans as well. Anything else is sour grapes.

:yawn:

Did Trent Green play like a Probowler last year before his injury? Just curious.

 

The point that he's been making is that Miami wasn't as bad as their record indicates because of the injuries they suffered. But he doesn't apply that same thought process to others teams.

Again, at the end of the day no team is going to be happy with leading the league in time of possession or sacks if they didn't win. Winning is all that matters in sports. A team that was good enough to win 7 games is better than a team that only won 1. I would love to be able to say that the Phins are better than Buffalo, but right now we aren't. Until we step out on the field and put some W's on the board, we have no room to talk smack about rival teams and we should acknowledge their accomplishments. That doesn't mean that we should be happy about it, but sour grapes is silly.

 

Makes me feel sorry for the fans of any team ranked lower than we are. :lol:

 

Exactly. No matter how it's spun, the fact of the matter is that the Bills went 4-2 in division play while we laid a goose egg. Offensive or defensive rankings aside they were in contention long after the rest of the division was decided. They were the best team in the division not named the Pats.

It doesn't matter how big a Dolphins fan anyone is, the fact that the Bills are better can't be changed. They had another good draft this year and with the players they're getting back from injury they'll have a decent young talent level.

That's why we hired Parcells and the rest of the staff - so that we can be there in a couple of years having folks talk about our turnaround while our division rivals fume that we're back on top :up:

 

Enjoy your love affair with the Bills.Maybe they'll beat Miami again this year and make you happy.

 

Again, I have no problem with the Bills being that high as most here. The one that has me scratching my head is the Jets at 14.