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The Official 2011 Boston Red Sox Thread

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by Ray Finkle, Nov 10, 2010.

  1. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Back by popular demand (or due to a private message from FaninPatsyLand) here is the Official 2011 Boston Red Sox Thread. I couldn't think of a better day to start this not just because (shameless plug) it's my birthday but because on this date just 4 years ago something happened that would forever change the Boston Red Sox. And that event was that the Red Sox were awarded the winning bid on Mr. Daisuke Matsuzaka. So to celebrate this historic day (hey the Sox did win a WS with the guy and he even had a big hit in Game 3 of the WS in 2007) why not start the thread and get it going?

    I already feel that the Sox should go out and sign Carl Crawford and resign Victor Martinez and let Beltre and Varitek go. And then sign a 1B or 3B on a 1 year deal and then go all in for Adrian Gonzalez next off season. Hopefully they can get that done. And soon.

    With free agency in full swing, let's talk Sox baseball. All are welcome.

    Let's go Sox!
     
  2. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    Outstanding - I love some hot stove action.

    I'm not sure what to make of the Carl Crawford interest. I think Theo might be using Gammons (who initially reported the Sox' interest) as a mouthpiece to get some leverage with Boras in the Beltre negotiations.

    I think resigning Beltre should be the Sox' #1 priority (they have really no alternative to fill the void from Beltre's departure without taking a massive hit in production by shifting Lowrie or Youkilis to 3rd) and I'm pretty certain that Crawford is a Plan B if/when Beltre walks. Lets face it, an outfield of Ellsbury, Cameron/Kalish and Drew is good enough to win the division in 2011, provided Beltre is back in the fold and we don't suffer another wave of catastrophic injuries. And I seriously doubt that resigning Beltre would restrict them from bringing Gonzo on board if/when he becomes a FA next offseason. We'll corner (pun intended!) the market on Adrians.

    Gammons has also reported that Detroit is poised to offer VMart a long-term deal that the Sox will not match. I can definitely see Theo taking the picks and moving on with Saltalamacchia, with Varitek being resigned in a mentor/backup role.
     
  3. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Resigning Beltre long term scares me. I think this was a contract push for him this year. I don't think there's any way he matches the production we saw from him this year. I think if we let him walk, we sold high on him. I'd perfectly fine with using Lowrie or a stop gap guy for 1 year and then getting Gonzalez. Don't forget Jose Iglesias and Anthony Rizzo could also help out sometime next year as well. So at least the Sox have options and aren't forced to make a move.
     
  4. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    His BABiP exceeded career norms by .037, so its safe to say his overall numbers from this past year clearly benefited from some good fortune. That said, I think he's a pretty safe bet to put up an average OPS of around .850 over the next few years.

    When you combine that with his defensive skills, I think resigning him is a total no-brainer. Also, consider there's currently no options to replace the void his departure would create defensively, and Crawford/Werth are the only realistic FA options that could provide anywhere near the offensive production.
     
  5. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Ok what kind of contract would you give him? Also if the Sox sign Beltre, you can kiss Gonzalez goodbye because there's no way they sign Gonzalez to big money to have him DH or have a rotation. It wouldn't make any sense.
     
  6. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    No idea. I haven't even seen reports regarding the type of contract Boras expects. I suppose I'd be willing to go higher on the AAV (say $15/yr) to keep the overall length of the contract down (general rule of thumb - 4 max, preferrably 3).

    We'll have to agree to disagree here. I don't see anything that might suggest the re-signing of Beltre would exclude them from entering a potential Gonzalez sweepstakes. I think, in the given situation, the corner infielders could rotate amongst themselves and the DH slot. And I would also argue that Beltre and (in particular) Youkilis might benefit from a decreased work load that this situation would afford them. Youkilis is notorious for running on empty at certain points during the regular season just because of the way he plays.

    And why wouldn't it make sense? Because all three options are almost too good defensively? Isn't that a good problem to have?
     
  7. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    I'm guessing Boras will ask for 5 years, and end up with 4 years minimum.

    While yes having a rotation would be nice, it doesn't make sense from a financial stand point because you're going to be tying too much money up in the DH spot. Plus why would Gonzalez sign up to play a third of his games as a DH? It would be a hard sticking point for him to sign. Plus I can't imagine either Youkilis or Beltre would be happy with that either.
     
  8. Mainge

    Mainge Season Ticket Holder

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    West Palm Beach
    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Thanks friend!
     
  10. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    God you guys can never be original!!!! Always copying us!!! :lol::lol::lol:


    Oh and Happy BDay bro...
     
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  11. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    The news of last night was that the Red Sox traded Dustin Richardson to Florida for LHP Andrew Miller (who was once considered the best LHP prospect in all of baseball and was traded for Miguel Cabrera and Dontrelle Willis).

    As I posted in the Marlin thread, this is a classic Theo Rediscovery/Recovery trade. Miller has had major problems throwing strikes but is still somewhat of a high upside guy. Let's see if Curt Young could work his magic here. Even if Miller doesn't pan out, losing Richardson isn't a big deal. Reminds me of the Hermida/Hunter Jones trade of last year. I guess whenever Florida has a once prospect that has fallen out of favor with them we're the team that collects.
     
  12. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Red Sox claimed Taylor Buchholz off waivers from Toronto today. He was very good in the pen in a set up role with Colorado in 2008 but he TJ surgery in 2009 and haven't pitched much since. I like this move. I mean why not right?
     
  13. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Sure why not....this and Miller, I like both of them....low risk, high reward...
     
  14. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Exactly. This is what GMs should do with bullpens. I'm all for signing/trading for a bunch of low risk/high reward guys and if they stick great, if not you can cut bait easily without having big money tied up into them (or regret trading for them because you gave up someone good for them). Why not take a flier on Miller or claim Buchholz. I'd rather do that then sign a Kevin Gregg type to a 3 year 15 million dollar deal, especially the way bullpens vary from year to year.
     
  15. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    Here's an update on the Upton talks:

    That proposed deal would be an absolute heist for Boston.

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/...tin-Upton-Boston-Red-Sox-Arizona-Diamondbacks
     
  16. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    I actually heard somewhere (although not sure if its true at all) is that the Red Sox already told the Diamondbacks that Casey Kelly is off the table. Not sure why Arizona would take a Sox deal without Kelly in it but hey great. And yes I would trade Ellsbury, Bard, Kalish and whoever for Upton. It would indeed be a steal. Sounds too good to be true really (which is why it's probably not).
     
  17. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Dont believe much what you hear...Ariz wont let this kid go unless they burn somebody....

    One AL exec told SI.com's Jon Heyman (Twitter link) that Arizona's asking price for Upton is "ridiculous."

    The Upton rumors are more than just talk, says ESPN.com's Jayson Stark, who was told the D'Backs are "genuinely open" to moving the 23-year-old. However, it might take a package of five players who could help the team in the short- and long-term (Twitter links).

    About half of MLB teams showed some interest in Upton, but the D'Backs aren't going to trade him unless they "win" the trade. The Red Sox are showing more interest than the Yankees, according to Jon Heyman of SI.com (Twitter link). He says the D'Backs would likely request Daniel Bard and Jacoby Ellsbury from the Red Sox.

    I dont know I wouldnt trade Ells and Baird for that guy, you guys think thats a steal?? Say what you want about Ellsbury, but evrything aside when he comes back this year healthy, the kid is actually better than him alone IMO....where else are you getting a 300 avg, 100 runs, 10-15 HR, 70-85 rbis, and like 70 SB's, and one of the best gloves in the field to boot?!?!? Baird is the closer after this year...thats too much to give up just those 2 guys, and it sounds like that wont even get it done...

    Thing is I dont think the Sox or Yankees can win this trade because Towers knows exactly whats in both teams system...there wont be any wool being pulled over the eyes....so at that point do you really want the guy at that price??? You better hope that he pans out...because the numbers dont warrant that big a return, even at 23 years old...and being labeled as the "next next"...
     
  18. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    If Bard and Ellsbury were the centerpieces, I'd make the deal in a heartbeat. Heading into next season, Upton is a much better option than Crawford or Werth in the OF.
     
  19. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Upton is a superstar in the making. Not only is he signed through 2015 with a pretty fair contract but he's 4 years younger than Ellsbury and is already better than him and you're getting Upton way before he hits his prime years. Plus Upton is a pretty good defensive OFer as well and has speed as well. We're talking about a young franchise player here. Absolutely I do that deal and I don't think twice about it.
     
  20. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    Jumping around a bit, but just wanted to touch upon the Beltre negotiations. Heyman tweeted the following yesterday afternoon:

    I'm on record as saying I'd love to bring Beltre back to Boston, but if that is indeed the case - its time for Theo to move on to Plan B (nevermind the news of the recent Oakland offer that Theo won't match in terms of years).
     
  21. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Happy days are here again! The Sox should just get a warm body to fill in at 1B next year for the year and then just go hard at Adrian Gonzalez.

    Actually I was reading SOSH last night in the Upton thread and a poster wondered out loud if the Sox were to take Mark Reynolds and his large contract off Arizona's hand along with Upton if that would lessen the package the Sox would have to ship out. That way you could move Reynolds to 1B next year, then have him take over the DH role in 2012 (if the Sox let Ortiz walk and if Ortiz is still on the team Reynolds could platoon with him) when the Sox sign Gonzalez and then buy out his contract after the season and let him walk if he doesn't produce. Granted Reynolds was pretty much useless last year outside of 32 HRs and isn't a high OBP guy either but a 2 year rental he might be worth the risk (kind of like taking Lowell back in the Beckett deal). What do you think Patsy?

    EDIT: He'd be making 5 million in 2011, 7.5 in 2012 and a club option in 2013 for 11 million with a .5 million buy out.
     
  22. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    Very, very interesting thought. What do Reynolds' splits look like? As an Ortiz platoon, ideally you'd like someone that rakes against LHP.

    Short of including Buchholz in a potential deal, I'm on board with doing pretty much whatever it takes to bring Upton to Boston, especially considering that it now seems like a sure bet we'll be losing Beltre's services at 3B.
     
  23. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Wait guys I am lost, what is it about Upton that you are willing to part the Red Sea for??....Instead of offering all those players, and the package from the Yankees would be the same too I'm sure, I would much rather see them take those players and try and get King Felix....

    Sorry I didnt see your response in the previous page RF...
     
  24. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    He's a career .252/.380/.528 with a OPS of .908 in 500 at bats vs. LHP. Sign me up.
     
  25. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Why would Seattle trade King Felix though? They just signed him to a long term deal last offseason and the team has the money and market to keep him. He's not even on the block, which Justin Upton is.
     
  26. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Yeah I can see your point, the kid doesnt have alot of upside especially in Fenway...the price is right, the age is right...signed thru 2013...
     
  27. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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  28. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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  29. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Thanks. It's a great site, I can't recommend it enough. I believe almost every writer refers to it now because it's spot on.
     
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  30. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    So what are you trying to say Victor, that you cant win in Boston, cuz bro if you think you cant win in Boston, I think Detroit will be a little bit of a letdown for you...

    there might be a beanball from Beckett in dear ole Victor's future...
     
  31. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    I doubt it. I mean what do you expect him to say? Something like I came to Detroit because they offered me the most money? I doubt anyone on the Red Sox roster cares, nor should they. Plus Martinez did thank the Red Sox during his press interview. There's no bad blood what so ever.
     
  32. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    pretty much....the truth sure....
     
  33. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Well let me know when that ever happens, because it will be the first time.
     
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  34. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    1:58pm: The Red Sox are serious about Crawford and have met with him and his representatives in Houston, according to Yahoo's Tim Brown (on Twitter).

    ouch Crawford on the Sox= domination of the MLB....I got news for ya, if they were healthy this year they win the championship...
     
  35. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

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    I swear sometimes I think you want to see this happen:pity:
    [​IMG]
    :tongue2::tongue2::tongue2:
     
  36. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    To be fair, he is a Rhode Islander - where a majority of the populace is loyal to the Sox, unlike those traitors from Connecticut, whose loyalties are much more evenly split.

    Maybe those fellow Rhode Islanders are slowly bringing him back from the dark side.
     
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  37. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Oh God no way, never a Sox fan, I will say 2 things though

    1) you cant deny the truth...and the truth is if Crawford was leadoff with Dusty, Youk, Papi, Scuturo, plus if they pull off a trade for A-Gone...bro you are talking domination with that pitching staff....

    2) I do root for Sox/Yanks playoffs every year, unlike most Yanks fans like my old man who root for them to go 0-162 on the year...and I understand if the Yanks lose that means the Sox are in the WS, but there is simply nothing like Yanks.Sox in the playoffs....4+ hours of nailbiting white knuckle tense you rip my throat out drama...then you go to bed at 2AM, and go to work tired, complain to your co-workers, then do it again all over the next night hahahah
     
  38. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    I will say though bro that even though Conn is New England, the southern half is all Yankees and they should be...it is all NY money there....
     
  39. FaninPatsyLand

    FaninPatsyLand The Truth

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    I completely agree. In fact, I would go as far as to say that its not even 50/50 -- driving through the state, you don't see a shift in allegiences to Boston until you reach the Hartford area. Ray would have a better pespective though, because he's essentially behind enemy lines.

    I just have a hard time calling any state a part of New England when more than half of its residents are Yankee fans. Its blasphemy.
     
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  40. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

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    Yeah it's pretty much all Yankee country south of Hartford. It's probably close to a 50/50 split, maybe closer to 50/40/10, with the 10% being Met fans.

    Where I live it's pretty much all Yankee land, growing up I think there were only 3 or 4 other Red Sox fans in my entire school. God bless the Yankee 1996-2001 run for giving me extremely thick skin.
     

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