True, and then look at their WR/TE Corps. Are they that good? They lose Rice, Harvin, they have Baldwin and Tate. Good players. Not ideal. Would Tannehill be as good as Wilson on that team? I have no clue. I do know Wilson is playing really well this year. And with those legs, and he's still trying to pass first? That's a great combo. He's short but what is he, 1" shorter than Brees?
Sample size is small on Foles so I'll hold off on final judgment on him but he's looking good isn't he? This whole forum was real high on Wilson that's why I took him in the 18th round in a dynasty league last year (first year of the league). Nobody knew who he was, so I just grabbed him and it's paid off this year (Eli was our starting QB yikes!). I remember all of the talk on him and Weeden but I didn't like what I saw of Weeden. Morris was great value but QBs are just so important. RBs last what, 6-8 years on average for the good ones?
If wilson was 6'4" he would have been top qb in my book and said on draft day if we got Kuechly and Wilson I would be thrilled. But in saying that doesnt mean Tannehill was a bad pick or wont be great.
Morris has been an excellent RB for the Redskins and he certainly has to be considered at the top, for players who were steals of the 2012 draft. I thought at the time of the 2012 draft that Miller was a steal for the Dolphins, but right now it appears Vernon was the biggest steal for the Dolphins in that draft. I just consider Wilson and Foles the bigger steals because of the position they play. Quarterback is the most important position on the team and both these players have improved the team around them by their play at this most important of all positions.
I agree Tannehill wasn't a bad pick but like you, I preferred Kuechly in the first round and Wilson in the second round of the 2012 draft. Right now Kuechly is the best defensive player taken in the 2012 draft and Wilson is playing QB better than any of the other QB's taken in 2012 draft. I hope Tannehill has a great career in Miami, but it would be fantastic if the Dolphins had both Kuechly and Wilson on their roster right now.
There's a lot I like about Tanne and I do think he's improved from last year. I love his ability to not get rattled when he makes a bad play. He's able to shake it off, not get rattled and keep slinging it. He's made some big plays. He's good at picking up crucial first downs, which shows a lot of composure. He's been hampered by an atrocious OL. That was especially bad earlier on. They've oddly been better as of late, but he is the most sacked QB in the league and that has to be taken into consideration. I think some of his problems are obvious. They are similar to what alen mentioned in his article. He needs to throw with better anticipation and work on his accuracy and timing in general. Considering the OL and this being a quick timing offense, I think he's done real well. Something which I've been watching a lot lately is that he doesn't seem to scan the entire field when he drops back. He seems to lock onto one spot and one receiver. I wish he would scan the field a bit better, but again, I know it's a quick timing offense. It's kind of like what Dan the Man said in his interview with Bill Walsh when Walsh asked him: "What do you look at first when you drop back? What's your first read or whatever?..and Dan says: "Hey man, I just look for the open man and I'm going to hit him". Now I'm not expecting Tanne to be Dan, but I definitely would like to see a bit more of that in his game. Hopefully that will come in time. I still like him a lot.
The risk and winning the evaluation was to accept the height and not let it factor in the decision, basically he was a no brainer regardless of height, to move him down your own board or discount him or move him to the third round is the mistake..
I watched Wilson all the way back in his NCSU days and knew he would be a good NFL Qb b/c he made plays happen with guys around his feet and guys in his face, he would let it fly and it would nearly always be an accurate pass. Been considering the criticisms of Tannehill's game, what strikes me is there is only one "Fatal" one, that is not being able to control the middle of the field, to me the last couple of weeks he has done a much better job at controlling the middle of the field Thinking about that crossing route to Wallace and Hartline housing that slant and CC9 making some plays in the middle of the field. A mediocre deep ball is not the end of the world as the Defense still cannot know if he will hit that throw or not, they cannot really just nap on it b/c he does hit Wallace deep on occasion What that does mean is we do not generate the chunk yds that the offense is capable of generating. Also think, eerily like last season, as the yr winds down, he is running more and leaving the pocket more often Going to be a fun gm v the Stealers
True, but think about it- who actually stuck to their guns and thought that he'd be a top 10 pick, or was a top 10 talent with the height issue factored in? Maybe Boomer iirc, that's all I can think of. Here's a clip, I went to 1:01 at random, his running ability is superb. The arm, accuracy, bounce in his step in the pocket, pocket presence, touch, everything- dude was superb and his stats were ridiculous: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8r7wLnb1xc I thought that the Jets would jump all over him in the 2nd rd and my guess is that they would have taken him in the 3rd if he wasn't taken a couple of picks before. Then again, I thought that they should have taken Matt Barkley in the 3rd rd and I never was a big Barkley fan. He's talented nonetheless, and my guess a big improvement over Sanchez as a game manager. I never was that big a fan of Geno Smith.
I agree with all that and I will add one better 4th quarter play.Did you know we averaging 1.16 pts in the last 7 games in the 4th quarter?This is a combination of line play,play calling and qb play all wrapped up into one. This continues you can kiss the playoffs goodbye.
I like Tanny. He has shown a steady progression of improvement from week to week. I don't think he has reached his ceiling yet. Time will tell but so far so good. I like his toughness and his calm demeanor on the field. I also like that he does not have a favorite target. He spreads the ball around. I think as the game slows down for him he is going to start shredding up defenses. Give him a solid line and a decent RB and he has the ability to win championships. He has had a relatively painless sophomore slump but I don't think he is vastly improved.
It's difficult to compare QBs because each situation is different. I'm not as high on Wilson as some because he isn't asked to do as much as the other young QBs. They maximize his skill set with half field reads via rollouts and a lot of his throws are high percentage. The latter is bolstered by the beast that sits in their backfield. They are such a dominant front running team that it's difficult to tell if Wilson can sit in the pocket, make full field reads and bring his team from behind. The one chance he had this year (vs the Colts) resulted in a pick on the final drive. I think he'll always be a good player but I'm not convinced he'll be elite. If you watch Luck closely, it appears as if he's not fully developing as a pocket passer. He's shown a tendency to over shoot his receivers and he tends to lack patience in the pocket. I wonder if this has to do with the team so heavily relying on his athleticism and not forcing him to fully develop his pocket passing skills. Time will tell with all these young QBs but I think, even without getting the same love from the national media, Tannehill is progressing right along with these other QBs.
i agree with you and Jim. Tanny will be good even very good, but I don't see greatness. Guys we can win a Super Bowl with very good if we have this defense and a solid running game.
If he becomes Rich Gannon I could sooooo live with that. Especially MVP Rich Gannon, 4x pro bowl, 2x all NFL 1st team except Tannehill has a much better arm. Gannon is one of the most overlooked players ever. You can absolutely win with that type of production. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GannRi00.htm Just re-posting so everyone can see this...again. It deserves to be reposted again. Total QB is an ESPN made up piece of garbage. 38.4% on 3rd down is about the league average for success rates anyway. 28PPG...since when did that become the benchmark? Doesnt that also have something to do with the garbage playcalling? Doesnt that also have to do with the lack of a red-zone threat? Lack of height/no one with real leaping ability at WR to throw jump balls to? Yeah, call me skeptical but Luck has his Stanford coordinator who he had almost 50 games with and Bruce Arians...and Tannehill has...drumroll.......Mike Sherman who didnt even believe in Ryan as a college QB. Get him the heck out of town please. Call me not sold on the Shermanator but I refuse to believe Tannehill isnt at least a good starting QB based upon the growth we have seen over 2 years. Next year will be a big year but Ive seen enough to give him at least 1-2 more seasons, and probably much more. I dont love Wilson, but the guy is 14-0 at home. hes got a strong team around him but so far hes been darn good. I still dont think hes as good a player as Luck or Tannehill long term
It was so obvious the kid was not gonna go in the first, so with the info I had researched, I thought we could get a two for one steal..kinda like what we tried to do with Jake and Chad, except it would of been Luke and Wilson..
I also remember when we were scouting qbs that year how blown away I was that an athlete could play wide receiver for two years, than do some of the things the very next year at the hardest position on the field in Qb.. Also was high on Weeden..
I was very high on Weeden, I actually still am. When I watched Weeden throw, it was like watching Ken Griffey Jr swing a bat. Was effortless....
Your kidding right? You obviously haven't watched him play. If you haven't go look at his stats. I wouldn't waste my time posting them. Their so ridiculously good.
Russel Wilson is better than Tannehill. Did you watch him dismantle the Saints? Have you watched any of his games?
I think RW is a very good QB, dont get me wrong. But he has allot of help. There were a few throws I watched him make on Monday night that werent very good. I dont think his deep ball is anything to write home about, and I question if he can make all the throws that Tannehill does. But, really thats just being hyper picky. I dont really see any reason he isnt every bit as good as Drew Brees is. One thing that you notice is his center of balance. He reminds me of an infielder....guess thats why he was drafted into the MLB. But..he just seems to keep everything infront of him. I can tell the game is really slowing down for him, that one play where he tried a lateral to Marshawn Lynch, you could just feel him waiting, and waiting for Lynch to adjust so the pitch would be backwards.... Im impressed with the guy no doubt about it.
Russell Wilson will be a great qb IMO. yes he doesnt have to carry them on his back, but that also makes him more desirable, he doesnt have to be all, he allows lynch to shine, he is about winning, and he does it well. But I do believe Wilson struggles alot more here and doesnt look all pro. Ryan has stood up well under fire
My view in regards to forums like this is that everyone is entitled to their opinion. Even if this opinion makes absolutely no sense at all. So while you are certainly entitled to your on view of Wilson, I think that the vast majority of individuals who actually follow the NFL would strongly disagree with you. Wilson so far has been the best QB drafted in 2012. This may not be the case when we look back in a decade, but right now I have no doubt if the draft was held today and GM's in the NFL were given another chance to evaluate Wilson after his play in the NFL so far, he would be at least the second QB taken in the draft. I still think Luck will eventually prove to be best QB out of all the QB's drafted in 2012, but Wilson certainly isn't far behind him.
Their Defense dismantled the Saints and allowed them to run their offense the way they wanted. To be honest though....that environment...theres a reason why they are great at home. Look how they played against the Rams though. I think Wilson got sacked what, like 8 times?
Honestly....I would still take Tannehill. When it comes down to it....his size, and athletic ability, matched with his arm....to me those are attributes you look for.
I hope this proves to be correct. right now I can't agree, but maybe in two years you will look like a genius - i hope so!
Tannehill is the QB of my team right now, so I hope you are right in your assessment of his ability going forward. Right now though, if the draft were being held, my first selection would be Luck, followed by Wilson, Foles, and then Tannehill. I think once he is fully recovered from his injury and has more talent around him, RG3 is still going to be a very good QB in the NFL. Yet given what we know about these QB's so far in the NFL, he would probably be the fifth QB drafted at this time.
My only issues with your thinking.... Foles is playing great, but remember its Chip Kelly's offense. Im not certain alot of this is based on the system he is running. Wilson, again, how does he do when not running the spread option as much? Luck I have no problem with....I believe he and RT are both QB's who can thrive in various offensive styles.
My view is that great coaches, such as Shula, adapt to the players they have on their roster. They don't force players to adapt to a system which doesn't suit them. I personally think Foles and Wilson could play in any system, but it would be up to the coaches to create a system in which both these QB's would strive. I'm not down on Tannehill at this time. I just think that right NOW, Foles and Wilson are better NFL QB's. That may not be the case in a few years, but I am just judging the QB's taken in the 2012 draft based on what they have done so far in the NFL.
Oh I totally agree with you. And I mean..hey...for years people said Brady was a system QB. Coaching I believe has ALOT to do with how a QB ends up. One of the reasons I wish we had a OC that was creative enough to force teams to stop our offense, not just call an offense based on what the defense gives us.
Heres a perfect example of being a Creative OC....check out what Scott Linehan called here in Minn against the Bears... [video=youtube;KqiG1abEkGc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqiG1abEkGc[/video] He lines Cordarelle Patterson up and moves Adrian Petterson to FB...the Bears defense looked like they were running in sand...not sure what to expect.
Russell Wilson is better than Ryan Tannehill because of whats around him. Take away Russell Okung (see the Texans game), take away Marshawn Lynch, and take away that dominant defense and Russell Wilson would struggle. I'm not saying Wilson isn't a good QB (I think he's very good) but circumstances and skilled positions surrounding him on both sides of the ball make his job a hell of lot more easier than what Tannehill has had to deal with. I'm just saying...Lets continue this debate when Wilson and the team he's on takes a turn at having an off year. It still takes a team to win games and Seattle certainly has that right now in their favor. Like I said...No doubt Wilson is very good and is probably going to get even better but it's way to early to say that Wilson is the better QB. Right now yes...He's having the better season but year to year things change. I think in conclusion it's safe to say that Wilson is a winner already while Tannehill is still learning how to win.
Jay Cutler has those attributes too, would you take him? What about Colin Kaepernick? I think that's half the problem. People see all those great attributes, but the one that matters - getting the offense in the endzone and scoring points, he's struggles at.
That play is so simple yet so effective with that player, reason being he's more effective as a runner than a receiver at this point.
With no running game the dolphins have been one of the best in the league in the red zone this season
I would attribute to some of our struggles to score points to Ryan not using his legs effectively throughout the game, especially early.
Im sorry but I dont see the comparison between either Cutler or Kaep. Kaepernick has a very slow delivery....and seems like he is in trouble once teams figure out the pistol. Cutler is a meat head, although hes gotten alot better. Where Tannehill soaks up coaching, almost to a fault, how long has it been that Coach's were trying to get Cutler to spread the ball around? I mean...why didnt you just compare Tannehill to Jim Drukenmiller or Jeff George? And...HE doesnt struggle at it...our OFFENSE does. Theres alot more to getting into the endzone then just Ryan Tannehill.
Russell Wilson in a vacuum is as good as anyone From that draft, but if you take away that stadium you might have a team that plays on a more even playing field as the rest of the NFL. It's a ridiculous advantage.
