1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

The Official 2012 Boston Red Sox Thread

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by Ray Finkle, Feb 17, 2012.

  1. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Good article:

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/ryan-dempster-quality-al-pitcher/
     
  2. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
  3. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Like you said time will tell but to get Dempster for 26.5 million for 2 years is a very good deal. I mean I'd rather go with Dempster for 2 years than Grienke or Anibal Sanchez for 5+.
     
  4. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Absolutely.....how funny is it that the Sox and the Yanks are like bottom feeders in free agency :lol: and it is been that way now for a few years.....
     
  5. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Red Sox just signed Stephen Drew to a 1 year deal. I approve as Iglesias isn't ready to hit ML pitching and by this time next year Bogaerts might be.
     
  6. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    For a significant return? For a closer? Why?

     
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous Well-Known Member

    14,163
    3,423
    113
    Jul 5, 2009
    Jerry Sands is involved in the deal.
     
  8. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    and more? Seems like alot for a one year deal no?
     
  9. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Word is it's a 4 for 2 deal with Mark Melancon, Jerry Sands, Stolmy Pimentel and another player going to the Pirates and Joel Hanrahan and another playing going to Boston.

    Pimentel was probably going to be DFA sometime this offseason as he was never able to repeat his delivery and his success in the minors has been very inconsistent, he's probably a bullpen arm right now. Sands has power but scouts question whether he's a 4A player or not yet, the jury is still out on him. Losing Melancon's arm probably hurts the most especially since he still has years of control left but he probably didn't have a role with the Sox anyway if they got Hanrahan. Depending on who the other two names are and it's been reported it won't be Jose Iglesias it looks like it win/win for both teams really. The Sox add to their already deep bullpen and you can argue they might have one of the best in the game. The Pirates get rid of payroll and add 3 interesting names, although all wild cards and not really elite prospects. The only player I'm a little disappointed in losing would be Melancon just because of his arm and he's under team control. The Pirates should have traded Hanrahan last offseason to really get max value for him.

    The Sox bullpen would be: Bailey, Hanrahan, Uehara, Tazawa, Breslow, Miller, Morales and possibly Aceves with Bard probably starting the year in Triple A. That's a pretty deep and pretty good pen.
     
  10. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

    3,106
    768
    0
    Oct 1, 2012
    I dont get it either unless the Red Sox are just making room on the 40 man roster for other moves. ( havent looked at the 40 man for them)
     
  11. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Like I said in the above post, Pimental was most likely going to be DFA once the team announces the Drew and Napoli deal so losing him isn't a big deal. It seems like the Sox don't have plans for Sands either as his name has never been mentioned to fill a hole in the OF or 1B. My guess is the 4th guy will either be Drake Britton LHP or Chris Carpenter RHP.
     
  12. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    ...
     
  13. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

    3,106
    768
    0
    Oct 1, 2012
    I'm not to familar with the players involved outside of Melancon and Hanrahan.... Anyone fil me in?
     
  14. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Not enough to even worry about. DeJesus is maybe an MLB ultility infielder, Pimental has potential but hasn't been very good in the minors in what seems like 3 or 4 years. Sands is a 4A/back up OF/1B. Brock Holt is a back up infielder.

    Basically the Sox gave up nothing for 1 year of a "proven" closer.
     
    BigDogsHunt likes this.
  15. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    ...
     
  16. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Yay! The one thing more unless than the All Star Game has to be the WBC, from a MLB perspective as I'm all for letting non MLB players play. I think the only Red Sox in the WBC will be Shane Victorino for USA and Aceves for Mexico. Personally if I'm Aceves I'm not playing in the WBC, especially when he has an option available and the Sox pitching staff is nearly set.
     
  17. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Well this is interesting and not really a shock with the popshots taken at Tito on the way out the door. Sorry if this didn't direct link, I did it from a phone...

    [FONT=.HelveticaNeueUI]http://www.csnne.com/baseball-boston-redsox/redsox-talk/Francona-Its-style-over-substance-with-R?blockID=823639&feedID=10430[/FONT]
     
  18. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    I'd much rather hear about behind the scenes stories with the 2004 team or anything to do with Manny Ramirez. Hearing about the ownership wanting to make more money isn't a big deal to me.
     
  19. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    That whole bit about them seeing Tito on the field at 90 wins and saying "the season is ****" is kinda wrong though you have to admit. Pretty indicative of the reality of all of them. They are like Ross, they have no clue about the sporting aspect of baseball and need a strong GM. But them their is this lunch pin in the way of all of it (Lucchino).

    All I am saying is I do t think Tito is lying.
     
  20. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Oh I don't think Terry is lying either. I just don't think this is in the least bit newsworthy.

    Let's see what we have here:
    - so the owner's want to make money
    - they were upset when their team, even though they won 90 games and they spent over 150 million on contracts, didn't make the playoffs or got swept out of the 1st round
    - they hired marketing groups to find ways to get more people to watch the team since it will generate more money

    I just don't see how this is any different from 99.9% (the .01% is probably the Marlins) of the other major sport franchises. I'd say 95%, or more, of the owners that own sport franchises know next to nothing about the actual game, how to scout/judge players and build a team and depend on a front office/GM to do it for them. I think the Werner comment about the team "needing to find more exciting ways to win" is just a silly, stupid comment but harmless. Again nothing we haven't heard before from other ownership groups, there's just nothing ground breaking here.

    I think Theo's comments are a bigger deal/concern because he's hinting at the fact that the Gonzalez/Crawford moves weren't his decisions but ownership but John Henry has gone on record numerous times that he didn't like the Crawford move. So my question is who's telling the truth here? Because Theo's comments make it seem like those weren't this moves he was making.

    At the end of the day it's a group effort (from the owners to the front office to the scouts to the coaching staff to the players) and from 2010 to 2012 they all failed and at times badly. I don't think you can or should put the blame on anyone, again simply a group effort of moves just not working out for various reasons (whether it was bad luck, injuries, bad moves etc).

    However, right now, it seems as though the owners/front office etc have learned from their mistakes and are going back to the basics which is nice to see. I simply can't wait for the team to be good again so all of this nonsense and noise will be over with.

    To me this is much like when Joe Torre's book came out when there was just a lot of noise and nonsense that came with it. It will be interesting to see if Francona goes after some of the players like Torre did though. Like I said I'm more interested in a Francona book about 2004 and 2007 and some of the crazy behind the scenes Manny stories instead.
     
  21. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
  22. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Wow the Red Sox and Mike Napoli have agreed to a 1 year 5 million dollar deal with bonuses included. A LONG way from the original 3 years 39 million dollar deal. His hip must be really bad for the contract to fall that far. Either way if he's good this year the Sox can offer him arbitration and either get him back or get a pick and if he gets hurt or stinks they can let him go. Still kind of crazy. He apparently got 3 different doctor's opinions on that hip.

    The Sox are still looking for a LHH 1B/OFer too, which is smart for insurance purposes. You have to wonder if they will try to buy low on Justin Smoak.
     
  23. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Of he is going to he was in it...To knock them is knocking himself.....and also I think players will at the end of the day stick with players, and suits will stick with suits....

    I am not knocking the owners for wanting to make money hell look at NY, I am knocking the treatment of Tito that they did obviously in the open and not behind closed doors....Managers are their to manage the game, not win excitingly so they can make more money....

    I hate that about The Boss too, he did that alot....
     
  24. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Which is great they got to save ALOT of money, but going forward it raises an even bigger ? on a guy whos defense was avg at best to begin with at 1st for them IMO.....so you have A-Rod at first, with a fulltime DH backing-up?? at agruably the most important position in the infield?

    Yea I agree Fink no way they can keep this like it is for the year.....but lets say they do a deal for Smoak, I mean that means Naps sits....the guy CAN hit, especially there he will crush balls....
     
  25. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    They will most likely sign a Casey Kotchman type that can be a defensive sub in later innings and can play a game a week or so to give Napoli a rest when needed. Moving forward yes it does raise the question of who will be their long term 1B since the FA options next year are weak as well but for 2013 they should be fine.

    If they make a deal for Smoak, he will be in Triple A learning how to hit. Smoak would be a buy low project but it wouldn't effect Napoli. Napoli will be the starting 1B for 2013.
     
  26. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    Do they have anything on the farm? For 1st?
     
  27. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Not really no. Closest guy they have is Travis Shaw but he's only played 31 games in Double A. He has power but he isn't a can't miss prospect by any means. More of a wild card at this stage.

    http://soxprospects.com/players/shaw-travis.htm
     
  28. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Good article about the Francona book, with a couple of interesting tibits (Mike Cameron started the whole ordering fried chicken thing in 2010, JD Drew liked to play hunting video games during games when he was on the DL and the starting pitchers watched football on Sundays in the clubhouses, also a funny Jeter/Arod story):

    http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/b...01/22/francona-and-red-sox-complicated-legacy

    I will definitely be reading it, just not right away, probably won't get my hands on it until the end of February but it seems like it's a little bit like the Torre book (which I really enjoyed).
     
  29. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    kid can't stay healthy
     
  30. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
    Yeah it's too bad, would have been nice if they kept Reddick instead. I think the Sox basically have to label him as injury prone and can't count on him being in their long term plans. I just hope he gets enough ABs this year since he's out of options next year.
     
  31. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    didnt realize he had a torn labrum, we are buddies...
     
  32. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
  33. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    hahahaha he wants to rebuild his image huh?? he lose the weight and develop another pitch too??
     
  34. LiferYank

    LiferYank New Member

    3,106
    768
    0
    Oct 1, 2012
    I predict Lackey has a better year then Dempster however i dont think either will do great.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  35. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    I would agree with that....
     
  36. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
  37. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
  38. Ray Finkle

    Ray Finkle Member

    13,514
    4,321
    113
    Dec 9, 2007
  39. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

    30,824
    5,458
    113
    Jan 6, 2010
    I am not sure I would put full faith in a guy who doesn't know how to unload a firearm before cleaning it....
     

Share This Page