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Reports: D'Antoni accepts offer to coach Knicks

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by DonShula84, May 10, 2008.

  1. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Moderator Luxury Box

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    What do you think? Good move? Bad move? He'll be missing Nash quickly once he gets around Starbury.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3389987
     
  2. Regan21286

    Regan21286 MCAT's, EMT's, AMCAS, ugh

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    I think he will miss Nash but I think New York could benefit from his style of play.
     
  3. ColoradoPhin

    ColoradoPhin New Member

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    The Knicks could bring back Red Auerbach from the grave and they would still suck. Isiah ruined the team and it will take years to fix it.
     
  4. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    I think they should have hired Avery Johnson. If Chicago has any brains, they'll bring him in.
     
  5. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    Chicago's brains seem to be right as of now, they are interested in Avery.
     
  6. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    I don't know why they didn't hire Marc Jackson, he wanted the job and would have been an excellent choice IMO.

    And I'm not sold on D'Antoni, sure he won over 250 games in five years but with all that God given talent he had who couldn't?
     
    alen1 likes this.
  7. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    Actually, I think Rick Carlisle would have been a better choice for the Knicks, though it seemed like he was in the bag for Dallas right away. However, Johnson might have been a better choice for the Knicks than D'Antoni. He'd be a little better at dealing with the NYC media, and his preaching of defense, defense, defense is what the Knicks really need.

    They're not all that well suited to D'Antoni's preferred style of play. Jamal Crawford and Nate Robinson might be well served by helter-skelter basketball, and Fred Jones is the sort of outside shooter he'd love, and David Lee's hustle and hard work will translate well to any system, but that's pretty much it. D'Antoni would favor mobile, active big men who can pass the ball...and only two of those words describe Eddy Curry and Zach Randolph. (Hint: those words aren't "mobile", "active", or "can pass the ball")

    Interestingly, D'Antoni coached Marbury very briefly in Phoenix; there was a 13 game overlap between D'Antoni's hire and the Marbury trade. Not much of a history there, but at least D'Antoni has some familiarity with the good, bad and ugly of Marbury's game.

    Ugh, the Knicks are much better off for passing on Jackson. Jackson's never coached at any level, as far as I know. Jackson may be well-suited to be an NBA coach, but he's got to get some experience first. And frankly, getting that experience as the head coach of a high profile franchise with an explosive locker room doesn't strike me as the way to do it.

    I'm not sure if D'Antoni is the best hire for NY, but he's certainly better than Jackson. Besides, we need Mark at the announcer's table. Breen-Jax-JVG is the best announcing team in years. Stay where you are, Mark!
     
  8. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    BTW, as long as we're talking about head coaches for the Knicks, or anyone else, for that matter, why not consider Tom Thibodeau? Thibodeau is one of the best defensive coaches in the league, and has been around long enough that he's got the experience to do the job as a head coach.
     
  9. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He might be able to get the Knicks back on track in a few years when some of those horrid contracts come off the payroll but I think the Knicks problem is a poorly conceived roster with horrible contracts, not coaching.
     
  10. H.Moody

    H.Moody Junior Member

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    I think D'Antoni should have given the Bulls job a better look.NY isn't Phoenix,he may not get the chance(time) to get the type of players he needs to run his offense.JMO
     
  11. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    But there was no way to justify keeping Isiah Thomas in charge of the team. Just no way.

    Damnit. :pity:
     
  12. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    I keep hearing that the plan is to make a run at the Class of 2010, which will include James and Wade. But I just don't see how that's going to happen. As it stands right now, the Knicks have $58M in salaries committed for that year. The salary cap isn't going to be $72M, allowing them to make a max offer to those guys. For all the talk about moving salaries around, the problem is that they have a shockingly high amount of salary that's untradeable.

    Jerome James and Quentin Richardson have player options totaling about $16M. They're really going to turn those down? I think not. Not when those two guys would be making $8 per hour at Burger King if the Knicks weren't paying them. (In James' case, he'd probably work for 3 Whopper Meals per hour.) Zach Randolph is due $16M then, and no team in their right mind is going to take his deal on at this point. Jared Jefferies will be due $6.5M then, and the only way they're moving him is taking an equally bad contract in return.

    There's some hope in that Eddy Curry and Jamal Crawford both have player options. If those guys thought there was a bigger deal out there, they might turn down those options, and THEN the Knicks would have some cap room to wave at LeBron or Dwyane. However, I'm not sure I see it. Maybe Crawford has some trade value, but I think Curry knows this is about as good as he's going to have it, and will exercise his option.

    Of course, the problem is that Nate Robinson and David Lee will be free agents then, too. If you're rebuilding, you should avoid throwing the baby out with the bathwater, i.e. getting rid of two of the closest things you have to true cornerstones. I think Walsh can rebuild the team, but I think that counting on the free agent class of 2010 to get it done is probably not a wise plan.
     
  13. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Wade isn't leaving South Florida. LeBron might leave Cleveland if they don't win something.
     
  14. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The only hope the Knicks have to get rid of a lot of these contracts is if Isiah gets hired by another team and trades for them again. I could see them MAYBE making a couple of maneuvers and perhaps clearing enough space to make a few moves but I doubt enough to go after LeBron or Wade. Their only real hope is the draft lottery and that Curry, James, Randolph and the rest of the over paid crew start to actually give a crap. Wake me when that happens.
     
  15. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't know another year in the draft lottery and he might seriously consider it. I doubt for New York but maybe some place else where a title is within reach.
     
  16. like2god

    like2god Typical white person Luxury Box

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    I agree 100%.

    The Knicks haven't been a good defensive team in a long time, this hire doesn't do anything to make me think that will change anytime soon. :sad::pity:

    I miss the days of Patrick and Oak pounding on anyone that dared come near the basket. They took pride in their defense and ability to rebound/block shots, something Curry and Randolph have failed to do.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2008
  17. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    Neither did Avery Johnson have experience as a coach when he took the Mav's job. Plus Jackson is a NYC boy true and true who would instantly have the respect of the fans and the media as well.

    D'Antoni will be coming in with a sick contract - $6mil a year - and will be expected to give results and if things start off badly the fans media could and probably will get on him and we all know NYC ain't Phoenix by a long shot, where as Jackson would probably be given more time to get things together there.

    So in this situation I would never say he is certainly better for the job, if we were talking about another city, then yeah, I would agree with you.
     
  18. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Wade leaves the Heat only if Spoelstra is a spectacular failure as a head coach and if another team offers him an incredible amount of money. It would have to be very incredible indeed for the Heat to not match or beat.
     
  19. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thibodeau was an assistant of van gundy. The garden didnt particularly care for the way he left the knicks. I would have liked that hire more but I can live with a guy almost 120 games ahead in the win-loss column. At the very least the contrast in styles will either force the knicks to change their personnel or change the way the personnel plays.
     
  20. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I would put in the unlikely category that Wade would leave but I do think he's actually more likely to leave than LeBron. Another horrible season, which is very possible and he might want to go to a winner. The Heat will be able to give him as much or more money than anyone else so money won't be an issue. Maybe Wade and LeBron team up in Cleveland? ....
     
  21. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Alright, now you're venturing from fantasies to wet dreams. :lol:

    I think LeBron treats basketball as a secondary venture now. It's just something that enables all of his other revenue streams. If he does think along those lines, then why wouldn't he want to go to New York? He'd make millions more just due to the nature of the market. Furthermore, we do know that LeBron isn't totally happy in Cleveland, that ridiculous house of his notwithstanding.

    Wade is pretty loyal to the Heat. He won a championship here, he signed a contract extension already, the person who pushed to draft him is now his head coach, and the team has already moved to make him the premier player by trading Shaq, simultaneously acquiring a possible piece in Marion. I think right now Wade is pretty happy despite the horrible season, because things are looking up. If the Heat can get the first or second pick in this draft, a top four playoff seed is not out of the question... especially with some of the jobber teams in the East. Atlanta? Philthy? Even Noo Yawk is going to take a few years to rebuild. (And that's one reason they'd probably make a huge push for LeBron.)

    But we'll find out what happens when it happens. It looks like Miami sports teams are starting to make a comeback.
     
  22. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Moderator Luxury Box

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    I've read rumblings of people saying the same thing about DWade. It's garbage speculation either way imo.
     
  23. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    No, Johnson was an assistant before he was a head coach. I'm not saying Jackson needs to be a previous NBA head coach, but Jackson's never even been an assistant coach. Hell, he's never so much as coached a high school basketball team. Being able to pound his chest and yell "Brooklyn in da house!" will only get him so far. There needs to be an understanding of Xs and Os, and an understanding of how to manage and handle NBA players.

    If Jackson wanted to pay his dues as an assistant on someone's staff, I'd be all for bringing him in as a head coach a few years down the road. But until then, forget it.
     
  24. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    I would agree that LeBron is more likely to leave than Wade. The Heat's move to trade Shaq and his millstone contract will accelerate the rebuilding process, and makes it much more likely that Wade will stick around. If they had kept Shaq's albatross of a contract, they'd have been stuck with lousy teams for the next several years, and I think Wade would be likely to bolt.
     
  25. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    Yeah, I wouldn't count too much on that happening. Curry and Randolph will report to training camp with man boobs once again, and continue fighting to the death over playing in the low post, while not rebounding or playing defense. That was Isiah's parting gift to this team; picking up an insanely overpaid guy who does the EXACT same thing as a guy you just paid dearly to get.

    Curry might be tradeable, if only because his contract is merely bad, whereas Randolph's is comical. And there are always teams in need of low post scoring.
     
  26. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    What he is going to learn as an assistant coach that he didn't learn as one of the top point guard in the NBA for 17 years?

    If anything he knows more about the X's and O's and handling players NBA players than most assistant coaches in the NBA today.
     
  27. Straz

    Straz Me and my girl :)

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    Maybe the Knicks have gotten the right man for the job, finally.
     
  28. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    Let me ask you this: is being a great point guard, in and of itself, all that's required to be a good head coach? By your logic, if a player was, say, the greatest point guard in NBA history, he'd seem to be a lock to be a good head coach. Am I correct?

    If that's the case, please explain to me how Magic Johnson flopped so badly in his stint coaching the Lakers.

    As an assistant, you learn the X's and O's. Yes, Jackson probably knows how to run damn near every offensive set in any given playbook. What he doesn't know is how to teach that to his players. He needs to know what play to call, and when. He needs to know how to light a fire under millionaires who don't want to hear nothin' from nobody. He needs to know how to make his schtick work for 82 games, not just one at a time. It is a completely different job, and a completely different mindset, and the vast majority of guys who have gone right from player to coach have failed. The best NBA head coaches ALL started as assistants. Greg Popovich, Phil Jackson, Pat Riley, Larry Brown, Jerry Sloan, etc. It might not take a LONG period as an assistant; Riley and Avery Johnson were both successful head coaches despite relatively short runs as assistants. But for Jackson to be successful, he would almost certainly need to cut his teeth as an assistant first.
     
  29. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    I never said that being a great point guard alone makes anyone an effective coach, what I am saying is in Mark Jackson's case and as a Nets fan listening to his color analysis he understands the game enough that he doesn't need to be an assistant coach first to prepare him to be an head coach. Would it help him, probably, is it necessary he gets it, no.

    Because Magic was too nice of a guy to be an effective head coach, something that wouldn't hinder Mark Jackson, he's not afraid to be critical and say what is needed to be said, anyone listening to his broadcasts would see this to be the case.

    And I never thought Magic had what it took to be a great head coach, in fact I would have been shocked if he did turn into one.

    How do you know he doesn't know how to teach players? And from what I saw as a player Mark Jackson leadership extended to lighting a fire under millionaires quite easily, why you think this would be a different transition as a coach is beyond me.

    As far as you last sentence how would you explain Larry Bird and Doc River's successes as Head Coaches? Neither of them was ever an assistant coach.
     
  30. ColoradoPhin

    ColoradoPhin New Member

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    The Knicks have a long way to go to be the team of Reed, Bradley, Frazier, Dave D., and the rest. D'Antoni can't be any worse than Isiah.
     
  31. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    I think Chris Kouffman (aka, our beloved ckparrothead) provides some of the best football analysis I've ever read. Do you think that qualifies him to be a head coach?

    Fine, but your sole criteria for proclaiming Jackson a great choice to coach the Knicks seemed to be his fine career as a point guard. And that damn sure didn't work for Magic.

    I don't know that he doesn't know how to teach players. He's probably got the tools to do it quite well, in fact. It's one thing to light a fire under a guy in one game, which a player can do. But a coach has to do it for an entire season, start to finish. That's a MUCH different job.

    If you're citing Doc Rivers as an example of a success story, you're going a long way toward proving my point.

    Obviously, you're dead-set on the idea that Jackson would be a fine head coach without working a day as an NBA assistant, in the face of overwhelming historical evidence to the contrary. I think you're horribly mistaken, but you're certainly entitled to your point of view.
     
  32. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    Rivers is not a successful coach. He wasn't particularly good with the Magic, and should have been fired last year. He's in the process of trying to screw up the best Boston team in 20 years. Like I said, if you want to cite him as an example of a success, you're proving my point.

    Collins was a very ordinary coach.

    Larry Bird was a success, but burnt out after three years. Kevin Loughery was a success, albeit in the ABA. He wasn't anything special in the NBA. Nelson is the only unqualified success story of the bunch. And even Nelson (like Bill Russell), basically functioned as an assistant coach in his final few years in the NBA. However, that was a different era. Player-coaches were not unheard of at that time, and coaches commanded a whole lot more respect simply because they were coaches.

    In any event, like I said, you're entitled to your opinion.
     
  33. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    All steps towards bringing Lebron to town.
     
  34. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Moderator Luxury Box

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    So who takes over in Phoenix?
     
  35. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    Did Avery get a job yet?
     
  36. Ronnie Bass

    Ronnie Bass Luxury Box Luxury Box

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    I heard Chicago is willing to talk to him, they also are looking at Mark Jackson now.
     
  37. High Definition

    High Definition No Smoke / No Drink 2011+

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    Seems like Paxson has a thing for Tom Thibodeau, so we'll see.
     
  38. phunwin

    phunwin Happy kids are Dolfans. Luxury Box

    Mark Stein has an excellent article on this, and all the D'Antoni-related goings-on. So far, Vinny Del Negro, Dan Majerle, Eddie Johnson, Jeff Hornacek, Tom Thibodeau and Paul Silas have been mentioned. Kerr wanted to hire Thibodeau as an assistant to D'Antoni this year, so you'd have to think he'll get strong consideration. I always thought Silas was a good coach as well, who usually deserved better than he got.
     
    DonShula84 likes this.
  39. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Dan Majerle would make a great Head Coach.
     

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