I beg to differ on the 3 week wait. We have had plenty of time to make the adjustments for the regular season. This is afterall when the games count. This isnt a first year QB, a first year staff, or an inxperienced group running things. This was week 1 regular season. When we had the same problems in the preseason, I heard people saying it's just preseason. I heard how we'd have adjustments in the regular season. I heard that we aren't showing all of our cards. The regular season is here and we should be running on all cylinders Padre. I don't think it's ok to go a month into the season before we can be expected to move the football on Offense, especially considering it's not a different failure each week. If that were the case the problems would be more complex. It's the same issues all the time. We can't run the ball and we are not attacking the whole field effectively. I'm hoping for the best just like you, and I want to see us successful in the worst way, but today was just more of the same stuff. I'm not sure I made any prognostications... I'm just saying so far the same things I mentioned as problems in preseason are still a problem in the regular season.
So Mike, do you see the players struggling because of the coaches scheme... or is a lack of players struggling because they are not physically talented for the scheme???
Not at all, rubbing it in isn't the point at all. The point is that our problems in preseason and last season are still with us and we've done little to fix the problem based on todays showing. Should it not be discussed? Seems to me the best way to answer those posts was to wait and see after we got to the regular season.
Tacky to talk X's and O's? Give it a break! I've been one of the most optimistic fans on this board for a very long time. If folks want to engage in a debate on our scheme or something football related as strong opinioned fans then I'm sure they are big enough Dolfans to enage in the discussion without a note from Mom.
Ultimately I think you are right that when the line improves our Offense will makes leaps and bounds. However, break it down. Is the OL just struggling because the personel? Could it be the blocking scheme? Could it be that teams have great keys on what we do and do not do when we have the ball. I think it's the latter. I think the OL is struggling because of the small box we live in when on offense. I think it's making life on the OL much tougher than it has to be.
Oh please, "so Smiley, you had a bad game and we signed this guy off of the street who will play at a high level for us" I do not deal in "hope" and we did run the ball "okay" the 4 TO's sank at least three scoring drives, we cannot really bench Fasano and Penny, it is highly unlikely that we bench Smiley or Jake Long, meaning the Staff is going to have to man up and solve some issues. Sorry Dmike, sometimes players have to play out of slumps, meaning the same Oline starts next Monday night, they simply have to play better. Meaning once again the Dolphins will go as far as the Staff can coach them up. And on the plus side, the Defense played lights out and the kick coverage teams played well as well, not all is bleak. To me, A) they worked to hard in camp B) Henning got to cute with P White C) Big Jake has to man up because the other Jake played just fine, the one everyone was worried about his level of play. To me, we should run a base 3 Wr offense or say screw it and run the one back with an H Back.
There was nothing "obnoxious" in my posts. I was engaged with other Dolfans in a discussion on X's and O's on a thread I started back in preseason. It's been an ongoing discussion as each game progressed and I've taken steps to explain my point of view in detail when asked. Part of that discussion was about waiting until the regular season to see what we really had and how we were really going to do things.
As a guy who categorically hates dink and dunk WC style offenses I have a problem with the idea of not attacking the deep areas of the field on a consistent basis but I think Henning and Penington are a pretty good match in terms of a coordinator who draws up a plan that fits his QB. A ball control type short passing attack is what Chad does well and as long as he is the QB it doesnt make sense to try and be too vertical. Its an offense that worked for us last year, we won the AFC East, but its a scheme that demands perfection because it gives little room for error. To score in a wide open vertical type offense you only need 1 or 2 good plays to get in scoring range because more of your throws are going deep, for us we need 4-5 because few balls are going to be traveling 35+ yards in the air and if you dont get a tone of yac then its hard to make explosive plays. For a vertical team its easier to overcome a turnover deficit because of the large explosive plays that can get you back in a game in a hurry, for us its harder because our scoring drives are going to be longer and more time consuming. Overall, like I said I dont like being a short passing team in general but I think you have to play to the strength of you starting QB and that is undoubtedly his. I think it bears pointing out though that we had 4 turnovers today, that hard to overcome for any offense, cant wait till the game goes up on NFL.com's rewind so I can watch it.
Hear hear DMike none of your posts have even the whiff of "obnoxious" we got our tails whipped and people are really emotional right now, I hope you don't take offense (pardon the pun). The offense is at that awkward stage do we play to make lots of yardage plays or do we become three yds and a cloud of dust and no turnovers? To me, we were in the middle today, we ran the ball effectively enough, but the passing game was a dead zone, our Defense played well, but not dominant, if I were Sparano, I'm not certain what I would do. I do think Cam Wake would have helped, and I do feel we should have moved the pocket more on rollouts and naked bootlegs.
Tell you what. When "us" Dolphin fans can blame Murlakey for our woes a few years ago and come back and complain about the O now? There is definitely a problem with the system. Try throwing a pass over the fricken' middle. Stop with the razzle-dazzle(nothing) plays. Stop trying to be a POWER running team when you are not. Attempt to get the ball to someone other than your safety valve? Stop being conservative "all the time" it seems... On and on and on... Oh boy,toooo many beers. Hey !!!! the D looked great considering.We have something there for sure.
I agree that individually there was nothing obnoxious in your posts. What made them collectively obnoxious, IMO, was the timing and the volume of your posts. 4 in a row just seems to me that you're awful excited to be right predicting that our offense would struggle, and that rubbed me the wrong way. But I wasn't too involved in this original discussion so if the people you're engaging in this debate with don't seem to care, then I'll stay out of it.
After a pre season of offensive problems and an 0-3 start to the season, Former Dolphin Jim Mandich said this about our offense today. http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/...gers-mandich-092709,0,1669366.story?track=rss "Take what Dolphins fans have seen in the first three games is a tragically flawed offense. An offense where there is no intermediate or long passing game, which ultimately becomes very easy to defend. Every week that fact is rubbed in your nose because you see that other teams are doing that to you, beating you deep, and with the big play. It's Malcom Floyd catching 47-yard passes. It's Vincent Jackson catching a 55-yarder. On offense, we saw a valiant effort in the first drive, slugging it out for 17 plays. Yet you can't deliver that haymaker to get it into the end zone, which is dispiriting." Tony Sparano mentioned before the game that the Dolphins needed to improve in gaining "chunk yardage" meaning get the ball upfield rather than just dink and dunk each play, yet the Dolphins made no real attempt to do so despite throwing long to Ginn on the first set of plays from scrimmage. "The red zone offense was not good," coach Tony Sparano said. "It was lousy." I suppose a good sign could be that Sparano has identified that we are not gaining "chunk yardage" and that it needs to be a point of focus. Hopfully we'll see a change next time we take the field. As it stands now: Dolphins Passing Yards - 29th Attempts Per Game - 20th Yards Per Attempt - 28th Sacks - 22nd QB Rating - 28th
Just thought I'd add to my original response on this, the scheme looked no different with Henne at the helm than it did Penny in terms of attack areas (which I charted) or stretching the field. Henne's arm strength advantage was not a factor at all IMO. Some people think that is because of Henne being the backup and not the focus in practice, while I think it's been a philosophical approach in our scheme that has limited the upfield action.
We now see what the coaching staff is made of, in the coming weeks. Sad to see Penny gone, but we were 0-3 with him at the helm. We now see if we made mistakes in personnel the past two years.
I'll be very interested watching to see if we call the game more to Henne's strengths, rather than those of Penny. Henne is no dink and dunk guy.
How much better is our running game with a respectable (doesn't even have to be spectacular) intermediate/deep game?
Well, after trading for Thigpen, a move I love, Sparano had this to say about our passing game and the addition of Henne as our starter. "“I think arm strength’s the obvious,” Sparano said. “Now arm strength in this league isn’t everything.” But Sparano said Pennington’s lack of arm strength didn’t hold back the Dolphins’ offense, especially deep throwns to players like Ted Ginn Jr. “I think Chad Pennington made some outstanding throws to Ted Ginn and I think Chad Henne will do the same,” Sparano said. Sparano said the QB change won’t change the game plan. “It won’t alter the way I call plays, the way Dan (Henning) calls plays,” Sparano said. “I have very much a great deal confidence in Chad Henne and Chad Henne’s approach to game.” I hope thats just coach-speak, and that a change is coming, because Henne will likely not be about to play Dink and Dunk like Penny did. Also, we havent been all that effective with our dink and dunk to begin with since the preseason began. Our Offense right now would only be mediocore even without the turnovers. Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. ~ Albert Einstein
I hope thats just coach-speak, and that a change is coming, because Henne will likely not be about to play Dink and Dunk like Penny did. Also, we havent been all that effective with our dink and dunk to begin with since the preseason began. Our Offense right now would only be mediocore even without the turnovers. I think we all hope it's only coach-speak, but seeing Henne during the preseason was disheartening, he was dinking and dunking, made me think they were turning Henne into Pennington.
thanks for the thread dolfanmike, been following it for a while and think its a great discussion topic. i am curious to see if henne throws it down the field. i think plays have been called to go deep, but i don't know what pennington has seen on those plays, i don't have the games to rewatch or film. i am very curious why the throws were not made, was it lack of confidence in the receiver, lack of confidence in penny's own arm, lack of time, receivers not open, wrong defensive alignment to attack, the list goes on. probably a combo of these and more things all i know is we just did not see it happen very often. as for the middle of the field i don't think fasano has the speed/athleticism to attack it the way martin did last season, but we need to make some plays in the intermediate and deep middle also. i think in order to score more points consistently we have to attack the whole field and make the defense defend the whole field. a step or two up or back or a quick look into the backfield by a defender can be the difference between a touchdown or 2nd and 10. i want henne to succeed, i hope henne can succeed, but i'm not convinced he can succeed yet. we are not out of this season by any means and the next 3 games will be very interesting to see.
Mike, I'm struggling to see whether Henning has been calling plays for Penny which are targeted towards his short passing strengths vs calling plays that give the QB options to go deep or short while Penny always chooses the short option. What do you think? I'm not sure myself but I am leaning towards Henning calling plays for Qbs to go either deep or short. If that is the case I would expect Henne to take the deep option more often than Penny.
I hope we have routes with a deep option, but from what I've been seeingit looks like most our stuff just floods underneath zones. Medium and crossing routes wounld compliment too.
I don't think people should be worried that our coaching staff will not play to the strengths that Henne possesses. This is the same coaching staff that used the wildcat to get our best personnel out on the field ( aka play to our strengths ), and the staff that didn't have pennington throwing the skinny post when he didn't have the arm strength to do it. This staff is going to play to the teams strengths. If they didn't do that, then last year we wouldn't have been AFC East Champs. Even with the easy schedule. This staff is going to do it right. Now maybe this week isn't the week to throw 14 bombs, We want to get Henne confident and comfortable out there. But over the course of time this staff will play to his skill set. I would actually look for the bomb more against the blitzing Jets, because there will be chances for big plays. You have burn the blitz or they will keep sending it.. unless you are Rex Ryan and you send it no matter what the offense does
This has been such an enjoyable thread to read. I want to thank DolfanMike and everyone else for their contributions. I thought I would bump this thread up, dust it off, give it a nice shake, considering we have a new young QB in the house. Let's continue please.
