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The elephant in the room

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by dirtylandry, Dec 18, 2016.

  1. Sloopy

    Sloopy Member

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    I'm not sure Tannehill could've done much better last night, unless the gameplan would've called for a great deal more passing that resulted in just as good a performance on Tannehill's part with that degree of an offensive imbalance. If the gameplan would've called for just as much offensive balance with Tannehill, it would've been difficult for him to play any better than Moore.

    The difficulty in making this evaluation of Moore versus Tannehill is that neither of them is the kind of game-winning QB that has proven he can carry a team. Both are largely game manager types, and so when the game plays out like it did last night, which involved a game manager role for Moore in which he played very well, it's difficult to distinguish Tannehill from him.

    Imagine for example if we were comparing Matt Moore's performance last night, within a game manager role, to the typical Aaron Rodgers (or Dan Marino) type game where the team is down relatively big on the scoreboard and he brings them back with his arm and mobility. Then obviously the distinction between Moore and Rodgers would be readily apparent (the game manager versus the game-winner).

    It's nowhere near as apparent when you're comparing Moore to Tannehill (both are game managers), and that's what people seem to be tuning in to here.
     
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  2. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Tannehill played a weak schedule but Moore hasn't? GTFOH. Moore got bailed out on 2 of 4 TDs and was lucky enough to be playing the jets. Plus our defense went off.

    I find it ****ing hilarious how you compliment Moore for spreading the ball around like RT hasn't done it for multiple SEASONS.

    I thank the stars people like you aren't involved with decision making with this team. Holy **** man
     
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  3. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Theres been a QB controversy in here for 5 seasons now...why should next year be any diff.
     
  4. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    So exciting he'll be on the bench next year guaranteed, eh?
     
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  5. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    Disagree, especially about Moore, he is the definition of a gunslinger which is the opposite of a game manager. Tannehill is a QB that takes care of the football but I wouldn't consider him a game manager either.
     
  6. Conuficus

    Conuficus Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well away from here
    Cart before the horse.
     
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  7. Sloopy

    Sloopy Member

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    You're right. I should qualify that. Moore is typically an unsuccessful game manager, due to his interception rate, whereas Tannehill is typically a successful one. They have different styles, but neither has demonstrated the ability to be the game-winner the best QBs in the league are.

    Both have demonstrated the ability of only the game manager, and not the game-winner, whereas Moore has been unsuccessful in that regard, which is probably why he isn't a starter in the league.

    Either way, it's hard to distinguish them from each other when Moore plays like he did last night. It's not like we have years of memories of Tannehill's playing like Aaron Rodgers or Dan Marino to distinguish him more sharply from Moore in our minds.
     
  8. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    I'm talking about this:

    7-1 team record

    100.1 passer rating

    13 touchdowns (5.6 TD%), 5 interceptions (2.1 INT%)

    1,723 yards on 233 pass attempts (7.4 yards per pass)

    If Moore put up comparable numbers over the next three games, people would be crowning him the GOAT. Tannehill does it, and people give him no credit.
     
  9. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    He played 2 teams with a winning record. He won 2 games due to a special teams td and a defensive td. He had a rb get 2 200 yard games. Philip rivers threw 4 picks in the 4th quarter to hand him that game. The rams started a really bad rookie qb.
     
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  10. Hiruma78

    Hiruma78 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    about the Jets (possibly) quitting, I was impressed (surprised) when Landry outran the D on his long TD, I didn't think he was fast enough and I was wondering if maybe a little bit it was also due to the Jets giving a weak effort
     
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  11. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Moore played 1 okay game where he got a TON of help from his receivers and a defense playing lights out? (against one of the worst teams in the NFL)

    What the **** is your point ????
     
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  12. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    To flip this on you, you're currently pushing for Matt Moore because he whooped up on the the third worst team in the league.
     
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  13. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    I would think that if Moore ends up with a 100 passer rating, then the discussion should really center around Adam Gase, not either of the QBs.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
     
  14. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    He played a couple of the toughest defenses in the league, too. How many teams play a majority of opponents with winning records?

    Cut the crap. Moore played the awful Jets, yet you're crowing about how much better he is than Tannehill.

    Pro-tip: if he were that much better, he'd have been starting a long time ago.
     
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  15. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    You are correct the jets aren't good. But look at what tannehill did against them at home. And tannehill played the 3 teams worse than the jets and needed ot to beat the browns. And had a miraculous comeback in the 4th quarter against the rams. Yes he led them to the comeback, but he was really bad the rest of the game.

    Look I know that tannehill is most likely going to start next year because gase is infatuated with him for some reason.

    That game last night was fun. Tannehill hasn't blown out an opponent since the Texans last year.
     
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  16. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Why would Gase be starting the better QB res? Wouldn't have to do with him trying to win games huh? Crazy pills for everyone!
     
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  17. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    Pro tip the coaches couldn't start Moore after drafting tannehill number 8. How did tannehill perform against those same awful jets at HOME?
     
  18. Brasfin

    Brasfin Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. I don't want to jump the gun but Gase seems to be the best thing that's happened to this franchise since Marino. Hopefully he'll be with us for a long time... long after both Moore and Tannehill retire, and hopefully we'll keep winning regardless of who's under center.
     
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  19. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    It's not "most likely", It's a lock. Because he is night and day better than Matt Moore. it's not close.

    Several of those teams were top 5 in defense when we played them, regardless of their record.
     
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  20. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    If Moore was the better QB they would have started him. SEVERAL TIMES he's been in multiple QB competitions and not ever won a single time under any coach. He was barely better then and now it's not even remotely close anymore. The narrative that they 'had' to start Tannehill is 100% false, most people were under the impression him sitting a year would be best, hence garrard.

    It's okay to admit you're wrong.
     
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  21. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    It's patently false that Tannehill started due to draft position. Tannehill was supposed to sit. They brought in Garrard, in fact, because they were so not sold on More to start. Fact is, as a raw rookie, with very few starts as QB, Tannehill showed more than Garrard or Moore. Garrard for hurt, and the Moore couldn't beat out a rookie.

    Moore is what he is. A solid career backup. Keep his throws limited, and he'll do well. Make throw a ton, he's going to turn the ball over in bunches.

    Just stop with the haterade.
     
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  22. TotoreMexico

    TotoreMexico Your retarded

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    Posting under a different username?

    Funny how these "new" posters come out of nowhere.
     
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  23. btfu149

    btfu149 Well-Known Member

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    So you're saying that he will become the starting QB and start breaking records?
     
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  24. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Exactly, Totore.
     
  25. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Hahaha! Well, no, I was simply referring to how he loved being the backup. Fans loved him, he was playing college ball, but doesn't have all the responsibilities of the starter, doesn't have to get hit, etc.

    Would love it if he does well, and we go on a postseason tear!
     
  26. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    Which teams did Tannehill beat that were really good on defense? Was it the Jets when they gave up 28 points to the browns the week before the dolphins scored 27? Or the Rams who gave up 49-26-42 the weeks after Tannehill scored 14? Or the Bills who gave up 41 the week after the dolphins scored 28?
     
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  27. Sloopy

    Sloopy Member

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    I think that's true, but if so, I think you then have to move to the fact that one of those QBs will account for more than 10% of the team's salary cap next year as it stands now, whereas the other would account for slightly more than 1%.

    In other words, if Gase is truly the mechanism of action in this sort of success, you don't need a QB who absorbs more than 10% of your salary cap, when you may be able to get that kind of performance much more cheaply, which then lets you spend more money on talent elsewhere on the field and do a better job of strengthening your team in other areas.
     
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  28. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    So Gase couldn't start Moore because Tannehill was drafted five yrs ago? Or that Gase said one of the reasons he took the job was Tannehill? Wow. Sadly, I hope you are just trolling and really do not believe this nonsense.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2016
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  29. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Several teams were ranked top 5 in defense when we played them (and won). The Rams and Jets among them. Irrelevant now, but those were facts then.

    Again, Tannehill > Moore. It's okay to be wrong, ETC ETC.
     
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  30. NyPhinfan

    NyPhinfan Season Ticket Holder

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    You wonder why Gase is infatuated with him? lol...You mean the guy who came in here with no ties to anyone...especially the QB? The guy who has no other agenda than to try and win games? The guy who knows just a little about QB play? The guy who has been around some pretty good QBs in his coaching career? That guy?
    So Gase wants to win but WILL NOT play the better QB because of when Ryan was drafted 4 years ago? Because he is infatuated with him?
    Color me crazy but it just might be he thinks one is the better QB and definitely thinks one gives him a better chance to run this offense and WIN..Bottom Line
     
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  31. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I said the same thing last week and met a lynch mob, so I'm sorry in advance for what will come over the following week. Just know that it's okay to appreciate Moore and Tannehill at the same time, despite what you'll hear from others.

    However, I think you're wrong in that there's no quarterback controversy to be found. Moore is better in the pocket and he does see the field clearer, but it was obvious last night that his arm strength has diminished. I think he's a good TODAY option because the players really respond to him...when's the last time you've seen that many smiles in the huddle? But I don't know if that's sustainable; especially since he's one hit away from retirement.

    Besides, Tannehill's best game as a pro probably came after the rumors of benching him a few years back. I've felt all along that it was a mistake to say he was definitely the starter, and I think him seeing Moore play with this much confidence/poise will only help him in the long run. The two of them have definitely become a team in recent years anyway.

    Anyway, Tannehill will start in 2017 and beyond...he has far too much upside not to. So I see this as an overwhelming positive in that the Dolphins know they have two starting caliber QB's on the roster and they're there for each other. I just don't see the controversy DESPITE Moore being a better fit for this offense- it's Tannehill's team.
     
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  32. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    You keep saying this, but all advanced statistics have Tannehill as below replacement level this year.
     
  33. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Link?

    He's starting next year and played some great Football this year. You're a hater in every sense of the word like several other dense people here.

    You're wrong about him. It's okay. We're all wrong sometimes.
     
  34. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Hey, Easy with the logic there! Liable to give some on here a brain aneurysm!. In the future when you post please use a disclaimer. Gase actually picked the QB that he thinks gives him the best chance? NO WAY!
     
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  35. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    Yeah...QBR is the worst metric of all time.
     
  36. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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  37. Runnincm

    Runnincm Active Member

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    Of course it is. We should judge a QB based on how many completions he can get on bubble screens to Landry. lol
     
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  38. NyPhinfan

    NyPhinfan Season Ticket Holder

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    QBR? The stat invented by ESPN? The worldwide leader in Sports? lol. The only people who push that stat are ESPN and the few people left who actually watch Sportscenter.
     
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  39. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    No, we should judge a QB based on 1 game against the jets after they blatantly packed it up mentally.
     

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