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Surprising Incognito News

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by KeyFin, Aug 24, 2018.

  1. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    Since this thread keeps going (have to admit it's entertaining).. I just want to point out that racism on Kap's part also played a role in him not being signed. According to Ray Lewis, Kap was about to be signed by the Ravens until a racist tweet appeared from Kap's girlfriend:
    http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/...ay-lewis-colin-kaepernick-20170905-story.html
    Hard for an owner to sign a guy that publicly compares you to a cruel plantation owner. btw.. in that anonymous QB tier polling they asked execs why Kap wasn't signed. #1 reason:
    http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...nsights-why-colin-kaepernick-remains-unsigned
    Makes sense really.
     
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  2. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    This is my point.

    He could've taken a knee because of ANYTHING and that negative attention wouldn't of jived with his diminishing skill set.

    If Cam Newton kneeled first, Cam Newton would still be the QB of the Panthers.
     
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  3. Den54

    Den54 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Really don't understand how people can't grasp the above.
     
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  4. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    Racism is judging someone based on their race. You've done that throughout this thread and compared many of us to cruel NFL owners, racists, oppressors, etc. You've also referred to many here as stupid and uninformed. And I'm sorry, nobody listens to someone screaming about racism when they're being blatantly racist themselves. The fact that you can not see that is THE ENTIRE PROBLEM FOR KAEP'S MOVEMENT and why racism is so out of control in America.

    As long as you keep saying "you people" with all the racist innuendos, you're ensuring that racism never changes.

    And PS- most people here think Ritchie Incognito is a white trash thug. He is not "beloved" by anyone on this site and calling him "Cogs" is not a term of endearment. It's pathetic that you keep bringing up his racist words but completely ignore what Martin said to him right before that, which was equally despicable. Read the full transcripts before passing judgement. They are both pathetic humans who treated each other horribly- stop trying to blame the white man in everything because it fits a preconceived agenda.
     
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  5. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    I for one am glad this is one of Kaepernick's last images of his NFL career. Game on the line, looking to run instead of pass, sniffed out and hammered into the grass.
     
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  6. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    It's very unlikely that they would have signed him. He had much more rumblings in Seattle and left without anything. I just find it astonishing that you're accepting that without any critical evaluation. Here's the thing, what she didn't wasn't racist. NFL owners have long been compared to plantation owners, a characterization that doesn't exist in other sports because in other sports owners don't act like plantation owners. Michael Wilbon did the same thing to Jerry Jones and didn't suffer for it:

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...ares-cowboys-owner-jerry-jones-to-slave-owner

    Again, it's not racist to compare someone to another racist. Add to it that Ray Lewis is very much playing the same role that Omarosa did for Trump and the same role that Sam Jackson played in Django. Ray Lewis is providing racial cover to the Ravens. Ray Lewis is that black friend that racists claim to have, it's just that Lewis is being paid for loyalty. You wouldn't get one historian, sociologist, anthropologist, or other academic worth their salt who would characterize what she did as racist.


    Let's not forget that this Kaepernick-Ravens stuff happened after he had spent the entire off-season unsigned coming off a 90.7 rating and after Flacco got hurt. He's probably as good if not better than Flacco (Flacco has never put great numbers) and he's better than I would say all of the back-up QB's in the league right now. Point being, the Ravens were at their most desperate at the time.

    But again, for as smart as you are, and for as great as you are with statistics, I'm legitimately shocked that you would accept the rationale of NFL execs without reservation. They lie about their own players on game day. They lie about any little thing. But, the major point to make here is that it would be stupid for NFL execs to admit that they colluded because of a non-football reason. They would have been sued the next day and lost if they were on the record saying that. The NFLPA would have come against them very hard.

    It's one of those things like when conservatives say they want small government and low deficits then pump up the military spending. What they really mean they don't want to spend money on helping poor people locally, what they'd much rather be doing is bombing them in other countries. It's understood what they mean, but you can't just outright say that because then the law gets involved. You're way too smart to be replying with this.
     
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  7. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Because it's uncritical nonsense?
     
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  8. cbrad

    cbrad . Club Member

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    It was an anonymous poll. I doubt you could sue in that case.

    More importantly, the reason the exec gave for not signing Kap actually does make sense. So it's not like one should automatically assume the guy is lying, especially when it's an anonymous poll.
     
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  9. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    You are so off-base with your opinions its ridiculous. Here you're taking one person's OPINION and passing it off as a fact just because other idiots repeated it.
     
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  10. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    No, it's the idea that a race is superior to another. Judging someone by their race is a tool of racism, but I haven't even done that.

    You're absolutely joking. You have to be. I'm judging them on their actions and their words. These are public people. Jerry Richardson lost the Panthers in part because of racism. Jerry Jones' casual racism is on video. Bob McNair equated his employees to prisoners. Dan Snyder is still out here calling his team the "Redskins". If I started the Whiteskins, Tucker Carlson would have a mic in my face yesteday. You seem to have this idea that I'm attacking white owners. The owners are white, yes, and they are perpetuating long-standing.

    lol

    LOL

    This runs counter to the love-fest after he was let go from Buffalo. Folks wanted him badly.
     
  11. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    A well-reasoned explanation and a well-reasoned lie are virtually indistinguishable. There's an owner under oath stating that it's about the protests.
     
  12. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    For the second part of your comment, you have done that repeatedly when you compared several of us to Jerry Jones or said that we were somehow enabling him. Or that we all love "Cogs". Or the many "you people" comments. Well, if "us people" are so ignorant while we collude with each other to "enslave the black man" like you keep saying, then you definitely fit your own description of feeling superior to us.

    The funny part is, you're screaming for the "systematic racism" to end yet that's exactly what you're doing to people here who have nothing to do with anything. You're a walking double standard with your LOL's to anything you're too scared to even consider.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2018
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  13. rackhound

    rackhound Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    America has a problem with hearing the truth about itself. Jimmy the Greek wasn't fired for being racist, he was fired for reminding America of what it did.

    @CaribPhin I usually avoid these types of threads like the plague, but what is it America did that is any worse that what any other country has done in the past? America was founded on freedom, and fought a civil war to change what I assume you are talking about. America is the reason the world isn't ruled by Nazis, and it spends millions of dollars to fight against racial and civil injustice around the globe. That doesn't even take into account the affect of its influence on other countries actions as far as human rights, because of its military power.....there is no other country who has a bigger part in making things better for people around the world....sometimes at the detriment of its own citizens. Nothing upsets me more than when people try to act like America is somehow not great because of its flaws.
     
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  14. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    And while the history is bad at times, it was like 4% of the population who actually participated in slavery. But yet now, 150 years later...if you are a born white, you somehow are intertwined in the conversation.

    More silly race baiting-whoa is me-victim non sense.

    IDC what race or sex you are, you get in life what you put into it. Sure, people get the short end of the stick in various situations, but that goes for ALL people.

    This is 2019, if you're life sucks? You actually CAN do something about it. But na, folks want to sit around and blame everyone else for their poor actions. And that goes for EVERY race. They all have people who posses a victim-loser mentality....and that mentality will have you failing in life.
     
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  15. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    That's where I disagree with you since there's a big misunderstanding between growing up white and growing up black. I've researched this quite a bit and Carib is right, there is a different standard because of poverty. Now, you would think there's broke white folks and broke black folks....and they both cope in the same way with higher crime rates, more prevalence to drugs, etc. The difference is the support group though- most of whites have a successful relative, neighbor or someone that can show a positive role model influence that tells them they can do anything.

    In black families, that "talk" is often the exact opposite- black kids are warned that they'll be treated different because of their skin color. They're told the police aren't fair, that it's almost impossible to get a decent job and that the system is out to get them. I personally don't agree with all of that but there's enough truth there to create a divide. A lot of the poorest kids (black and white) grow up thinking the only way to make a buck is crime, gangs or drugs....and that often takes place in the poorest of communities (mainly black).

    So you have this cestpool coming together with more crime, less opportunity, negative thinking, prejudice, community violence, high incarceration rates, etc...and that leaves a heck of a lot of black kids growing up thinking that there are no opportunities out there to break the cycle of poverty. Again, that's not specifically true as you and I know- anyone can build a future with hard work and the right attitude. But the frustration of never hearing that message leads to anger and you have communities at war from within, which makes the police more vigilant and in turn makes the hatred/violence even worse.

    And it's a cycle that just keeps spinning downward out of control.

    Then there's what we've been talking about- these political groups encouraging black pride in basically a militant mentality where everyone is the enemy and everything's a conspiracy...it's like throwing a match to gasoline once the media gets involved. They've seen so much though that they can no longer look at the problems objectively. The ONLY REAL SOLUTION is reaching the youth and sharing exactly what you said in a positive way, in a positive environment where a different path can be imagined...but we're nowhere near being able to do that since we're so focused on blaming everyone for our own shortcomings.

    The conversation needs to change though and it has to stop being Black vs White vs Latino vs Asian. The same goes for Democrat vs Republican, Christian vs Muslim, Conservative vs Liberal, etc....the list is a freaking mile long because we're so divided by stupid, infantile crap that really shouldn't matter. We all live in our own little worlds where we think we know everything and there's no reason to ever listen to another viewpoint from the "other side"...and all that hatred just makes things that much worse.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2018
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  16. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member

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    I took a course in college about the history of Africa prior to 1800. When we covered the history of African slavery, it surprised me to find that before trade began with Europe, slavery was common place there. Usually a chief or relative or a neighboring tribe took there tribe members, relatives or someone they could overpower and sell them into slavery. The further a slave was from where they lived, the more money they were worth because it was harder for them to run away. The first European explorers, the Portuguese, visiting the west coast of Africa, found slave trading enclosures in Ghana that were believed to be at least 80 years old at the time of their discovery. One of the fiercer tribes near the mouth of the Congo river did hard rock gold mining using slaves.

    It was that gold that pushed trade between western Africa and Europe, especially with England's use of silver as the basis for their money vs. Spain using gold. Most countries preferred dealing in gold. Spain had a monopoly on the gold from the New World, but the African gold was of higher quality and gave England some balance with Spain. This was the basic emphasis for developing trade with Africa. Slaves could and had been procured from northern Africa through out the history of the Mediterranean. Keep in mind that not all those slaves were black.

    When the slave trade with Europe began to expand due to the European plantations in the Caribbean and Brazil, American traders reduced their slave cost and increased the number of slaves they could take in one trip by first, buying the slaves from the native slave traders and second, taking the slave traders into captivity the next day at a party set up to celebrate the conclusion of the sale. No money was spent in the trade and twice the number of slaves were obtained.

    Those folks who had been enslaved in this country have been free for around 150 years. It is interesting to note that about 50% of the current black community in America immigrated here after the civil war, mostly from the Caribbean and South America.

    As far as social inequality goes, people choose who they like and who they want to socialize with as a matter of personnel choice. Our current laws have gone a long way in evening the civil playing field for everybody. Some folks are only interested in their personnel enrichment without regard to anything else (sounds a little like the same attitude those native African slave traders had before they were taken into slavery). These folks are easy to identify. They are always pointing their finger at somebody else complaining about their wealth. Look at the attitudes expressed on this forum aimed at Mr. Ross. It's seldom about race. That's usually just an unjustified excuse that try's to play on someone's sympathies. Some folks even keep it up after they move on to favor another team.

    The issue of slavery in Africa was about 10% of what we studied in this class. It was an elective class that turned out to be both interesting and enjoyable. We read the story of a king of Mali (sundiata keita). It was part history and part myth but it gave a comprehensive picture of life in central sub-Saharan Africa. It had family interactions (his mother was the Buffalo woman who was ugly but also part of a prophecy - that's how she became a kings third wife), deceit (his uncle was going to assassinate him after the king died because of sundiatas claim to the throne), the personal growth of sundiata as a boy and a leader and eventually a king. I think most folks on this forum would actually enjoy this book (not to thick ha-ha) and give them something to do besides vent their frustrations here for the next week and a half, until the NFL season begins.

    A little off topic, but its been a slow football day.
     
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  17. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    I'm white. I grew up in a 420 sq ft home with no father raised by a grandmother. I'm doing just fine.

    But I do agree on the economic side of the discussion. If you are poor you have a very good chance of staying poor. Rather that be through growing up in that culture, with no father figure etc etc. It is all relevant.

    However we have a huge amount of white folks that are or grow up in broken homes and poverty also. Some make it out, some don't.

    This is why pounding victim mentality into people who are already up against the ropes in life disgusts me. You think you are helping them?? Na, you are discouraging there progress by spewing hyperbolic BS into their fragile minds that someone is out to get them.

    Kid's in these situations have no one to turn to, and no real perspective or desire of facts. In turn, any Facebook click bait becomes gospel and people like Shannon Sharpe are worshiped on Twitter.

    I truly feel bad for most kids in this era...it is a ****ty cocktail of laziness, ignorance, and entitlement wrapped into one.
     
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  18. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    This is a great post.

    However too many facts that a lot of people simply do not want to hear or accept.

    We are all present day humans, we all mostly have the same basic goals in life.

    If you are a backup QB in a game and you come in down 10-0 in the second quarter, are you going to just not try to win the game? Or hide behind "well I was down 10-0". That's the mentality that is being taught and accepted these day's.
     
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  19. Puka-head

    Puka-head My2nd Fav team:___vs Jets Club Member

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    AHoles is AHoles, no matter what color.

    You want racial equality, be like me. I Hate EVERYBODY! Equally. Flip ALL YALL!!!
     
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  20. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    What is this topic about again... oh right, incognito is bat**** crazy... water is wet..
     
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  21. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Let's be clear about why Collin kneeled. He kneeled to honor service members. At first he didn't respond to the Anthem at all staying on the bench. After meeting with a veteran he modified his protest to kneeling inorder to acknowledge veterans and their sacrifices. He refused to stand becuase he felt that not enough was being done to address what he saw as systemic racism. This is also why I found it so very ridiculous that at one point the NFLs solution was to have players that wanted to kneel stay in the locker room. Whoosh.

    I also find it absurd that a man making a heartfelt and legal political statement is considered more troubling to employ than a child beater, dog killer, or even a mentally troubled individual like Incognito.
     
  22. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

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    Mental illness is no joke. My first girlfriend in high school was diagnosed with bipolar disorder and is now, decades later, a drug addict who lives in a trailer park with multiple kids from different fathers who are all locked up in prison.
     
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  23. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I can't disagree with a single word you said- and its ultimately why I can't stand Kaepernick's message in the form it's been delivered. Instead of publicly discussing ways to rise up, it's about pointing fingers at the police and team owners. And when the youth take that message to heart, it basically ensures that they're going to be a statistic one way or the other. I absolutely hate it too.

    The social media is a completely different topic though- don't get me started there. We can save that topic for another day.
     
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  24. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    It sucks- the mental health just isn't there in America and it's not going to be any time soon. The worst part is that most cases are 100% manageable and those people can be living normal, productive lives with the right treatment. They just can't find it though before everything spirals out of control.
     
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  25. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    To me, it all came down to communication. I've visited Kaep's charity websites lately and it's amazing that there's not a single bit of information about overcoming adversity, dealing with community issues, etc. It's just all militant viewpoints about battling systematic oppression and racism....which to me is saying, "It's everyone else's problem- we're perfect and shouldn't do a single thing different."

    Why Kaepernick never actually sat down with the media and talked calmly about his beliefs and what's going on boggles my mind- he literally had the world stage and used it to divide people instead of making positive impacts. To me, that makes the kneeling irrelevant because to this day, he has made zero effort to speak with the media and change the narrative.
     
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  26. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I remember reading articles where, to my mind, he did just that. That is how I found out my information. Regardless, this is turning into pofo so I'm just going to leave a video with the Vet that convinced him to kneel and bow out.

     
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  27. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    I'm not saying stuff like that isn't out there...but I personally have not seen it and I've actively looked for it several different times. I did see where he's received several awards though so it's pretty clear that something is missing from the bigger picture that the public hasn't heard. Personally though, I can't imagine a talk show that hasn't tried to book him the past few years and why he hasn't used those opportunities to make a true global impact.

    Having that much attention is so rare in this world and I just think he blew it with pursuing the lawsuit. I have a feeling that he's getting very bad advice from all the wrong people.
     
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  28. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Caps girlfriend and Miko I think hang out in the same coffee shop.
     
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  29. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Mommabilly was a cantankerous man, but I truly hate seeing all this happen.
     
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  30. Puka-head

    Puka-head My2nd Fav team:___vs Jets Club Member

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    I REALLY MISS THE POFO...

    No I don't have time to MOD it or I would. I get from 10-11pm pacific time to hang around here some nights.
    But there is a wonderful cross section of our society represented here who's thoughts and opinions I genuinely respect, especially when I disagree. Its a shame the grown ups in the room aren't allowed the opportunity for thoughtful discourse with their peers because mean people suck.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2018
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  31. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  32. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    True sacrifice.

    [​IMG]
     
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  33. Pandarilla

    Pandarilla Purist Emeritus

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    You guys sure Richie wasn't trying to freeze his dad's head? That's a thing now...
     
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  34. KeyFin

    KeyFin Well-Known Member

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    He basically said, "I want to cut his head off to see what's wrong with him." It's entirely possible that's what he meant since the body was being cremated.

    The problem there is that the Tillman family has REPEATEDLY said that they don't want anything to do with politics or sending a message. In fact, Tillman spoke with a fellow soldier before he died and said he didn't want to be a poster boy for anything- he was just doing what he thought was right. Politicians on both sides have been using him as a talking point though and it's VERY UNCOOL to ignore the family's wishes. Although it would make a great Nike message, the family would definitely say no.

    And for the record, Tillman's father said in an interview recently that he's sure his son would have been one of the first ones kneeling with Kaep since he strongly believed for everyone to chase what they believe in. I think it's a travesty the way the media has twisted his actions and disrespected that proud family....it's about as un-American as it gets.
     
  35. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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  36. Fin-O

    Fin-O Initiated Club Member

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  37. Finatik

    Finatik Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Just saying much better poster children then that traitor Kap.
     
  38. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yes. Yes. 1000 x Yes. This should be framed and hung in every dining room around the country.
     
  39. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito. Club Member

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    This is an insult to both his family and his memory.
     
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  40. danmarino

    danmarino Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    America didn't invent slavery. White people didn't invent slavery. Although it's true that both participated in slavery. It's also true that slavery still exists in many parts of the world.

    But not in America.

    America abolished slavery. America has done much more good than harm to people of this world. Sure, we should all want to fix any and all flaws America has, but let's put things into perspective. In many parts of Africa you may be a slave. In South America, Africa, parts of Asian, and the Middle East, you may be burned alive or imprisoned for life for simple drug crimes or even for stealing food. No trials. Mob rule. Slavery. Brutality. Poverty the likes that many here have never witnessed. Poor people in Chad, who live off of about $1000/year, would LOVE to be poor in America. Being a homosexual in many parts of this world isn't celebrated like it is here, it's punishable by death or prison. Want to bash the U.S. President? Go right ahead. Want to be irreligious? No problem. Try either of those things in many other countries and you'll find yourself being thrown off of a building, shot, or beheaded.

    Cops in this country need an overhaul. It is within Kaep's rights to speak out about this fact. It is not his right to use the NFL as his platform if they don't want him to. The NFL firing Kaep, even if only for the kneeling, is not illegal. It is not an infringement of his God given rights.
     
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