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Salary Cap for 2024

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Finatik, Dec 19, 2023.

  1. Striking

    Striking Junior Member

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    Don't ruin the negativity man
    -Tommy Chong
     
  2. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    You do realize that half of the defense is not under contract currently, and the other half is injured correct?
     
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  3. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    It is interesting people say , just release all these players and we will under the cap, apparently not realizing we will have to sign players :) Losing Wilkins, Baker. AVG, X because of the salary cap mess is not a win in my books.
     
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  4. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    1/2 a game and about 10 injuries away. Lol
     
  5. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Good thing no one is suggesting losing Wilkins, AVG, or anyone else of consequence. Will they be signed? Who knows, but it won’t be because the Dolphins can’t afford them.

    And All a person has to do is a little google search to see who else will be a FA from other teams and possibly signed to replace X and Baker. Cheaper and as good or better.
     
  6. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    Bro. Those games weren't close though. We were blown out by the playoff level teams, Chiefs, Bills, and Ravens.

    In a season where QBs had a down year, where Tua's league leading yard total would have led the league once in 15+ years (and that time was a 16 game season), Tua stayed healthy, and we faced the least winning teams in the sport. That is going to be the ceiling for Tua and the team. The team are going to lose so much talent, and no easy solutions to replace. We don't have the draft capital.

    The window is closed. The wrong QB was chosen. The question now is do you stubbornly pretend it's still open, and keep going, or rebuild. It's going to be the former because Grier wants to keep his job.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2024
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  7. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    2 guys are injured and they will be back. Some of the other guys will be signed. And there's this weird thing called free agency. You've all been shown how the cap can be managed but the chicken littles are still running around crying the sky is falling.
     
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  8. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    No. We just aren't buying your version of the future that you're selling. It's fine if you buy it. I don't.

    This year was outer best shot at winning it all. Injuries crushed that. I don't see us keeping this much talent while also giving Tua a big contract etc etc.

    I know I know, fancy accounting fixes that. Great.

    So we get 2-3 seasons more to try to win it all, before the the contracts all balloon and we're screwed, and the rebuild starts anyway.

    I don't think they win it all in the next two seasons...unless they simply franchise tag Tua.

    I think Tua sits out of they do that...I would if I were him.
     
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  9. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Franchising Tua is likely to be a significantly higher cap hit than an extension.

    We had some tough losses to end the season and did the classic Miami thing of being unable to pair good defensive games with good offensive games. Annoying!!

    But the idea that we aren't close and must rebuild is fallacious. Nonsensical even. The team has some heavy lifting in navigating free agency and the draft but if they do well and the injuries normalize, we absolutely have a very good shot at the division and a key home playoff game or two.

    I get we ended the season on a downer, but the doomsaying is a bit much frankly. Maybe it doesn't work out, but it doesn't work out for 31 teams every year. We are 100% still close enough to keep the run going and try again.
     
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  10. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    So AVG with broken ankle is not injured? Baker is not injured with broken hand? The cap can certainly be managed, but for me losing AVG. Baker, Wilkins, X is not a win, that is loss. They could easily manage it by just cutting everyone.
     
  11. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    What? LOL what? OMG thank you for the laugh out loud moment this morning. So the Dolphins will just let some of their best players go for the fun of it and it has nothing to do with money LOL .............
     
  12. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    The issue is the salary cap. You are correct if we brought everyone back and added some pieces things would be great. However, the reality is the salary cap is not going to allow for us to bring everyone back. Reality is we could lose Wilkins, Baker, AVG, and X. that is almost 40% of the defense. Our DE will be out 9 months. so over 50% of the defense could be new, that is kinda starting over.

    If you push Tua's contract out, and he continues to fail in December and against good teams, then you have another Tannehill situation.
     
  13. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    No. If Wilkins leaves it will be because he’s offered more than the Dolphins WANT to pay, not what they CAN’T pay. And that’s been the narrative..that the Dolphins can’t afford him because they are in some make believe salary cap hell. They are provably not. So laugh away while you continue to move the goalposts and ignore all the evidence to the contrary.
     
  14. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    That’s just false. Why you keep ignoring the evidence about the salary cap is baffling to me.
    As for losing X and Baker…. So? I mean, X has been one of my favorite players for years, but age happens to us all. And there is pretty compelling evidence that suggests that Cam Smith can play as well as X has over the past few years. As for Baker, same thing, I like the guy, but his level of play can be replaced at a cheaper rate. And the Dolphins have plenty of money to get someone to replace him. I hope they keep AVG and Wilkins, and if they don’t it WON’T be because they can’t afford them.
    Chubb and JP are concerning because their injuries will likely have them missing the first month of the season. However, let’s see what they do to mitigate that before we start handwringing and just making stuff up.
     
  15. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Wilkins is interesting. It seems he wants the money more than anything if reports from last offseason are true. Basically, he was offered something akin to the Kenny Clark contract and he refused and essentially demanded to top the DT market. He went out and after some early struggles he had an absolutely elite year. Will he demand to reset the DT market again and do we pay that? Does he try and sign before Chris Jones? After Jones?

    If we want him - and we should - we will need to offer him more than we did last offseason. But dang man, is he THE BEST DT in the game? I don't know, and if he isn't, why pay him as such? I get we don't want to let our "homegrown" players go, but the contract can't be outrageous.

    I guess our new Coordinator offers some flexibility here - Wilkins could probably thrive under his tutelage and scheme, but we can also get some solid production from less expensive players if we need.

    IMO Hunt is the first priority. I'd take Williams if he will accept a team friendly deal, but I'm not breaking the bank to bring back a C who has shaky snapping and may not be ready to start the year.

    People I think may be sleeping a bit on Baker. While that contract isn't cheap, it's not onerous and we absolutely and completely performed worse when he was out. I'd be leery of thinking we can "easily" upgrade him.
     
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  16. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    It’s 100% about the money for Wilkins. And don’t take that wrong, I think he’s an exceptional teammate and player, but the guy is notoriously cheap and money driven. Maybe frugal is the better word? Anyhow, that’s not a criticism for Wilkins, but just the way it is.
    He’s not the best DT, but he’s top 8-10… maybe a few spots higher. And he should be paid accordingly. Will the Dolphins want to do that? Don’t know, maybe Weaver thinks he can get a couple of players for that money that give close to a Wilkins type production between them?

    As for Baker, it wasn’t so much his play, which was fine (not anything special), but the fact he made the defensive calls was the reason the defense look off when he was out. That and Duke is worse than Baker.
     
  17. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    LOL seriously LOL. The Dolphins could pay him if they were not in salary cap hell, that is reality. The could always franchise him to keep him, but again they may not have the money because of SALARY CAP
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2024
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  18. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    If they don't at least tag and trade him, it's DEFINITELY about the salary cap.
     
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  19. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Keep not understanding or ignoring the information provided to you.

    Wilkins doesn’t want to be tagged. It’s a huge risk for someone who can get a big payday. If he’s tagged, my bet is he holds out. No one will win.
    If the Dolphins want to pay him his market value they have plenty of money to do it.
     
  20. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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    You tag and trade.

    You can also just tag, and deal with it. Wilkins might not be happy, but the deck is rigged, and players are screwed if they don't play. Look at Chris Jones w/ KC.
     
  21. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    The way that I am seeing the cap situation, there are multiple layers to this.

    Easy cuts -

    Howard (Post June 1st)
    Baker
    Ogbah
    Crossen
    Wilson Jr.

    Dicy situations -

    Mike White - My understanding was that during the preseason there was a genuine battle between him and Skylar. If they really were close, I would cut White. I would also be looking at mid to late round quarterbacks who I believe could be serviceable backups. I do think that with Tua, we need a viable presence as a backup.

    Jason Sanders - He is slightly underperformed his contract, but he is still a good kicker with a big leg. I would not want to cut him, but we may have our hands forced. This is a situation where we are kicking ourselves later.

    Durham Smythe - We are on the hook for a decent portion of this year's contract, and we would save $1.5m by cutting him with $3.3M being paid to him one way or another. Perhaps you could argue that our replacement is already on the roster with Julian Hill or Tanner Conner. I would certainly be looking to upgrade this position in the draft which could make him expendable.

    David Long Jr. - He was a pretty solid player last year, but he is not under contract after next season. I could see how using his cap savings to spend on someone with a long term future with the team.

    Duke Reilly - He is definitely not worth $3M, but it just feels like our LB unit is on thin ice. We are probably looking at a situation where we are choosing between Reilly or Long.

    Salary Cap Jujitsu

    Christian Wilkins - Obviously, we could play the compensatory pick game and let him walk and get a third round pick for him, but that would also dictate our free agency plans. That being said, I don't see us making a lot of big slashes either, so there is a decently likelihood that we can get that third rounder next season. What I would really like to do is a tag and trade. It is a dangerous game to play, but I really do think we could get a second rounder for him this year.

    Connor Williams - At the start of the season, I thought he was gone at the end of the year. Having an injury late in the season makes his availability in question at the start of the season. I do think that it is reasonable to think that this might hurt his value. He might be forced to take a 1 year deal and try and land a big contract next offseason. I would monitor this situation.

    Andrew Van Ginkel - This one is gonna be painful. Talk about developing your draft picks - Van Ginkel has really exceeded all expectations for a 5th round pick. You just hate to see a guy like him go. Ultimately, we probably are gonna have to let him go, but I really do think we should try to retain him.
     
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  22. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    I think we need to retain AVG unless he's really just trying to make bank. To be blunt, I don't think we will get Phillips back in '24. He will PLAY, maybe even week 1, but he probably won't be the Phillips we are counting on. That's just what achilles often do man. Chubb will probably come back closer to full strength, but not as early, and has some injury risk. We need an AVG to fill in, and probably need to bring back Ingram and sign/draft another major contributor. I will say, if Weaver can get a Clowney performance out of someone inexpensive, that's a HUGE get.

    I'm also good cutting Mike White and just going with Thompson or some other late round pick/UDFA. I think if a QB misses real time, you're just done. That's the reality. Mike White isn't getting you to the playoffs if he's playing 8+ games. A QB just needs to keep you afloat for 2-3 games if there is a minor issue. EVERY deep playoff team - hell, almost every playoff team in general - had a QB that missed little to no time. It's just reality.

    You can't cut Baker and Long and Reilly imo, unless we are radically changing our defense. Long actually makes the most sense - he's much better than Reilly and cheaper than Baker.
     
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  23. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    LOL, plenty of money , OK ;) ;) ;)

    They have to clear up over 70 million JUST to sign him. Then there are those other 28 players they will need to sign.
     
  24. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    They are saying AVG injury may take much longer. "Unfortunately, as we said, athletes of a professional level need surgery in almost every case. This puts their return to the playing field at 3-6 months after the injury. Unfortunately, the athlete does not always return to their pre-injury form. The injured joints can remain painful and weakened."
     
  25. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    That is the argument some want to make, the salary cap is easy!, just cut everyone.
     
  26. tirty8

    tirty8 Well-Known Member

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    Here is the thing. AVG absolutely needs to be trying to break the bank. He will be 29 at the start of the season, and he will have made $7.9M over the course of his career. If he can land a multi-year deal, it will most likely be his last multi-year deal. Moreover, he should be able to get more in terms of guarantees in this contract than he has made over the course of his entire career. Even if he can only get a 1 year/ $5M deal, he really should take it. Unfortunately, late round picks like this, have to really treat football like a business, and if a terrible team like Carolina offered him bank, he has to do what is right by his family. It is those big money first round picks with endorsement deals that have a little flexibility to work with.
     
  27. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Again,

    "Keep not understanding or ignoring the information provided to you."

    Do you really think that a Wilkins extension, even if he's going to be paid like a top 5 DT, will cost $20m+ against the cap in his first couple of years? You really don't know anything about how the cap works, huh? For example, in 2018, Aaron Donald signed a 6 year extension worth $135m. That's $22.5m/year. His first year cap hit was about $8m. His second year cap hit was about $9m. His 3rd year was about $14m.

    And if you think the Dolphins, or any team for that matter, will keep every FA on their roster I have a bridge I'd like to show you.

    Maybe you should just sit this topic out?
     
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  28. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Literally no one except you is making a "cut everybody" argument. YOU are the one who thinks that the only way the Dolphins will have cap space is if they cut everyone. LMAO!

    If you took the time to actually inform yourself (or just actually read the info that has been spoon fed to you on this forum) about the cap it would be easy.
     
  29. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure why you don't want to see letting Baker, AVG, X, Wilkins go is a big deal. Yes, again like I have stated multiple times, getting under the cap is "easy" if you release the cog players from your team. I however, don't see that is a win. Not sure why that is difficult for you to understand.

    Not literally everybody, but some are oblivious to the releasing of cog players being related to the salary cap.
     
  30. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I would like us to pay our players, the ones we draft and who have been on the team for sometime. I think it shows loyalty to players in an unloyal system.
     
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  31. JJ_79

    JJ_79 Well-Known Member

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    When the player deserves it, like Wilkins, then I totally agree. For that to happen more consistently, we need better drafting.
     
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  32. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    And who said letting all 4 of those players go isn't a big deal? You've been trying to act like it's a forgone conclusion that they are leaving due to the salary cap, but that's not true and that's been my argument.

    Out of those 4 players, I think X is gone and that's due to his age more than anything else. It just so happens that cutting him will make it easier to keep those other 3. If I had to guess, right now, AVG will definitely be back if nothing more than because we need an edge players until JP and Chubb are healthy. I think Wilkins is 50/50 and that's because Weaver may be able to entice DT's nearly as good or better (again scheme comes into play here) for cheaper money. If Weaver thinks Wilkins is a better fit they have the money to pay him. However, if he wants some kind of top 1 or 2 money they probably won't pay that. Not CAN'T pay that. As for Baker, same thing, Weaver may think he fits the scheme well, but if not, there are other LB's that are cheaper that may fit the scheme better.

    Again, there will be no issues with paying players due to cap constraints. You've been shown this over and over and for some reason continue to ignore it.
     
  33. Fishhead

    Fishhead Well-Known Member

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    One defensive player who might be back:

     
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  34. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

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    Pretty decent rundown on the cap and a few easy solutions.

     
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  35. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    My bet is this very concise and simple breakdown will either be ignored or not understood by some so they can keep screaming “THE SKY IS FALLING”!
     
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  36. Dorfdad

    Dorfdad Well-Known Member

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    this is the game Grier got us into. My take is they are going to try and restructure a few players and back end those contracts 3-5 years. It’s the only way they can afford to keep them.

    They believe they are in win now mode. (They aren’t) so Grier will won’t hesitate to save his career by passing the problem 2-3 years down the line and hope for a miracle.
     
  37. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

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  38. Fireland

    Fireland Well-Known Member

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    Its that or blow it up. There really isn't any other move that makes sense.
     
  39. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    So you mean they'll do what all playoff teams do each and every season?
     
  40. danmarino

    danmarino Tua is H1M! Club Member

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    Looks like the cap is going up $26m rather than the initial projection of $16-$18m.

    Cutting Ogbah ($13.7m) and X ($18.5m) will have the Dolphins basically even.

    For those that can't seem to comprehend how this works, here's the math:

    18.5+13.7+26= 57.7

    Dolphins are currently over the cap by $51m

    So they will be +$6.7m before the season starts just by cutting these two players.

    Extend Tua and save about $17m ($23.7m under the cap)

    Release Baker and save about $10m ($33.7 under the cap) (Extending Baker if Weaver thinks he's a good fit will save about $8m)

    Restructure Tyreek and save about $22m ($55.7 under the cap)

    Extend/Restructure Ramsey and save around $15-$20m ($70m under the cap if we go with the lower of those numbers)

    Restructure Chubb and save about $14m ($84m under the cap)

    This is plenty of money to pay Wilkins, Hunt, Williams, AVG, etc. and sign their rookies.


    I'm sure some will not read or comprehend this, however, and keep bemoaning about the "cap hell" they think we're in. lol
     
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